Topic : Pornography

Number of Replies: 30846
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Created on : Friday, July 01, 2005, 05:18:48 pm
Author : dataimport

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October 13, 2005, 12:25 pm PDT

My wife is and always has been

Quote From: kimikomine

would you be upset if you found out your wife was talking to some guy that lifted her spirits? For example: say your wife needed to feel desireable but you were not around or just not able to give her what she needed,but, she found some guy, by the way who is also hot, and he makes her smile and she comes home and feels really good inside, would this upset you or would you just assume she is getting what she needs and as long as she is not having sex with this guy, it is acceptable?  

  

i think my husband is a litle upset with me because i did find someone that makes me feel sexually alive again, even though there is no sex involved. but i think of him and i even fantasized about him once in a while . is this cheating or is this just getting my emotinal needs met? thankx. 

 a very social person. We have had quite a few arguements over the years about how she would come home and tell me what a great idea she heard from someone else that we should seriously consider. I tell you that without fail all I had to do was remind her of the conversation we had had about just that and I had said the same thing and she didn't think it was a good idea at that time. Without fail she would respond that that was not the way she understood me.

Yes she has always come home feeling better after being with friends and collegues. Why? Because she has said home is where all the trouble is and being able to get outside that trouble is refreshing. To this day I am always hearing about this one man she works with, how he's doing, what a good talk they had at lunch, etc., etc. No they are not having any sex and he brings up no sexual fellings in her. I am sure of that. It's just that she has put her *home* life in one basket and her social life in another and truely believes there to be nothing wrong or unnatural about that. No matter how much I tell her how that takes away from me she doesn't get it. She just doesn't see what she is doing as being wrong.

This is just another example of what I have been saying all along. One side will always be able to see how they are being misused and at the same time have no concept that they are misusing someone else....because they don't see it that way.
 
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October 13, 2005, 12:38 pm PDT

What I have briefly explained to Kimi

Quote From: luvmiman1

It's very likely that if it's such a struggle for a man to show or gain the trust that he is "working" or doing anything to prove to a woman that she can be secure within their relationship....it most likely was "conditioned" into her from far before she met him....NOT that this is his problem, but it is one that can be solved.  This often stems from seeing how her parents interacted or possibly from previous relationships or betrayals.  Whatever the cause, seeking porn certainly will NOT allow a woman to ever come to terms that she can trust a man.  Using porn says one very distinct thing about a man who uses it....HE WILL NOT BE TRUSTED completely, no, not ever.  And why should he?  He is backing up her already doubts that she will ever be what he wants exclusively.  So that would mean that no matter what she does, he refuses to help an already bad situation, no matter where it stems from. 

  

And yes, God did make men to be the head of the house.  However, that applies to those men who know and walk in Gods' will for their lives.  Because it isn't the "man" that a woman can or will trust 100%, but instead it is God working THROUGH that man that allows her to trust and literally not fear his decisions and or efforts.  Whatever a woman does, she will never be able to look at a man who is not led by God or one that he does not walk in the ways of God to be the "leader" of the household.  There are way too many men NOT showing that they themselves trust or believe in what the word speaks about marriage...so how can they lead their families in this?  They can't, it's plain and simple.  And that's precisely why marriages fail today by the thousands.  Keep taking God out of everything as we see today....and watch it fall and crumble before our eyes.  And that's fact, not religion! 

  

There is nothing anyone can say, that will ever support the necessity for any man to seek outside his marriage.  It's reaps exactly what it sows into the marriage.....mis-trust.  And the very first thing it does to a woman is opens her eyes to the fact that she actually does dis-respect him and can't put her children or her self into his hands completely.  That just won't happen.  Her "conflicts" stem from her choices of the spouse she chose and her once high opinion of him.....that are crushed because he can not resist everything that is thrown into his face as temptation.   That's not "emotions" ruling her....that's the very nature of what her marriage was and should be built on. 

  

Luv 

 is that women also seek outside the marriage. Because it may have nothing to do with sex makes it all that much more acceptable to them that they are doing nothing wrong and only natural.

Why shouldn't *she* want to spend more time with girlfriends who want to go shopping, see the chick flicks, luncheons or anything else that men may not want to do on a regular basis. Why should she give up what she wants to do if her husband isn't that interested in doing?! If having sex as often as he wants to doesn't interest her, why should she have to change the way she feels.

