Topic : 07/06 Baby Wars

 I was stunned to watch the young man and his attorney's in reference to his desire not to be a father to his daughter. First of all, he made a decision to have sex with his girlfriend.  He also made a choice not to protect himself despite what he had been told of his girlfriends chances of bearing a child. If he would have made the choice to protect himself not only from the possibility of impregnating his girlfriend but, also from the possibility of getting a sexually transmitted disease things MAY have turned out differently.   The only contraceptive that is 100% is abstinence.   Due to the fact that he was obviously adamant about having children at this point in his life he should also be adamant about making 100% sure that he did not become a father by not having sex.  His girlfriend did not rape him and as a result of their sexual encounter they made a baby. Although neither of them were ready to become parents they made a beautiful miracle. It is both of their responsibility to care for this child.   

We live in a world were trust is becoming more and more of an issue in a relationship. If you meet someone and they tell you that they do not have a sexually transmitted disease or have never had a STD each individual has to make a choice to believe their partner and have unprotected sex or to protect themselves.  Some people do not know that they have a STD so therefore, it is ALWAYS a wise idea to use protection. This theory is also true for the man who believes he was lied to and therefore, should not bear the financial or emotional responsibility for his child. He made the decision to have unprotected sex. Therefore, the courts should make the decision to have him bear some of the financial burden for the care of his daughter. When in doubt, take a condom out!      

 Why would you side with a guy who made a choice to have sex with his girlfriend and not use a condom? Although, his girlfriend told him she was unable to have children that is not 100%. He made a choice to rely on his girlfriends statement and not protect himself. They both made a child together...although, it was an accident. They must now handle this like adults and take care of this innocent child.   

It takes a lot more than money to raise a child.  A child needs both a mother and a father.  A mother can NEVER give a child what a father can nor can a father ever give what a mother can give.  I am sick of hearing about $$$$$$$$$$ what about support in the way of guidance, love, nuture and understanding.  Sure money does help but it doen't fix the problem.

FIRST LET ME SAY THAT I AM A WOMAN AND MOTHER OF A 7 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER.  SECONDLY, LET ME SAY THAT THERE SHOULD ALWAYS BE CONSIDERATION FOR THE CHILD IN ANY SITUTATION.    

   

HERE'S MY STORY.  2 WEEKS BEFORE MY WEDDING IN APRIL OF 1995, MY HUSBAND GOT THE RESULTS FROM A PATERNITY TEST WHERE IT SAID THAT HE WAS THE FATHER OF A 5 YEAR OLD BOY.  SURPRISE!!  YES THE BOY WAS A PRODUCT OF A ONE NIGHT STAND.  HOWEVER THE MOTHER WAS DATING A FRIEND OF MY HUSBAND'S AND DECIDED TO MARRY THIS OTHER GUY EVEN THOUGH SHE KNEW THAT MY HUSBAND WAS THE FATHER.  (WE KNOW THIS BECAUSE SHE TOLD HER BEST FRIEND THAT SHE KNEW IT WAS MY HUSBAND'S KID BUT THE OTHER GUY MADE BETTER MONEY AND SHE WOULD BE ABLE TO STAY HOME WITH THE BABY.)  AFTER 2 YEARS THE MOTHER AND OTHER GUY GOT DIVORCED.  SHE ALLOWED THE OTHER GUY VISITATION FOR ANOTHER 3 YEARS.  AFTER THE DIVORCE, BEFORE SHE MOVED OUT OF THE AREA, SHE TOOK THE CHILD AND WENT TO MY HUSBAND'S PARENT'S HOUSE.  NO ONE COULD FIGURE OUT WHY.  (WE KNOW NOW)....  

   

ANYWAYS, THIS CHILD HAS GROWN UP WITH MAJOR PSYCHOLOGICAL PROBLEMS BECAUSE OF THIS.  WHEN WE FIRST STARTED SEEING THE CHILD, HE WOULD SAY THINGS TO ME LIKE, "ONCE I GET YOU KICK OUT OF MY DAD'S HOUSE, I CAN COME UP WHEN EVER I WANT!"  NOW WHAT 5 YEAR OLD COMES UP WITH THAT?  MANY OTHER EXAMPLES COULD BE GIVEN, BUT YOU GET THE PICTURE.  IT SEEMED THE MORE WE HAD TO DO WITH HIM, THE MORE SHE USED HIM A PAWN.  SO WE CUT THE TIES FOR MANY YEARS.  THAT BOY IS NOW 16 AND WE HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH HIM THAT IS GOOD.  

