Topic : The Other Woman

Good to hear from you and we're proud of your progress!  Keep it up!  So funny...OM-free...I've been OM-free since February 13, and like SC, I'll never forget that day.  It does help to keep them on a lower level and even be angry at them--although anger takes up a lot of energy--keeps us strong.  But we won't ever forget them--especially the better qualities that drew us to them, and that's what makes it hard because I, for one, can turn that into a wonderful fantasy--one which I am clearly unable to separate from reality!  So, we all just keep truckin...one day at a time...this really IS AA, isn't it! 

I appreciate all the patience, understanding, love and advice I have received from all of you--I still need it! 

Hey MT, 

CONGRATS on being OM free since Feb 13th! As silly as it may sound to outsiders, we do need to celebrate each milestone to stay away from OM and get on with an authentic life. I myself have been keeping myself busy focusing on what matters. This board is great. We all may be at different stages, but we need to support each OW at whatever state she is in. I think it was BGO that I read feels like she shouldn't be on the board because she saw her OM. NONSENSE! Hey, I have gone back before I got it right. Most of my strength to stay away comes from this board. We know that it may take a few hundred times to get it right, but get it right we must. For ourselves! You all are my extended family and I appreciate the updates. MT, one day we will be years away from our "OM free" day! I feel it. Enjoy your day. Snow 

So what do you think that I need to do now? I am torn apart here. I always believed that when you got married it was for life, that is one of the reasons that I stayed for 31 years with my first husband, when I should have left him in the first 6 months. I tried to make it work, that is impossible unless both want to change and make it work. Now with this husband I said that I would make this marriage work and I am going to try with all I have because I do love him but I can't help how I feel. I know that he does love me, he is so good to me in everyway. He is working out of town as I said before and he calls me at least 10 or 12 times per day, I am not kidding at all. Sometimes it drives me crazy that he calls so much, he asked me if I cares that he calls so much becauses he misses me so bad and I said no that I don't care, but come on! He wants to move to the state that he is working in at the present time. He has wanted to move out of state since we got married and I just do not want to, this is my home and I have never lived anywhere but here so I am a little scared to leave this place. I feel that he is just running from his past and her. He said that is not what he is doing at all, he said that he hated her and would not care if he never seen her again. In one of his call this morning we were talking and I said something about his son and his school, his remark was "I hate the thought that he has to get up and get ready for school and leave without breakfast (he is 18) while B is laying in bed on her lazy a_ _. Then all she has to do is  get up and get all pretty and dressed up fancy and go to her littel office job, what a B_ _ _ h" . See what I mean, not a conversation we have he can't seem to leave her out of even if it is negative things. I am ready to scream. She would love this if she knew that I was having issues with this matter. She told him on the phone one day, while he was home, she called here to talk to him about their son and she had to add this little remark " I don't know how your wife can put up with you being so obsessed with me like your still are" his remark to that was -to say nothing at first - then after a couple of minutes he said "you have got to be kidding" that's it, that is all that was said. I got so upset that he didn't tell her off and he told me "you just don't understand, she has this thing about her that just takes anyone by surprise and you don't know what to say, she takes you when you are off guard - that is why I hate her so much" What do you make of that? I just need someone to talk to about all this mess.  

DG, 

I've only read your posts over the last couple of days, so if this has been asked and answered, forgive me.  Your husband sounds like he has ALOT of issues with his ex, and those aren't going to go away unless he gets some help...would he consider counseling (with and/or without you)?  Hate is love's ugly twin, and I agree with SC that he is not over his ex-wife.  The goal is for him to be indifferent, which indicates NO feelings.  Hate means he is still emotionally involved.  It's difficult to separate him from her because of his kids, but if he is so eaten up with hate for her, he needs help to get rid of that.  If he loves and respects you and your marriage, he will do what it takes to put this behind.  Difficult, though, when he won't admit it's a problem.  Even the ex can see he's obsessing about her.  He's making excuses not to confront her or piss her off because he still cares what she thinks...does he tell HER how much he hates her?  You're in a tough spot, that's for sure, but we're all here to help as best we can. 