I have said it time and time again, women have their own way of going *outside the marriage* because the husband doesn't have the same level of interest in what she does. Because it may not be sex doesn't actually mean she is going outside the marriage now does it.

As far as her always recognizing that the man is working out of God's will is just not true. As long as she is bent to believe that women are largely mistreated by men that's all she will see it as. Just another way for men to minimize women and use religion as the excuse. And I have seen no proof, on this board even, that women don't believe men taking the upper hand, even when necessary, is not subjugating women. Because it is not necessary unless she sees it as necessary. If she doesn't see it as necessary, it ain't necessary.
 
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October 13, 2005, 12:42 pm PDT

One more thing on this Kimi

Quote From: kimikomine

would you be upset if you found out your wife was talking to some guy that lifted her spirits? For example: say your wife needed to feel desireable but you were not around or just not able to give her what she needed,but, she found some guy, by the way who is also hot, and he makes her smile and she comes home and feels really good inside, would this upset you or would you just assume she is getting what she needs and as long as she is not having sex with this guy, it is acceptable?  

  

i think my husband is a litle upset with me because i did find someone that makes me feel sexually alive again, even though there is no sex involved. but i think of him and i even fantasized about him once in a while . is this cheating or is this just getting my emotinal needs met? thankx. 

 You have to assess if you would even allow your husband to meet your emotional needs if he tried. AND can your emotional needs actually be met.
 
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October 13, 2005, 12:51 pm PDT

Another thing on this also Luv

Quote From: luvmiman1

It's very likely that if it's such a struggle for a man to show or gain the trust that he is "working" or doing anything to prove to a woman that she can be secure within their relationship....it most likely was "conditioned" into her from far before she met him....NOT that this is his problem, but it is one that can be solved.  This often stems from seeing how her parents interacted or possibly from previous relationships or betrayals.  Whatever the cause, seeking porn certainly will NOT allow a woman to ever come to terms that she can trust a man.  Using porn says one very distinct thing about a man who uses it....HE WILL NOT BE TRUSTED completely, no, not ever.  And why should he?  He is backing up her already doubts that she will ever be what he wants exclusively.  So that would mean that no matter what she does, he refuses to help an already bad situation, no matter where it stems from. 

  

And yes, God did make men to be the head of the house.  However, that applies to those men who know and walk in Gods' will for their lives.  Because it isn't the "man" that a woman can or will trust 100%, but instead it is God working THROUGH that man that allows her to trust and literally not fear his decisions and or efforts.  Whatever a woman does, she will never be able to look at a man who is not led by God or one that he does not walk in the ways of God to be the "leader" of the household.  There are way too many men NOT showing that they themselves trust or believe in what the word speaks about marriage...so how can they lead their families in this?  They can't, it's plain and simple.  And that's precisely why marriages fail today by the thousands.  Keep taking God out of everything as we see today....and watch it fall and crumble before our eyes.  And that's fact, not religion! 

  

There is nothing anyone can say, that will ever support the necessity for any man to seek outside his marriage.  It's reaps exactly what it sows into the marriage.....mis-trust.  And the very first thing it does to a woman is opens her eyes to the fact that she actually does dis-respect him and can't put her children or her self into his hands completely.  That just won't happen.  Her "conflicts" stem from her choices of the spouse she chose and her once high opinion of him.....that are crushed because he can not resist everything that is thrown into his face as temptation.   That's not "emotions" ruling her....that's the very nature of what her marriage was and should be built on. 

  

Luv 

 How many times have I brought up what God has stated in the Bible about the obligation of a sexual relationship in the marriage and been met with the responce that God would not want a woman to do what made her uncomfortable doing.  Excuse me but God said nothing about only is she feels comfortable with it. What was meant was he was saying *you* CAN feel comfortable with it because I said you can, and should.
 
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October 13, 2005, 1:04 pm PDT

hi. darcy and luvi.

Quote From: darcylove

Let me be the first to say....I understand how these things happen. But what I don't believe is that it is ever exceptable. My son the other day got really ticked off at an adult for somethings he was saying about him. Now this boy.....(my son) turned around and layed into this adult. He told the guy to go F off. And I have to say....I completely understand how it happened. But and that's a big BUT....I don't want this to be the way my son deals with things like this. 

