Replies to '11/24 Great School Debate'
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November 18, 2006, 3:29 pm PST
 Quote From: kschmittz My husband and I are very "concerned" with our children's education, therefore, we moved to a higher end area with good public schools. My oldest son is 8 and in 3rd grade. He is almost a year younger than most of the other kids as their Moms kept them back a year. He is doing above average work and not having any issues. I think there is A LOT of mis-understanding about public schools. First, in my son's class there are LESS kids than the average area's private schools. Next, there are boudaries set by the district on w hat they can teach your child that do not exist in private school. In private school (I found this out after we checked out private schools and from a teacher) they can teach whatever they see fit. Also, it is up to the parent to be involved in their child's education. If you see your child is struggling in any way, then go to the teacher and work something out. Public school has a multitude of programs to assist you and with the "NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND" there's really no excuse (learning disability or whatever) to not have your child succeed. We have what is called a 504 plan for my son. Basically, it is a legal document that will follow him through High School. I can dicatate (if need be) every move/action the teacher makes in regards to my son. It is NOT that way now but the option exists. This is available to all parents at any public school. Last, I can claim all you do about my son's public school. That is why we are "dishing out the money" to live in a nice area. Therefore, the crime and bullying you speak of really isn't an issue where we live. If it does happen, then my son will take care of it with help from his Dad and I. I think a lot of people are very mis-guided about not only private school but homeschooling and unschooling as well. Part of education is not just academics. There is so much more. In today's world, there is very little chance for self-sufficiency without a decent education. Also, you need to have skills beyond that. If you can't deal with people or situations that may come up in life (like bullying) you are not likely to have a lot of job offers. In a public school setting, although not perfect, there is much more to learn on a social level. You learn to wait your turn, respect others and that there are consequences for your actions that can affect your whole class. Anyone who thinks the majority of private schools kids are perfect, think again. When I was young, these were among the most wild of us all. They just had the $$ to get out of most any trouble.
All in all, a good education can come from a good public school. I agree, not all are good. There are some even in my district I would not send my kids to. That is why my hubby and I are very careful if we decided to buy another house in this area. We want to make sure we stay within school lines that we like. Also, if a parent expects the school to teach everything to their child then they are in error. I am in my son's class every week helping out. No, I am not Room Mom every year but I am there. I have been on Field Trips and helped out with parties and such. I consider myself lucky to be able to do this even though I work full time. There is academic education which I believe needs to be done by people who are qualified- someone with teaching credentials. For what it's worth, I also believe anyone who homeschools/unschools should have these same credentials. Then there is the other edcuation which is about life. This is up to parents.
Last, don't assume every kid in public school has parents who don't care. Just as you assume this there are people who assume things about you and your choices. You are not the only parent who is involved in your child's life the way you are. I have many many friends who are teachers in public schools and I can tell you they are far more trained than anyone realizes. They are concerned and they do teach every child no matter how big their class is. Also, in public school in 1st and 2nd grade the class size has to be UNDER 20 kids...again lower than most private schools. My friends also say their biggest battle is not teaching the kids but dealing with parents. Food for thought. If you notice in my postings, I always express the fact that parents need to do their research and be familair with the schools and system in their area. I am not downing any one's choices and if you feel that way about me, I am sorry that I have come across that way, we as paretns have the privelege and obligation to do what is right by our kids and if you noticed , my originall response was to the poster who basically said it is public or nothing (not in those words), Parents have choices and that is the way it should be. I dont like every private school out there and I also posted about the one that I checked in to. Kids need to be on the top of our priority list as parents, unfortuanetly every school district is different and the crime and all that is higher in some areas then it is in others. Again, I say Kudos to all the good parents out there putitng their kids first and seeking out the best options for them, too bad that not all parents do this or are they invlved int herio children's loves, let alone their education. We, as parents can tell if our children are benefitting from their education atmosphere and if they are not then it is our responsibility as parents to figure out the issue and solution and to make the right decission to benefit our kids. |
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November 18, 2006, 3:55 pm PST
