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Topic : 05/04 Violent Love Intervention

Number of Replies: 299
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Created on : Thursday, April 27, 2006, 07:13:48 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
They’re slapped, beaten and bruised. Sometimes, the violence doesn’t end until they’re dead. Dr. Phil talks to women who say they are the victims of abuse and need an intervention before it’s too late. Michelle says her boyfriend, Ryan, flies off the handle over the smallest issues. She reveals that he began hitting her when she was pregnant with their son. Ryan says he can’t control his anger because his own dad was abusive with him as a child. Is it too late for Ryan to change? Then, Linda says her fiancé, Eddie, shot her in the eye and nearly killed her when she threatened to leave him. He’s now serving only four years in prison because, Linda says, she lied to the police and called the shooting accidental. Her mom, Jody, says she’s sickened that Linda still cares for the man who almost took her life. Will Linda stop loving the man who shot her and learn how to have healthy relationships? Talk about the show here.

Find out what happened on the show.

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May 7, 2006, 8:22 am CDT

I Don't Understand

I really don't understand how people can take abuse.  Back in high school, a boy , with whom I'd severed relations, showed up at my house as I was attempting to start cooking breakfast.   (My parents were gone for the weekend, we were alone in the house.)  He started to argue with me and following me around the kitchen, staying "in my face," and being generally disagreeable.  He whacked me on the backside, really hard.  I thought he was kidding around, so I ignored it...the FIRST time.  When he did it again, I grabbed the skillet and told him to leave or I'd brain him.  He left.  I was 5'7" and weighed 115 pounds, and he was taller and heavier than I.    

   

 I always said, "Any man who lays a hand on me in anger will very quickly lose a hand."  When a co-worker noticed a bruise on my arm, and looked doubtful about my explanation that I had bumped in on the doorjamb, I told her that if my husband had done it, he'd be in the morgue and I'd be awating trial.   

 
May 7, 2006, 8:23 am CDT

We will just have to agree to disagree.

Quote From: awfulcute

Rage and frustration is one way for people to express many triggers. This is all I was trying to say.  People can only act from a limited menu of  emotions even though the causes are many. One of these causes is demerol at birth.  

  

There are however subtle differences in the abusive acts. Ryan's girlfriend says he looks like a maniac when he gets going but when he calms down he is very sweet.  In normal times, he also expresses himself in a particular way which is a dead giveaway to demerol damage. He is very literal and frank. He sees things very "clearly." 

  

You speak of people "choosing" to be abusive. I agree with you that this happens often and I think this comes from the idea that men are superior to women. This trigger comes from the justification put out by religious ideas. There is so much abuse that comes from the idea that women have to be kept in line by their husbands. That God says so.  

  

There are other notions such as the one that says, men own their wives. Others include, pornography which shows women "liking" to be abused. Movies show women trying hard to be beautiful which in turn says, "I hate myself." The abuse that comes from these triggers can be talked about and sorted out. This behaviour can be changed on the part of the man, and woman if necessary.  

  

Brain injury however, is a physiological reason. One of the signs of brain injury is that people will fly into rages. They can't help it. They do not specifically choose it. I believe Ryan can't help what he does. His father can, however for the reasons I mention above. This is why Dr Phil said Ryan wasn't a bad person 

  

Ryan is susceptible to stress. The thing he needs to do is recognize that a doctor harmed him at some point and then adjust to his injury. Things are so much better when one knows why they are a certain way. He can then stay away from stressful conditions. And people will be less prone to blaming him for something he can't help.  

  

In general, women in the "civilized" world should be very careful to avoid birthing drugs. These harmful toxins are said to contribute to the huge increase in ADHD and autism. They also pave the way for MS and other brain illnesses. It is better not to bring a human into the world who will suffer. Better to think very carefully before you get pregnant.  

Sadly, I still see excuses and reasons being given for behavior that just don't wash with me.  

   

You might as well claim 'the devil made me do it.'     

   

Ryan's behavior is that of a typical abuser.  The Dr. Jeckyl/Mr. Hyde behavior.  His 'clarity' of thought, as well as his rage identify him as such.  I think you do a disservice to people with brain injury when you lump Ryan into that category and use that as an excuse for his actions.  

   

However, you say 'tom-ay-to' and I say 'tom-ah-to' so let's just leave it at that.  

 
May 7, 2006, 1:22 pm CDT

How many times have you lobbied for the children?

Quote From: mogirl227

For the life of me I just don't get how anybody who was living with an abuser can even THINK of allowing their child to have contact with the abuser.  I don't give a damn if he had years of therapy, medication, or devine intervention, you don't take that chance with your child. PERIOD.  That is NO father as far as I'm concerned. A child is better off with NO father than a creep who would hit, beat, or otherwise abuse his wife.  The woman who said 'he is a great dad' is sadly delusioned.  Of couse he APPEARS to be nice. That's how they operate.  You will never forgive yourself is something happens to your child or he grows into the type of person his father is and thinks it's OK to abuse women.  if that were me, I would have a restraining order PERMANENTLY, move out of town and get on with my life without that creep.  Only a pathetic, needy, can't-stand-on-her-own woman would expose a child to a creep like that.  I'm embarrassed and ashamed of my own gender.