  

How does that apply to you?  Well your husband.....completely disappointed you. He was not able to give you what it is you wanted in this marriage. And the harder you tried to figure it out.....the more angry you became at the situation. You were looking for something....that you weren't getting. So soon you found yourself watching other people that were able to give you exactly what you need. You turned outside the marriage to get validation. You went looking for something that made you feel good again inside. Something  you felt you were not able to get from  your husband and something you felt you never would. 


My question is Kimi.....if it has come to a point in which you are searching for affection from someone else.....why don't you finally take it upon yourself to leave what has always appeared to be not going to work?  I think......your husband should be angry. I think you should be angry. YOu both cheated each other and now......the two of you are coming to a head on this one.  

  

Kimi.....be the person I know you are. Be honest with him (your husband) and let him know what it is you are feeling, thinking and needing. And if he cna't meet what it is you need.....try to fix it or leave the marriage. Kimi.....you deserve happiness and he deserves happiness and if it isn't obvious to you ....it sure is to me.....neither of you are happy and neither of you plan to be happy together. 

  

SOmething I was thinking about this past week. If something smells like a rat and looks like a rat.....it is probably a rat.  

thanks for writing. i agree the tit for tat....no good. but how easy it was to fall into that one! i didn't tell anyone yet, but, we did have a very important conversation the other day. so crucial that i landed up over the bowl throwing up later on that evening. i told him exactly how i was feeling and how i have been feeling. he also openend up and we both walked away with a lot to chew on. it has been two days now and nothing really came up. but i have a feeling things are going to change. they have to, at least i would think so. 

  

i don't think i am looking for affection but when it shows up, on a given day, it is rather tempting. i am not going to be able to get the emotional fulfillment from him not because he doesn't want to but because i really don't think he has it in him. so i am going to have to accept this as a part of him. but, as most who use porn would say????? then what??? do you just live with the absense of something so important?  

  

i think i am probably more unhappy then he is. he has many attachments to so many people that if i am not around, he is sure to get it from someplace else. he sure as heck knows how to occupy his time. i truly believe he might be like a lot of guys. they want sex, they want a good meal, and they want to look good to their friends and family.  and if they have children, they want the woman to love their children as much or at least close to how they do. i have been struggling with many things in this marriage but the biggest struggle has been "why is it that he and i just don't seem to find the time to get together?". maybe we both just really don't want it like that afterall. 

 
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October 13, 2005, 1:24 pm PDT

hi all inall....

Quote From: allinall

 You have to assess if you would even allow your husband to meet your emotional needs if he tried. AND can your emotional needs actually be met.

i don't think my husband could ever complete me all the way emotionally. i wouldn't expect that and that would be boring for me anyway. when my friend asks me about something, they sit there and listen and there is some feedback and then other topics. i don't think he is interested to go into details honestly. not who he is. 

  

but maybe you are on to something. and that is, even if he tried, which i don't believe he has, but even if he did, i don't know if i would trust it. i think he is a simple man and i am a complex woman, as i have been told, heh heh......and it does take a certain type of individual to appreciate me......as well, as i am sure it is for him. i just don't know if too much time, too many bad feelings, too many struggles between us, may be something we can't get over.  

  

i will never be the kind of woman that he wants or needs, and he won't be the ideal mate for me, it doesn't mean we can't be happy together but it does restrict how far we will be able to go on a spiritual level. and that is very sad to me. 

 
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October 13, 2005, 3:40 pm PDT

Excuse me also Allinall.....I never realized this until now....

Quote From: allinall

 How many times have I brought up what God has stated in the Bible about the obligation of a sexual relationship in the marriage and been met with the responce that God would not want a woman to do what made her uncomfortable doing.  Excuse me but God said nothing about only is she feels comfortable with it. What was meant was he was saying *you* CAN feel comfortable with it because I said you can, and should.

After coming back and reading your response to Kimi about your wife.  I totally understand the "balance" within your marriage, or at least as much as you would allow for "us" to understand about it hear.  The lack of closeness, intimately, makes it clear where and why you look through the lenses that life has handed you.  It's clear you also choose to believe only certain things about women because of your experience in this marriage.  It's unfortunate that neither of you wants change bad enough to stop and take a closer look at the solutions instead of dwelling in the pits of why it's not working. 

  

The relationships that women have are extremely important for women with women.  It's mentally healthy and it also can and will improve her spiritually as a mother and a wife....WHEN those relationships are of a "pure" nature.  Female friends are a must.  But good friends never, EVER, hinder the balance in the marriage first and foremost.  Because true friends clearly understand your first priority IS your husband....or at least should be.   

