Topic : 11/24 Great School Debate

Quote From: tlmurr

This was your original quote:

 

Homeschoolers do not take advantage of public school, even though their taxes support it, because they believe that for their children there's a better way.  

 

I do not take advantage of the resources, not because I believe there is a better way, it is because I choose not to due to personal past experiences with my district.  Some families in the district where we reside do not take advantage of the resources (in their case band and music lessons) because they were not ALLOWED to. I have posted several references on here about the taxes and my take on how that works in our state, and believe me, I think policy regarding that should be changed ASAP.

 

If I misunderstood you, I am sorry.

 

Quote From: motherof2ny

I discussed your recent show with my 10-year-old daughter.  She quite eloquently named the benefits she feels children receive from the school environment -- the ability to get along with all different types of children with all different levels of interest and learning abilities, who are from all different types of home environments.  (We do happen to live in a very diverse community.)  She also stated that she appreciates meeting adults who are different than I am.  This gives her other adults in her sphere that she trusts and loves, and gives her different perspectives on all kinds of things that will affect her future ability to "make it" in this world full of different kinds of people.  She is learning that I may not always be right, and that she may agree more with her teacher about a political issue, for example.  She is learning how to learn through different teaching styles and teacher's personalities.  (She is learning to cope.)  She is learning about different topics that I may not have thought to brought into her life.  Some of them she has an interest in, and some not so.  But, that's OK, too.  She is learning to decide what she has an interest in, and learning that she must follow through on the other subjects, as well.  My daughter also feels she has learned flexibility.  I feel that is very true and very necessary in life.  She is learning empathy for students who don't come from a loving, supportive home, or from a middle-class home with everything she needs easily provided.  She is learning how to pick her own friends, and how to stay away from that child who annoys you.  As you can see, she is a very creative thinker and very eloquent -- she could go on, but I think you can get the point that there are many things children learn in a school environment that help them cope with our world as it is.

 

My 14-year-old daughter and I did not discuss this topic, but I can tell you how I think she'd respond to this question.  She appreciates the ability to leave the house every school day.  She likes to keep her school day mostly private from me.  She is going through a very normal phase of development -- learning to be her own person, away from me and her father, learning what her interests may be, and how to find her own way in the world.  She then comes home to a safe, warm environment with people who are here for her when she needs us, and who are learning to let go, which seems to be mostly what she needs right now.  Letting our children go is not hard for them -- they yearn for it and will fight for it.  Yes, there will be bumps in their road, but who would want to delay these bumps and life lessons?  It is us parents (mothers, especially) who must take a good, hard look at our own motivation for keeping our children home and who must let our children move through the normal stages of development so that they will be normal, happy, successful adults.   

 

Let me add my own opinion to this --  I could not provide the rich learning environment that my children are acquiring in school.  I could not cover every single subject as well as a whole truck load of teachers do every day for my children and others like them. 

Quote From: motherof2ny

I discussed your recent show with my 10-year-old daughter.  She quite eloquently named the benefits she feels children receive from the school environment -- the ability to get along with all different types of children with all different levels of interest and learning abilities, who are from all different types of home environments.  (We do happen to live in a very diverse community.)  She also stated that she appreciates meeting adults who are different than I am.  This gives her other adults in her sphere that she trusts and loves, and gives her different perspectives on all kinds of things that will affect her future ability to "make it" in this world full of different kinds of people.  She is learning that I may not always be right, and that she may agree more with her teacher about a political issue, for example.  She is learning how to learn through different teaching styles and teacher's personalities.  (She is learning to cope.)  She is learning about different topics that I may not have thought to brought into her life.  Some of them she has an interest in, and some not so.  But, that's OK, too.  She is learning to decide what she has an interest in, and learning that she must follow through on the other subjects, as well.  My daughter also feels she has learned flexibility.  I feel that is very true and very necessary in life.  She is learning empathy for students who don't come from a loving, supportive home, or from a middle-class home with everything she needs easily provided.  She is learning how to pick her own friends, and how to stay away from that child who annoys you.  As you can see, she is a very creative thinker and very eloquent -- she could go on, but I think you can get the point that there are many things children learn in a school environment that help them cope with our world as it is.

 

My 14-year-old daughter and I did not discuss this topic, but I can tell you how I think she'd respond to this question.  She appreciates the ability to leave the house every school day.  She likes to keep her school day mostly private from me.  She is going through a very normal phase of development -- learning to be her own person, away from me and her father, learning what her interests may be, and how to find her own way in the world.  She then comes home to a safe, warm environment with people who are here for her when she needs us, and who are learning to let go, which seems to be mostly what she needs right now.  Letting our children go is not hard for them -- they yearn for it and will fight for it.  Yes, there will be bumps in their road, but who would want to delay these bumps and life lessons?  It is us parents (mothers, especially) who must take a good, hard look at our own motivation for keeping our children home and who must let our children move through the normal stages of development so that they will be normal, happy, successful adults.   

