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Topic : 04/17 Dangerous Kids

Number of Replies: 260
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Created on : Thursday, April 13, 2006, 01:12:18 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

What happens when a child you’ve loved and raised turns against you? Meet families who are afraid for their lives because their children are angry and incredibly violent. Thirteen-year-old Nick is so out of control, he has used an ax to destroy his home, often chokes his little brother, and has threatened friends and family members with a knife! His aunt, Tonya, fears for the family's safety so much that she calls every morning just to make sure her sister is still alive. Dr. Phil informs Nick's parents, Greg and Trisha, that they have a tough decision to make. Then, Laurie says her 14-year-old daughter, Mariah, hates her so much that she feels Mariah is capable of killing her. They get in knock-down, drag-out fights at least twice a week that don't end until Mariah is physically pulled off her mother by her stepfather. Laurie's husband, Don, is ready to call it quits because he can't deal with his stepdaughter's violent and rebellious behavior. What is behind Mariah’s anger? Talk about the show here.

 

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April 17, 2006, 11:25 am CDT

Awesome post!

Quote From: buckleypat

I may be going out on a limb here and maybe will reamed six ways to Sunday.  But, I think a lot of people could benefit from watching Cesar Millan on "Dog Whisperer".  I know, I KNOW that dogs are not people and people are not dogs but his understanding of psychology seems to transcend those boundaries. 

 

Basics:

- Establish yourself as the leader with a "calm assertive" behavior rather than a nervous, aggressive energy which just may bounce of the child and feedback to you from the child as nervous aggressive energy in tumultuous moments

- Set rules, boundaries and limitations

- Exercise (in the case of children maybe activity), discipline and then affection

 

This guy has taken aggressive and out of control, vicious animals and totally rehabilitated them.  I think his psychology has some merit in the people (parent/child) arena and it may take a while to "get it".  But, for what it's worth . . . watch the show.  "Dog Whisperer".   You need to watch it more than once.  I was not impressed with the first two or three times. 

I have no doubt this will work with kids.  And spanking & yelling only serves to fuel nervous, aggressive, negative energy in the household.
 
April 17, 2006, 11:26 am CDT

My Prayer for All

Just want to extend the love of God to everyone on this site, believer or not:

 

Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

Cast me not away from Your presence; and take not Thy Holy Spirit from me.

Restore unto me the joys of Thy salvation and uphold me with a willing spirit.

 

Psalm 51:10-12  I am experiencing this, and still learning!  Love to you all, Susanpear

 
April 17, 2006, 11:36 am CDT

Comments

Quote From: susanpear

Hi Groovy, it's Susanpear.

 

How are you?  I'm good.  Upon reading your response to Busterss, I feel led to comment.  I am torn between the two sides "Spare the rod, spoil the child" and "Violence begets violence".  With all due respect to you, I would like to share something.  I realize you may not be a Christian, so I don't mean to offend you in any way.

 

I attended our Good Friday service.  The subject of  Jesus' death started out as "why would a Father allow this to happen to His Son?"  Jesus was obedient unto death on the cross.  Of course He is God's Son and created solely for our redemption.  No other person is born for that purpose, of course, which includes children of the past and today.  The rest of us are born with a sinful nature.  Jesus was sinless.  He made the perfect sacrifice for our sins, and He is alive again so we can triumph over death.  God does not want us to live in fear or be inconsiderate, spoiled brats  But He does expect a healthy respect in our attitude toward Him and others.  There is a balance that needs to be achieved here.

 

Now,  I am NOT advocating violence at all!  The spanking issue is controversial, I agree.  There are many clever ways to discipline our children.  Sometimes, parents like me do not have anyone to talk to or get advise from in the heat of the moment.  Since becoming a mom in 1988, I saw that many kids are too aggresive, spoiled, contradictory, interruptive and show poor manners.  I did employ spanks when they were very young after they were warned first.  I did not do it the second they acted up or disobeyed.  I agree that Busterss came across more extreme.  However, he does have a point.  Kids take over and become little tyrants if we stay passive.  My girls were very good at the baby and elementary school age.  I knew the physical discipline had to stop AFTER THEY WERE OLDER, and learn to impose more effective consequences instead.  It's about getting a grip on the children while they are very young.  Sometimes spanking backfires and the effects depend upon the temper of the parent employing it.  I remember how much more respectful kids were to their parents when I was a kid.  Kids did fear their parents more, but the parents also showered them with love when they were behaving respectfully.   A firm hand is needed for kids of today.  That does not necessarily mean spanking, but somehow the children need to know that the parent is to be obeyed - not disrepected!

