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Topic : 07/06 Baby Wars

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Created on : Thursday, April 13, 2006, 01:22:17 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 04/21/06) Being a parent is hard enough, but what happens when Mom and Dad can't agree on how many kids to have, how to raise 'em and how to get ‘em to sleep?  Sometimes, it can lead to an all-out baby war! Matt's baby battle ended up in front of a judge and made headlines. He was ordered to pay child support for the baby he had with his ex-girlfriend, but he says he shouldn't have to cough up the money because she told him she wasn't able to get pregnant, and he told her he didn't want to be a father. He, his attorney, and the director of the National Center for Men discuss the lawsuit they filed, known as “Roe v. Wade for Men,” arguing that men should have a constitutional right to avoid fatherhood. Next, Dan says even though he and his wife, Lisa, already have four children, he wants just one more. Lisa has been pregnant on and off for 11 years and says she's closed for baby business. Will Dr. Phil help Dan see Lisa's point that four is enough? Then, a frustrated husband is camping out on the roof of his house and living in a tent. He refuses to go back to his bedroom until his wife moves their kids out of their bed and starts paying more attention to him. Can Dr. Phil get him to come down the ladder? Plus, a sleep expert has a simple method for getting your child to sleep through the night. See the plan in action! Share advice and talk about the show here.

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April 21, 2006, 6:50 am PDT

Mens Choices

 Dr. Phil I never do things like message boards, but I signed up today because I just had to say my piece to this man that wants chioces. I really believe that when God blesses you with with a child wanted or not you really should be thankful. That little baby girl looks healthy and beautiful. The way he has disconnected himself as even the paternal father was interesting to me. I think he should think about what this is going to do to that little girl as she gets older and how much he is going to screw up her life just the way he believes her mother screwed up his. The only one really suffering here is going to be that little girl and I really think this man is a joke and it is even worse that we even have to listen to his crap. If he really doesnt  want  children than he should get himself fixed and call it a day !  His made his choice when he had unprotected sex! As for his lawyers they are supposed to be somewhat intelligent  men and it is really to bad that they think it necessary to help a man treat a living breathing human being this way. I want to know what choice she will have when 10 years from now he realizes that she is his flesh and blood and she wants absolutely nothing to do with him.  I really hope that she never knows this man as her father ever in her life....Thanks for listening!
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:52 am PDT

I don't get it...

Admittedly, I have not read all the posts, so please take that into account.  

My first, and only, thought when watching what Matt said on Dr. Phil was "Are you kidding me?"  

I am not a conservative, nor do I only believe in women's rights.    

I completely agree with everyone having rights in situations.  

There are no infallible forms of contraception out there.  None.  A condom breaks.  The pill can just plain not work.  So, if you are not ready to have children, you should be abstinent.  Period.  THAT is where your choices lie.  If Matt was so concerned with choice, he should have focused on that one.  

It doesn't seem to me that the girl in question was expecting to get pregnant or necessarily wanted children either.  She was on the pill.  She also has some medical condition (as reported) that apparently can cause difficulty in getting pregnant.  She wasn't planning on getting pregnant either.  

Once she did, she took responsibility.  And that is the issue here.  She made her choice (to have sex) and then she took responsibility.  Matt made his choice.  He just doesn't want to take responsibility.  And hopefully, that child will never have to realize that her father is not even concerned with her welfare.  

What happens in the future?  What if he grows up and realizes he made a huge mistake?  What then?  There are going to be some hurt feelings.  How is that going to be overcome?  

I hope this child has a wonderful support system with her mother's family because every child deserves that.    

   

P.S.  Has he even looked at that beautiful baby?  How can he deny her?  

 
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April 21, 2006, 6:53 am PDT

Matt's Delima

Matt, i'm on your side...and listen to this...i am a 42 year old wife and mother of 2, and i am on YOUR side!    To me, that girl set you up!  She was either trying to trap you or just simply become pregnant b/c her biological clock is ticking!  By her not being here on the show today, shows her guilt, in my eyes!  I don't think it is fair to you or any other guy in this world when a woman sits here and tells a man....'Ohhhh, there is NO WAY possible i can become pregnant and i am even on the pill.'    (But see in my eyes, 'can't become pregnant' and 'on the pill' in the same sentence, would put up a red flag for me!   But i don't think guys brains work that fast!!!)    Still, you should NOT be held accountable for this b/c you made it clear to her, having a child right now was not in your plans and i feel you should have rights just as much as women have rights!   Maybe it would teach these women a thing or two.  There is far too many people in this world having kids that honestly have no business having them in the first place!  And now that she had a daughter, it'll be that ficious cycle...like mother like daughter!   It's really too bad women like that have to exsist in this country!!!     I hope you win your case in court!!!!!    Good-Luck!!!!!   