I have to tell you that your post is of ignorance of the laws.  

   

Regardless of the beatings I took, the courts told me "I" would go to jail if I did not allow him to see them. There was concern for sexual abuse of my children as well. It was not until the sexual abuse was "PROVEN" that the courts finally stopped him from seeing them.  

   

Not even children's aide society could stop him from being with the children.  

   

So if you are so ashamed of what is happening, point that "ANGER" and disgust to the "LAWMAKERS" and get others involved in petitioning your government to make changes to the laws to protect ALL CHILDREN!  

   

What have you done? You have smeared and catagorized "YOUR GENDER" as incapable. I might suggest to you that you do a little research before you slam people like me.  

   

I have been to the government, fought for laws, fought children agencies, fought the courts, ignored court orders and ran for the sake of my children.  

   

I am ashamed of your post!  

Coffee  

 
May 7, 2006, 5:52 pm CDT

SELF-DEFENCE WEARS THE ABUSER

  

DEAR COLLEAGUES WHO ARE IN ABUSIVE RELATIONSHIPS, 

 

Wouldn't it be in everyone interest to at least attend some form of self-defence courses to protect themselves from their abusers. 

 

The mentality of an Abuser is someone who emulates the following personalities: 

 

  1. Their ego is fed on your fear, low self-esteem, your bodily expressions that gives him or her power to have control over you;
  2. They are compulsive insecured, confused, lost souls;
  3. They often use physical abuse and verbal abuse as strategies to intimidate you and harass you to try to scare the living days out of you;
  4. Those are the only types of communication styles they know works best to accommodate their abusive behaviour;
  5. This means, that, they have very low self-esteem and in desperation are always searching for external objects or factors to hide their real insecurities and fears about themselves;
  6. They love to scare the living days out of their spouses or loved ones who are closest to them because they know they can get away with it and there is no one to challenge their distorted ideals and abusive bad habits;
  7. It could become some form of addiction for them because they've been allowed to get away with it far too much and have had no intervention or a wake up call to stop their abusive behaviour or scare the living daylight out of them;'
  8. Most of them, are matured enough and are aware of the negative impact their behaviour has on their spouses or loved ones as noted by guests who have been invited on Dr.  Phil's show to discuss their abusive behaviours towards their spouses;
  9. Most of them, are not as stupid as they appear to be;
  10. Most of them could be labelled as "TYRANTS" who have no remorse or sense of respect for anyone, let alone the furniture or inanimate objects;
  11. The mentality of most of them are so low that their self-esteem, couldn't be detected because, they were sitting on it;

It is unfortunate that once you are in a relationship with an abuser and you have children, the cycle of abuse becomes very difficult to reprimand and deter.   

 

It's too impossible to teach an old dog new tricks as the expression goes. 

 

It just means that it's going to require a lot of work, effort and commitment to get to the end of the rainbow. 

 

It would be a life worth livinging and saving if those already in abusive relationships with children, can turn their lives around for the better and the best. 

 

If you had a choice to come back to complete what you failed to complete the first time, probably changing your relationships with your spouses where were physically abused and mistreated, would be your highest destiny to achieve.   

 

You will get not only a second chance in the kingdom, but, you'll also get the Medal of Honour for Courage and Bravery with Full Honours. 

 

THIS MEDAL OF HONOUR FOR COURAGE AND BRAVERY WITH FULL HONOURS IS AN AWARD THAT IS THE HIGHEST HONOUR TO HUMANITY.   

 

EVEN A GRAMMY, A GOLDEN GLOBE, A DOCTORATE, AN OSCAR, A NOBEL PEACE PRICE WINNER, AN OLYMPIC GOLD MEDAL, THE NAVY MEDAL OF HONOURS, THE WAR MEDAL OF HONOURS, THE WAR VETERANS' MEDAL OF HONOURS, THE PROFESSORSHIP HONOURS, COULD NEVER AMOUNT TO THIS SPECIAL MEDAL I AM TALKING ABOUT. 

 

THESE AWARDS ARE NOT EVEN CLOSE TO: 

" THE MEDAL OF HONOUR FOR COURAGE AND BRAVERY WITH FULL HONOURS". 

 

ITS A ONCE IN A LIFETIME AWARD. 

 

Perhaps, if something had been done much earlier about the abusive behaviour, even before making the long-term commitment to marry, get engaged or get hitched, then, perhaps, the intervention into the abusive behaviour would have been under control and apprehended at its early stages before escalation to the worst end of the scale. 

 

FOR THOSE WHO SEEM TO BE UNABLE TO LEAVE THEIR ABUSIVE SITUATIONS.   

 

THE NUMBER OPTION FOR YOU IS TO PROTECT YOURSELF FROM FURTHER HARM. 

 

YOU MAY NEED TO BECOME RESOURCEFUL, INNOVATIVE, AND CREATIVE ABOUT STRATEGIES TO COUNTERACT YOUR ABUSER FROM PHYSICALLY HARMING YOU ANY FURTHER. 

