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Topic : 03/27 More Wifestyles, Part 3

Number of Replies: 1158
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Created on : Thursday, March 23, 2006, 07:13:20 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
The letters keep coming in! Dr. Phil revisits the controversial topic of what defines the role of a wife. Ken thinks his wife, Diana, is lazy because she can't keep the house up to his standard of cleanliness. Ken works two jobs and keeps his spouse financially comfortable but doesn't understand why Diana, a stay-at-home mom, can't keep a cleaner house. Diana is pregnant with their third child in five years and says she's doing the best she can. Then, meet "Anne," who performs nude shows online to bring home the bacon. Her husband, "Rob," disapproves of his wife's method of income, but he hasn't stopped her from doing it. Now that Anne has had an affair with one of her customers, is it too late to save their marriage? Share your thoughts.

Find out what happened on the show.

More March 2006 Show Boards.

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October 14, 2006, 8:20 pm CDT

03/27 More Wifestyles, Part 3

Quote From: kschmittz

"I think that staying home is "superior" IN MY LIFE than daycare. Just like you feel that daycare is "superior" to staying home IN YOUR LIFE. "

 

I have never even said anything close to this so where you get this is beyond me.  YOU stated that we are not "on the same level" because you are home and I'm not.  The assumption that only daycare workers are caring for my children is absurd!  Yes, I am proud to have the kids that I do- they are great.  However, I am humble enough to know that others have helped me and contributed their time and efforts.  I cannot be everything to them and I realize that.  I also think a lot of at home Moms have help they don't appreciate or recognize and take for granted.  Also, for you to sit and "cry poor" like you do really bothers me, too.  You could work or maybe you could manage money better to have more for your daughter.  Just as we could sell our place and live in a trailer park and I could homeschool so I could be home.  You made a choice just as I did.  I will not stay home just so I can watch my boys go without.  All in all, you do feel superior, you stated it and now you are trying to be friends for whatever reason.  You ask for forgiveness yet you are an atheist....that's interesting. I can forgive you as I feel you have issues you need to work on. 

 

As for posting pics of my kids, mabye when I come up for air I will do that!  For now,  I have two kids who need me with them...not on the computer! 

"YOU stated that we are not "on the same level" because you are home and I'm not."

I apologized for that for the 237,456th time Kira!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quit MILKING it to death...GET OVER IT already. You are so UNFORGIVING! GET OVER IT!

And I haven't "cried poor"!!! I have said I live simply, by choice, because I value staying home MORE than having more material things. (And before you FLIP out about that comment, I KNOW you work because you have to...you've said that and I understand that, that is simply NOT THE CASE for me!!!)

"You could work or maybe you could manage money better to have more for your daughter."

I don't lack anything for my daughter! She has MORE than enough of everything, she's healthy, well fed, has a roof over her head and we live in a safe neighborhood with low crime. What exactly do you think I'm not giving her? How dare you!

"I will not stay home just so I can watch my boys go without."

Again, go with out WHAT?!? My daughter goes with out NOTHING.

"All in all, you do feel superior, you stated it and now you are trying to be friends for whatever reason."

Because I don't want to fight anymore! But I will defend myself from nonsense remarks you make.

"You ask for forgiveness yet you are an atheist....that's interesting."

How is that interesting? You think atheists don't believe in forgiveness? Or you think an atheist doesn't deserve forgiveness? I'm curious. REALLY, I don't get what me being an atheist has to do with you forgiving me for something I apologized for repeatedly. Can you explain that please? Does it say somewhere in the bible that you don't have to forgive atheist...this comment made me laugh a little...LOL I have heard strange things since I've been an atheist but this is in my top 5...LOL

" I can forgive you as I feel you have issues you need to work on. "

What "issues"? Why are you so arrogant and superior sounding to me all of a sudden? I made one remark to you months ago and have apologized profusely since and you still bring it up, milking it and milking it. Why am I the one with the "issue"? Hmmm? Seems to me that you have the issue. I have never in my life encountered this kind of unforgiven...I was molested as a little girl and I forgave the man who did it. I think what I did to you was markedly less bad Kira.