  

Then for the second couple on there!  Dude, if you want to have more children...than it should come out of you, not her!   I only had 2 children,  by C-Section, no less and i can tell ya the damage it does to your body!   So chill dude, be Thankful you have 4!   At the high cost of things these days, that's about all most families can afford!  So, go take a cold shower and give your poor wife a break!!!!  Think of her....iim sure it's her butt raising those kids, not yours!    

 
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April 21, 2006, 6:53 am PDT

Wow....

Quote From: lieven

Whats really best for a baby ? How about TWO willing parents ? When a single woman " oopsies " a man, her action is *already* going against whats best for the child, so at that point, NO such woman has any standing to pimp out the child for money from someone who never got their own choice to say " No ". 

But, the quoted person's argument is *exactly* the same argument for the banning of abortion. 

Funny how flushing fetuses down drains is OK, but not paying a woman who had the ONLY choice 

to bear a child is evil ? Talk about Double Standards ! 

" Her body, her choice... HER *responsibility* ". 

 I absolutely agree w/ you - and I'm a female w/ kids - that was very well said.
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:55 am PDT

Objecitve view

Trying to avoid complaining, here is my input:  why complain if you do not have a solution or offer a solution.  Here is my observation and possiblt solution. 

  

 

 

The story presented today (April 21, 2006), regarding the legal issue of the constitutional choices that are not applied to men when it comes to a woman’s pregnancy are most certainly interesting.  I see this from many perspectives.  When I was 18 years old, I am 42 now, I made the choice to NOT become a father.  I made this choice not because I do not like children, or feel I would make a bad father.  I made this choice because I saw in our society too many people getting involved in telling the parent how they are or are not to discipline or train their children.  I had no desire to be put in jail for spanking a child, or for what religion I choose to bring my child up in.  I did not want to deal with the possibility of being hauled into court because some idiotic over-enthusiastic teacher though I abused my child if the child fell off his/her swing or sliding board.  If fact I often baby-sit for my wife’s cousins and other people. 

  

 

Having said that, I have contended for at least 20 years, that should not be held to child support in the event a woman becomes pregnant.  There are many men who upon finding out their partner became pregnant would want the child and want to raise the child, however men have no choice in any aspect of the child once the child is conceived. 

  

 

Regardless of whether the man wants the child of not, the woman hold the complete choice on terminating the pregnancy or not.  Many women, not most, will crank out kids receive child support, and state assistance for the quantity of children they produce. 

  

 

I am not by any means saying the child should become a second thought; however, by forcing one parent to cough up cash when they have no choice in the disposition of the child is irresponsible to the child itself.  Of what benefit is it to the child to grow up knowing the father hates the child, or resents the child just to force the father to pay some monthly amount for child support. 

  

 

If both people are putting the child first, the scenario should probably unfold like this, and there would be many variations I am sure. 

  

 

Scenario 1 

  

 

  1. Woman becomes pregnant.
  2. Woman opposes abortion and Woman chooses to carry the baby to the full term.
  3. Woman has 3 choices at that point.
    1. Ask Man for support and to stay involved in the child’s life

                                                               i.      Man can accept or not, if the man chooses not to pay and be involved he must sign and relinquish all parental rights. 

    1. Raise the child as a single parent bearing full responsibility for the raising of the child.
    2. Place the child up for adoption.

  

 

In this scenario the child is still the focal point and is the primary focus for who will be the parent(s) in the child’s life. 

  

 

Scenario 2 

  

 

  1. Woman becomes pregnant.
  2. Woman decides she wants to abort the child.
  3. Man decides he wants the child.
    1. Man must pay all medical care for the woman during the course of the pregnancy
    2. Can choose at the time of birth to become part of the child’s life and pay child support, or relinquish all parental rights to the father.
    3. Man can place the child up for adoption.

  

 

In this scenario again the woman and the man who do bear responsibility for the life that was brought into the world still are placing the welfare of the child first, by determining the best course of action to see to it the child has parents and has parents who can raise the child. 

  

 

Scenario 3 

  

 

  1. Neither Potential Parents want the child so a mutual decision is made to abort the child, and both must pay 50% of the costs associated by default, or a sum negotiated between the two people.

  

 

I personally am strongly opposed to abortion at any cost, however under our current legal structure abortion is available. 

  

 

I also realize that these are only 3 scenarios of the multitude that could occur; however, one thing to consider, which may seem a reach, but, still is important to consider in how our laws work. 

  

 

If a woman is raped, and a child is produced.  I have yet to hear of a single case where the convicted rapist was forced to pay child support.  Why is that?  In that case the woman made the choice to carry the child and takes on the sole responsibility to either raise the child or put the child up for adoption.  Most likely the woman does not want the rapist being part of the child’s and her life which is obvious.  I have not seen where the courts order the convicted rapist to pay child support after they get out of prison. 

  

 

Regards, 

  

 

 

  

 

  

 

  

 

  

 
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April 21, 2006, 6:55 am PDT

Choices

First off I must say that baby girl is beautiful and precious and looks just like Matt.  I know he didn't want her but how can he not look at her cute little face and fall head over heels in love?  Thats COLD Matt!   