 

ABUSERS DON'T LIKE SURPRISES AND BEING MADE TO FEEL SMALL, HUMILIATED, OR MADE TO FEEL INADEQUATE. 

 

YOU MAY WISH TO TRY OUT SOME SMALL STRATEGIES TO COUNTERACT THE BEHAVIOURS. 

 

WOMEN ARE NOT PHYSICALLY STRONG AND FOR SOME ITS A CASE OF FEAR OF BEING IN CONTROL OR INFLICTING HARM ON THEIR MEN.  ITS TOUGH WHEN SOME WOMEN DON'T HAVE THE MANCHO ATTITUDE OR TOUGH ATTITUDE.  SOME ARE TOO SOFT OR TOO NICE.  IT MIGHT MEAN THAT THEY NEED TO GO SEEK ASSERTIVENESS TRAINING OR CLASSES SO THAT YOUR HUSBANDS COULD BE CHALLENGED.   

 

THE MORE PASSIVE AND RESISTENT YOU ARE TOWARDS YOUR ATTACKER OR YOUR ABUSER, THE WORST ITS GOING TO GET FOR YOU. 

 

I AM REALLY SURPRISED THAT SOME OF THOSE WOMEN WHO HAVE BEEN PHYSICALLY ABUSED HAVE SELF-CONTROL AND NEVER LOSE IT TO THE BRINK OF POISONING THEIR HUSBANDS, SETTING TRAPS OR HARMING THEM WHILE THEY ARE ASLEEP. 

 

LET ALONE I DON'T UNDERSTAND FOR THE LIFE OF ME, HOW, THEY COULD BE INTIMATE WITH THEIR ABUSIVE HUSBANDS AND SLEEP IN THE SAME BEDS EVERY NIGHT, YEAR AFTER YEAR. 

 

WE WILL ADMIT THERE HAVE BEEN HORROR STORIES ABOUT TERRIBLE DEATHS ALL OVER THE WORLD REGARDING MEN AND WOMEN. 

 

HOWEVER, WE WOULD ALL WISH NOT TO BE ONE OF THOSE STATISTICS. 

 

REMEMBER AN ABUSER CAN DO ALL HE OR SHE WANTS TO PROVOKE YOU OR GET A REACTION FROM YOU.  

 

BUT AS LONG AS THEY ARE NOT ABLE TO LAY A FINGER ON YOU OR A SCRATCH ON YOU, YOU ARE IN CONTROL AND A WINNER. 

 

SO IF THEY COME AT YOU TO TRY AND THROW YOU AGAINST THE WALL OR THROW SOMETHING AT YOU, YOU HAVE TO ENSURE THAT HE OR SHE IS NOT ABLE TO LEAVE A BRUISE OR HARM YOU. 

 

BELIEVE ME THEY WILL EXHAUST THEMSELVES, IF ALL YOU DO IS OUTSMART THEM, AND BE QUICK ON YOUR FEET AS WELL AS YOUR MIND. 

 

SOME OF THEM ARE PLAIN DUMB AND STUPID WHEN IT COMES TO SURPRISES. 

 

ITS NO WONDER THEY ONLY KNOW PHYSICAL AND VERBAL ABUSE.  BECAUSE THAT IS HOW SMART THEY REALLY ARE. 

 

IF THEY THROW A KNIFE AT YOU, YOU MUST AVOID IT AND SAY SOMETHING THAT YOU WILL NOT TOLERATE THAT KIND OF BEHAVIOUR.  YOU DON'T LIKE IT.  YOU DECIDE ON WHAT CONSEQUENCES OR PRIVILEGES YOU ARE GOING TO DO TO REPRIMAND HIS OR HER  BEHAVIOUR.  

 

YOU DON'T HAVE TO TELL HIM OR HER WHAT CONSEQUENCES THAT YOU ARE GOING TO APPLY TO DEAL WITH THE UNACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOUR. 

 

YOU NEED TO CALL YOUR NEIGHBOUR OR YOUR RELATIVES TO HAVE A FAMILY CONFERENCE THAT SO AND SO JUST TRIED TO KILL ME OR HURT ME AND I WANT SOMEONE TO TELL HIM OR HER THAT THEIR BEHAVIOUR HAS TO STOP AND THAT IT IS UNACCEPTABLE. 

 

I KNOW A LOT OF COUPLES WOULD SAY, ITS NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS AND YOU SHOULD MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS OUT OF OUR AFFAIRS. 

 

THIS IS WHERE EVERYONE GETS IT WRONG.  WE ARE ALL HUMAN BEINGS THAT IS ONE BIG FAMILY.  WE ARE ALL RELATED BECAUSE WE ARE MAMMALS AND BLOOD RUNS THROUGH OUR VEINS. 

 

SOME OF THEM DON'T EVEN KNOW TO FEND FOR THEMSELVES OR SURVIVE IN THIS COLD WORLD WITHOUT YOUR EXISTENCE OR HELP. 