   

MY POINT TO THIS, IS THAT THIS MOTHER, NOT ONLY HAD ALL THE RIGHTS BUT MESSED WITH 3 DIFFERENT LIVES IN THE PROCESS, ESPECIALLY HER CHILDS.  (HE STILL HAS PROBLEMS TO THIS DAY AND SEES A DOCTOR.)  MY HUSBAND WAS FORCED TO PAY 17% OF HIS INCOME IN CHILD SUPPORT AND SUPPLY HEALTH INSURANCE FOR THE CHILD.  HE HAD NO CHOICE.  SHE CAN MARRY A GUY, DIVORCE HIM, GIVE HIM VISITATION FOR SEVERAL YEARS AND THEN WHEN SHE DECIDES, SHE CAN JUST SAY, OH YOUR NOT THE DAD BUT HE IS.    

   

IF A MAN IS DELINQUENT IN PAYING HIS CHILD SUPPORT, HE GOES TO JAIL.  BUT A WOMAN CAN DO THIS SORT OF THING AND IT IS LEGAL.  THAT IS NOT RIGHT.  PLAIN AND SIMPLE.  I BELIEVE THAT WHEN HER YOUNGEST CHILD TURNS 18, SHE SHOULD GO TO JAIL.  MY HUSBAND MISSED OUT ON THE FIRST 5 YEARS OF HIS SON'S LIFE AND THAT SON HAS BEEN MENTALLY ALTERED FOR LIFE.  DOES THAT NOT MATTER?  WHAT IF MY HUSBAND DIDN'T WANT TO BE A FATHER TO THIS BOY?  HE HAD NO CHOICE!    

   

I ALSO DISAGREE WITH THE WAY CHILD SUPPORT IS HANDLED.  WHILE WE STRUGGLE, THE MOTHER TAKES SEVERAL TRIPS A YEAR.  IN FACT THE SON HAS BEEN TO MEXICO MORE THAN I CAN COUNT AS WELL AS YEARLY TRIPS TO DISNEY WORLD.  I THINK IT IS TIME TO TAKE BOTH THE MOTHER'S INCOME AND THE FATHER'S INCOME INTO CONSIDERATION.  THE MOTHER CAN REMARRY AND LIVE HIGH OFF THE HOG AND THAT MEANS NOTHING TO THE COURTS.  IN THE NETHERLANDS, WHEN A MAN MARRIES A WOMAN WITH CHILDREN, HE ACCEPTS THE FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY FOR THOSE CHILDREN.  

   

MY HUSBAND IS AN EXCELLENT FATHER, WE SHARED ALL THE MOMENTS AND WORK OF RAISING OUR DAUGHTER 50/50.  HE SHOULD HAVE HAD THE RIGHT TO DENY BEING A DAD TO THIS BOY.  HE WOULD NOT HAVE,  BUT HE SHOULD HAVE HAD THE CHOICE.  PERHAPS IF MEN HAD A CHOICE YOU WOULD SEE A LOT LESS WOMAN GETTING PREGNANT AND COUNTING ON THAT WEEKLY CHECK.  WHICH WOULD MEAN LESS DEAD BEAT DADS AND UNWANTED CHILDREN.    

