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Topic : 07/06 Baby Wars

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Created on : Thursday, April 13, 2006, 01:22:17 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 04/21/06) Being a parent is hard enough, but what happens when Mom and Dad can't agree on how many kids to have, how to raise 'em and how to get ‘em to sleep?  Sometimes, it can lead to an all-out baby war! Matt's baby battle ended up in front of a judge and made headlines. He was ordered to pay child support for the baby he had with his ex-girlfriend, but he says he shouldn't have to cough up the money because she told him she wasn't able to get pregnant, and he told her he didn't want to be a father. He, his attorney, and the director of the National Center for Men discuss the lawsuit they filed, known as “Roe v. Wade for Men,” arguing that men should have a constitutional right to avoid fatherhood. Next, Dan says even though he and his wife, Lisa, already have four children, he wants just one more. Lisa has been pregnant on and off for 11 years and says she's closed for baby business. Will Dr. Phil help Dan see Lisa's point that four is enough? Then, a frustrated husband is camping out on the roof of his house and living in a tent. He refuses to go back to his bedroom until his wife moves their kids out of their bed and starts paying more attention to him. Can Dr. Phil get him to come down the ladder? Plus, a sleep expert has a simple method for getting your child to sleep through the night. See the plan in action! Share advice and talk about the show here.

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April 21, 2006, 6:20 pm PDT

Twin Mommy is right

Quote From: geo5char

I don't know where you live but where I live the government subsidizes single mothers. And to top that off, if you look around you could find a day-home that doesn't charge that much. I found a good one where the provider was licensed and charged $20/day. The most I ever paid was $120/month to day care and on weekends $18-20/eight hour shift. Oh and that was for two children. We are not to make money off of our children. They are not a commodity in which we can buy and sell or put a price on.
 I work with child care assistance and if (AND ONLY IF) you fit within specific income guidelines may you qualify for child care assistance in my state.  Other states do not even offer assistance for child care.  It also depends up where you live as to what the child care costs are.  In my state, infant costs are at the top nationwide and 3rd in the nation for toddler-school aged kids, including in the metro area to be $400/wk PER child at school-aged kids.  Up to $40/day for infants in rural areas.  The costs are real, as inflated as they may be.  The government also needs to address how to change the ever-increasing health insurance rates.  The rates are inflating beyond justification.  My family health insurance alone is $1,200/mth.  That's crazy!  Something needs to change in these areas without dumping the burden soley on the custodial parent.
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:22 pm PDT

It can be done

Quote From: devand

Hello - As the mother of two unplanned but much loved children with the same father, I can empathize with the MAN's position.  My children's father and I elected to continue the first unexpected pregnancy despite the tenuous state of our relationship (we were each independently able to support the child) but he did not want to have the second baby.  He asked me to choose between us.  I chose to have the child and, fortunately, did not have to have $$$ from the father to raise him.  The father denied paternity, turned his family against me, ignored our first child, and did just about all he could to embarass me publicly during this time.  Ultimately, as a judge was about to order a paternity test for the day after the birth, he recanted and claimed the child as his own.  He pays support for both and has exercised mandated visitation but has made our lives hell for a long time.  He has only recently become interested in the children.  13 years later, I can understand what he was going through and why he didn't want more children (he had two others).  Ttherefore I somewhat agree with the father who doesn't want the legal or financial responsibility for the child.  As Dr. Phil pointed out though, Mr. Butay's intentional failure to use a condom rather invalidates his claim to reject these responsibilities but I also see WHY he feels he should have a choice to abort (I don't agree with abortion) or adopt the child out as the mother does.  Equal rights for men & women, I agree, however I don't see how this can be handled in reality.  A witnessed, notarized contract before sex to set the terms?  Not likely.  A woman requires the semen of a man to get pregnant and therefore the men just have to accept that, if a pregnancy occurs (despite protection, stated infertility, etc.), they will be responsible.  This may not seem fair but it is their choice.
Men have the women sign papers  period... I realize my sex partner wishes to have no children at this time and this contract will stay in effect until such time as it is rewritten. Woman signs and we are done..If she choices to go through with act , it's all on her...  This should not be the mans lifetime sentence.  Married mother of 3,  never on welfare or S.S. I.
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:22 pm PDT

04/21 Baby Wars

As a woman I believe that men should have a choice on whether they want to be fathers or not. JUST LIKE WOMAN!!!!!!!!!!! Why should men, just because they are not carrying the child not be aloud to have a choice? Both choose to lay down and do the deed both should have a choice!! If the mother can not do it on her own then she should not have it or put it up for adoption. I personally would raise my child on my own and let my child know that I did it on my own!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am all for men's rights!!! GO MEN!!!! 

