Topic : Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

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Created on : Thursday, June 30, 2005, 12:50:41 pm
Author : dataimport
Is spanking a necessary evil or can you discipline effectively without physical punishment? Sound off about spanking.

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May 17, 2008, 7:33 am PDT

Wake up and parent your kids so this is not a question

I hear a lot of parents that answer this question saying what Dr. Phil would want to hear but in Dr. Phil's own words "Let's get real" .  Parents are the one's that know their children best and they know before they enroll the kid in school whether or not he/she is in need of alternate disiplinary measures not the (time out joke).  If you are so against the disipline of the school then you should communicate with the school and be a volunteer, guess what ! they even let you sit in the classroom with your children.  I for one do not want the teacher to stop teaching my child and spend all her time on someones child that is not being controlled at home.  Swift is the word and fast is the motion.  Swat the buttocks and quickly set the child down and continue on the path to educate (what teachers are actually hired to do).  People, you need to think back to your childhood days, when you went to class you didn't have to worry about a " Bomb Threat", or guns in schools like my child does now days and that 's only because your parents would have not only spanked you but you had already been taught right from wrong.  In the context of spanking makes children violent, then taking something away teaches them to steal, not letting them play with others makes them depressed  and so on... So if you think that our school taxes would be better spent on babysitting your kids then keep on sending your kids to " time out " on school days.  I for one do not agree.  Spare the rod spoil the child and let society pay the price?  NO,   spank (don't beat) them get their attention quickly and do all the talking then because they are a captive audience when you show them you mean business.  Society will ultimately pay the price anyway if they go to jail.  In Florida we cut the school budgets and shut down schools and laid off teachers, but we approved the Law enforcement pay raises and added more police to the streets, we have more alternative schools for drop outs and fewer graduates.  Parents need to take off the blinders and actually get involved and in control of kids so we don't have to have this discussion.
 
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May 17, 2008, 7:38 am PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: hall01

I normally agree with Dr. Phil, but yesterday's show really let me down.  It is quite evident in the schools today that discipline at home is lacking.  The teachers are there to teach, not provide parental discipline.  If they need to spank to make undisciplined children listen, good for them!! I feel there are children who understand "No" or "Don't do that", but there are many who only respond to a good swat on the bottom.  No, this is not violence with a weapon!!! Have you noticed the violence going on in schools?  Children in 2nd grad threatening to kill their teacher, pipe bombs thrown in schools, shooting, etc.; it's on the news everday!!  Maybe if everyone would stop the Dr. Spock attitude and get real with kids today, the schools would better be able to teach.  My sister has stopped teaching....has been told to "F....you"  to her face and was told not to go down certain halls at lunch time because that's were kids go to fight.  Come on Dr. Phil; maybe some of this would stop if kids knew they were going to get spanked.  The Dr. Spock attitude of expressing yourself needs to stop now...the ONLY THING I heard you say that I agreed with was "Maybe we need to bring the parents in and spank them".  I agree whole-heartedly with the teacher who said she spanks.  

If I were a teacher today, I'd be afraid to lay a hand on student for fear I'd have a target pasted on my back.  As you mentioned in your post, times have certainly changed.  I went through 12 years of Catholic school with nuns and brothers back in the 60's and 70's.  While I both respected and feared the clergy, I never had one ever lay a hand on me.  Of course as you and Dr. Phil alluded to, if I did something wrong or showed disrespect to any of the teachers, they need simply contact my mother and she would take care of business with me.  Today, many kids, if disciplined by a teacher, would plan their revenge; post a video announcing their planned attack on the Internet; and then go on some type of rampage at their school.  School administration aren't helping the matter by pandering to the ill-mannered and unmotivated, which again are both results of piss-poor parenting.     
 
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May 17, 2008, 7:56 am PDT

Assault Is Assault

After all of the years I have spent on this planet, I remain surprised that parents think that their violence doesn't breed violence. Do parents really want to watch their Grandchildren being abused? The cycle must be broken.
It is agains the law to hit or threaten an adult! Why do parents think that it isn't wrong to do that to their children?
Thank you, Dr. Phil for so clearly delineating the difference between discipline and abuse!