   

I can't say how pleased I am to finally hear somebody speak up about this issue. About ten years ago I wrote a college paper on equal rights, with this issue being the main topic. I have long believed men should have the same, or as near as possibly, rights as women when it comes to parenthood. This is not an issue about a man being a "dead beat" father. It is about if he wishes to be a father at all. As a woman, many my find it strange I would speak out "for men" regarding this topic. However, it is not about men, it is about both men and women, as well as society in general. I honestly believe many problems would be solved by allowing men to have choices regarding parenthood. It would go a long way toward cutting down on the number of women who use pregnancy as a means of "keeping" a man. If women knew, fully understood, a man had a choice in accepting fatherhood or not, it would create an environment where the women would think twice about getting pregnant when a man has demonstrated he would prefer either to not become a father or to wait to become a father. It would also keep down the number of unwanted or resented children. These children born of this type of conception have to live with the bad decisions of the parents. I strongly feel children deserve the best start at life, and in my opinion the best start begins with two loving parents. While most women do not stoop to this level of "tricking" their partner, sadly it does occur and more often than many would like to believe. This leads to such unhappiness and tragedy for the child and I would like to see the number of children born this way reduced. On top of this, there should be a level of fairness between the sexes. It is true that women have all the options and "choice" when it comes to parenthood. Women call all the shots, can choose whether or not they want a child but a man is not able to do the same. We all talk about equality for women, I would like to say we need to open our eyes and mouths and speak to the real issue about equality for women, men, blacks, Hispanics, Germans, Latino, Asian, etc, equality across the world. While I understand this is far reaching, some would even say dreaming, it has to start somewhere. We, here in America, have the ability to make changes which can effect the entire world. We have the government which can make the world a place of equality. A place to begin would be to allow men to have a say if and when  they become parents. It would not even be a difficult thing to accomplish. We all agree in the concept of equality. Yet we don't put our money where our mouths are. This saddens me a great deal. Change is not a comfortable thing, we just don't like it much. However, in order for us, the human race to reach a better place, change is something which must happen. I believe we could effect a great deal of change by setting law which would enable men to choose when and if they become parents. This is not an issue about dead beat dads. In fact, this issue, if it were to become a reality, would begin to put a stop to dead beat dads. While we will always have parents who run out on their children, families, we will stop a large portion of children having parents who resent the existence of their children. Right now we are half way there. Women have the ability to decide if they want to keep a child. While I am pro-choice, I do not personally subscribe to abortion. However, even I would have to seriously consider this drastic option if I were raped and were faced with the knowledge I may very well be forced to deal with the father of a child born of that rape for the rest of my or my child's life. This would be intolerable to me. I would most likely feel forced into adoption, but there are many who would opt for an abortion. If I knew I could keep my child and not face the man who brutally raped me I would definitely keep that child. So, there are issues on both sides which still needs to be addressed. While women do have many more choices than men, they still are faced with intolerable choices. However, women at least  have those choices. Men do not. I think it would go far toward equality if men were allowed a choice such as this. It is difficult for a man who dearly wants his child to know the woman opted for an abortion. How helpless men in this situation must feel, knowing that the life or death of his child will occur without any input what-so-ever, from him. To stand by and know your child will die, and have not a word you say make a difference in that life, is intolerable to me. Well, we can do much to empower men in reproductive rights. I feel strongly that true equality will never be achieved until we deal with this fundamental inequality. Men must be given the right to choose too. This is not a moral issue on a parental level, but a moral issue on humanities scale. Why should men grant full equality to women, when women are not willing to give some back to men? I firmly believe this will create an atmosphere of decency and moral rightness in which men and women can come together and make the world a better place for all. We must put aside our old beliefs and make room for newer and much more viable beliefs. At one time men believed the smartest woman was not as smart as the dumbest man.  