 

SINCE THERE ARE LAWS THAT GIVES US RIGHTS TO PROTECT OUR INTERESTS IN SOCIETY, WE ALL HAVE AS MUCH BUSINESS WHEN IT COMES TO PHYSICAL ABUSE, VERBAL ABUSE AND DOMESTIC VIOLENCE TO PEOPLE WE KNOW VERY WELL IN OUR NEIGHBOURHOOD OR COMMUNITY. 

 

DOES ANYONE KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO THE ABUSER WHOSE WIFE OR HUSBAND ABANDONED? 

 

I KNOW: 

 

HE OR SHE WAS SO ASHAMED THAT HE OR SHE HAD TO RETREAT TO HIS OR HER LONELY WORLD.   

 

HE OR SHE BECAME A NICE ORNAMENT THAT DIDN'T EXIST AND WAS SO DUSTY AND RUSTY THAT IT HAD NO PLACE TO GO TO OR EXIST. 

 

SOMEONE ELSE SAID THEY SAW SOMEONE RUNNING DOWN THE ALLEY WITH SUCH A LONG TAIL BETWEEN THEIR LEGS. 

 

This is all I have to add to this unfortunate plague. 

 

ET 

 

 

 

 

  

 

 

 

 

 

  

 
May 7, 2006, 7:43 pm CDT

Can abusers change?

Can abusers change?  

   

I hope so...if not I am going to continue my work to try.  

   

I am a 32 year old single male, father of a wonderful 8 yr old boy. I am not currently with his mother. She is truly the love of my life and I hope someday that she will take me back.  

   

I grew up in a home where I listened and watched my father emotionally, verbally and mentally abuse my mother. I never saw any physical abuse but I am sure it happened, watched my mother and her mother, my grandmother, fist fight and I would try to break it up. My mother was just defending herself from a larger woman who was epleptic and evil. I was molested by a boy two years older than me when I was 4. It continued until I was 14. My brother who is 5 years younger than me in addition to being hit by me because I believed that my parents were not tough enough on him was also molested by the same boy who was 7 years older than him. The guilt that I have is tremendous regarding these matters.   

   

Over the 24 or 25 years I have been verbally, emotionally, mentally and/or physically abusive to the following people: my mother, my father, my brother, the mother of my son , her other son (not my son not that it matters...it is still abusive, a woman at work...and I have been very abusive towards myself.  

   

I remember when I was 8 yrs old I was in the back yard and I hit my mother with a rope...on PURPOSE. What kind of 8 yr old does that. The kind of 8 yr old that at the age of 32 ,on at least 4  different occasions, physically abused the woman I love. I do love her...I realize that I was wrong and that way she was acting...which she was NUMB...she did not have a job and did not do much all day, according to everyone else, even her own mother was and is a sick, lazy, antagonistic, mean individual. I feel like my actions...degrading her, calling her names, screaming at her, threatening to take things like her car, her engagement ring, even her son, away, not giving her money, not being supportive, coercing sex, offering to pay for sex, badgering her into performing sex acts that she did not want to do...simply put made her NUMB. Not able to cope, depressed, no self esteem, no being able to be a good mother, not feeling like she could find a job let alone keep one...just feeling worthless and NUMB. At the end of our relationshipshe could not fight...I believe she did not have the will. We were living with my mother with our son staying with her mother in a better part of town. She was living there because her mother and father kicked her out. Her eldest son who is 14 went to live with his father and our son stayed with his grandparents where I thought he would be best taken care of. I pushed for her to come and live with me when she was kicked out in November 2005...she came. Things were good for a couple of weeks maybe even a month.   

   

Now please understand that we have been toghther on and off for 11 years. It has been a rocky road each of us being abusive in our own ways. I started being abusive to her when she was 3 months pregnant. I backed her down with a balled up fist...I do not remember why or what was said...but that was the first of many abusive things. She also spent the summer of 2003 lying to me, stealing from me and cheating on me. Up until then I had not been physicall abusive with her. Since then I have pulled her hair and put my fist in her face, grabbed her aroung the neck, broken a car window, thrown her clothes and make up down a flight of stairs, tried kicking her in the back while she ran down stairs to get away from me, put my face right up against hers, spit in her face, kicked a chair into her knee, grabbed her, pushed her, punched her it the knee, the arm, and the head, twisted her wrist and hit her as hard as I could with a pillow about 10 times. WOW that is alot more than 4 times and I am sure I am missing a few.   

   

