Topic : 07/06 Baby Wars

It does happen....this story I know....I do know someone who was in a non comitted relationship..he wore a condom..she went off the pill but did not tell him...he was moving and told her there was nothing they had that would keep them together...next thing you know she is pregnant and making threats to him..along with her parents...and a letter from a lawyer...making threats..after all the threats a phone call comes telling the young man to wait it out...she was also with another guy..the young man pleaded with her to give it up since he was in school and had no way of becoming a supportive father..he was not happy about the mess she was in..made it clear it was not going to happen ....she proceded to tell him she would have his money for her and the baby as long as he lived...very sad person and very miserable...the young man was wearing a condom....she had no protection the condom failed....so you are telling me he has no choice but to give into her demands...and her threats..he has no choice...I think in our state a man can give up his parental rights...for these 2 people it would be hell for them to even attempt to share custody of this child due in September......I fully agree with the young man and Lawyer on your program today..where are the rights of the man????  Anyway very long story cut short...should the male be forced into a situation not of his choice???

That isn't much of a choice to make. A lot of people can't handle abortion. And once you're pregnant, you don't have a lot of options. Especially if the father refuses to be involved. All options suck!  

  

1) you have an abotion and become emotionally scarred for the rest of your life, and you might never be able to have children in the future. 

2) you give your baby up and again become emotionally scarred  

3) have the baby and try to provide for it as best u can alone or with help, and give up the next 18 years of ur life to care and provide for it 

Couldn't agree with this quote more!! Excellent thinking!!! Maybe MATT should be our first example of this!

 -- we used to say, thirty or forty years ago, when an unmarried woman got pregnant that "she should have kept her legs together."  We shamed her and held her fully responsible for the consequences.  We hid her away somewhere until after the baby was born and could be adopted out.

I don't see how what you're saying is any different, except that now you're applying this backward attitude to the man rather than the woman.

It's arguable that 18 *years* of payments is a much tougher road to hoe than several months of pregnancy, which when done with can be gone past and largely forgotten.  $108,000 is a lot to pay for sex by anyone's standard.  How about she give him the baby and the $500 a month?

On a related note, one of the great myths is that men don't like and won't use condoms.  The untold story is all the women out there who are trying to get men to *not* use a condom.  This pressure usually comes at a crucial point in the proceedings where the man is especially vulnerable.  Presumably these hookers (in the literal sense of the word) are quite aware that once a guy's dick gets wet he's on the hook for 18 years of child support payments.  Kinda puts a new spin on the phrase "getting lucky", no?

I hope the coverage on the show causes men to withdraw even more from women until women figure out many of us guys won't put up with being second class citizens in the area of reproduction any longer.

Perhaps some bright woman out there will even flash on the insight that men won't fight to maintain reproductive rights for women when we don't have any such rights ourselves -- other than not to participate.

That's what happens every time the abortion debate comes up.  Yea, in principle I may be firmly in favor of legal abortion, but then I realize I really don't have any stake in it one way or the other.  So don't ask me to march, right my congressperson, or vote for your candidate.  Until I have reproductive rights also.

my partner's ex-wife told him she was on birth control but lied about it, tricked him and got herself pregnant at 17.  her own mother had even sent my partner's parents a letter at the time warning them and him that her daughter told her that she had been trying to get pregant for ages.  sure enough, they broke up and two weeks later she comes back saying she's pregnant.  sure maybe he could have used a condom every time they had sex, but when you're in a relationship and the person tells you they're taking the pill, you believe them and trust them to be fullfilling that role.  

   

she woudln't get an abortion or put the child up for adoption, and forced him to marry her.  five years later they got divorced because she was just a lazy slob that never cooked or cleaned or anything day in and day out.  all of this came up during their trial.  but thanks to the biased court system in canada, he's now paying child support and spousal support for the rest of her life because she refuses to work (even part time) outside of the home (even though the child is in school fulltime) because then the child and spousal support would get reduced or eliminated.  she won't go to back school to get an education because she just wants to stay home for the rest of her life and have someone pay for it.  she even asked the judge for a maid (to be paid for by her ex-husband) as part of her divorce settlement!  even our welfare program up in canada kicks you off after 3 years if you're capable of working, which she is.  but she doesn't want to work.  to her, her kid is her cash.  and sadly her own mother has lived her life in exactly the same manner, so the daughter is just continuing the cycle.  

   

i just hope that my partner's and mine parental modeling and influence in my partner's daughter's life, and being around my two kids, will help to ensure that the cycle does stop.  i don't want her mother to influence her into tricking some guy into getting pregant and then leaching off him for the rest of her life just because she thinks that's the way to go through life.  