Quote From: kschmittz My husband and I are very "concerned" with our children's education, therefore, we moved to a higher end area with good public schools. My oldest son is 8 and in 3rd grade. He is almost a year younger than most of the other kids as their Moms kept them back a year. He is doing above average work and not having any issues. I think there is A LOT of mis-understanding about public schools. First, in my son's class there are LESS kids than the average area's private schools. Next, there are boudaries set by the district on w hat they can teach your child that do not exist in private school. In private school (I found this out after we checked out private schools and from a teacher) they can teach whatever they see fit. Also, it is up to the parent to be involved in their child's education. If you see your child is struggling in any way, then go to the teacher and work something out. Public school has a multitude of programs to assist you and with the "NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND" there's really no excuse (learning disability or whatever) to not have your child succeed. We have what is called a 504 plan for my son. Basically, it is a legal document that will follow him through High School. I can dicatate (if need be) every move/action the teacher makes in regards to my son. It is NOT that way now but the option exists. This is available to all parents at any public school. Last, I can claim all you do about my son's public school. That is why we are "dishing out the money" to live in a nice area. Therefore, the crime and bullying you speak of really isn't an issue where we live. If it does happen, then my son will take care of it with help from his Dad and I. I think a lot of people are very mis-guided about not only private school but homeschooling and unschooling as well. Part of education is not just academics. There is so much more. In today's world, there is very little chance for self-sufficiency without a decent education. Also, you need to have skills beyond that. If you can't deal with people or situations that may come up in life (like bullying) you are not likely to have a lot of job offers. In a public school setting, although not perfect, there is much more to learn on a social level. You learn to wait your turn, respect others and that there are consequences for your actions that can affect your whole class. Anyone who thinks the majority of private schools kids are perfect, think again. When I was young, these were among the most wild of us all. They just had the $$ to get out of most any trouble.
All in all, a good education can come from a good public school. I agree, not all are good. There are some even in my district I would not send my kids to. That is why my hubby and I are very careful if we decided to buy another house in this area. We want to make sure we stay within school lines that we like. Also, if a parent expects the school to teach everything to their child then they are in error. I am in my son's class every week helping out. No, I am not Room Mom every year but I am there. I have been on Field Trips and helped out with parties and such. I consider myself lucky to be able to do this even though I work full time. There is academic education which I believe needs to be done by people who are qualified- someone with teaching credentials. For what it's worth, I also believe anyone who homeschools/unschools should have these same credentials. Then there is the other edcuation which is about life. This is up to parents.
Last, don't assume every kid in public school has parents who don't care. Just as you assume this there are people who assume things about you and your choices. You are not the only parent who is involved in your child's life the way you are. I have many many friends who are teachers in public schools and I can tell you they are far more trained than anyone realizes. They are concerned and they do teach every child no matter how big their class is. Also, in public school in 1st and 2nd grade the class size has to be UNDER 20 kids...again lower than most private schools. My friends also say their biggest battle is not teaching the kids but dealing with parents. Food for thought. "Next, there are boudaries set by the district on w hat they can teach
your child that do not exist in private school. In private school (I
found this out after we checked out private schools and from a teacher)
they can teach whatever they see fit." That is an excellent point. Private schools that get no public funding can teach whatever nutty thing they want and that worries me greatly. |
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November 21, 2006, 7:44 am PST
Quote From: kschmittz My husband and I are very "concerned" with our children's education, therefore, we moved to a higher end area with good public schools. My oldest son is 8 and in 3rd grade. He is almost a year younger than most of the other kids as their Moms kept them back a year. He is doing above average work and not having any issues. I think there is A LOT of mis-understanding about public schools. First, in my son's class there are LESS kids than the average area's private schools. Next, there are boudaries set by the district on w hat they can teach your child that do not exist in private school. In private school (I found this out after we checked out private schools and from a teacher) they can teach whatever they see fit. Also, it is up to the parent to be involved in their child's education. If you see your child is struggling in any way, then go to the teacher and work something out. Public school has a multitude of programs to assist you and with the "NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND" there's really no excuse (learning disability or whatever) to not have your child succeed. We have what is called a 504 plan for my son. Basically, it is a legal document that will follow him through High School. I can dicatate (if need be) every move/action the teacher makes in regards to my son. It is NOT that way now but the option exists. This is available to all parents at any public school. Last, I can claim all you do about my son's public school. That is why we are "dishing out the money" to live in a nice area. Therefore, the crime and bullying you speak of really isn't an issue where we live. If it does happen, then my son will take care of it with help from his Dad and I. I think a lot of people are very mis-guided about not only private school but homeschooling and unschooling as well. Part of education is not just academics. There is so much more. In today's world, there is very little chance for self-sufficiency without a decent education. Also, you need to have skills beyond that. If you can't deal with people or situations that may come up in life (like bullying) you are not likely to have a lot of job offers. In a public school setting, although not perfect, there is much more to learn on a social level. You learn to wait your turn, respect others and that there are consequences for your actions that can affect your whole class. Anyone who thinks the majority of private schools kids are perfect, think again. When I was young, these were among the most wild of us all. They just had the $$ to get out of most any trouble.
