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Topic : 07/06 Baby Wars

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Created on : Thursday, April 13, 2006, 01:22:17 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 04/21/06) Being a parent is hard enough, but what happens when Mom and Dad can't agree on how many kids to have, how to raise 'em and how to get ‘em to sleep?  Sometimes, it can lead to an all-out baby war! Matt's baby battle ended up in front of a judge and made headlines. He was ordered to pay child support for the baby he had with his ex-girlfriend, but he says he shouldn't have to cough up the money because she told him she wasn't able to get pregnant, and he told her he didn't want to be a father. He, his attorney, and the director of the National Center for Men discuss the lawsuit they filed, known as “Roe v. Wade for Men,” arguing that men should have a constitutional right to avoid fatherhood. Next, Dan says even though he and his wife, Lisa, already have four children, he wants just one more. Lisa has been pregnant on and off for 11 years and says she's closed for baby business. Will Dr. Phil help Dan see Lisa's point that four is enough? Then, a frustrated husband is camping out on the roof of his house and living in a tent. He refuses to go back to his bedroom until his wife moves their kids out of their bed and starts paying more attention to him. Can Dr. Phil get him to come down the ladder? Plus, a sleep expert has a simple method for getting your child to sleep through the night. See the plan in action! Share advice and talk about the show here.

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April 21, 2006, 8:09 am PDT

Fathers don't have choices?

Father's have rights when it comes to fatherhood.  Men have complete control over their bodies and I hope they understand that accidents happen, and this includes dishonest women and contraception failure.  Risk is on both sides... for both men and women.  I guess the point that made me feel uneasy during this segment  was when I heard men should be on equal playing fields as women (or something to that effect).  There is a natural unequality with having children.  Women take a huge emotional and physical tolls when having children and I think men just need to stay out of this one.  I feel this "second choice" as they call it should remain with the women until men can find a way to have children outside of our bodies.  To me, men have a choice and don't need a second choice.    Although this lawsuit looks like it has a good intentions, I feel it will ultimately hurt our women.  In the big picture, I wish men would stop competing with women and take responsibility and respect us.  Women are strong but we need to protect our rights.  This issue is huge to me and I wish our country would grow strong, responsible men instead of  "victimized", score keeping men who comepete with it's own women.        

 

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April 21, 2006, 8:10 am PDT

For Matt

You need to grow up and accept the consequences of your own actions.  ANY time two people engage in sex, there is always a chance of pregnancy.  You are an adult (chronologically speaking anyway). You knew what you were doing when you fathered this child.  Now you have a child and it is time for you to be a father. 

  

You seem to assume that your child's mother lied to you.  That isn't necessarily so. I was told by a fertility specialist that because of a health condition, I would need surgery to be able to get pregnant.  Three years later I had my son (a wonderful surprise:).  My mother got pregnant with my baby brother late in life when she was told that she had completed menopause.   

  

There are no perfect, fool proof ways to have intercourse with a woman and take no chance to have a baby.  The only way to ensure that you won't be a parent is to not have sex. 

 

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April 21, 2006, 8:10 am PDT

you missed the point

Quote From: fluffyfat

I'm so tired of men being the villian and women the poor victim in these situations.  Would people be accusing the girl of having "unprotected sex" if she had not been taking the pill while Matt used a condom?  It's considered protected sex if one person is using a reliable form of birth control; and the pill is usually 99.9% effective. 

  

I agree with Matt.  He was misinformed if not out and out lied to by the girl about her chances of getting pregnant.   He was not given any choices down the line about abortion or adoption.  

  

It's the woman who has had all the choices, so if a she decides that she is going to have sex before marriage, not get an abortion if she gets pregnant, and not put the baby up for adoption then she should also decide to support that baby herself.  Otherwise, she just might want to [iget married[/i before she starts having sex.  Marriage is the tried and true, time honored method of finding out if a man is committed enough to a woman to bear his children. 