   

there are men out there that do get tricked by women who just use kids as a source of income.  i don't think it's fair that the men's lives have to get screwed up just because some woman tricked them.  their rights were taken away.  obviously these people weren't destined to be together if such a level of deceit existed between them.  if the women choses to be deceitful to get pregant then she should have to solely carry the responsibility of raising that child.  

   

   

I am a woman who intentionally got pregnant with a boyfriend who'd said he didn't ever want kids. After 4 years together, I suddenly had the strong desire to have a baby. I lied and told him I was on birth control. He thought he was sterile since he'd never gotten his previous girlfriend of 7 years pregnant. I knew I wanted a baby, with or without him taking part. We married a month into our pregnancy. I eventually came clean and told him that I had "tricked" him, and he knows that he should've worn a condom if he wanted to be sure. It's all said and done and you can't change the past. Fortunately for our son, he accepted responsibility and is an awesome father and friend to our now 9 year old son.  

For a guy to simply trust a woman's word is foolish on his part. Like Dr. Phil said, if you wear a condom, you're in control. They may not be 100%, but at least it's more protection that nothing at all! And a box of condoms- a pallet of condoms!- costs a heck of a lot less than 18 years of child support!   

And if you don't want to be a part of her life or your child's life, THAT is your "choice", (and your child is better off not knowing you if you're only going to resent him/her) but the law states you have to pay child support if you father a child, and I'm sure you knew that before you had intercourse. Ultimately, it's your own doing.   

Next time you play in the rain you'd better wear a raincoat!   

     Well I just wanted to state the I am a woman & I don't think it's right to force a man to pay child support when he has been lied to. When a woman manipulates a man & lies so she can have a child against the man's will, he should not be accountable for supporting that child if he does not wish to. Now I do think he should've used a condom no matter what she said. I think if well thought out  people could reach a common ground on this subject. I also belive that if a mother to her child has the choice to give up her rights & responsiblity to her child than a man should be giving that same choice. If giving men the same choice is the wrong way to go about it, then maybe we should take away that choice from women as well, and force women to be responsible for their actions as well! I do feel that the American society cater's to women & immagrants way too much.

Hello all, I am 23 years old and will be 24 in November. I have been married for 5 years now with no kids. My husband has an 8 year old child from a previous relationship. I was my husbands first girlfriend after he had broke up with his ex, and I turned out to be the wife of his future. The main reason they broke up, because they did not get married after having there child. Please stay with me, because I am making this story short and to the point. Due to my  husband and I getting married so soon, yes me being 18 at the time, and us knowing each other for only 2 years. All and all we bet the odds are still in a happy marriage. .........During this whole time the babies mother has always used the child for amo! If my husband stayed with me she would not let the child see the father, if continued to see me, the father would have to PAY MORE. She used this child for WIC, on all TAX RETURNS, MEDICAL EXPENSE, DENTAL, on a child he COULD NOT EVEN SEE. My husband tried over and over to recon with this woman, he continued to send money, and still go over to her house to see the child even if he was unwelcomed. It came to a point to where he wanted to give up his rights as a parent. He could not see his son, he could not visit him at school, and he still had to pay and hurt our current family for a big head ache of a woman. Please get the picture, that we are staying on the topic of his ex. I love my stepchild with all of my heart as if he were my own. His mother told bad stories about us, sad he was a no good dad, and that he doesn't pay for them to live!? I can't believe how far Californian governmnent, alone, lets this happen. My husband doesn't trust me to have his own child because he thinks I am going to use the child as collateral! I can't stand the fact I am suffering for her mistakes and being a horable mother, and yet my husband still have to go through the motions because he has to deal with this on a 24/7 bases until he is 18 years old, the child. My son does stay with his mother full time and there is no custody shared. She has all the control and all my husband wants to do is be a good dad. He has gone through mood swings with me, this has hurt our marriage, his pride as in being a good dad, and he as well has gone through depression. We continue to ask why do WOMAN/MOTHERS get all the law in there favor just because the child lives with them? There is no hope for good fathers out there. Especially when the mother says "Look who's cashing in this tax season!" Where do the dads go? What law supports them? And protective services really don't help out here neither. We have tried every route to get this delt with. We are to broke to take a custody trial to court. Now please America, what ARE DADS SUPPOSED TO DO?

Wear a condom.  You cannot deny your child support when you do have a child.  You have a choice - to be protected or unprotected. At the point that you decide to be unprotected you have to take responsibility