Thank you for the reply. I did get a reply for someone else but please believe me I need all the help that I can get. So please give me advice and anyone else that is willing to reply with advice would be greatly appreciated also. Yes, he has alot of issues with her and that is an understatement! He did go to counseling when she filed for the divorce (she would not go). He thought that would help  hold the marriage together, the counsler told him that he needed to get on with his life because she did not love him and had not for a long time, he told him that she had been laying the groundwork for this divorce for a very long time and he could not believe that he had not seen any of this. He (my husband) had some letters that she had written, where she had admitted to the affairs and also she told of how she wanted her time to do her thing without him or the kids. She said "she wanted and needed to be single she was tired of being stuck with someone" So he wasn't happy with the counsler at that time for being so truthful and honest with him, I guess is the reason. Now myself, I think I could have seen what was going on there. So I am not sure if he would go back to another one or not. I have not mentioned going to a counsler to him yet. I just want to wait and see if we can't just talk this all out. He does listen to me when I try to explain how I feel about her and the way he keeps talking about her all the time. I am stupid I guess, I know that a lot is me because I am so jealeous of the way he treated her and how he felt about her even after the divorce he tried to get her back knowing that she had cheated on him several times, he didn't care about that if she would have stayed. I am not kidding at all, he treated her like she was a queen, she didn't want for anything that she didn't get, she was always just doing things for herself, hair, makeup, nails, shopping for clothes for herself, etc. She was and is a very selfish, self-centered person that just thinks of herself only. She loved going out to clubs at least once a week and then she had the "girls weekend retreats" always leaving him at home with the kids. Now I do not think that a married woman has any business doing this, I would never had done anything like this in my first marriage or now.  I'm totally opposite from her, completely. He tells me all the time that he is so happy and he feel blessed to have met me, that I am the type of woman that he has always wanted (his Southern Bell is what he calls me) someone that respects family and home life, honest and true. Well I am honest, truthful, kind plain and simple, I do not wear all the makeup like she does, I do not waste 10 hours per day getting my self together like she did. So my question to him is and has been - If you loved her so and you thought that she was the greatest thing that ever was, how can you say that you love me and tell me that I am the kind of woman you have always wanted? He didn't just love her he worshipped her and it was very obvious when I found all those pictures and disks, he had hundreds and hundreds, now I must saw that she loved being in front of the camera, she thought that she was a model or a want to be (long way from that in my book)......... I don't know...period!  I feel that we were brought together for a reason, because the way we met was one of those "just to be things". I do love him and he loves me to, I just think that he doesn't love me like he loved her. I feel like I am a security blanket for him, I'm stable, secure, have my feet planted firmly on the ground. She was and is nothing at all like me (Thank God)! I know for sure that if she would have called off the divorce that he would have taken her back, I know he would have. But she wanted that man that she left him and the family for but he dumped her as soon as she left and filed for the divorce, we met (at my work- one time) about a month after she left him, about one month after the divorce we met again (at my work - medical field) theat is when we started calling each other and then dating. He told me that he could never get me out of his head from the first time he met me, and he didn't even know my name, he said that I seemed to stay in his thoughts all the time. That is what helped him through the end of the divorce, he said. I had been divorced for 3 years when we met so I was totally over any feeling that I once had for my ex. and I was not at all looking for anyone when I met him but we just, I don't know there was this feeling between us when we met, I can't explain. Anyway back to the issue -I tell him that he should be able to talk to her about the kids when an issue with them comes up but he will not do that, he said that he never wants to talk to her again. I know that it would probably bother me but he need to be able to do that for the kids. I do talk to my ex if I have a question or an issue that I need to discuss concerning our sons and he should be able to do that also. I do not have any type of feelings for my ex at all, I don't hate him, I don't like him, I don't have any kind of feelings at all where he is concerned and I have been that way for a long time. I wish that my husband was that way with her but he isn't he feels the need to tell me daily how much he hates her. When we were out with 2 of his co-workers several weeks ago the subject of ex-spouses came up for a second and my husband had to go into detail about his ex and one of the co-workers ex lived in the same town, he kept on about how weird he thought that was, how horrible she was, about her lover living there, etc. the co-workers didn't say anything they could see that I was uncomfortable and they were uncomfortable for me, my husband never even give it a thought. It is things like this that keep me upset and worried. Is it possible that he could love me and still have these feeling for her? Will he ever get over this? Do I just need to ignore his comments about her? Or do I just need to tell him that this it it - shut up about her or go back to her - I don't want to hear about her anymore.   

Oh my goodness there is so much more that I could say, things that I have found since we got married that he had kept. Just to much to tell but would love to talk about it to someone willing to listen. Thanks for sending me the reply and I hope you don't get to tired reading all this stuff, it's just that I need answers, need help with what to do. Thanks  