All in all, a good education can come from a good public school. I agree, not all are good. There are some even in my district I would not send my kids to. That is why my hubby and I are very careful if we decided to buy another house in this area. We want to make sure we stay within school lines that we like. Also, if a parent expects the school to teach everything to their child then they are in error. I am in my son's class every week helping out. No, I am not Room Mom every year but I am there. I have been on Field Trips and helped out with parties and such. I consider myself lucky to be able to do this even though I work full time. There is academic education which I believe needs to be done by people who are qualified- someone with teaching credentials. For what it's worth, I also believe anyone who homeschools/unschools should have these same credentials. Then there is the other edcuation which is about life. This is up to parents.
Last, don't assume every kid in public school has parents who don't care. Just as you assume this there are people who assume things about you and your choices. You are not the only parent who is involved in your child's life the way you are. I have many many friends who are teachers in public schools and I can tell you they are far more trained than anyone realizes. They are concerned and they do teach every child no matter how big their class is. Also, in public school in 1st and 2nd grade the class size has to be UNDER 20 kids...again lower than most private schools. My friends also say their biggest battle is not teaching the kids but dealing with parents. Food for thought. It is good for your family that you have the money to move to a more expensive area for your child's education. Most don't have that ablility. Also, a higher socio-econimic area does NOT guarantee a good school. I agree that a major problem in the public schools is when parents turn their children over and expect the school system to do it ALL. That is just a recipe for disaster. I disagree with you when it comes to "socialization". My son (homeschooled for the past year and a half...7th and now 8th grade) is very socialized. He just got his black belt in Karate - where he learns to fight if necessary, walk away if he can, respect, honor, self esteem, etc - he works a part time job two hours a day - where he learns to deal with bosses with different personalities, deadlines, expectations, responsiblity, etc - he spends time at his grandmother's retirement community where he helps her neighbors and socializes with them, he raises bearded dragons and rehabs box turtles. Then there is his church youth group and all the activities there. He acolytes at church, is an usher, etc. He is having a problem right now with some of his friends growing away from him, and is making new friends. We talk to him and guide him, but this is part and parcel of being a young teen - NOT something he is dealing with because he is homeschooled. Over all, he is happy, well adjusted and very social. He is extreemly curious, has some unscheduled learning time when we talk and research things that he is curious about, but he also is required to sit and have structured school. He's advanced in math and science. The problem with this whole debate is the anecdotal nature of it. For every failure in public school, I can show you one brilliant success. The same can be done for homeschooling. We can go tit-for-tat back and forth all day and never resolve the "debate". Neither side will ever run out of "examples" to back thier side, and the other side will always say, "That's just one example. What about........." And so it goes. All I can say is that I feel I am doing what is right for my own child. He is getting a good, well rounded education and is not lacking in social skills. As a matter of fact, he may have more social skills that a large number of his peers. -Lori |
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November 21, 2006, 1:04 pm PST
Quote From: kschmittz My husband and I are very "concerned" with our children's education, therefore, we moved to a higher end area with good public schools. My oldest son is 8 and in 3rd grade. He is almost a year younger than most of the other kids as their Moms kept them back a year. He is doing above average work and not having any issues. I think there is A LOT of mis-understanding about public schools. First, in my son's class there are LESS kids than the average area's private schools. Next, there are boudaries set by the district on w hat they can teach your child that do not exist in private school. In private school (I found this out after we checked out private schools and from a teacher) they can teach whatever they see fit. Also, it is up to the parent to be involved in their child's education. If you see your child is struggling in any way, then go to the teacher and work something out. Public school has a multitude of programs to assist you and with the "NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND" there's really no excuse (learning disability or whatever) to not have your child succeed. We have what is called a 504 plan for my son. Basically, it is a legal document that will follow him through High School. I can dicatate (if need be) every move/action the teacher makes in regards to my son. It is NOT that way now but the option exists. This is available to all parents at any public school. Last, I can claim all you do about my son's public school. That is why we are "dishing out the money" to live in a nice area. Therefore, the crime and bullying you speak of really isn't an issue where we live. If it does happen, then my son will take care of it with help from his Dad and I. I think a lot of people are very mis-guided about not only private school but homeschooling and unschooling as well. Part of education is not just academics. There is so much more. In today's world, there is very little chance for self-sufficiency without a decent education. Also, you need to have skills beyond that. If you can't deal with people or situations that may come up in life (like bullying) you are not likely to have a lot of job offers. In a public school setting, although not perfect, there is much more to learn on a social level. You learn to wait your turn, respect others and that there are consequences for your actions that can affect your whole class. Anyone who thinks the majority of private schools kids are perfect, think again. When I was young, these were among the most wild of us all. They just had the $$ to get out of most any trouble.