Back to what I was saying. So she is living with me at my mothers house. She said she would get a job soon after getting there. When she left in the middle of February she did not have one. From November to February we argued alot. When we argued my mother would always get involved and I would ask her to mind her own business...most times she would not. This made it worse. During this time I was very abusive...saying that my sons mother was a cheating slut and whore, that she was probably seeing other people while I was at work. I would call her every name in the book. I would say she was a bad mother. I would threaten to take her car away and kick her out on a frequent basis. I would tell her to give me the engagement ring back that she did not deserve it...one day she did. When she did not want to have sex or right after a fight i would offer her money for sexual favors. Physically...I grabbed her, kicked a chair into her knee, got into a fist fight with her while we were in a car...I twisted her wrist and punched her in the knee repeatedly...then there was the final morning that she woke up there. We had a good couple of days it was Monday night and we actually ahd sex. The next morning I woke up and I thought well we are getting along...maybe I can finally communicate with her...about getting a job...doing something to help us. Well that did not go well. She said the same things that she always said and I allowed it ot set me off. I told her to leave...she would not....I started screaming at her...then my mother chirped up and I screamed at her. I took some of her stuff out of the bedroom and put it in containers down stairs. She would not go saying that she would leave when i was gone...that she was scared. I actually moved a recliner that was next to where she was sleeping so I could get closer to her. I started screaming at the top of my lungs right in her face to get out...I punched her in the head...thank god not hard...this was actually an accident...I am way to affraid to actually leave any marks so she could press charges. Then I hit her with the pillow over and over...all the wile her crying like a little girl saying what the police told her to do if I get physically violent..."Put your hands over your face and head and curl up". She was crying saying this over and over. I stopped and went to work.  I went to see my son after work. His mother showed up there after I asked her not to. I left for a while. When I came back she left. That morning as I was leaving I told her that I would stay away from my mothers house that night so that she could have a place to stay. When I left my sons house I went to my mothers house to see if she was there. She was not. I went inside locked the doors and windows. She had a key for the backdoor but I had an inside door that i locked. After what had happened that morning, she came back at about 1 am. I told her she was not allowed to stay she needed to leave would not even let her use the bathroom. After all that I did to her she still wanted to come back. I walked some of her stuff outside and she left. Where she stayed that night I do not know. She wnet to her mothers about noo on Wednesday and was told to leave and come back when the kids come home at 3. When she did not her mother and father called the police. After a little while and her not wanting to leave she was arrested with the promise from the police that they would try and get her some mental help becuase she was out of it. I would be out of it too if I had been kicked out of an abusive house and relationship came to my mothers and was kicked out of there too. So now my sons mother is in prison where she spent the next 8 weeks until she was released and deemed competent by prison psychatrist. She is realeased and told she needs to get some mental help, get evaluated for having a drug and/or alcohol problem and she needs to get a job. Oh did I forget to mention that when she was arrested that her parents got a PFA with their names, my sons name, their residence and his school named in it. Oh also that the court saw fit to grant emergency temporary custody of my son to his grandparents for 18 months. So my sons mother is not legally allowed to see our son unless OKed by a judge with a visitation schedule. So my sons mother is asked by the judge if she would like to set up a visitation schedule at this time. My sons mother says no...she needs to get some help and get some stuff straight first. So now almost a month after court...3 months since she has seen our son last...she is living in homeless shelters...she still has not seen him. It is killing me. I have started to go to a counseling group for abusers...it is helping. I find it absouloutely amazing that when I tell people about how I abused my son mother...even the physical...people like our friends...my boss...even her mother somehow someway justify even if it is a little bit. It is NOT justified ever. I need to be and am responsible for my own actions. No matter what anyone else does or says to me...NO MATTER WHAT...I can not react the way I have learned to act. I need to be proactive and end the cycle of abuse. I am now trying to get custody of my son whom I am allowed to see when ever I want and do on a daily basis. His mother on the other hand is not allowed to see him. Her parents will not drop the PFA because they do not want things to go back to they way they were. Today I moved into an apartment away from my mother and away from my old way of life forever. I am going to change....I am not going to be abusive anymore to anyone. I just hope that I can help the innocent woman whom I made NUMB get feeling, life and self esteem back. Maybe someday after she sees that I have indeed changed then  we can start over.   

 
May 7, 2006, 8:46 pm CDT

I'm not so trusting

Quote From: groovy

*Trusting the therapists Dr. Phil assigns:  When Dr. Phil sends someone to a nutritionist, personal trainer, doctor, treatment program etc. I trust he has good referrals who know what they're doing.  Any competant therapist is going to delve into Linda's childhood & father-situation to get at why she's hellbent of staying with her homicidal abuser.  Even if Dr. Phil had gotten into that, it's doubtful he would have made her understand the folly of her belief system in such a short period of time.  I think he went for the greatest impact with showing her Eddie's cold lies & pointing out to her that she was a victim of pre-meditated murder who just didn't die.  

   

* Sociopaths:  We're on the same page re. sociopaths.  The public absolutely needs to have a greater awareness of sociopaths.  Here's how I began my Amazon review of "The Sociopath Next Door":  

   

"I've written many five-star reviews, but never have I been so motivated to try to convince everyone to read the book. Here's why: one in twenty-five Americans is a sociopath, a figure psychologist Martha Stout obtained from three journal articles and a U.S. government source. Assuming this premise of The Sociopath Next Door is correct, or even if the figure is say one in 50, odds are you know at least one sociopath. He or she could be an abusive partner, the person in the next cubicle at work, your landlord, or the person your teenager is dating. Even if you can't think of sociopath you know, you have high odds of encountering one. Given the havoc even one sociopath can wreak in one's life, this book provides a sort of insurance that you'll be able to identify him or her and deal with that person so they don't harm you emotionally, financially, or in any other way. This is a well-written and well-researched book that I think will benefit the 96% of you who are not sociopaths."   