Hi DG...thanks for giving more background.  I'm sure your husband does love you, but he has been obsessed with his ex for so long, it sounds like he will continue with it unless he gets help.  I think when people go to couples counseling, each of the spouses expect the counselor to take their side and, when that doesn't happen, they get turned off to it.  You go to counseling to have the truth brought out--no matter how painful it is.  If one isn't ready to hear and deal with the truth, it's not going to work.  Sounds like that's what happened when he and his ex went.  Would he consider individual counseling?  But first he has to acknowledge he has a problem--as Dr. Phil says, you can't fix what you don't acknowledge (or something like that!).    If he worshipped her in the way you say, then he probably does still love her in some way--that's why he can't let go.  Doesn't mean he doesn't love you too, but it sounds like he never gave himself the chance to grieve and get over his marriage before getting into a relationship with you.  I don't think you should ignore this because you'll only be able to do it for so long before you implode.   Maybe the "tough love" approach would at least make a dent ("shut up about her or go back to her").  It's not fair to you at all for him to suck you into his obsession and force you to deal with it.  I've learned the hard way with my husband that keeping feelings and communication under wraps is a sure recipe for divorce--we are still doing it and it spells TROUBLE.  Hope this helps you.  Keep posting--we're here for you. 

It's tough now a days since I've seen him so hurt for the last month. He looked for the councler that we are currently seeing, he cooks, cleans, he's depressed at times. He tells me that he will win me back since he can tell in my eyes that I don't even look at him the same. I wonder sometimes if it's regret, guilt or what he says...."I never thought that I was doing anything wrong, it was just a phone conversation here and there....she would never be someone I would even think to have an affair with, as a matter of fact thats why I never blocked calls or cared that you had my passcode to my voicemail." He tells me that it all has seemed 100 time worse that what it was. He compares it to some of my co-workers who will occasionally call me to say hello. Yet that doen't compare because he knows my co-workers..he's met them...yet he lied about her. I wonder what my feeling are going to be 3-4 months from now. It will take such a long time to try and forgive but the hardest is trusting hime again.  

I am engaged and am planning to get married this summer (in just 3 months, so I am writing because this issue is timely).  Things were going well until this past weekend when I was informed that my fiancé’s best friend (and matron of honor) thinks that I do not like her.  We have met but a few times as she lives out of town.  She thinks that when we have spent time together that I do not give her enough attention and make her feel a part of things.  Admittedly I do not treat her like my best friend and have shown her more attention than anyone I have known for 3-4 days, except for my fiancé.  I am concerned for a few reasons.    

First is that my best friend's fiancé seems very jealous.  When we talk she repeats multiple times that my fiancé is her best friend.  It is also obvious that this young woman is dependant on my fiancé’s friendship.  My fiancé is a very caring person and wants to help others and does so sometimes to her determent.  By that I mean in the past 6 months she has suffered from 3 different medical conditions that doctors believe are stress related (2 cases of staff infection and one case of shingles, she is 25 years old).  I see this relationship as being dependant as the friend talks to my friend multiple times a week and during that time there is nearly always something negative that is brought up.  I wish I were exaggerating.  There is always a complaint of some sort.  So much so that last weekend the friend spent an hour discussing how she thinks I dislike her with my fiancé while we were traveling to meet some of my fiancé’s family for the first time.  This is the first time I realized there was a major problem.    

I called her recently and asked her how we could fix things, because this is not good for any of us.  She started going through a list of things she felt bad about and talked for 15-20 minutes straight without pause.  The phone call lasted an hour total.  This friend has brought up these concerns to my fiancé, I then discussed them with my fiancé and we decided that I was not doing anything toward this friend out of spite.  I then considered the issue settled, until the most recent phone call.  I am really at a loss here.  I love my fiancé and have seen how caring she is.  But I also think that she is in a negative relationship that is weighing on her.  I asked her a while back how she deals with the constant negativity and she replied that this friend is needy and that she has been a friend so long that my fiancé does not see it as negativity.  To cap things off the friend has a husband and I don't know where they stand as far as discussing things and how close they are as friends.  And I also think that by always brining her thoughts/feelings about anything to my fiancé she should be discussing them with her husband.    

As a final thought the wedding is coming up.  And to be honest I am opposed to having anyone in the wedding party that opposes our union and will not whole heartedly support our marriage.  As for support, I have met my fiancé’s relatives, other friends and have traveled across the country meeting others.  When I proposed I added the condition that I wanted to meet everyone important in her life before we were married.  To my knowledge no one has objected and all have been happy and wished us well.  I am also concerned that if this friend says yes to our wedding and harbors negative feelings that in the future my then wife and I will argue about something or other, talk to this friend and this friend will validate any negative feelings my wife and I will be having about our relationship.  To add to the problem this friend has mentioned that she is no longer going to talk to me and will no longer bring up any problems about me with my fiancé.  However if my fiancé talks about me then she will discuss things.  I find that unrealistic.  And cutting communication can not be healthy.  

So I am looking to be wise and figure out what to do here.  I want things to work out but I am also afraid that this friend of my fiancé’s will not support our union.  I’d really appreciate help in this matter.  Thank you for taking your time to read this.

  

---Groom in Limbo