  

The sexual comments about what God would or wouldn't want for a woman is clear.  However, that being said.  If a man is really "in" a relationship with God in the first place...the "want" or desire to do anything that would put his wife in a situation where it might "harm" or cause her discomfort wouldn't be an issue in the first place.  Although I do know some women take this to an extreme, just as some men take their pleasurable wants to levels that are also unreasonable.  This is where some serious communications about what each partner wants is important.   

  

Put it this way, and very simple, when two people sincerely care and respect eachother, compromise is possible and a healthy fulfilling sexual life together is totally possible.  Taking away the trust, or denial that certian behaviors have and will cause that other partner to not totally be honest with their husband or wife...or cause the trust to decay is really the reason that most seperate emotionally from one or the other.   

  

Clearly, your wife has successfully seperated herself from you emotionally and spiritually.  And that is heart renching. But in spite of this, there is always hope.  But, as with anything , it takes some serious looks at what *you* and her have done to contribute to this kind of marriage.  But, as I expect, this won't happen any time soon.  It's still that individual choice to stay and leave things as they are because the partners have developed skills and outside relationships with other sources that mask the real pain and loss of eachother. 

  

Luv~ 

 
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October 13, 2005, 3:47 pm PDT

I have an honest question

Quote From: allinall

 How many times have I brought up what God has stated in the Bible about the obligation of a sexual relationship in the marriage and been met with the responce that God would not want a woman to do what made her uncomfortable doing.  Excuse me but God said nothing about only is she feels comfortable with it. What was meant was he was saying *you* CAN feel comfortable with it because I said you can, and should.

I am a Christian but am not familiar with specific passages of the Bible. I was wondering if you could clerify this post of yours for me. You say the bible comments on sexual obligation of the wife, but then you say it is meant to tell you only that you can feel comfortable having a sexual relationship with your spouse. Does the Bible say how often the wife should satisfy her husband, or does it also say how a husband should treat his wife? I know that women sometimes withold sex from their husbands (not the way to fix a marriage by the way) because their husbands aren't treating them with honour and respect. I also know that some husbands do not treat their wife with honour and respect because she is witholding sex from him. Sometimes this vicious circle has gone on so long no one can remember who started it or why. Anyways....sorry to ramble on but  I was just wondering if you could clear that up for me. :) thanks 

 
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October 13, 2005, 3:51 pm PDT

you still got it :)

Quote From: luvmiman1

After coming back and reading your response to Kimi about your wife.  I totally understand the "balance" within your marriage, or at least as much as you would allow for "us" to understand about it hear.  The lack of closeness, intimately, makes it clear where and why you look through the lenses that life has handed you.  It's clear you also choose to believe only certain things about women because of your experience in this marriage.  It's unfortunate that neither of you wants change bad enough to stop and take a closer look at the solutions instead of dwelling in the pits of why it's not working. 

  

The relationships that women have are extremely important for women with women.  It's mentally healthy and it also can and will improve her spiritually as a mother and a wife....WHEN those relationships are of a "pure" nature.  Female friends are a must.  But good friends never, EVER, hinder the balance in the marriage first and foremost.  Because true friends clearly understand your first priority IS your husband....or at least should be.   

  

The sexual comments about what God would or wouldn't want for a woman is clear.  However, that being said.  If a man is really "in" a relationship with God in the first place...the "want" or desire to do anything that would put his wife in a situation where it might "harm" or cause her discomfort wouldn't be an issue in the first place.  Although I do know some women take this to an extreme, just as some men take their pleasurable wants to levels that are also unreasonable.  This is where some serious communications about what each partner wants is important.   

  

Put it this way, and very simple, when two people sincerely care and respect eachother, compromise is possible and a healthy fulfilling sexual life together is totally possible.  Taking away the trust, or denial that certian behaviors have and will cause that other partner to not totally be honest with their husband or wife...or cause the trust to decay is really the reason that most seperate emotionally from one or the other.   

  

Clearly, your wife has successfully seperated herself from you emotionally and spiritually.  And that is heart renching. But in spite of this, there is always hope.  But, as with anything , it takes some serious looks at what *you* and her have done to contribute to this kind of marriage.  But, as I expect, this won't happen any time soon.  It's still that individual choice to stay and leave things as they are because the partners have developed skills and outside relationships with other sources that mask the real pain and loss of eachother. 