Nobody is saying that woman is the victim in this situation.  The BABY (aka: innocent child, person who needs parents to love, raise, and nurture her, etc.) is the victim.  If he was so naive to believe that, then okay, fine.  He is still the father.  And what if she honestly believed she couldn't have kids???? We have all heard stories of people with their tubes tied and everything else who end up pregnant.  So, by your point, she didn't wait until she got married, but that doesn't change the fact that she got pregnant, and she didn't do it alone.  So, maybe he should learn that their are alternate methods that he can use to take care of his needs that don't involve someone he might impregnate until he's ready to get married and have kids as well.   

But back to the victim, the baby is the one who is not at fault here, and he needs to get over himself and do what's right.  However, if she had a choice in who her parents are, I'm sure she could do with out the lame 'boy' who can't step up to the plate because he isn't ready yet.  He doesn't deserve her!!! 

 
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April 21, 2006, 8:10 am PDT

Dangerous ground

My personal opinion of the man is that he is a smug and arrogant jackass, and she should not want him as an active part of this child's life.  Having said that, I think his attorney and that idiot from the center for men are treading on dangerous ground.  The road to Hell is paved with good intentions (not that I think the client has any good intention).  If this case is won by the father the door is opened for any man who doesn't want to pay child support to step up and say he didn't want the child, it wasn't his choice, and he has no responsibility.  This attorney is naive to think otherwise. I can't believe they actually tried to say he didn't have unprotected sex.  That argument won't fly anywhere.  No condom is unprotected sex. Birth control is not just the woman's responsibility.  If he had used a condom and she still got pregnant, would he still be screaming that she tricked him?  I disagree with the guy from the center for men 100% when he says this guy will be a great father "when he chooses" to have a child.  He can say that, because he didn't choose it,  the baby isn't his until the cows come home, but that doesn't make it true.  The substance of his character is ringing through loud and clear.  No woman should ever want him  to father a child again!  The child is already here.  You can't unring a bell.  He is not being asked to take complete financial responsibility, only a small part.  He needs to buck up and be a man and take responsibility for this child, just like the mother is doing.  

 
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April 21, 2006, 8:11 am PDT

Deadbeat Dad

It is a fact of life that having sex can result in an unplanned pregnancy.  Both partties obviously consented to the act that created that beautiful baby.  Now Matt is crying because he did not get to choose to have the baby aborted or put up for adoption.  My thought is that when a man can become pregnant and carry the baby in his body for 9 months, then he can get that choice.  (You say "But he can't get pregnant"  RIGHT!) But since Matt didn't get the choice, he figures he can just walk away and pretend nothing happened.  But a baby did happen.  So he should grow up and take responsibility for his actions. 
 
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April 21, 2006, 8:11 am PDT

04/21 Baby Wars

Quote From: jennx3

O.K. I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt here.  Did you read her message entirely?  She found out in August that her son was due in Nov.  Do the math....she was already 6 months pregnant.  That means no choice for abortion.  So she was down to two.  Sounds like she made the choice to raise the baby on her own and gave him the choice to participate or not.  That is why she gave him her email address.  DUH!!!  So I am going with SHE CAN HANDLE IT AND HAS.
I don't care what you get  done,the doctor will tell you there is always a very small chance you could get pregnant. The ONLY thing that is 100% is DOING WITHOUT !! If you are are going to make the choice to have sex anyway,you need to make the choice to extra sure you don't bring an unwanted baby into this world. They don't ask to be here. It's both peoples responsibilty. If he don't "cover " his up first,then she needs to cover hers back up. If not,take what you get, and be GOOD at it. Don't ever make a child feel unwanted. How would you feel?When you just send a CHILD,child support, Is the mother suppose to show it to the child and say "this is your father.
 