 
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April 21, 2006, 6:23 pm PDT

That's not equality

Quote From: fanfrommi

Fact: Men don't get pregnant, Fact: Men don't have to have the surgery and kill a child (abortion), Fact: Men don't have to carry the child for nine months, Fact: Men don't then have to push a 8# child out tof hier penis after 12 hours of labor just to hand it off to complete strangers (adoption), Fact: Men don't have to spend the next 18+ years caring, protecting, raising the child (keep the child).  Sorry fellas, If an accident occured, I would much rather be in your shoes - pay $500.00 dollars a month and forget about the rest.... as opposed to having to pick one of the above  so called "choices"..... 

Women fought for equal rights in employment - they wanted society to be gender neutral - and they won. yet the do not want men to have the same equal rights in regards to parenthood.  

   

this is not equality. Equal Rights means Equal Rights regardless of gender  

 
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April 21, 2006, 6:24 pm PDT

congradulation

Quote From: thequeen63

My son is now 22 years old. I gave up on anything from his father 21 years ago and I never looked back. I raised my son to be a good man and to treat women with respect. I also taught him to live up to his responsibilities. I couldn't care less about the money anymore. I like my self respect alot better. 

You seem to not be the norm,  but I hope the tides are a changing
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:24 pm PDT

04/21 Baby Wars

Quote From: vanessaebc

 That's your fault for sleeping with guy you have only been dating for two months.
*cough* as opposed to the much longer amount of time he must have been dating her before sleeping with her?
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:25 pm PDT

Regret

I think that if he can see himself not regretting what he is doing now in the years to come, then more power to him. I wish sometimes my oldest dad would decide if he is going to be a dad or not, he only comes around when convenient for him.  Luckily my husband is their enough for him to block any hurt feelings his dad causes.  So to the mom,  I am proud of you for having the child and you will be okay with or without his help.  At least he is man enough to say he doesn't want to be one instead of trying to do the right thing by being a father figure and leading the child to some hurt feelings  down the road
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:25 pm PDT

04/21 Baby Wars

Quote From: icondoit06

(1)  I'm a against abortion.  Period!  Unless the mother's health is in jeopardy.......I say let the little human being have a life.   

   

(2)  Matt was very specific about not wanting a child at this time in his life.  No question Phillip!   

   

(3)  The woman may have lied......Too many women are using men to get pregnant using the same excuses...."I can't get pregnant....I'm taking the pill. " Bull Honky!   

   

(4)  Women have way too much power when it comes to pregnancy why don't they take more responsibility?   

   

He has a case, I'm in the legal profession and my vote is to him.    

GO MATT!    

Susan Waters (I'm still wringing my clothes out from waiting in the rain to visit your set)   

   

PS:  The best thing that comes out of this is that young people will ACTUALLY THINK before they have sex.  Oh my Gaud!  What a concept!   

You being a woman yourself I am surprised and little disgusted with your comments, we do not know if she lied about not being able to have kids, misdiagnoses happen.  When you go to law school is a requirement to be cold and calculated and heartless?, so automatically it is the womens fault and we should all feel sorry for poor helpless Matt. My opion she should take him to court to have him fixed so he does not do this to some other woman, sound stupid to you, well it is about as stupid as his court case. He needs to grow up, until then he should keep it zipped. Hey are you married?I'm thinking you and Matt should hook up, you both have the same mentality.
 