"For now,  I have two kids who need me with them...not on the computer! "

I suppose that's true, you spend 40+ hours a week away from them, I assume you'd want to spend your time off with them. As for me....I spend 90% of my time with my daughter, so I am not impressed by your backhanded insult to me.  I feel free to spend time on the computer because my daughter is an individual as am I and we both desire time to ourselves. It's only healthy for both of us.

I wrote to you things that I thought you'd like to talk about, besides this asinine fight that you refuse to let go.

Since you are taking what I said months ago so far, and milking it so hard, and being so unforgiving and exaggerating the hurt it caused you and your dramatics over it I have to assume all other "comments" you get you have an equally insane reaction to.  The way you treat me with my comment is indicative of the way you treat other comments made about you and to you. So I think your exaggerating greatly.
 
October 14, 2006, 8:29 pm CDT

03/27 More Wifestyles, Part 3

Quote From: julie1418

I am absolutely stunned by your response to me. I feel like I offer you olive branches and you hand me back thorns. You blast Penny for a comment she made months ago and has apologized for repeatedly, yet you post this to me?

 

I think a lot of women marry with one thought in mind- he can support me so I can stay home.  They don't look much beyond that.  Then, when they are home and things get tough (cuz it is no picnic) they don't want "a boss" telling them what to do. 

 

Are you kidding me? You don't get this would be offensive to me and other stay at home Moms. You are all upset for being judged for working, yet you hand out this judgment?? Unbelievable.

 

For the record, I do not feel like I have unequal status in my marriage because I also married my best friend. He saw some of the wifestyles shows, and I could not print the words he used to describe those husbands. He does not treat me like an employee. The judgment of being being unequal comes from others, just as the judgment you face for using daycare comes not from your husband, but from others.

 

You keep making these assumptions that SAHMs do it so they don't have to really work and that they are lucky that their husbands support "their" choice to stay home. That is ridiculous. I didn't REFUSE to work. My husband knew before he met me that he wanted to be a Dad and that he wanted his wife to stay home to raise the children. It was never a question or a struggle for us, it was OUR decision to set up our family this way. I REALIZE that the fact that my husband makes a substantial amount of money made this decision an easy one, but that does not make the decision any less mutual. I resent you implying that I married my husband as a meal ticket. You really have accepting the idea that a marriage with a SAHM could be an equal partnership.

 

 I get frustrated, though, when another Mom begrduges me or mine for having maybe what they don't.  For example, my kids are well taken care of.  Not spoiled but they have enough.  Why, then, do I have to feel guilty about working? 

 

Okay, well I get frustrated when another Mom begrudges me or mine because we don't have to use daycare. You DON'T have to feel guilty about working. Why you do is YOUR issue. It is SO obvious that you are struggling with guilt and resentment. What would be nice is if you could stop hurling insults at SAHMs to alleviate your own frustrations and guilt.

 

I have posted numerous times that I would probably work before I would live on the financial edge. So to insist that I say it is always superior to stay home is silly. No two families have the exact same circumstances, so there is no one size fits all way to do things. Sometimes I think you would only be happy if all Moms got a job, put their kids in daycare, and let you have a big "I told you so!"

 

Okay, well I get frustrated when another Mom begrudges me or mine because we don't have to use daycare. You DON'T have to feel guilty about working. Why you do is YOUR issue. It is SO obvious that you are struggling with guilt and resentment. What would be nice is if you could stop hurling insults at SAHMs to alleviate your own frustrations and guilt.

Julie I couldn't agree more. And that makes me sad. Honestly. Kira is probably a wonderful and sweet woman, but these emotions make her hard and irrational.
 
October 14, 2006, 9:19 pm CDT

03/27 More Wifestyles, Part 3

I agree Julie. I'm done too. I think it's painfully obvious that Kira has guilt about not being able to stay home and that's a shame, because I'm sure her family is doing just great...seems like she in unable to enjoy her life in general when so obsessed about those who don't approve.

I am stunned that she says she dislikes people judging her and then turns around and judges me for being an atheist, judges you for your husbands long hours.

Kira, it's not our fault that your filled with an obvious guilt. (It's just just us, I have received numerous emails of people who lurk here who pointed out the same thing.)