 
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May 17, 2008, 8:49 am PDT

Yes, violence IS violence

Quote From: lysapooh

You are soooooo right..but can I ask a personal question?? How do you feel about slavery times?? I'm about to speak in general terms, but its sort of weird how people say violence is so wrong but yet SOME and again I say SOME individuals think it was okay to treat African Americans the way they did back then. Its like now people try to avoid slavery topics...why?? Violence is violence...I also notice that many people tend to misuse spanking...when someone uses that term most people automatically think of abuse and violence. And for individuals like me, who stand strong on spanking feel that SOME people do not think outside of the box. Its different levels of spanking...control and uncontrol (abusive).
 Slavery is never okay. It is, as you point out, another form of violence. I am hopeful that someday all peoples of the world will have "evolved" to the point where violence in any form is completely unacceptable. As for spanking, there are so many non-violent methods of teaching a child what kinds of behavior are inappropriate, why would anyone resort to violence? As I said before, those same people wouldn't dream of "disciplining" an adult in such a way.

Every single day of my own childhood was extremely brutal. As a result, I and several of my eight siblings attempted suicide at various ages. Since surviving to adulthood, not one of us has spanked our own children and those children have, in turn, become very happy, loving, compassionate and productive adults who are now raising their children in the same gentle way.

Beyond the fact that violence is just plain wrong, violence is absolutely not necessary.
 
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May 17, 2008, 8:58 am PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: jettav

discipline is something all of us need in life, it is something that is needed to keep us on the right track. discipline for children is about teaching and guiding them into learning right from wrong, learning to make good choices and helping them become good and productive adults. All of us as parents have differnet views and experiences and what works for one child may not work for another, whether a parent spanks or not should not be the determining factor on whether we think a parent is a good parent or not, but looking at the children and seeing what is being accomplished with them, in their attitudes, their behaviors, their relationships with their parents/family and how they treat others can be keys in determining how a parent is doing with their child but at the same time realizing that children are not alike and some are harder then others to discipline and in that case, chances are the parent has not sought out the "right" discipline for that child. I think some people are too quick to judge becasue they do not agree with a technique. I personally do not have a problem with spanking as I have spanked on a few occasions, a swat on the diaper, but for the most part, I have found that rediercting, taking something away for a period of time (for my four year old, she loses priveleges), and communication and consistency is definetly imporant keys in disciplining our children. children need to know what they did wrong and why they are being disciplined. My four year old always knows these things and though she will throw a temper cause she has lost a privelege, she knows it is a waste of time that I am not gonna give in. Lucky for me, I have two easy kids who do not require too much discipline but they do know that the boundaries are not meant to be crossed, my two year old is a little harder but catching on. :) There are many resources out there to help parents and it is too bad that there are many not seeking out those resources, none of us are perfect but it is possible to raise good productive kids into becoming great adults, it isn't a matter of whether you spank or not, it is a matter of knowing your child and seeking out what will help them to grow and to mature and for myself personally, I am not afraid to change my technique if needed. We need to ask our selves if what we are doing is helping our kids, if it isn't then something is wrong. I know people who came from both sides of the issues and those with good loving parents who had the children's interests as a top priority, are great productive loving adults, some have fallen through the cracks of very bad parenting, some were spanked and some were not. definetly working in the inner city with all classes of people have opened my eyes when it comes to parenting. And of course there are always exceptions......(some kids who grow up in great loving homes end up on the other side as well as some who come from abusive situations come out on the good end of things which I am a good example of that). I believe I personally am a good parent as well as my husabnd, not perfect but we are content with the way things are going in our house hold, and every one is happy and easy to live with.
 My sister is a teacher in an African American community.  I have sat in on her classes.  The  kids in her class were totally  out of control.  They roamed the room while she was speaking, played with each other and generally were totally unresponsive to her warnings.  When she contacted the parents by phone and had them talk to their child, they acted as though they never even spoke with their parent when they hung up.  They actually laughed at her!  It is obvious that the parents do not participate in disciplining their children.  They could use a paddling.
 
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May 17, 2008, 9:05 am PDT

spanking

Quote From: PennyLane78

Sorry, I think that generation is one of the most vile and hideous. History for that generation has become romanticized and white washed, but we are talking about a generation of people who embraced racism, sexism and homophobia. I don't care how hard they worked. Also, every person from that generation that I know has a very disgusting attitude about sexual abuse....I have no respect for that generation as a whole.