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April 21, 2006, 8:11 am PDT

Men do have rights, too

 I am a mother of two children and I got pregnant out of wedlock with both.  It was my decision to fool around, my decision to keep my boys and my decision to raise them  Even though they both have the same father, I felt it was my decision to have them and therefore it was my responsibility to provide and care for them.  I never asked for child support, I never got any.  I took care of their every need with no help from their father.  They are now 15 and 17 and prepping for a college eduation. I am not rich and have had to gladly make sacrifices and adjustments to provide for my boys and to fill both the mother and father roles.   Yes, the gentleman this morning could have kept his pants on...yes he could get a vasectomy, but why put all the responsiblity on him before the pregnancy when the woman has all the rights after the pregnancy? If they both were there to make the baby, then they both should try and agree on the outcome.  But my gripe is,  when it comes right down to it, legally, only the mother has the right to decide the outcome of the pregnancy.   It was her right to decide to keep the baby even after she knew how he felt, then it should be her responsiblity to take care of her.  What about the woman's right to decide to abort a child even though the biological father wants the baby and his decision and desire falls on deaf ears according to our legal system?  Here again, the father has no rights  because legally, it's still the mother's "right  to choose".  If it's going to solely be an unwed woman's decision to keep a baby or not, no matter how the father feels, then it should solely be the woman's responsiblity to take care of it.  If she knows the father is no-count, a druggie,  jobless or she knows that he doesn't want children, then it's her legal "right" to decide to abort the fetus or carry it and put it up for adoption.  If neither one of those are a moral option, then she should be ready to care and provide for the child on her own...just like she made the decision to keep it...  on her own.
 
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April 21, 2006, 8:11 am PDT

I believe he made his choice

What happened to the old saying "you play, you pay"?  I think he made his choice when he put his faith and trust in another person.  In any relationship today, you have to trust yourself first.  Especially when it comes to sex, protection, and childbirth.  I think he is trying to avoid his responsibilities, and avoid paying for his mistakes literally.  He has a choice left.  He can sign his rights away saying he does not want to be the father.  I have a friend who has a daughter, and the father signed his rights away so her new husband could adopt the little girl.  Why doesn't he give her up himself.  He has that right the same as she does.  He is a loser.  Think about how that child is going to feel to know her own father didn't want her.  I was lucky to have one child.  I lost six babies total.  Maybe he should understand it isn't a right, it is a privilege!  I hope he gets racked right in the balls, so he can't have babies when he is ready to have them.  He doesn't deserve any children ever!
 
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April 21, 2006, 8:11 am PDT

unbeleaveable

Quote From: fluffyfat

I'm so tired of men being the villian and women the poor victim in these situations.  Would people be accusing the girl of having "unprotected sex" if she had not been taking the pill while Matt used a condom?  It's considered protected sex if one person is using a reliable form of birth control; and the pill is usually 99.9% effective. 

  

I agree with Matt.  He was misinformed if not out and out lied to by the girl about her chances of getting pregnant.   He was not given any choices down the line about abortion or adoption.  

  

It's the woman who has had all the choices, so if a she decides that she is going to have sex before marriage, not get an abortion if she gets pregnant, and not put the baby up for adoption then she should also decide to support that baby herself.  Otherwise, she just might want to [iget married[/i before she starts having sex.  Marriage is the tried and true, time honored method of finding out if a man is committed enough to a woman to bear his children. 

matt has all the choice in the world it's called a condom if he was that worried about becoming a father he would have wore a condom.... Now he should have to take responsibility for his actions and father the child. If he knew he did not want to be a father , birth control or not he would have proteted himself. i think this is just his way of getting out of being a father to this child he is a descrace to the male gender.
 
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April 21, 2006, 8:12 am PDT

To Be a dad or Not!

               Dear Dr Phil, 

                                          I understand that if he was forced to have sex with her it might be different. They had a relationship going on. They both made the decision to have sex. I feel that even though he doesn't want to be a father then he had the right to say I don't want to have sex. Since he had sex and a baby is the result of it he needs to step up to the plate or give up all rights to the baby. I really feel sorry for the baby because she didn't do anything but be born. I would hate to see what will happen when she gets older and she finds out that her father didn't want her or love here. That is the unforgivable. He needs to be man!!!!!!!!!!!! Stop the bull and think of the kid. Too many kids don't know who there mothers and fathers and our looking for them to love them and why did they give them up. Do you want  your little girl knowing that dad doesn't love her and dosen't want her. Just think when she gets older . You will be back on Dr. Phil explaining to her why you didn't love here. Do you really want that.                From a mom! 

 
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