 

Thanks for listening.  Hope you are healthy and happy. Susan

 

 

Hi Susan, great to hear from you.  Doing well & glad to have taxes out of the way.

 

Re. the Easter service, I think we're all capable of both good & bad behavior, given the right or wrong circumstances, so that probably jives with us all being sinners.

 

I too see too many aggressive, spoiled, ill-mannered children & I think that stems from lack of discipline.  (And discipline does not equate with spanking.)  I think many of today's parents are waaay too lenient, parenting from guilt , wanting to be the kid's friend, & never wanting the kid to experience frustration of any kind.  It's easy short-term to take the easy way out:  giving in to every tantrum or the other easy way out (spanking) to obtain short-term order in the household or public place where the kid is having a tantrum.  It's more work in the short-term to establish time outs, loss of priviledges, etc:  non-corporal consistent punishment & rewards.  But in the long-term, the household is more orderly & the child is well-behaved out of respect, not out of fear. 

 

 

 
April 17, 2006, 11:42 am CDT

What I meant...

Quote From: lotofshoes

People Like you !! now thats rude!! they have the right to discipline the way they want to....But  YOU just LUMPED us all into one big Bible thumping clump....lol  They don't hand out a manual at CHURCH on how to beat your Child....Some Christians don't Beat  childrern ....a Spanking is done ONLY on the BUTT...not legs not back not head...those are Psychos not loving parents...

Sign....People Like YOU....

By "people like you" I mean mean the "spare the rod spoil the child crowd."  Not Christians as a group, not church goers as a group. 

 

So what, spanking is done on the butt.  It's a word for HITTING in that one particular area of the body.  It's still HITTING & still VIOLENT.    

 
April 17, 2006, 12:03 pm CDT

Thanks for the Advise!

Quote From: killerb255

To an extent, I was actually one of those dangerous children. 

 

My sisters annoyed me so much when I was 12 that I scared them by stabbing knives in their bedroom door. 

 

I also hit my mother after getting so angry when I was 16. 

 

I had major anger problems back then.  At that time, anger was a blanket of protection for me--a blanket of protection for the ridicule I've taken from peers and the lack of understanding my family had for the problems I had.  Eventually, I had to do something which I never heard verbalized until I started watching Dr. Phil six months ago: give yourself the love you wish others would give you. 

 

Was there any excuse for any of my past behavior?  Of course there wasn't.  I have to live with the memories of these incidents for the rest of my life, learn from them, what's behind that anger (as Dr. Phil says, behind anger, there's always something else).  My mother didn't deserve any of that, and neither did my sisters.  I wish I never did any of those things, but that's reality.  

 

I'm not violent at all now.  In fact, I'm actually quite calm now, often a mediator for many disputes, knowing how little fighting solves and how much more problems it causes.  A lot of my positive changes over the years is because I'm now aware of some of the problems I had: ADD in particular, although my current counselor is looking into possiblities of Asperger's syndrome and depression, and whether any depression symptoms are because of true clinical depression or if they were a result of trying to cope with society's reaction to my various issues, which happens often with ADD/ADHD and autism spectrum disorders). 

 

I was in counseling twice during my teenage years: one for communication skills, the other for anger management.  My mom still insists, to this very day, that I got nothing out of these sessions, although I beg to differ (from her perspective, she was desperately looking for a solution, and was frustrated that dramatic changes didn't happen--I was only in these sessions for a month each: one at age 14, the other at age 17).  If I didn't get anything out of these sessions, I would have probably been in jail at various times in my life (and I currently have no criminal record, and no plans on having one).

 

I've also taken martial arts at age 14, which, unfortunately, made things worse, as, at the time, I didn't want a fix for my anger problems (again, it was a blanket of protection for me). 