 

Let me add my own opinion to this --  I could not provide the rich learning environment that my children are acquiring in school.  I could not cover every single subject as well as a whole truck load of teachers do every day for my children and others like them. 

Quote From: farrall

As a public school teacher I have mixed feelings about home schooling. There are success stories for both approaches. I cringe, though, when I read messages from home schooling parents who clearly never learned any gramatical structure in their own schooling. As a math teacher, I know that parents who are comfortable and knowledgable with the math being taught in middle and high school are rare. I wonder where the non-school families expect to encounter higher mathematics during their travels in the "real world", and who is going to prepare their children with the prerequisite skills for using the higher mathematics. One advantage to formal schooling is that the students have the benefit of a variety of teachers, each an expert in his or her specific field of study. There are ineffective teachers in schools everywhere, though. Fortunately, students in our schools do not depend on these teachers for their entire education. I am concerned that the parents who reject any structured education are denying their children exposure to things it would not occur to them to ask their parents about. How could they possibly know they want to learn about something if they have no idea that thing exists? You nver know what will be the thing that stirs a child's interest and begins the path to a lifelong career. It may be nothing you can find in books or on the internet or in worldwide travels. It may be as simple as the personality of one teacher in a public school - or even a classmate in that school. I think of life and learning as a lottery, and I would want to provide my children with as many "lottery tickets" as I could. Socialization is, to me, a big issue. Getting children involved in activities such as sports, scouting, and theater is only one type of socilization. In these activities they are involved with others who have similar interests and a desire to participate. This still is a very limited sphere of experience. In these settings, there is no need to learn the tolerance, understanding, and negotiation skills required to work in harmony with people who do not share your interests or goals. I believe that some parents have the skills to provide an adequate academic education for their children. This includes the skill to recognize their own limitations and find ways to address those issues. I still believe that, though they may receive the best possible home schooling, they are denied some of the positive influences of public schooling. This may, for them, make little difference. I believe that more and more people, seeing the successes, think they can accomplish the same level of success. Unfortunately, I don't believe that most parents are adequately prepared to be the sole providers of education for their children. I am most concerned about the effects of the "non-school" strategy. The most successful home-schoolers have set courses of study and structured "school" time. This makes it more likely that the student will be exposed to learning about things beyond their own expressed interests.I believe that it is a mistake to condemn any type of instruction. I suppose my biggest worry is that people espousing one form or another will completely close their minds to any possible negative aspects. The fact that there are negative aspects should be used to find ways to eliminate or minimize them. You have to acknowledge the problems before you can correct them. There is not a very big spotlight shown on home schooling and non-schooling so the problem issues are not as visible. Home and non-schoolers need actively to serach for problems and manage solutions. This won't happen if they won't accept that the problems exist.

Quote From: sramsey3544

I am a teacher and wanted to comment of several things that you said.  First: FYI: teachers do a lot of research and incorporate learning styles into the classroom.  Your statement sounds like a false assumption.

 

The bottom line in parenting and growing up is that it takes a village.  Parents, no matter how well educated or well-intentioned, do not possess the ability to provide all of children's' needs.  Children need to have their own experiences with no parent there to fix the wrongs or take them out at an sign of adversity.  Children need to learn to try things that don't initially interest them and to finish things even if they don't want to. 

 

By having children raised so closely to parents, I believe these children to be stifled and crippled.  It may not seem evident now, but wait until college...the social gaps will be regrettably obvious then.  Most home school children either maintain some level of distance from the greater group or overindulge due to lack of exposure to issues like sex and alcohol.

 

Talk to you kids all you want.  Enroll them in a weekly soccer practice if it backs up your argument better.  If you really want to feel convincing, bring Science into the kitchen....no ones really buying it but it may make you feel better.   You can not recreate the atmosphere of school, the expertise of teachers or the rich experience for children.  Parents who enroll their kids in home schooling usually fit into one of the following categories:

 

Motivations

1) They themselves experienced social rejection

2)They themselves experienced academic failure

3)An irrational fear of "the world we live in today"

4) A selfish desire to experience everything that your child experiences so much to that you are willing to deny you child most if not all experiences that don't include you

5) An obsession with control

 

As I read through the pro homeschooling letters, I just enjoy attaching the motivation to their argument.  Notice...what is best for children didn't make the top five. 

Quote From: sneakers145

I do find that the posts that clearly present the reality that homeschoolers and unschoolers live are glossed over and ignored because there's no argument left.  Instead, the detractors keep looking for the straw men and grammatical mistakes with which to ridicule homeschool parents.

 

Judge not, lest ye be judged, on your own grammar, because yours is not perfect, either.