  

In abortion (which btw I do not support) women have the choice because its their body.  So thats not the mans call. 

  

In adoption the father does have a choice and has to be notified before an adoption proceeds.  The father can choose to raise the child or to allow the child to be adopted.  Is it fair to ask a father to support a child he claims he didn't want in the first place?  If he really didn't want to be a father, shouldn't he have taken care of that before having sex?  It may seem unfair because men do not have as many options in birth control as women do but given that fact, I think if a man doesn't want to be a father, he should choose not to have sex or use a condom use two in case one breaks!  Once the baby is conceived and born its too late to then claim you didn't want it.  You have to accept the consequences of your actions.  You are half responsible for that child so suck it up and make sure you don't make the same mistake next time! 

  

Matt claims that he was told by his girlfriend that she couldn't get pregnant.  Does she agree that she told him this?  Where is the proof that he didn't know that having unprotected sex with her might result in a child that he now claims he never wanted?  For Matt to win his case I think he will have to prove that his girlfriend lied and misled him.  Otherwise its he said she said. 

 
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April 21, 2006, 6:55 am PDT

KEEP IT IN YOUR PANTS

IF YOU ARE  SO AGAINST HAVING KIDS  KEEP YOUR PANTS ON OR HAVE A VASECTOMY IT WAS YOUR CHOICE TO TAKE YOUR PANTS OFF HOW WONDERFUL IT WOULD BE FOR YOU TO HAVE TO MAKE THE DECISION TO CARRY A BABY IN YOUR BODY  TO DECIDE TO KEEP THE BABY OR GIVE IT AWAY IT'S NOT AN EASY DECISION SO WHEN YOU GET THE URGE TO TAKE YOUR PANTS OFF TAKE THE MATTER IN HAND AND NO ONE WILL GET HURT NOT YOU OR YOUR PARTNER OR AN  INNOCENT BABY
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:56 am PDT

Equal Responsibility

When you gamble in life sometimes there are unfavorable results. He knew the rules before he helped created this child. Now like a bad sport... he wants to complain and sit on the bench. Should have thought of that before now. I sympathize with his position but bottom line, it is also his responsibility. Children should always come first.
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:56 am PDT

Single Mom

Okay, I know this may seem wierd coming from a single mom, but I have to agree with this guy.  She didn't give him a choice.  I feel if women are going to make the choice to have a child then she needs to be ready to take care of that child by herself.  However, if the man says he wants the child and then backs out, then he should be responsible.  Let me give you a little background.  When I got pregnant, I decided to keep this child.  She's mine and I wanted her.  No matter what her father thought, I was going to keep her.  My daughter is no three years old and her father hasn't paid on cent of child support.  But I don't care, I can take care of her on my own and I had to be ready to do that since I chose to have her.  Also, what I don't think some mom's think about is if a man pays child support, he has rights to see her and spend time with her.  Because my daughter's father doesn't pay child support, he has no say so in her life.  She is mine and only mine.  If one day she asks about money from her father, that's something I'll let her discuss with him.  I'm not a cruel mom, his family sees her every week and I don't exclude anyone from my daughter's life.  If he wants to see her I normally allow him to do so.  But when it comes to money and support, that's my job - I CHOSE TO HAVE HER!
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:57 am PDT

Um...

Quote From: candace21

When a man and a women decide to have sex they should be married and ready to have kids, however life isn't always that easy.  

The reality of it is that women have unplanned pregnancies all the time and abortions happen everyday.  These abortions are happening because the mother has made the choice, why can't men make the same choice.  

I'm not saying men should be able to make a women get an abortion but if wants nothing to do with the child than why are they forced to pay child support.  

If a man wants to give up his rights let him. Parenting is hard enough without having it forced upon you. The women made the choice to have the baby with out the father's consent so why is he the one expected to take care of it financially and not the mom.  

  

Are you saying you don't want to be the provider for your woman and children? Are you saying you would rather stay at home or work to make ends meet and still have to cook the meals, run the house, stay up with a sick kid even when you are barfing your lungs up, check the homework, teach the discipline, clean the house, entertain the company, never be alone, never be guaranteed a night's sleep, stay thin and beautiful and sexy and spread your legs whenever sex is needed even though you are tired, wore out, exhausted, sick, half asleep, or 8 1/2 months pregnant or better yet you are in your first trimester and therefore EXTREMELY tired and puking your guts up for no reason? Or would you rather go to work and send the money? Your choice.  

  

Do you think there aren't women out there who heard "Oh Honey I can't get you pregnant because I am sterile! Sure I'll be around for you and the baby if you have it. Sure I'll pay for an abortion if you need it. Of course I love you" But what they are really saying is I don't want a baby or you. I want sex and I will say anything for it. And I don't like condoms so I'm not going to use them. F---want is reponsible or what this girl wants. F--- her dreams and feelings and emotions. I need sex and I need it now. Screw everything else......... Oh go jack off somewhere! 

 
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