You have NOTHING to feel guilt over, you are probably a wonderful mom, a wonderful professional and you deserve to enjoy your life fully and totally.

This has become an act of ramming my head against a brick wall. So I, too, am done.

Have a nice life Kira, I honestly mean that. (Atheist are people too....)
 
October 15, 2006, 6:50 am CDT

Purple...just a thought...

Quote From: purplepenny

I agree Julie. I'm done too. I think it's painfully obvious that Kira has guilt about not being able to stay home and that's a shame, because I'm sure her family is doing just great...seems like she in unable to enjoy her life in general when so obsessed about those who don't approve.

I am stunned that she says she dislikes people judging her and then turns around and judges me for being an atheist, judges you for your husbands long hours.

Kira, it's not our fault that your filled with an obvious guilt. (It's just just us, I have received numerous emails of people who lurk here who pointed out the same thing.)

You have NOTHING to feel guilt over, you are probably a wonderful mom, a wonderful professional and you deserve to enjoy your life fully and totally.

This has become an act of ramming my head against a brick wall. So I, too, am done.

Have a nice life Kira, I honestly mean that. (Atheist are people too....)

Wow! Looks like I hit a nerve and a big one, too.  First, please point out where I have JUDGED you for being an atheist.  I have simply stated a fact- no judgment.  Big difference.  Also, I have not "judged" Julie's husband for working long hours.  Simply stated I'm lucky I have mine home every night.  Yes, I know you and the other have never said anything to make me feel guilty.  You have all been supportive of my position as a Mother and willing to accept I'm doing an equal job to all of you.  Your right I am a wonderful Mom and despite what you think, I do enjoy life to the fullest.  Also, when I mention your daughter may or may not have this or that you seem really defensive.  Does that mean you feel guilty?  Maybe, maybe not.  It sounds like you are providing basics and struggling with that.  That's great if all your daughter needs are basic necessities but from someone whose kids are older their needs change.  Their clothes cost more and if you put in any activity it also costs money.  College is also something that is not free.   All in all, you are not wiling to see anyone's side other than your own.  Just to set the record straight, you want forgiveness, why?  I have read your posts over and over and there is no remorse for what you said and you don't say anything to the contrary.  Why is my forgiveness so important?  If you feel strongly about your position then so be it.  I feel strongly about mine which is:

 

Being a Mom is NOT about staying home or working.  It doesn't matter if you use daycare or not.  It's about what you do for your kids.   It's about loving them, teaching them and doing what's right for them, not for you.  It's not about what "feels" good to you.  It's about making sure they have every opportunity available to them throughout life.  It's about keeping them safe and healthy.  You are not a better parent because__________ (you fill in the blank.)  We all do it differently and make choices based on our situation.  We'd all make different choices if that situation changed

 

You can read what you want into that.  I have stated my position simply and plainly.  I'm sorry it's offensive and causes so much distraught among everyone.  However, I will defend my position just as others defend theirs.  I don't feel superior/inferior because I use daycare.  I am proud of what I've done for my kids and what I provide for them.  I am proud I could put aside my own wants/feelings to give them what they have.  I have made sacrifices far beyond materialistic ones but I don't regret it.  They have far beyond materialistic things and I am proud they have a good marriage of Mom and Dad to look back on.  I get offended when others question me and judge me.  It happens and yes, I fight back.  Wouldn't you?

 
October 15, 2006, 6:52 am CDT

You missed a lot then..

Quote From: julie1418

Kira, YOU don't get it.  I have never seen Penny "cry poor". You ASKED her how she earned staying at home, and she told you. She explained the financial sacrifices she and her husband decided to make so that she could stay home to care for their daughter.,then you got mad because you didn't like the answer and you blasted her for living in an apartment and not having enough financial security.

 

Your comment about her being an atheist is out of line. Christians don't have a choke hold on forgiveness (as evidenced by these exchanges). You have insulted and made horrible assumptions about SAHMs for months. When is the last time you asked for forgiveness or offered an apology?

 

I think I am done with this. It is clear that you have grown quite attached to that giant chip on your shoulder and there is no point in trying to build a bridge. Good luck in life!

 
October 15, 2006, 7:20 am CDT

Julie...