   

* Re. Dr. Phil sending sociopaths to treatment even though they are untreatable - Dr. Phil is not with his guests long enough to determine who's a sociopath & who is not.  Nor does he do the proper assessments, nor is his psychology license active.  It's better that he send all the potential sociopaths to licensed mental health professionals & let them make the assessment.
  

I don't trust that his specialists are any better than the ones I've seen around me all my life and the people I've seen them treat.  Now and then one here and there seems to be better than most but they still don't touch the subject of psychopaths or sociopathy like they should. And I wasn't talking about sociopaths.  I said psychopaths. To me, however, there isn't much difference.  Lack of empathy and conscience is pretty much the same in my book regardless of the name you give it. 

  

Don't get me wrong here, I've been one Dr. Phil's greatest fans, especially in the beginning.  But what I've seen over this last year concerns me.  He's changed his sails, adjusting to some kind of new wind and I'm just not sure why or what's up with that. 

  

All in all I just find it interesting that we push this one off into the closet, behind the door of therapy and we just won't speak about it much, like it happens so infrequently and they are only the jack-the-ripper types and the one in a million kind of person. That's just not true, they are all around us.  Different levels of them, some more skilled than others and with our narcissistic brainwashing that we get everywhere we turn about how it's "all about me", I'm not sure we'd be able to identify one if saw one because growing up watching "My Sweet Sixteen" shows and the like - how in the world would you know one if we bumped into them. To be self-centered - is to be praised and envied and is now our role model of choice. And what's with the reality shows or the survival shows?  I love the survival shows because it promotes being a team.  But wait, No, now we split you up and you turn on the very people you were on a team with.  The programming promotes narcissism, praises psychopaths, self-centeredness, backbiting, the more the better.  And we wonder why so many people end up on this show in the shape they are? Well.........you put a little box like that in your home and put your mind on auto-pilot and watch it without critically thinking and it programs you. Survival of the fittest I guess.  May the best psychopath win.  Only trouble is - when there's only one because he or she ate their best friend - then what? 

  

I have two books for you an anyone else reading - "People of the Lie" by Dr. Scott Peck and "Without Conscience" by Dr. Robert Hare. Interesting reading. Eye-opening. 

  

  

 
May 7, 2006, 10:52 pm CDT

After all you have posted, You really don't give a damn about her

Quote From: giffins

Can abusers change?  

   

I hope so...if not I am going to continue my work to try.  

   

I am a 32 year old single male, father of a wonderful 8 yr old boy. I am not currently with his mother. She is truly the love of my life and I hope someday that she will take me back.  

   

I grew up in a home where I listened and watched my father emotionally, verbally and mentally abuse my mother. I never saw any physical abuse but I am sure it happened, watched my mother and her mother, my grandmother, fist fight and I would try to break it up. My mother was just defending herself from a larger woman who was epleptic and evil. I was molested by a boy two years older than me when I was 4. It continued until I was 14. My brother who is 5 years younger than me in addition to being hit by me because I believed that my parents were not tough enough on him was also molested by the same boy who was 7 years older than him. The guilt that I have is tremendous regarding these matters.   

   

Over the 24 or 25 years I have been verbally, emotionally, mentally and/or physically abusive to the following people: my mother, my father, my brother, the mother of my son , her other son (not my son not that it matters...it is still abusive, a woman at work...and I have been very abusive towards myself.  

   

I remember when I was 8 yrs old I was in the back yard and I hit my mother with a rope...on PURPOSE. What kind of 8 yr old does that. The kind of 8 yr old that at the age of 32 ,on at least 4  different occasions, physically abused the woman I love. I do love her...I realize that I was wrong and that way she was acting...which she was NUMB...she did not have a job and did not do much all day, according to everyone else, even her own mother was and is a sick, lazy, antagonistic, mean individual. I feel like my actions...degrading her, calling her names, screaming at her, threatening to take things like her car, her engagement ring, even her son, away, not giving her money, not being supportive, coercing sex, offering to pay for sex, badgering her into performing sex acts that she did not want to do...simply put made her NUMB. Not able to cope, depressed, no self esteem, no being able to be a good mother, not feeling like she could find a job let alone keep one...just feeling worthless and NUMB. At the end of our relationshipshe could not fight...I believe she did not have the will. We were living with my mother with our son staying with her mother in a better part of town. She was living there because her mother and father kicked her out. Her eldest son who is 14 went to live with his father and our son stayed with his grandparents where I thought he would be best taken care of. I pushed for her to come and live with me when she was kicked out in November 2005...she came. Things were good for a couple of weeks maybe even a month.   

   

Now please understand that we have been toghther on and off for 11 years. It has been a rocky road each of us being abusive in our own ways. I started being abusive to her when she was 3 months pregnant. I backed her down with a balled up fist...I do not remember why or what was said...but that was the first of many abusive things. She also spent the summer of 2003 lying to me, stealing from me and cheating on me. Up until then I had not been physicall abusive with her. Since then I have pulled her hair and put my fist in her face, grabbed her aroung the neck, broken a car window, thrown her clothes and make up down a flight of stairs, tried kicking her in the back while she ran down stairs to get away from me, put my face right up against hers, spit in her face, kicked a chair into her knee, grabbed her, pushed her, punched her it the knee, the arm, and the head, twisted her wrist and hit her as hard as I could with a pillow about 10 times. WOW that is alot more than 4 times and I am sure I am missing a few.   