  

Luv 

Hey Luv, boy you hit the nail on the head with that post. Very well said. I hope that one day he and his wife find their way back into eachothers hearts and begin to really share their lives with eachother again. It is heartwrenching to hear about two people who have devoted their lives to each other but have such a cold steril relationship with each other. It would be great if they could recognise the commitment they share and build from there. Start over and begin with love.
 
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October 13, 2005, 4:00 pm PDT

Then you haven't been reading that closely....

Quote From: allinall

 is that women also seek outside the marriage. Because it may have nothing to do with sex makes it all that much more acceptable to them that they are doing nothing wrong and only natural.

Why shouldn't *she* want to spend more time with girlfriends who want to go shopping, see the chick flicks, luncheons or anything else that men may not want to do on a regular basis. Why should she give up what she wants to do if her husband isn't that interested in doing?! If having sex as often as he wants to doesn't interest her, why should she have to change the way she feels.

I have said it time and time again, women have their own way of going *outside the marriage* because the husband doesn't have the same level of interest in what she does. Because it may not be sex doesn't actually mean she is going outside the marriage now does it.

As far as her always recognizing that the man is working out of God's will is just not true. As long as she is bent to believe that women are largely mistreated by men that's all she will see it as. Just another way for men to minimize women and use religion as the excuse. And I have seen no proof, on this board even, that women don't believe men taking the upper hand, even when necessary, is not subjugating women. Because it is not necessary unless she sees it as necessary. If she doesn't see it as necessary, it ain't necessary.

If you haven't seen, even on this board, then you don't know me or what I stand for at all.  I will admit fully that in the beginning of my marriage I "was" a woman completely against anything to do with the entire male population.  After all I had experienced some really bad stuff at the hand of a man who had claimed to "love" me.  It was only after learning that this examply handed to me early on was not a good example of a "man" to begin with.  And that it was my lack of patience and maturity that even allowed me to "choose" such a man to give myself to in the first place.  So my husband has had his work cut out for him in the early years let me tell you. 

  

What I have learned is this, that in order for my husband to flurish and be totally respected in the position God put him in within my life...I had to trust that God was and is in control.  And that doesn't mean that I don't have  a "say so" in life...it just means that I have to trust that God will direct his path.  Although I will have to say that seeing the "evidence" that he too leaned on God was critical for me to be submissive to him in the first place.  In other words...don't preach to me or tell me how to live life if you are sitting there cussing me out, cutting me down, or acting like my feelings don't matter.  Because according to the "word" man is to love his wife like Christ loves the church...and if you learn "how" Christ loves his church....then the treatment of a wife becomes clear. 

  

In the Bible I am referred to as the "weaker vessel" in this relationship...but not weaker in this world. Some people take this out of context.  As a mother I am stronger than most will ever know here on this board.   It really means that I am under the 'covering' of protection of my husband.  And that to HIM means that he will always strive to not allow things or situations or people to  harm me emotionally, spiritually, physically, and keep me protected so that I can be all that God wants me to be.  If we see  "lack" in either of us  spiritually, we can go to God and pray that God enriches our life spiritually.  I can pray for my husband in areas that he needs God's wisdom and not his own....and I have to have enough faith to know God will handle this with him.... and 100% of the time....God always does this.  BUT, I also have to know that when or if my husband makes a wrong decision that "I" am not the one to put him in his place.  Yes, we disagree, but it's with respect of eachother.  And learning HOW to talk about disagreements is so important.   God is the only one and the mistakes are mere trials we ALL go through to get us to the next level of where we are to be in this life.  It's simply about depending on God to keep and ensure my marriage, my husband, and me.  Because if it were simply what or who my husband is...this would fail.   I believe also when I pray that God makes me satisfying to my mate....he does just that.....because its a pure desire of my heart.  

  

Luv~ One quick note.....no man that is ever EVER known to use porn for ANY reason within a marriage can ever nor should ever expect that his wife can successfully treat him with total admiration or respect....and IF she claims it's "ok" with her....I will tell you right now, she's not being honest and there IS other reasons she is so accepting of it.  Whatever those reasons might be...she will always have this "reason" not to change or adhear to his wants, desires, or needs.  She simply can't be intimate with some one she has no respect for.   

 

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