All in all, a good education can come from a good public school. I agree, not all are good. There are some even in my district I would not send my kids to. That is why my hubby and I are very careful if we decided to buy another house in this area. We want to make sure we stay within school lines that we like. Also, if a parent expects the school to teach everything to their child then they are in error. I am in my son's class every week helping out. No, I am not Room Mom every year but I am there. I have been on Field Trips and helped out with parties and such. I consider myself lucky to be able to do this even though I work full time. There is academic education which I believe needs to be done by people who are qualified- someone with teaching credentials. For what it's worth, I also believe anyone who homeschools/unschools should have these same credentials. Then there is the other edcuation which is about life. This is up to parents.
Last, don't assume every kid in public school has parents who don't care. Just as you assume this there are people who assume things about you and your choices. You are not the only parent who is involved in your child's life the way you are. I have many many friends who are teachers in public schools and I can tell you they are far more trained than anyone realizes. They are concerned and they do teach every child no matter how big their class is. Also, in public school in 1st and 2nd grade the class size has to be UNDER 20 kids...again lower than most private schools. My friends also say their biggest battle is not teaching the kids but dealing with parents. Food for thought. First I would like to say that I am glad for you that you are able to live in a nice neighborhood and spend a lot of money to send your children to the "best" schools. I am not as fortunate. I live in the heart of Philadelphia, Pa. I WILL homeschool my child. She is 2 and she is already learning a lot. I am very proud of her. You mentioned about the No Child Left Behind. All that means to me is even is a child is failing in school they will not keep the child back and make them repeat that grade. So These children are our future and they will not be able to read or write because the public school system just pushes them right through. Also most children who are diagnosed with ADD or ADHD are being done in the public school system and they have to be put on medicine and I don't think that is the solution to the problem and there is a book that you can only get from Amazon.com called The harsh truth about public schools. Get the book and read it it will open your eyes to just how bad the public schools are. Just my opinion. |
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November 21, 2006, 4:00 pm PST
Quote From: kschmittz My husband and I are very "concerned" with our children's education, therefore, we moved to a higher end area with good public schools. My oldest son is 8 and in 3rd grade. He is almost a year younger than most of the other kids as their Moms kept them back a year. He is doing above average work and not having any issues. I think there is A LOT of mis-understanding about public schools. First, in my son's class there are LESS kids than the average area's private schools. Next, there are boudaries set by the district on w hat they can teach your child that do not exist in private school. In private school (I found this out after we checked out private schools and from a teacher) they can teach whatever they see fit. Also, it is up to the parent to be involved in their child's education. If you see your child is struggling in any way, then go to the teacher and work something out. Public school has a multitude of programs to assist you and with the "NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND" there's really no excuse (learning disability or whatever) to not have your child succeed. We have what is called a 504 plan for my son. Basically, it is a legal document that will follow him through High School. I can dicatate (if need be) every move/action the teacher makes in regards to my son. It is NOT that way now but the option exists. This is available to all parents at any public school. Last, I can claim all you do about my son's public school. That is why we are "dishing out the money" to live in a nice area. Therefore, the crime and bullying you speak of really isn't an issue where we live. If it does happen, then my son will take care of it with help from his Dad and I. I think a lot of people are very mis-guided about not only private school but homeschooling and unschooling as well. Part of education is not just academics. There is so much more. In today's world, there is very little chance for self-sufficiency without a decent education. Also, you need to have skills beyond that. If you can't deal with people or situations that may come up in life (like bullying) you are not likely to have a lot of job offers. In a public school setting, although not perfect, there is much more to learn on a social level. You learn to wait your turn, respect others and that there are consequences for your actions that can affect your whole class. Anyone who thinks the majority of private schools kids are perfect, think again. When I was young, these were among the most wild of us all. They just had the $$ to get out of most any trouble.