 

So my advice goes to two different groups of people:

 

1) If you are a teenager with major anger problems, you need to ask yourself what's behind your anger.  Is it fear?  Is it frustration?  Are you afraid of someone within your family or something bad happening?  Are you frustrated because the ones close to you don't understand you?  Are you using your anger as way to dominate others or look tough?  If any of these things are true, then you need to talk to your school counselor, church pastor, or anyone you can reside confidence in so you can get whatever's hurting you under control and find some closure before you hurt the people you care about the most any further. 

 

2) If you are living with a teenager who has major problems with anger, then look at #1 above and ask this person some of these questions without getting angry and frustrated yourself.  In addition, you may also want to take them into counseling.  There can be other problems as well:

 

- Depression

- Bipolar Disorder

- ADD/ADHD

- Oppositional Defiant Disorder

- Conduct Disorder (which is often a sign of future Antisocial Personality Disorder, psychopathy, or sociopathy)

 

if nothing is done about their issues, it could lead into some grim possibilities:

 

- suicide

- homicides

- aggravated battery

 

Although, to be honest, if your teenager does have Conduct Disorder, then I think everyone here should be saying prayers for you, as psychopathy is some really bad stuff: your son/daughter has no conscience, no ability to learn from his/her mistakes, and no remorse when hurting others.  Some say there's no cure for this.  I personally would like to find out if there are any reformed psychopaths, sociopaths, or people that have had ASPD...

Hi Killerb255.  My username is Susanpear.

 

I have just become more healed by following that advise:  "Give yourself the love you wish others would give you".  It started by my listening to my favorite style of music (music that invigorates my soul and brings out the good endorphins), pursuing my craft hobbies, and improving my conduct and role as wife and mom.  Also, I brain-stormed on how I could escape the oppressive situations in my home - what kind of goals I could set.  I learned to use the internet to gather information.  I can get away from home for a few hours to calm down and reflect.   I am also working on what kind of gainful employment I might do, and improving my skills.  For years, I resisted working on MYSELF!  After all, I thought, it's others who are doing the hurting!  But I finally learned and it works.

 

I have two daughters who are 17 and 13.  The 13-year-old has a problem with anger and frustration.  I think she feels like no one understands her, and only recently have I tried to be more sensitive and instructive in positive ways.  Yet I haven't got all the answers and we will continue to have set backs I'm sure.  Her problems include:  bossing us around about bedtime, getting too technical in arguments, always fighting for the last word, fighting back (verbally) when I have to remind her of her responsibilities, cutting me off when I try to explain, using rude tones and expressions, acting equally authoritative to me (as if I am not older than her or deserving of respectful parent status), yelling/screaming when things escalate.  Fortunately, she doesn't use foul language nor does my other daughter.  I admit I have used foul language for years.  Am trying to stop now.  Although nothing dangerous is going on, destructive behavior has been executed by me, my husband, and her.  My 17-yr-old has come to my defense against her many times, because I have usually fallen apart during the battles and disintegrate into crying.  My stomach has been turning near the time she comes home from school.

 

I have recently been in a severe depression, endured a loveless marriage for 22 years, and just recovered from breast cancer treatment.  I really value your message and believe you are right on the button.  Thanks!  Susanpear

 

 

 
April 17, 2006, 12:09 pm CDT

Hi!

Quote From: groovy

Hi Susan, great to hear from you.  Doing well & glad to have taxes out of the way.

 

Re. the Easter service, I think we're all capable of both good & bad behavior, given the right or wrong circumstances, so that probably jives with us all being sinners.

 

I too see too many aggressive, spoiled, ill-mannered children & I think that stems from lack of discipline.  (And discipline does not equate with spanking.)  I think many of today's parents are waaay too lenient, parenting from guilt , wanting to be the kid's friend, & never wanting the kid to experience frustration of any kind.  It's easy short-term to take the easy way out:  giving in to every tantrum or the other easy way out (spanking) to obtain short-term order in the household or public place where the kid is having a tantrum.  It's more work in the short-term to establish time outs, loss of priviledges, etc:  non-corporal consistent punishment & rewards.  But in the long-term, the household is more orderly & the child is well-behaved out of respect, not out of fear. 