yes, they did learn racism from their parents and society as a whole, but you also have to remember that societies were very isolated at that time and didn't interact much with other cultures.  I think people naturally do this and it has to be overcome.  and I'm not sure sure that racism is that much down from then.  people now don't admit it because they know it's wrong but I think it's still there, alive and kicking from all sides of the equation.  we have to understand why to overcome that.  definitely.  life is better now for minorities (and women in somes ways) but we're not as successful at overcoming racism (or sexism) as we think we are.  In fact for women, in many ways or treatment has gone downhill.  we've allowed ourselves to be used more than ever before and in many ways we're respected less than ever before.  just use and toss like everything else (and no, I'm not one of those so I don't have issues :)  ).  but as for the quality of the generations, I suspect if you look at the incarceration rates of that generation compared to our's, fathers (and mothers) who stuck around then to raise their children compared to our's, the number of people who learned real marketable skills to support themelves as compared to our's, then you'd have to say that the generation that raised our grandparents were much more successful.  even though the experts today disagree because according to them they did everything wrong, results count and I think we have to relook at what we believe.  I also think that the people who are most opposed to spanking are the ones who's parents were the most extreme.  the rest of us don't see a big deal in it.  and I'm not opposed to learning new and better methods of discipline, bring it on, we can learn.  so long as it works.  If it doesn't we may have to resort to more tried and true methods.  At least as a last resort.  I just think it should be an available tool.  people don't need to be so extreme against it.  it shouldn't be all or nothing.  some kids won't respond to anything else and some kids respond better to other methods.  people seem to be like that.  they have to believe one extreme or the other, no middle ground for us. 

 

it's not really a fair statement to say about the sexism.  women have been considered second class for a millenia before WWII.  since then things have slowly improved.   but we're going backwards now, and mostly that's women's fault for not demanding more from men.  if we allow them to use us, they will.  if something catastrophic were to happen today, we'd be right back where we started from in a heartbeat.  we have to be very, very careful with the gains we made not to lose them.

 

Homophobia - we didn't really understand it then.  again, that took place over a millenia.  we thought (wrongly) it was a choice.  it's only slowly changing now, very slowly.  so the sixties did encourage a lot of good changes.  but we threw out the good from the previous generations along with the bad.  big mistake.

 
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May 17, 2008, 9:16 am PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: crackerjack1

I'd like to chime in.   We are born with a sinful nature.  It is natural for us to do what we want.  That is why, it seems, that the first word we learn is "no".  My 3 yr old is already very independant and wants what she wants.  My wife and I are trying to instill a sense of morals while she is young so that it will be a part of her developental ideals.  As she gets older, she will make her own conclusions on the morals that my wife and I have established.  Then, she will either adopt them for her own, reject them, or modify those morals. 

oh okay...yeah I know we are born in sin..I just wanted to see what the other person was going to say...if I'm not mistaken I think they said children aren't bad or something like that..truely there are children who are terrible...everyone has that bad side of them..why?? because we as people are not perfect..but thank you for you input...well taken..

 
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May 17, 2008, 9:22 am PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: amburgessbetts

You know what...why make such a comment, none of your comment was neccessary, I think you were just being ridiculous  
Yes, the person who made that comment to you went way past the line..that was very rude..and the statement saying lets hit our children for everything...ignorant comment again..people who believe in spanking does not believe in hitting is the answer to every problem your child throws at you...its ONE OF THE MANY..and  you have to learn when to use it and when not to use it..DUH..sorry you had to read such a thing from someone who clearly is presenting themselves as ignorant!!!
 
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May 17, 2008, 9:54 am PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: lmcoffee

Spanking done the way God actually intended it to be is NOT abuse, it cannot even be compared with "wife beating" paleeaaaseee!  What you said is insulting to other people's beliefs, did you not read my whole passage?  By the way there ARE experts who condone spanking such as James Dobson who wrote "Dare to Discipline".  Just because people have different beliefs doesn't give you free license to compare them to abusers.  Wouldn't you agree there is a world of difference between spanking out of anger and spanking to teach the child out of love?  Believe it or not it can be donelisa
I don't believe in God firstly. Secondly I know plenty of people who do believe in God how have found non-violent and non-physical ways to TEACH and GUIDE their children into healthy adulthood.

I wasn't comparing wife beating and spanking, reread my post please. I was comparing the idea of having an expert on the show who supports something Dr. Phil does not.

I think in the mind of a child it doesn't really matter what is going through the mind of the parent...so, no I don't see any difference between the two.

I think spanking is lazy parenting.
 
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May 17, 2008, 10:16 am PDT

Spanking: Useful or Cruel?

Quote From: lysapooh

oh okay...yeah I know we are born in sin..I just wanted to see what the other person was going to say...if I'm not mistaken I think they said children aren't bad or something like that..truely there are children who are terrible...everyone has that bad side of them..why?? because we as people are not perfect..but thank you for you input...well taken..

So you really do believe that there are children, through no fault of anyone but themselves are "terrible"?
 

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