Topic : Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Violence is physically,mentally & emotionally tramatizing at all levels. There are longterm effects but a lot  of children are in nonsurvival mode by 3. Hard object hitters who often brutalize and try to scare litterally to death drive to drugs,crime,rape, & murder. Our grandparents had that group. 

The fallout went for years. The control wasn't much at such a high cost. At the lowest level I saw 

spousal,screaming, destroyed people and out of control people. So I have trouble with anyone who thinks you are hurting kids feelings. I am totally anti-violence. I am seeing a lot of hard hitters concerned with scaring children to death hitting their bones and too excess on & on. From the Mid-west or South maybe. They attack other adults like Hitlers. It is the reason I came on a little too strong.  Everyone lives in different worlds, some better than others, but violence is a gateway drug 

to powermad addictive destruction. And all emotion destruction is surpressed by violence for years. 

  

I guess it never ceases to amaze me how we equate "spanking" with "abuse".  I have spanked all three of my children.  None of them have EVER been abused.  I know spanking can lead to physical abuse, but speaking can lead to verbal abuse.  Should we all stop speaking? 

  

Abuse is a horrible thing, whether it be physical, mental, sexual, or verbal.  Some have endured all forms and it is hideous when inflicted by anyone much less a parent.  I also find it interesting that so many people believe spanking is done when angry.  I have yet to ever spank from anger.  When I get angry, I mean REALLY angry, I generally go to a room or outside to gather myself.  Regardless of where I am or who I'm around, I just get away.  But since I don't get angry easy or often, I don't have to really worry about it.  Now, when my children were warned of a spanking as a result of a behavior and the spanking was carried out, anger was not necessary simply b/c I carried out what I told them would happen.  Just like I don't get angry when I revoke privileges, make them sit and think, or any other consequence.  I just don't understand it.  I have seen people hit their children out of anger, but that is not spanking, that is abuse. 

Well, I thought I posted a message earlier today but evidently I didn't LOL. Whatever the case, I don't see it here so hopefully I am not repeating myself. It sounds to me like you are a very angry victim of abuse and that you are bitter and unforgiving which is something that I personally do understand as I have had the same sort of feelings and hate as well. If you have not already, I would reccomend some good counseling and don't stop seeking help til you are fully healed of all this. It is possible to love and to be happy even in a world of turmoil and violence, It is possible to get beyond the anger that you seem to be feeling and it is possible to forgive others for their trespasses and to live life to it's fullest. It doesn't mean that you forget what people has done or said to harm you and it doesn't mean that you have to trust them and make them your best friend, but what it does mean is that you have prooved to them as well as yourself that you are worthy to love and to be loved and respected and that you can live a happy and fullfilling life even though they have tried everything in their power to destroy you. As far as I am concerned, my abusers have eaten dust and unless they have asked for forgiveness and changed their life style according to the way God intended it to be, they will pay for their deeds but I refuse to be dragged down with them. Abuse is a horrible ordeal for any one to have to go through and I agree that children can and will carry it over to adulthood and with out the care, love, and help that they need, chances are they too will become abusers, but with the right help and guidance they can become achievers and I thank God that I am who I am today and that He has helped me through the ordeals and most of all, I am thankful that I am not an abuser that my children are well mannered and happy kids, we love and care for each other in our home and it certainly shows. Whether a parent spanks or not is not the determination on how their children will turn out but how they have raised their kids and whether or not their kids were loved, respected and disciplined in a way that will teach and guide them through this life and of course by the choices that they will make as they will have free will of choice on how they live their lives. I am not perfect but I am the best parent for my children and maybe someday you will feel confident enough in your self to know how imporant you are and that you have great value and potential and much to offer others. I certainly will pray for you that you can get the help and healing that it sounds like you need. And I am being very sincere here, I sense that you are not a happy person becasue of abuse in your life..........................

Ok, now it is my turn to talk. 

I am very much opposed to spanking, I believe it only teaches children to use violence, and if their friends for example don't do what they tell them to do it is ok to hit. I have a hard time believing that a child can differenciate between discipline and being hit. To them I believe it is the same thing.  

Why in the world can't our children have the same rights as us adults??   Why can't we protect our children for physical harm when we are protected by law???  Why is it ok to degrade children and then call it discipline?? Why can't the US take after Sweden to illegalise spanking??   

  

Me and my husband don't spank our 2 year old, we will never do it but we have a friend that is doing that to his child, and the fear that child has in his eyes if he thinks that he is gonna be spanked is heartbreaking to see.  Does anyone by chance have any suggestions on what to do with that situation??  I don't want my son to see that his friend is being spanked/hit.  I am trying to teach my son that it is never ok to hit other people but this situation showes him that appearently it is ok to hit.   Am I the only one in this situation??   I do need some advice.  When we had them over for dinner one night and I believe they stayed for maybe about 3-4 hours, this poor child got spanked probably half a dozen times.  Every time I wanted to yell out and protect that child.  

  

  

  

my suggestion is...find friends with your beliefs if you feel that strongly about it!!! 

Just what we need ...another law from the government telling how to raise our children....the  

more law you put in it ...seems like the worse this world gets.  ...look backwards to the days of Leave it to Beaver....no gov't. laws about spanking your child.  JMO 

Like I said, it is one friend but it is my husbands best friend.  And why not have that as a law to protect our children??  We have laws to protect us adults why not children??  I think child abuse would decrease dramatically if it was a law. Where is the line  between spanking and abuse then??  There is other ways to discipline your child then spanking.