 

 

Hi Groovy!  I wish I had known how to get on these chat sites before, when parenting was new and daunting!  That's the best way to exchange advise before things escalate.  Thanks so much!

Love, Susanpear

 
April 17, 2006, 12:13 pm CDT

Mental Illness or Past Child Abuse

My brother, like Nick had the same problems. He was always a "problem child", threatening people with knives, being very violent. We found out when he was 17, he has Schizophrenia/Bipolar/Pshychosis.  I was physically abused by my mother for the first 7 yrs of my life. My Dad raised me from 7 on. By the time I got to be around 14, I turned on them both. I never recieved treatment or couseling until I was 16. I became very violent, when I got grounded. The most minor things would prompt me to go after my dad and tear up the house. After treatment, I became much better at handling anger, but I still have communication issues. I still tend to suppress negative emotions.
 
April 17, 2006, 12:26 pm CDT

Help is not easy to find

Help is not always easy to find for children who become dangerous. My son is also 13, he has been dignosed with Aspergers.  Trying to get councling for him and even with insurance, its to expensive, I can barely keep up with the medication payments. As a mother I try not to cover up what he does, and I will not give up on him, we do the best we can for the time being.  I have read books and checked the internet, but still I can't help my son. Insurance company would not let him stay in the hosptial for extra help. He is a good person, who needs help. I feel helpless!!
 
April 17, 2006, 12:39 pm CDT

Dangerous and Sad

I am a child of abuse that resulted all from my older brother.  Not only did he physically abuse me, but he also sexually abuse me.  He has turned my life into a complete hell.  I was stabbed multiple times by my brother.  He began to collect knives at a young age, and my parents did nothing about it, so I got the short end of the stick.  I remember waking up in the middle of the night, to see my brother standing over me in my bed with a knife to my throat.  I would always scream for my mother and she would come in to the room and comfort me, but Nathan was just sent back to his room.  He distroyed everything I ever had.  He broke everything, including my bedroom door, which meant that I had no way to keep him out.  He used to punch me and throw me down the stairs on a weekly basis.  He tripped me in the school hallways so that I would fall completely on my face.  When he got older the violence just got worse.  He got a car for his 16th bday, and when it wouldn't start, he totaled the car with a baseball bat.  When he and my father got in a fight, Nathan hid a rock behind his back, came up behind my dad, and tried to hit him with it but my dad instead turned and got him to the ground.

I have almost all horrible memories of childhood, and I will never be able to fix all the damage.  In attempts to make something out of my life, I am working on getting my Ph.D in Abnormal Psychology at a nearby University.  It helps me to try to sort out all the damage and pain that I am left with.  My parents never sent my older brother anywhere, he lived with me only one room away for 14 years, until my parents got divorced. 

I will always hold resentment toward my father and mother for NEVER doing anything to protect me.  Please if this is your family, don't forget about the innocent siblings who are tortured and ruined all because as parents you aren't sure of what action to take.  Any action is better than none.  I have all the odds stacked against me, and I am fighting to survive with myself and my pain! Don't allow this to happen to your children!  It was and is the worst thing a parent could ever do to a child!

 

If someone reads this and feels that there family may be in this position, please email me, I have only my personal experiences to speak from, but I am very open and honest. 

 
April 17, 2006, 12:41 pm CDT

04/17 Dangerous Kids

Parents should have total control back of their kids.  That's what's wrong with them today, they are taught in school (thanks to the government) that they don't have to listen or behave to their parents and if the parent does correct them, they (the kid) can turn them into the authorities..of course the school personnel doesn't tell the kid what happens to them once their parent is turned in for correcting them!........THE KID IS REMOVED FROM THEIR NICE PRIVATE BEDROOM WITH TV, VCR, STEREO, GAMES, ETC!......my own grandson threatened to turn his mother in if she were to hit him or correct him, that's when I went off on him and told him to NEVER let me hear him say that again and I then explained the cold truth to him as to where HE would go, not his mother!!!..the parent does come back home but the kid does not!.........Kids are taught this in school!!!  It needs to be changed, an idiot can see that it's gotten worse over the years with kids and parents are scared to death to correct their kids anymore because of it.........time for a change!...........Parents, take back your control, don't let kids run your household..at any cost!.........your kids will thank you one day!

 
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