This belief was wide held and had to be dispelled before any rights were granted women. It was men who granted women the vote, the right to own property, the right to be free from the rule of thumb, the basic rights we have achieved to this day, are given by men who saw a better world, and put aside long held beliefs and misinformation about women. It is now time to do this again, only women must be the ones to lead this forward. Men have turned aside from long held beliefs and granted rights which they did not have to do. It is time to take these rights back to men and grant them the ability to have a say in procreation. This is a way forward into a future where true equality can exist. I may not have been able to say this as well as I would have liked, in this forum, but I hope to have expressed it to some small degree. I do not believe this is an issue of anybody wishing to be bad people, or to refuse to accept responsibility. While that may occur in small numbers, overall I believe this would make the world a better place. Less children who are born unwanted, resented, and more children born to those who truly wish them in their lives, love and cherish them, and provide a stable loving home. I heard many who got stuck on the idea of men needing to step up and accept the responsibility of "playing". Well, women have the ability to step down from that "playing" and to not take on the responsibility of raising a child conceived during that "play". Why then is it so difficult for individuals to grasp that men should have rights to decide not to become parents too? I hope nobody will step up and say they believe men have more moral fiber than women. I see a much higher level of expectation of mens behaviors than those of women. On the Dr. Phil show, I have watched while Dr. Phil has been very hard on men, but much easier on women for the exact same offense. This offense is the act of cheating on a spouse or partner. I understand Dr. Phil is as human as the next, though I do believe him very intelligent and astute. I was disappointed to see him behave as though men are more morally responsible than women are. I know I have the capacity to have as much honor as any highly honorable man. I also know I am responsible for my own actions, not any one else. I see sometimes Dr. Phil treating women who have behaved in reprehensible manners much more gently than men who have behaved the same. I don't know If Dr. Phil is aware of this tendency of his, but I hope he sees it soon and realizes that it is not right to expect higher degrees of moral behavior from men than he does from women. I also watched today while Dr. Phil became upset with the idea of men having a choice. He seemed troubled with the idea, and I was surprised this issue had not been something he had a higher degree of understanding, at least the concept of fairness and true equality. I am not putting Dr. Phil down, so don't any of you attack me here! :-) As I said, he is as human as the next and as prone to the frailties being human brings. I challenge all to just stop and think this through. Try to ignore preconceived ideas and beliefs just for a time and think of what good could come of this. Try to set aside belief systems long enough to just look at this logically and really think about what this could accomplish for the world. It takes putting aside these preconceived ideas and notions in order for any change to take place. I do not see much negative outcomes in this issue. Many wish to think that this would allow men to just walk away from "their" responsibilities. Well, women are walking away from theirs every day, yet we say this is their "right". Why is it not also a right for a man? why is a man less eligible for this right than a woman? Man is not less eligible for this right. He should also have the ability to make decisions in his life about procreation. Let a law be passed which provides a man six months to decide, from the date he has been informed of impending fatherhood, whether or not he wishes to be a father. If not, let him petition the court for all rights and responsibilities be set aside for ever. Clear the way for a man who wishes to be that child's father to easily adopt. Let every child have the highest chance possible to be raised by loving parents in a stable home. Let women know men have rights, that they may chose not to be a tather. This will cut down on many unwanted pregnancies or babies born out of needs not related to the true desire to be a parent. I could continue on, but I really think this is about all the area I should take up. I want to reiterate the challenge to set aside pre-conceived ideas and beliefs and to just think of this logically. Set aside all the emotions this brings up and try to look clearly. If you do this and still believe the way you do, I can respect that belief. However, if a person just refuses to really look at issues and blindly clings to pre-concieved ideas and beliefs without really looking at this without emotion involved, then I have a problem in believing that person has truly given this fair thought, and therefor the opinion does not have merit. Nobody has to agree with me, just give this issue a fair hearing by truly looking at it from all angles and without heated emotion. Lets try to make a difference in our life times, as our ancestors fought so hard for freedom and the level of equality we have today. The world still has far to go in achieving true equality and I truly believe this issue will cut to the heart and hasten change for the better, for all mankind. Thank you for reading this. Nikki