   

Back to what I was saying. So she is living with me at my mothers house. She said she would get a job soon after getting there. When she left in the middle of February she did not have one. From November to February we argued alot. When we argued my mother would always get involved and I would ask her to mind her own business...most times she would not. This made it worse. During this time I was very abusive...saying that my sons mother was a cheating slut and whore, that she was probably seeing other people while I was at work. I would call her every name in the book. I would say she was a bad mother. I would threaten to take her car away and kick her out on a frequent basis. I would tell her to give me the engagement ring back that she did not deserve it...one day she did. When she did not want to have sex or right after a fight i would offer her money for sexual favors. Physically...I grabbed her, kicked a chair into her knee, got into a fist fight with her while we were in a car...I twisted her wrist and punched her in the knee repeatedly...then there was the final morning that she woke up there. We had a good couple of days it was Monday night and we actually ahd sex. The next morning I woke up and I thought well we are getting along...maybe I can finally communicate with her...about getting a job...doing something to help us. Well that did not go well. She said the same things that she always said and I allowed it ot set me off. I told her to leave...she would not....I started screaming at her...then my mother chirped up and I screamed at her. I took some of her stuff out of the bedroom and put it in containers down stairs. She would not go saying that she would leave when i was gone...that she was scared. I actually moved a recliner that was next to where she was sleeping so I could get closer to her. I started screaming at the top of my lungs right in her face to get out...I punched her in the head...thank god not hard...this was actually an accident...I am way to affraid to actually leave any marks so she could press charges. Then I hit her with the pillow over and over...all the wile her crying like a little girl saying what the police told her to do if I get physically violent..."Put your hands over your face and head and curl up". She was crying saying this over and over. I stopped and went to work.  I went to see my son after work. His mother showed up there after I asked her not to. I left for a while. When I came back she left. That morning as I was leaving I told her that I would stay away from my mothers house that night so that she could have a place to stay. When I left my sons house I went to my mothers house to see if she was there. She was not. I went inside locked the doors and windows. She had a key for the backdoor but I had an inside door that i locked. After what had happened that morning, she came back at about 1 am. I told her she was not allowed to stay she needed to leave would not even let her use the bathroom. After all that I did to her she still wanted to come back. I walked some of her stuff outside and she left. Where she stayed that night I do not know. She wnet to her mothers about noo on Wednesday and was told to leave and come back when the kids come home at 3. When she did not her mother and father called the police. After a little while and her not wanting to leave she was arrested with the promise from the police that they would try and get her some mental help becuase she was out of it. I would be out of it too if I had been kicked out of an abusive house and relationship came to my mothers and was kicked out of there too. So now my sons mother is in prison where she spent the next 8 weeks until she was released and deemed competent by prison psychatrist. She is realeased and told she needs to get some mental help, get evaluated for having a drug and/or alcohol problem and she needs to get a job. Oh did I forget to mention that when she was arrested that her parents got a PFA with their names, my sons name, their residence and his school named in it. Oh also that the court saw fit to grant emergency temporary custody of my son to his grandparents for 18 months. So my sons mother is not legally allowed to see our son unless OKed by a judge with a visitation schedule. So my sons mother is asked by the judge if she would like to set up a visitation schedule at this time. My sons mother says no...she needs to get some help and get some stuff straight first. So now almost a month after court...3 months since she has seen our son last...she is living in homeless shelters...she still has not seen him. It is killing me. I have started to go to a counseling group for abusers...it is helping. I find it absouloutely amazing that when I tell people about how I abused my son mother...even the physical...people like our friends...my boss...even her mother somehow someway justify even if it is a little bit. It is NOT justified ever. I need to be and am responsible for my own actions. No matter what anyone else does or says to me...NO MATTER WHAT...I can not react the way I have learned to act. I need to be proactive and end the cycle of abuse. I am now trying to get custody of my son whom I am allowed to see when ever I want and do on a daily basis. His mother on the other hand is not allowed to see him. Her parents will not drop the PFA because they do not want things to go back to they way they were. Today I moved into an apartment away from my mother and away from my old way of life forever. I am going to change....I am not going to be abusive anymore to anyone. I just hope that I can help the innocent woman whom I made NUMB get feeling, life and self esteem back. Maybe someday after she sees that I have indeed changed then  we can start over.   

Maybe someday after she sees that I have indeed changed then  we can start over.   

   

If you really cared, you'd never ever get near this woman again. Don't you think you have done enough?  

 
May 8, 2006, 12:22 am CDT

What?

Quote From: jamesr

 While there is no excuse for the physical violence, Michelle does not know when to shut up. It was evident on the program that she is one of those women who knows very well "how to push the hot buttons". Ryan needs extreme anger/temper management counseling, while Michelle needs to learn when to shut up! 