Your home is your home.  If you don't agree with spanking, ask them in an adult conversation to please refrain from spanking their child in your home.  You can let them know you believe it is a bad influence on your child (in your opinion) so please choose other forms of discipline.  I do not allow anyone to curse, smoke, or speak meanly in our home b/c it is a bad influence on our children.  If people don't like it, they don't have to come over.  Quite simple to me. 

  

Quite frankly, if they are there only 3-4 hours and the child has been "spanked" THAT many times, they are not spanking.  I'm not sure why the child has to be disciplined that many times if the form of discipline is effective.  They CLEARLY need another form of teaching if this is the case.  ALL forms of discipline should have positive, definite, lasting results.  If they are spanking THAT many times, the child is not getting it.  Now, if he has special needs, they need to guide him/her more instead of spanking.  Spanking should be a consequence that is CLEARLY understood, carried out, and then resume with normal activity as with any consequence.  It sounds to me that the child is just being smacked for whatever and no lesson is learned.   Spanking, IMO, will not be against the law b/c it has been effective for too long when used properly.  There are no laws protecting us from consequences of wrong choices (i.e. speeding ticket when speeding).  Child abuse IS against the law in the US.  It is a hard crime to convict on b/c it is sometimes difficult to see all the damage being done when you are not around.  And yes, there other ways to discipline, but not always as effective in that time frame.  If you don't know the line between spanking and abuse, I would strongly suggest you not spank as well.  For us, it is VERY clear where the line is and even my children could share that with you. 

  

Take care, 

Tselb2 

I didnt implie that I don't know the line between spanking and abuse. I don't spank at all because I think it causes more damage then good.   

They spank this little boy in my opinion for no reason at all, he pushed my son a little, my son did not fall did not get hurt and this boy got a smack for it, in my opinion it is to much. He closed the door pretty hard, he is 3 years old he doesnt know how hard he is closing the door, it scared my son a little bit and he got smacked for that. They dont give him any warnings or even talk to him about what he is doing, they just smack him.  

  

I know child abuse is against the law but in my and a lot of other peoples opinion it is child abuse. I think every child should have the right to grow up in an environment that is safe from smacks, spankings, abuse and violent. We adults have that right, why not our children?? 

  

  

  

  

Exactly, it is an opinion. to spank or not to spank is up to the parent to decide and no government has the right to come into any ones home and tell them how to discipline a child. yes, my children have been spanked, it is a rare thing around here but I will not hesitate if need to and my children are not abused, physically or mentally. They are very well adjusted kids. You, in my opinion are describing an abused child because he is just getting slapped around for whatever reason and isn't even being told what he is doing wrong. Communication I believe is an imporant key to discipline/ raising a child to become great adults. just because you and a lot of other people think spanking is abuse doesn't make it so, there are many people as well who do not believe it is abuse so you do not have a good arguement there. So, what do you think should happen? Every one who gives their child a swat on the bottom should have child protective services called on them? I know a family who was accused of abusing their child and their kids taken away when in reality they were innocent and a family torn apart all becasue of one persons agenda and opinion, it just doesn't work, there are many children abused and who falls through the cracks of the system and you want to accuse innocent parents of abuse because they spank. I think if you want to go after abusers, you need to go after the REAL abusers, the children who are harmed, your opinion is just that, so I would advise yuo not to spank, stick up for the abused but don't accuse, accusing can ruin good and happy families. And by the way, my children are living in a happy, fun environment and safe as well. I treat my kids the same way in public as I do at home, You would be surprised how well behaved and happy a spanked child can be, as I said, it is a rare thing but I won't hesitate, the key to good discipline is to be consistent and teach the child and if they continue to repeat the actions over and over then something is wrong and a new method needs to take place, My oldest is in preschool and she has gotten many compliments on her behavior as well as skills, she is a loving and friendly little girl, she is smart and very socially and physically active. She loves school and at the same time excited when I pick her up, that does not sound like an abused child to me, believe me, I know what abuse is for I lived through it and I would never abuse my children and yes I have spanked.

"Where is the line  between spanking and abuse then" 

  

I gathered from this statement, you were unsure of the line.  So sorry for the misinterpretation. 

  

They are CLEARLY not spanking him, they are abusing him.  Not sure why, but that is what I would call it.  They should, at this point, teach him boundaries by example.  If he does not learn them, and only when he understands them should they enforce any kind of consequence.  Simply pushing your son the first time he should have been spoken to as well as the door scenario. 

  

I understand you believe spanking is child abuse, but in my home and many other people's, for that matter, it is clearly not.  Spanking is an effective form of discipline when used properly.  If not used properly, it can no longer be called spanking, but abuse.  I believe every child should grow up in an environment free of smacks, abuse and violence as well.  None of these tie into a spanking at all.  As I've said, I've spanked my children and they are CLEARLY not abused.  They are CLEARLY loved, respected, and awesome, awesome young men.  My children have many rights in life, but taking a consequence for a wrong choice is not a right, it is, in fact, a wrong.  They need to be taught that with wrong choices, consequences are inevitable. 

  

Tselb2