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Topic : 07/06 Baby Wars

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Created on : Thursday, April 13, 2006, 01:22:17 pm

Author : DrPhilBoard1

(Original Air Date: 04/21/06) Being a parent is hard enough, but what happens when Mom and Dad can't agree on how many kids to have, how to raise 'em and how to get ‘em to sleep? Sometimes, it can lead to an all-out baby war! Matt's baby battle ended up in front of a judge and made headlines. He was ordered to pay child support for the baby he had with his ex-girlfriend, but he says he shouldn't have to cough up the money because she told him she wasn't able to get pregnant, and he told her he didn't want to be a father. He, his attorney, and the director of the National Center for Men discuss the lawsuit they filed, known as “Roe v. Wade for Men,” arguing that men should have a constitutional right to avoid fatherhood. Next, Dan says even though he and his wife, Lisa, already have four children, he wants just one more. Lisa has been pregnant on and off for 11 years and says she's closed for baby business. Will Dr. Phil help Dan see Lisa's point that four is enough? Then, a frustrated husband is camping out on the roof of his house and living in a tent. He refuses to go back to his bedroom until his wife moves their kids out of their bed and starts paying more attention to him. Can Dr. Phil get him to come down the ladder? Plus, a sleep expert has a simple method for getting your child to sleep through the night. See the plan in action! Share advice and talk about the show here.

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birdsmom

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April 22, 2006, 1:19 am PDT

Baby wars

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dbachelor

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April 22, 2006, 1:24 am PDT

Pre-sex agreements?

Quote From: wintrywood

First off I must say that baby girl is beautiful and precious and looks just like Matt. I know he didn't want her but how can he not look at her cute little face and fall head over heels in love? Thats COLD Matt!

In abortion (which btw I do not support) women have the choice because its their body. So thats not the mans call.

In adoption the father does have a choice and has to be notified before an adoption proceeds. The father can choose to raise the child or to allow the child to be adopted. Is it fair to ask a father to support a child he claims he didn't want in the first place? If he really didn't want to be a father, shouldn't he have taken care of that before having sex? It may seem unfair because men do not have as many options in birth control as women do but given that fact, I think if a man doesn't want to be a father, he should choose not to have sex or use a condom use two in case one breaks! Once the baby is conceived and born its too late to then claim you didn't want it. You have to accept the consequences of your actions. You are half responsible for that child so suck it up and make sure you don't make the same mistake next time!

Matt claims that he was told by his girlfriend that she couldn't get pregnant. Does she agree that she told him this? Where is the proof that he didn't know that having unprotected sex with her might result in a child that he now claims he never wanted? For Matt to win his case I think he will have to prove that his girlfriend lied and misled him. Otherwise its he said she said.

You raise an interesting point, namely proof. I can see now that us guys are going to have to produce a legal form and get the gal to sign it before things can proceed, in order for us to be fully protected, as Dr. Phil wants us to be. I'm guessing the signature would have to be witnessed by a notary.

The form, or course, would stipulate that what we're about to engage in is recreational, as opposed to procreational, sex. Sub-clauses would spell out in detail what would happen in the event of contigencies A, B, C, etc...

Machines dispensing these forms will be provided in bar restrooms next to the rubber dispensers...

I'm being a bit facetious, but formerly the proof that a man was willing to father and provide for a woman's children was his willingness to marry her. Period. This seems so elementary. It makes me wonder what was wrong with that and why we as a society changed to something else.

In other words, since when did a man's mere willingness to have sex with a woman become a "gotchya" whereby we then say "oh, well, you had your jollies so now you're obligated to pay and pay and pay because she wins a free baby", not to mention that he gets none of the reciprocal benefits of having a wife, raising the kid the way he sees fit, etc...

The reason men resent and protest child support payments is because IT'S NOT OUR BABY IF SHE OWNS IT, which is how the law views it.

The current system is terribly messed up and broken, and all most can think of doing is blaming the guy, like that will make it better.

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sevensmile

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April 22, 2006, 1:31 am PDT

So Angry!!!

These are scary times we're living in, when a grown man (chronologically at least) can have unprotected sex, conceive a child, and then claim that he "isn't a father, because he didn't choose to be one" - what a pile of B.S!!!!! This guy needs a swift kick in the arse, really. What happened to responsibility, not to mention having a heart. His daughter is going to grow up rejected, because he's selfish. This guy's living in serious denial - he hopes that if he pretends his daughter isn't here, she'll just go away. WAKE UP!!! She's a human being with feelings, and one day she'll be feeling anything but loving towards you, you pathetic coward of a man.

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annleeah

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April 22, 2006, 1:31 am PDT

how Matt can win his

This is how Matt can win the "war".

By being civil to his daughter's mother and by loving his daughter unconditionally.

When he hurts his daughter's mother, he hurts his daughter. When he hurts his daughter, he hurts himself.

It's that simple.

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birdsmom

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April 22, 2006, 1:33 am PDT

04/21 Baby Wars

I am sorry to say that man did not know the reality of life. He gave life, and he could not accept it. He said that birth control was not 100% effective, but he still decided to have sex. If he did not want any children, then he should have abstained from sex. His own gratification made a child, a really beautiful child, a child that he may never know. I am so sorry for u, but I am greatful for the mother who has decided to keep, love and raise the child,.

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sevensmile

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April 22, 2006, 1:37 am PDT

relevance of rant?