Quote From: julie1418

Kira, YOU don't get it.  I have never seen Penny "cry poor". You ASKED her how she earned staying at home, and she told you. She explained the financial sacrifices she and her husband decided to make so that she could stay home to care for their daughter.,then you got mad because you didn't like the answer and you blasted her for living in an apartment and not having enough financial security.

 

Your comment about her being an atheist is out of line. Christians don't have a choke hold on forgiveness (as evidenced by these exchanges). You have insulted and made horrible assumptions about SAHMs for months. When is the last time you asked for forgiveness or offered an apology?

 

I think I am done with this. It is clear that you have grown quite attached to that giant chip on your shoulder and there is no point in trying to build a bridge. Good luck in life!

First  off, Purple does cry poor so I'm sorry you have missed that.  She stated that she doesn't have a home, a back yard, new clothes because she stays home with her daughter.  I do not understand her answer about how she "earned" staying home.  It made no sense. I explained to her that dual income families made the SAME sacrifices as she did and she had snippy, snide comments for that as well.   She and I started off on the wrong foot due to HER COMMENTS, not mine.  Contrary to popular belief,  I can forgive when people truly care about what they said being hurtful, she doesn't.  She feels what she does but  cannot /will not explain why so she asks forgiveness.  Yes, I have asked forgiveness, when I truly felt bad about what I had done/said.  She doesn't.   Her comments continue and she only wants to talk to other Moms who see her point.  Can' t blame her there, so would I. 

 

I am sorry that my comments stun you and you feel so offended.  I simply state facts based on things you have written down and brought to the table.  The "inequality" in single income families and so on.  These are issues you speak about and when I comment, I get blasted.  If they are not issues then why bring them up?  Also, the statement about having a husband who wants a wife to raise his children....please! That is EXACTLY what I'm talking about!  There is no question in my life about who raises my kids- it's me and my husband.  If you knew me you'd know that.  You don't so I can expect you to see anything that might not fit your idea of what "raising kids" is.  This is the type of attitude that is really offensive and degrading to ANY WM out there.  Do you say this to your working Mom friend? 

 Marriage (for me) has much more to it than raising kids.  What will happen then when the kids are "raised" and you have just each other to deal with?    Who knows.  I married someone who I can live my whole life with, not just raise kids with.  Kids grow up and move out .    Our marriage for now is about the kids but eventually I am looking forward to having him all to myself again.  I guess I'm weird. 

 

This whole show started about what women should/shouldn't do, right?   I find it funny all of you stay home and yet you are offended that people think the house should be clean, dinner made and kids taken care of.  Those things need to happen regardless of staying home or working.  Some Moms can leave the dishes to play with the kids, some can't.  Some have housekeepers and nannies, some don't.  Some eat out every night, some don't.  Some hire out for house stuff, some don't.  Some can afford what others can't.   We all make choices for our families that should best suit the entire family - not just ourselves or just the kids.  Please take a look at my response to Purple to see my belief and maybe, just maybe you will "get it".  Take care. 

 
October 15, 2006, 1:56 pm CDT

LOL

Quote From: kschmittz

First  off, Purple does cry poor so I'm sorry you have missed that.  She stated that she doesn't have a home, a back yard, new clothes because she stays home with her daughter.  I do not understand her answer about how she "earned" staying home.  It made no sense. I explained to her that dual income families made the SAME sacrifices as she did and she had snippy, snide comments for that as well.   She and I started off on the wrong foot due to HER COMMENTS, not mine.  Contrary to popular belief,  I can forgive when people truly care about what they said being hurtful, she doesn't.  She feels what she does but  cannot /will not explain why so she asks forgiveness.  Yes, I have asked forgiveness, when I truly felt bad about what I had done/said.  She doesn't.   Her comments continue and she only wants to talk to other Moms who see her point.  Can' t blame her there, so would I. 

 

I am sorry that my comments stun you and you feel so offended.  I simply state facts based on things you have written down and brought to the table.  The "inequality" in single income families and so on.  These are issues you speak about and when I comment, I get blasted.  If they are not issues then why bring them up?  Also, the statement about having a husband who wants a wife to raise his children....please! That is EXACTLY what I'm talking about!  There is no question in my life about who raises my kids- it's me and my husband.  If you knew me you'd know that.  You don't so I can expect you to see anything that might not fit your idea of what "raising kids" is.  This is the type of attitude that is really offensive and degrading to ANY WM out there.  Do you say this to your working Mom friend? 