When I was 38 years old, divorced and a single mom, I found myself in the exact same boat (on the mother's side though.).  My baby's father wanted nothing to do with me or the baby, and I chose to have the baby anyway. I knew in my heart this wasn't a "trap" and I wanted the baby to have one loving parent, anyhow.  I had a beautiful baby boy and would do it all over again if I had the choice!     

   

During the first few years of my son's life I didn't ask the father for help because I felt mostly responsible for the pregnancy. I had been through years of infertility treatments during my marriage and was certain I couldn't get pregnant (we had ultimately adopted a child.)  My friends later convinced me that my son deserved support from EACH parent so I contacted his father and asked for financial support, at least.  He tried to deny he was the father so I dished out another $1,000 to prove it through DNA testing, and he is now paying $340/month.  We worked out our own deal.   

   

In my mind, fathers have plenty of rights in this situation.  They have the right to walk away and leave the mother to endure the pain of childbirth, the sleepness nights, the expenses . . .  They have the right to leave a child, his own flesh & blood, wondering why his Daddy isn't around.  They have the right to continue their lives and careers as if nothing ever happened.  What about the BABY'S rights?  Where is the attorney for the innocent babies that have no voice in these situations?  Wake up Matt, and take some responsibility.  You can walk a day in my shoes (or better yet -- your child's shoes!!!)   

I know where you are coming from with this.  When I found out I was pregnant with our second child neither of us was happy about it, neither of us wanted another one yet.  I came round before he did and I can remember trying my hardest not to hate him for his distant and cool attitude towards our baby.  Yet, now that she has been here for 18 months, he is smitten.  He had no interest in another child, until shortly before she was born, and even then his interest seemed to be minimal.  But the day that little girl was born she became daddy's little girl and it has been wonderful to watch.  So do let him know how you are feeling and that he is going to have to deal with it, but don't give up.  As for you having to do most or all the work, I have no help on that, still trying to figure out how to break my husband of that.  There have even been times where I have left him home with the children at night, after they go to bed, and gone out with friends and he has called me telling me to come home because our daughter woke up.  I told him no and my bestfriend grabbed the phone after the 3 or fourth time and told him to deal with it himself because I dealt with it all day.  For some reason he listened to her and I have not had a problem any time I have gone out since then, other than calling to ask where things are!  Really, sometimes I think he would just be lost without me.  He might be able to get dressed but that would be about it!  :-P

           If you dont wont kids than don't have sex. There are women who get their tubes tide and still get pregnant. Also some doctors make mistakes and tell some women that they can't have kids and still do. Unless she lies than it is his resposibility too. I believe if he would hold his child than he would have some feelings for her. And if he doesn't than he doesn't have a heart. But I guess that some men can not see that. The only way I would be on his side would be if she lied to him. If she didn't have a note from her doctor and just assumed than it would be her fault. Even though the man should take responsibilty. At least visit her. Also just because it wasn't planned doesn't mean she isn't his daughter. It's still his DNA and you can't run from that.

   OK, how about the women should not have children they can't afford.  If they can afford to have kids, they shouldn't need child support.

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THE GUY I'M A MOTHER I HAVE ONE SON I FEEL MEN GET THE SHORT OF THE STICK IN THIS CASE HE STATED HE DIDNT WANT ANY CHILDREN AND SHE TOLD HIM SHE COULD NOT HAVE ANY AND SHE WAS USING BIRTH CONTROL PILLS. IF THAT WAS ME AND I HAD TOLD A MAN THAT I COULDNT GET PREGANT AND HE TOLDME HE DIDNT WANT CHILDREN AND I BE CAME PREGANT THAT WOULD BE ON ME BECAUSE I HAVE CHOICE TO KEEP IT OUT GIVE UP OR WHATEVER. IT'S NOT LIKE SHE DIDNT KNOW HOW HE FEEL I DONT  FEEL HE SHOULD HAVE TO PAY CHILD SUPPORT HE SHOULD GIVE ALL PARENT RIGHTS THATS FORCING TO BE A DAD BACK IN THE DAY IF A WOMEN GOT PREGANT MEN WERE FORCE TO MARRY THEM I FEEL CHILDREN DONT A MAKE A MARRIAGE THEY HINDER A MARRIAGE. I HOPE THE GUY WINS. BECASUE WOMEN CAN LIE JUST TO TRAP A MAN ITS NOT FAIR NOT SAYING THIS IS IN ALL CASES BUT IN THIS ONE THEY TALK ABOUT IT AND ESPECIALLY SHE STATED SHE COULD HAVE ANY CHILDREN AND SHE WAS USING THE PILL YES HE DID RIGHT HE SAID HE TRUSTED HER..... I THINK THERE SHOULD BE A LAW BUT I FEEL IT SHOULD IN WRITTING WHEN ONE PARTY DONT WANT ANY CHILDREN THERE IS WOMEN WHO DONT WANT ANY CHILDREN AND THE MAN DOES. 

  

THANKS 

DANIELLE