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April 21, 2006, 6:25 pm PDT

04/21 Baby Wars

Quote From: dedwards

Dear Dr. Phil,  

I am an advid viewer of your show.  I record you everyday.  I have to admitt you struck a subject that I am passionate about.  I have very strong opinions about the rights of women and babies.....and with this new case ......men.  I am a wife or 15 years and a mother of two.  One child of which was an unplanned pregnancy.  I am so tired of hearing about women's rights and their bodies.  Babies have no rights at all until they are born.  How bizarre is that!!  We treat stray puppies in this country better than we treat our unborn children.  Some women would not blink twice at having an abortion, but wouldn't kill a stray puppy that they didn't want.  As you can guess I do feel that abortion should be illigal, with the exception of rape, incest, and the life of the mother.  Women do have the right to choose.....the same choices that men have....before the baby is ever concieved.     

   

I do feel that men and women currently have completely different rights in this area.  A man can only control a limited number of factors and they are ALL prior to conception.  He has three choices abstenence, condoms, or a vasectomy.  ALL other forms of birth control and ALL other options are controlled by the women.  Also keep in mind.....when it comes to contraception....the only thing a man can lie about is that he has had a vasectomy or that he is stirile.  It is really obvious to the woman whether or not he is using s condom.....Can't exactly lie about that.  Virtually ALL forms of birth control for women are "HIDDEN".  The pill, the diaphram, spermacides, IUD, etc.....are all internal.....and virtually impossible for the man to be 100% sure that the woman has actually done what she says she has done.  Yet if he actually trusts her.....and she has lied...he is still responsible for that child.  And remember after conception......he has NO CHOICES about the child.  The woman still has multiple choices.  

   

Since the baby is in the woman's body....the father has ZERO say.  What if the father actually  WANTS the baby.......if the mother chooses to abort..........he has no rights at all to save his own child.  Women have all of the control in what happens to his life and his baby after conception.  How is this right or legal.  IT IS descrimination based on sex.  If the mother chooses to keep the child then the father is automatically responsible......WHY????.....Why does ONLY the mother have the right to choose adoption.   If and only if the mother decides to give the baby up for adoption, does the father THEN have a new option to fight for custody of the child.  It is an amazing double standard that we have put up with for decades.  

   

Just another thought....for those who are pro-choice.  If a baby is NOT A LIFE until it is delivered......(especially since late term abortions are still legal in some states)....why was Scott Peterson convicted of the MURDER of his unborn child.  Is it only murder if you DON'T have an M.D. behind your name??    You can't have it both ways.  Either an unborn child is a life or it is not.......they are not only a life when they are convenient.  

   

Dr. Phil I have to say I was a little disappointed to see that you to placed  ALL of the blame on the young man.  If he had used a condom consistantly and it had simply failed....would that have made a difference for you.......but even if it had changed your position....it still would be no different for him legally.  Even if a man does EVERYTHING right in efforts to avoid pregnancy........if the woman gets pregnant he is still automatically responsible for that child for the rest of his life..........unless of course the WOMAN CHOOSES adoption.  

   

A final thought for all women.......please remember we currently do have this much power over a man's life.  Be wise, be responsible and honest with your partners and spouses.  Be pro-choice  PRIOR   to the conception of a child.  After all,........after conception....your life and the man's life will never be the same ...No matter what choice you make.  

Excellent points. Especially here: Dr. Phil ...  you to placed  ALL of the blame on the young man.  If he had used a condom consistantly and it had simply failed....would that have made a difference for you.......but even if it had changed your position....it still would be no different for him legally. 

I've heard stories of people who used condoms correctly, they DIDN'T break, and the woman retrieved the used condom from the trash and made herself pregnant with it. THOSE men are still made to pay. So much for the man's right to choose BEFORE conception.... 

 
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April 21, 2006, 6:26 pm PDT

Give the Guy a Break

How awful that life presents us with situations of this nature.  I feel really sad for the child, but I also think the young man should get a break.  Had he set out to intentionally impregnate the young woman, telling her he was sterile when he wasn't, we would all be calling him something lower than worm spit.  Instead she gets pregnant after being advised that he was not ready for fatherhood, and many think he should be drawn and quartered for not wanting to be drained financially for the next 18 or more years.  Give the guy a break!  He was up front and honest.   

  

I hope his legal actions are successful.  Perhaps it will send a message to women that if there is any possibility of a pregnancy occuring, then the man you have sex with may have the right to walk away.   

 
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