 Marriage (for me) has much more to it than raising kids.  What will happen then when the kids are "raised" and you have just each other to deal with?    Who knows.  I married someone who I can live my whole life with, not just raise kids with.  Kids grow up and move out .    Our marriage for now is about the kids but eventually I am looking forward to having him all to myself again.  I guess I'm weird. 

 

This whole show started about what women should/shouldn't do, right?   I find it funny all of you stay home and yet you are offended that people think the house should be clean, dinner made and kids taken care of.  Those things need to happen regardless of staying home or working.  Some Moms can leave the dishes to play with the kids, some can't.  Some have housekeepers and nannies, some don't.  Some eat out every night, some don't.  Some hire out for house stuff, some don't.  Some can afford what others can't.   We all make choices for our families that should best suit the entire family - not just ourselves or just the kids.  Please take a look at my response to Purple to see my belief and maybe, just maybe you will "get it".  Take care. 

Offended, not all of us get so offended over crap that other people say and do.

I have been home  practically all day right along with hubby and the girls, it is 430 in he afternoon and lunch dishes are still in the sink waiting to be washed, the girls bedroom and playroom have been pretty well lived in today and they are not getting cleaned this day. I have been scrapbookin, the girls have been playing and watching their shows, doing a little scrapbookin themselves, hubby hasn't felt too good, been laying around and playing his computer game. who cares what others think, if they think my house needs cleaned and dishes need washed, then they are more then welcome to come and do it.

So what should women do? They should love and respect their husbands and be a team player right along with their husbands doing the same. I very rarely clean my house during the day, I clean early morning or late night, and that is if I feel up to it. My husabnd comes home and if dinner is ready, we eat, if not, he bathes the girls or hangs out with them while I get dinner, what's the big deal! Yes, I have been home all day, playing with the girls, doing what  stay at home mommies are suppose to be doing,  taking care of kids and hanging out with them.we play outside, go to the mall, go to the library, we read, academics, hang out, whatever and if there is a moment in between to clean and do dishes, then I will, otherwise, those things can wait til the girls are sleeping or out with daddy and  depending on what is on the agenda, I will do what needs to be done when the opportunity arises.

My marriage is about me and my husband, we love, respect and spend alone time together, we go out on dates on a accasions because we believe our time is just as imporant as our time with our kids, kids need to see a good marriage relationship in progress and they need to learn that life isn't all about them. My kids love date nights, cause they get to hang out with special friends of ours, once a month is the deal for us but I am working on twice a month. Marriage and family is a high priority and that is what wives are suppose to think right along with their husbands, there is no, "you do this and I do this, I do this so you have to do this" There is no "I get paid so  it is your job to cater to me attitude, or I took care of the kids all day now it's your turn" this is the attitude that the people on the shows had and it shows within their marriage relationship.

So to all the stay at home mom's out there, you are a mom, so take care of your kids, take time for your self, and make sure there is time left over for your husband. Appreciate your husbands. Husabnds, love,respect and appreciate your wives and I guarentee you will have a more fullfilling marriage, take time for yourself and make time for your wife, both spouses, cherish one another and take care of the kids together, they will be happy you did.

Now, I addressed this to stay at home mom's because this is what the wife style was about. wives as well as stay at home mom's are not door mats, they have an imporant role and I thank God that I have a husband who knows how lucky he is. All this can also be for working mom's, it comes down to respecting one another, it has absolutely NOTHING to do what others think, what others think has absolutely nothing to do with how I should do things and thank goodness for that.



Happy Parenting every  one and see most of you on the other boards, laeter in the week, maybe tonight,w ho knows but I suppose I should clean the dishes first LOLLLLLLLL






 
October 28, 2006, 8:03 am CDT

Apoliges and Exaggeration.

Quote From: purplepenny

"YOU stated that we are not "on the same level" because you are home and I'm not."