That statement is so off. Everything you do in life is a choice from waking up in the morning to going to sleep at night. No one can force anyone to do anything. Michelle does not need to shut up. She needs to get out and get help. Ryan needs to get some real help and you need to get some too. If you are an abusive person then you learned it from somewhere or someone. You need to learn how to think and act all over again...not an easy task. You need to make the right choices all the time...ne exceptions. Everyone in the world owns their actions. Ryan owns his abusive actions and is responsible for them. You are also responsible for your incorrect written words. 
 
May 8, 2006, 7:12 am CDT

LIKE FATHER LIKE SON, LIKE MOTHER LIKE DAUGHTER..

 

Dear Dr.  Phil, 

 

Thank you for your the immense hard work that you engage in everyday.  At first, I hesitated in posting messages on your website. 

 

Now, I am grateful, for having encountered your website and learnt from everyone else's experiences shared about the various issues that affects all of us in some form or another. 

 

Many have open up and finally come to terms with their cognitive thinking or abusive behaviours that has enslaved their lives for years. 

 

Breaking the silence and the internal turmoil of being abused or traumatized is setting some  of us free at last.  My opinion is that men tend to shy away from talking to a professional about their problems or issues.  Women are the forefront of open communication and seeking professional help or counselling when they have problems.  This sets them apart from men in general. 

 

The metaphoric expression like father like son, like mother like daughter has been true in most cases of physical abuse and verbal abuse.  As noted in some of the messages posted on this board. 

  

Too often people want to get away with the excuse that their abusive behaviour was due to their encounter of physical abuse and verbal abuse by their parents or caregivers when they were growing up as toddlers, children and teenagers. 

  

To some extend this is usually the case.  However, it can also be one of those excuses, that could be easily bought or accepted.  Everyone pretty much these days will buy into it and accept it.  

  

The saying like father like son and like mother like daughter is very poweful and influential in everyone's lives.  The parents are the adults in a family and their main job is to rear and nurture the children.  Automatically, the parents, become the influential role models that children look up to and mimick with absolute admiration, loyalty and obedience.  

  

It is unfortunate for most of us to grow up in abusive environments that is neither nourishing nor healthy.  For some of us despite growing up in abusive environments we still live successful and nurturing lives thereafter.  That we managed to not repeat the cycle, instead we learn from such historical mistakes and imperfections because we make the decision to change our lives for the better.  I know that there have been people I knew who grew up in very abusive and violent environments as well as upbringing, yet, they still grew up to be fantastic and outstanding role models and citizens to their country and communities. 

 

So, the excuse, that I beat up my spouse, because, my father did the same to my mother is nothing more than an excuse and a fabricated story to hide the real issue. 

  

I recalled back years ago walking past a neighbour's house, and I saw both the father and mother screaming at this toddler who was no more than 2 years old.  I couldn't believe my eyes at the fact that this child was so tiny and helpless, yet, they were screaming obscenities at the child who seemed clueless and oblivious to their commands. 

 

I never quite got it then, as a teenager seeing it at that time.  Now, in my 30's I finally understood the significance of that incident I witnessed as a teenager regarding this toddler or child with the raging parents.  

 

The parents were in their late twenties early 30's or older, didn't quite understand their own behaviour.  They were so stupid to see the real problem is their screaming obscenties at this child.  A child at the age of 2 years has no sense of right and wrong.  They do not have the discernment or maturity to understand their parent's instructions that adults would understand automatically.  The parents are the only ones that would have known of this developmental stage that their child had not quite peaked to.   

 

Tying shoe laces and knowing which is your right foot or left foot seems to be something that children below the age of 5 years or 6 years find it difficult to grasp.  Unfortunately, there are bright children who do master this phenomenon much earlier than their peers. 

 

So their obsenities and screaming could amount to nothing more than a good waste of oxygen and energy.  

 

Today, I had this strange thought, about the irony of children being scared of the dark, the boogie man, the ghost or the monster.  

 

I giggled like a little child, when, I remembered the story of Red Riding Hood and the big bad wolf.   

 

It dawned on me, that the real monster or big bad wolf is our parents or the ones we sleep with every night, year after year. 

 

Poor Mummy or Daddy tenders to the Monster, by cooking his or her favourite meals, by obeying his or her every word, nurturing him or her and sleeping beside him or her every night, year after year.   

 

Then, instead of being rewarded for all that nurturing and 10 years of hard labour without a bonus, the Monster, turns on him or her and kicks him or her out of her or his own house. 

 

What an ungrateful Monster!   

 

So listen up little children, beware of the Monsters you live with everyday.   

 

Even if they read you bedtime stories and fairy tales, beware of the Monsters. 

 

And you'll all live happily ever after. 

 

The End. 

 

ET 

 
May 8, 2006, 7:14 am CDT

05/04 Violent Love Intervention

Quote From: coffee831

Maybe someday after she sees that I have indeed changed then  we can start over.   

   

If you really cared, you'd never ever get near this woman again. Don't you think you have done enough?  

So let make sure I have this right...you do not believe that people can change? 

  

So I guess based on your opinion that I should just remain alone? 

  

Please tell me what you think I should do...I did not post this to get almost abused myself! 

 
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