All in all, a good education can come from a good public school. I agree, not all are good. There are some even in my district I would not send my kids to. That is why my hubby and I are very careful if we decided to buy another house in this area. We want to make sure we stay within school lines that we like. Also, if a parent expects the school to teach everything to their child then they are in error. I am in my son's class every week helping out. No, I am not Room Mom every year but I am there. I have been on Field Trips and helped out with parties and such. I consider myself lucky to be able to do this even though I work full time. There is academic education which I believe needs to be done by people who are qualified- someone with teaching credentials. For what it's worth, I also believe anyone who homeschools/unschools should have these same credentials. Then there is the other edcuation which is about life. This is up to parents.
Last, don't assume every kid in public school has parents who don't care. Just as you assume this there are people who assume things about you and your choices. You are not the only parent who is involved in your child's life the way you are. I have many many friends who are teachers in public schools and I can tell you they are far more trained than anyone realizes. They are concerned and they do teach every child no matter how big their class is. Also, in public school in 1st and 2nd grade the class size has to be UNDER 20 kids...again lower than most private schools. My friends also say their biggest battle is not teaching the kids but dealing with parents. Food for thought. Bullying has gotten a lot worse then when I was in public school. Eons ago. Even good neighborhoods have kids bringing knives and guns to school. There have been tons of articles in my local paper about kids getting in fights at school and other kids taking pictures with their cell phones and posting the fight to MySpace and other websites. The teachers are scared to break the kids up for fear of getting hurt. And excuse me but you aren't likely to be bullied and harrassed at work, there are LAWS against it and employers do a much better job of preventing bullying and harassment then public schools do as they don't want to get stuck with lawsuits. And not everyone can afford to buy a house in a high end neighborhood.
Why do you assume that you need teaching credentials to "teach"? Why do you assume that homeschooling parents aren't providing their students (children) with a top notch education. The public schools measure a teachers success by student performance so consider this.
I do not have teaching credentials, I have an associates degree in Marketing. I homeschooled my eldest son until he was 15, at 15 he took the ACT and scored a 28 which made him eligible for early admission to college. He started college at 16. He is 17 now and in his second year of college he also works after school by anyones definition he is a success. He is majoring in computer science.
Or consider Christopher Paolini who was homeschooled all his life, graduated at 15 wrote Eragon which is a best seller and has been made into a movie that will be released in December
I don't assume that you don't care because you send your child to public school; you sound like a very caring parent. But please don't assume that homeschooled kids are handicapped or crippled for life because their parents choose an educational choice that was different then the one you made for your kids. |
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November 24, 2006, 6:17 am PST
Quote From: kschmittz My husband and I are very "concerned" with our children's education, therefore, we moved to a higher end area with good public schools. My oldest son is 8 and in 3rd grade. He is almost a year younger than most of the other kids as their Moms kept them back a year. He is doing above average work and not having any issues. I think there is A LOT of mis-understanding about public schools. First, in my son's class there are LESS kids than the average area's private schools. Next, there are boudaries set by the district on w hat they can teach your child that do not exist in private school. In private school (I found this out after we checked out private schools and from a teacher) they can teach whatever they see fit. Also, it is up to the parent to be involved in their child's education. If you see your child is struggling in any way, then go to the teacher and work something out. Public school has a multitude of programs to assist you and with the "NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND" there's really no excuse (learning disability or whatever) to not have your child succeed. We have what is called a 504 plan for my son. Basically, it is a legal document that will follow him through High School. I can dicatate (if need be) every move/action the teacher makes in regards to my son. It is NOT that way now but the option exists. This is available to all parents at any public school. Last, I can claim all you do about my son's public school. That is why we are "dishing out the money" to live in a nice area. Therefore, the crime and bullying you speak of really isn't an issue where we live. If it does happen, then my son will take care of it with help from his Dad and I. I think a lot of people are very mis-guided about not only private school but homeschooling and unschooling as well. Part of education is not just academics. There is so much more. In today's world, there is very little chance for self-sufficiency without a decent education. Also, you need to have skills beyond that. If you can't deal with people or situations that may come up in life (like bullying) you are not likely to have a lot of job offers. In a public school setting, although not perfect, there is much more to learn on a social level. You learn to wait your turn, respect others and that there are consequences for your actions that can affect your whole class. Anyone who thinks the majority of private schools kids are perfect, think again. When I was young, these were among the most wild of us all. They just had the $$ to get out of most any trouble.