I apologized for that for the 237,456th time Kira!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quit MILKING it to death...GET OVER IT already. You are so UNFORGIVING! GET OVER IT!

And I haven't "cried poor"!!! I have said I live simply, by choice, because I value staying home MORE than having more material things. (And before you FLIP out about that comment, I KNOW you work because you have to...you've said that and I understand that, that is simply NOT THE CASE for me!!!)

"You could work or maybe you could manage money better to have more for your daughter."

I don't lack anything for my daughter! She has MORE than enough of everything, she's healthy, well fed, has a roof over her head and we live in a safe neighborhood with low crime. What exactly do you think I'm not giving her? How dare you!

"I will not stay home just so I can watch my boys go without."

Again, go with out WHAT?!? My daughter goes with out NOTHING.

"All in all, you do feel superior, you stated it and now you are trying to be friends for whatever reason."

Because I don't want to fight anymore! But I will defend myself from nonsense remarks you make.

"You ask for forgiveness yet you are an atheist....that's interesting."

How is that interesting? You think atheists don't believe in forgiveness? Or you think an atheist doesn't deserve forgiveness? I'm curious. REALLY, I don't get what me being an atheist has to do with you forgiving me for something I apologized for repeatedly. Can you explain that please? Does it say somewhere in the bible that you don't have to forgive atheist...this comment made me laugh a little...LOL I have heard strange things since I've been an atheist but this is in my top 5...LOL

" I can forgive you as I feel you have issues you need to work on. "

What "issues"? Why are you so arrogant and superior sounding to me all of a sudden? I made one remark to you months ago and have apologized profusely since and you still bring it up, milking it and milking it. Why am I the one with the "issue"? Hmmm? Seems to me that you have the issue. I have never in my life encountered this kind of unforgiven...I was molested as a little girl and I forgave the man who did it. I think what I did to you was markedly less bad Kira.

"For now,  I have two kids who need me with them...not on the computer! "

I suppose that's true, you spend 40+ hours a week away from them, I assume you'd want to spend your time off with them. As for me....I spend 90% of my time with my daughter, so I am not impressed by your backhanded insult to me.  I feel free to spend time on the computer because my daughter is an individual as am I and we both desire time to ourselves. It's only healthy for both of us.

I wrote to you things that I thought you'd like to talk about, besides this asinine fight that you refuse to let go.

Since you are taking what I said months ago so far, and milking it so hard, and being so unforgiving and exaggerating the hurt it caused you and your dramatics over it I have to assume all other "comments" you get you have an equally insane reaction to.  The way you treat me with my comment is indicative of the way you treat other comments made about you and to you. So I think your exaggerating greatly.

First off, Purple, you are one to talk about exaggeration.  You received one negative comment (which is true) and you go off on a total stranger!  You made more than one comment over the course of these boards and I really don't get the feeling that you see things differently.  I can forgive but not when the person doesn't really hold a different opinion.  All in all, you don't feel working Moms are equal to at home Moms and that most kids don't need to be in daycare- it's just a matter of sacrifcing.  What did I miss?  I could challenge and pick apart your theory but I'm sure it wouldn't change your mind or your life just as your comments do not change mine. 

Next, about living simply...this (in my opinion) doesn't include Internet services.  Just as your computer is important to you working (for some) is important to them.  The difference is that a job provides much more for the FAMILY not just one person.  Yes, there are a lucky few who really choose to work for self fulfillment but most do it for other reasons.  My job provides benefits- health, dental and medical- for the entire family so I feel my 40+ hours is worthy.  Beign that your daughter is only 2 I see no need for Internet in your home other than for you.  Also, you are paying for a service that takes time away from your daughter.  If you are home just for her, to mold her personality and witness every breath,  then I don't see how Interenet/message boards enhance that.  I also challenge your 90% theory.  I could very easily point out that you spend less time than that with her but what's the point?  All in all, you (and the others) will always believe a women who is home is always the better, more dedicated parent.  That is very  sad for you and your kids.  I love the fact that my children see so many different ways to live and do things throughout our town.  Yes, there is a lot of money here but also a lot of hard working, dual income families.  We all do what we can for the other to benefit the community- not just our own.  It's really nice.  Hope you can see my points someday....take care!

 

 

 
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