Quote From: jesseca

I think it's fascinating that so many people resort to the bible for solutions to problems. Now if you think you can find something in the bible that "predicts" situations like this, you are just plain silly. Ya' know, i think it's great there's people like you that have a positive outlook on life (not that i don't) because of the bible, but come on nowlet's reason here. A fictatious book that was written a million years ago has no relevance on today's societal problems. Do you think our ancestors would be able to predict that we'd be presented with issues like this, or how we'd react to them? Probably not, so what makes you believe the bible (which is supposedly written by "jesus" and his prophets) forsees events we're presented with today? I just find it very interesting how everything is tied to the bible. Situations like Matt's prove that there is always going to be people who try to find the loopholes in the legal system. It doesn't validate anything in relation to the bible!

p.s. i am an athiest who doesn't need the bible to feel validated, or reason people's actions. Common sense does that all by itself!

What is this? I didn't get to read the message that you were replying to, but I don't see why you're hacking down someone else's faith.

Billions of people around the world have a faith system that they believe in. You have one too - it's a 'forced choice'. We all believe in something. There's no reason to get offensive here.

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sstrnes

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April 22, 2006, 1:37 am PDT

Unbelievable!!!

Okay, I agree with Juli0421, that is the biggest copout in the world that I have ever heard. I know lots of guys who will and have openly told me that they ARE NOT ready to be dads, however they have also said that should that happen unplanned they would still be MAN enough to step up and take their role as a father and do their best to protect their child. It's called growing up and being a man! My honest whole hearted advice to this "poor, pityful" guy is real simple. Either A: grow up, and keep your pants zipped,. and hey if your having a problem with that aspect, you know Wal-mart does sale belts if thats the problem! (In case you didnt have that much sense)! Or B: go home to mommy and daddy and have them go to the store and get you some more diapers, a bottle, and a pacifer if needed! Simply because they obviously didnt finish the job! Bottom line! Just Dont Have Sex and you will not be having these problems! Duh!!!!

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magicsmom2

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April 22, 2006, 1:37 am PDT

What a bunch of idiots!

If this man didn't want to be a father, then he shouldn't have gone to bed with this woman or any other. When a man and a woman have sex, especially unprotected sex, it's entirely reasonable to assume there is a chance it will result in pregnancy. Now that he has fathered a child, he should be held responsible for making sure she is properly cared for. Of course, I am pro-life so I hold the woman to the same standard of responsibility. With limited exceptions, abortion should not be a choice. Adoption is a choice and a good one if both parties agree, but a woman shouldn't have to give away a child because the father isn't "ready" to be a proper father. How weak is that! This whole thing is so tied up in morality and choices, it will never be sorted properly. And the lawyer! - what a slimeball. "I'm not sure you could say they had consensual sex" blah, blah, blah. It is lawyers like him that give the profession the image it has. I hope their case goes down in flames, but it'll probably end up in the Supreme Court and goodness only knows what will happen then.

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jimmyv3

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April 22, 2006, 1:37 am PDT

04/21 Baby Wars

Quote From: stupormom

Women get the lion's share of the choices in this issue because they get the lion's share of the concequences. The day that a man can carry, deliver, and nurse the child, they can have all the choices they please!

The day women truly act as EQUALS, pull their own weight, knock that chip off their shoulder, stop acting like their vagina is a golden key to rule the world, and stop being a deceiving species, then and only then, they can make some choices.

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dbachelor

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April 22, 2006, 1:38 am PDT

Yea, you're right

Quote From: blindlibby

Again... a man is showing why we, as women, need Rowe vs Wade in the first place. Men can be very controlling, manipulative, and even violent about sex.... and sometimes resulting in babies. And women pay the price in every aspect of their life, for the rest of their life. If she chooses to abort, she lives with that sickening feeling that she killed her baby... no matter how many times she tries to forgive herself. If she puts the baby up for adoption... she lives with the fact that she has a child somewhere that she abandoned... albeit usually for very good reasons. Or keep the baby... childbirth is very painful, pregnancy is not a vacation, a lot of businesses look down on responsible single mom's and aren't their first choice on a job. And most mom's continue to be a mom (financially and emotionally) forever. No matter what, all decisions affect your life .... THESE ARE NOT EASY DECISIONS FOR US TO MAKE!!!

BUT.... men can walk away when tired of it.

Look around you. Most women are raising their children alone. A few men (thank you to all of you) are responsible even after a divorce or separation, even to the point of fighting for custody. I applaude these men. There are more deadbeat dad's than ever. More rape's than ever. More drugging young women for sex than ever.

NOW YOU WANT TO OPEN A DOOR TO TAKE AWAY OUR RIGHTS TO CHOOSE TO KEEP OUR CHILD??? This makes it too easy for any man to walk away and leave ALL responsibility on the woman. Isn't there already enough of that going

-she should have just kept her legs together.

I thought the whole point of the lawsuit is that under current laws the man *can't* walk away when tired of it, as you put it. As President Clinton said "we will hunt you down and make you pay". And that's what's happening: millions of dollars are being spent trying to squeeze child support out of unemployed and marginally employed men who can't pay no matter how many laws are passed and how many enforcement agents are hired.

The fact that women totally control reproduction -- the way men used to control everything in business and politics -- implies that the fact that there are so many women raising children alone is because of choices made by women. Men have little to do with it, because by definition we have no say in the matter.

I think the person who's being "very controlling, manipulative, and even violent" is the woman and her agents the state. They do cart away beat-dead-dads in handcuffs and put them in jail....

You last sentence makes no sense in light of the show -- no one was trying to take away a woman's right to keep her child -- except that it's suddenly *his* child when it comes to the money thing.

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