All in all, a good education can come from a good public school. I agree, not all are good. There are some even in my district I would not send my kids to. That is why my hubby and I are very careful if we decided to buy another house in this area. We want to make sure we stay within school lines that we like. Also, if a parent expects the school to teach everything to their child then they are in error. I am in my son's class every week helping out. No, I am not Room Mom every year but I am there. I have been on Field Trips and helped out with parties and such. I consider myself lucky to be able to do this even though I work full time. There is academic education which I believe needs to be done by people who are qualified- someone with teaching credentials. For what it's worth, I also believe anyone who homeschools/unschools should have these same credentials. Then there is the other edcuation which is about life. This is up to parents.
Last, don't assume every kid in public school has parents who don't care. Just as you assume this there are people who assume things about you and your choices. You are not the only parent who is involved in your child's life the way you are. I have many many friends who are teachers in public schools and I can tell you they are far more trained than anyone realizes. They are concerned and they do teach every child no matter how big their class is. Also, in public school in 1st and 2nd grade the class size has to be UNDER 20 kids...again lower than most private schools. My friends also say their biggest battle is not teaching the kids but dealing with parents. Food for thought. You indicated with No Child Left Behind and the programs instituted now at schools that there is "no excuse" for even "learning disabled" children not to succeed in a public school. While these programs at the schools are wonderful, and my children have participated in them, the reason this is not an accurate statement is because some children have neurological problems that must be fixed before any program will cause a child to succeed in school--be it public or homeschool setting. You cannot simply pour even more water into a pot with a hole in the bottom expecting the result to the different.
By way of example, if a child is left ear dominant and right eye dominant, no amount of continuous reading through reading clubs or other programs is going to fix that neurological confusion. Public schools are simply not required to resolve that, nor should they be responsible for doing so. Your state has the 504, others have an IEP (individualized education plan). Yes, a parent can request multiple services for their children using these documents/rights. In my state, the school being asked to provide services has the right to refuse services a parent might think are necessary for their child to succeed on the basis that it is not a necessary service for the child's education. For example, a parent may request at the IEP (as it is in my state) end of school year meeting that their child receive occupational therapy for a weak handgrip which results in poor, difficult, labored handwriting which will profoundly impact that child for the rest of his/her life, but most importantly demotivates a child to engage in writing at school. The school can choose to deny those services on the grounds that the child can actually write. Therefore, there are reasons for children not to succeed with the public school programs, and to suggest that a child with these problems is better off in public schools versus homeschooling is simply not accurate.
I am sure you are not trying to say that a child must endure bullying tactics at school to get a good job. I am also sure you are not saying that only public schools can teach social skills or consequences for actions. I think it is well-settled even herein that is not the case.
With regard to a family's decision to homeschool, a typical toddler takes in information at lightning speed, learns, digests that information within minutes, and moves on to the next conquest. That doesn't change when they reach the age of 5 or 6. However, at the age of 5 or 6, they enter public school and are then asked to sit quietly and spend 15 minutes learning about a frog. This example is not an indictment of a public school. Rather, it reveals a learning method which is one of the many reasons people may choose to homeschool their children.
I am glad you are finding wonderful success in public schools for your children. I am finding great success for my children through homeschooling.
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