Topic : 11/24 Great School Debate

It's really sad to think that there are unschoolers out there not providing their children with lots of resources.  That's really the basis of unschooling... to provide resources and have faith that it will work. 

 

I have to say that there are some people out there who should not homeschool, I haven't met many (3 out of hundreds) but, I am beginning to suspect that they are the people who don't come to support groups and social activities.  

 

My view is that no matter what schooling used, parents need to be the main force behind thier childs education. That being said I do not believe that home schooling is good because of the lack of socialization and building of personal esteem. That being because of the lack of different experiences. I base this on the 27 people I know who are involved with home schooling. The situations are below. 

 

I know 4 families that home school(ed) and my son in law was home schooled and what I see from all of  the home schooled people that I know,  they are short on "street smarts" and social skills. They are all intimidated easily when put into social situations and never heard of or have never seen some of the things they come upon when going out on there own, like all of the socialization needed in getting a job. 

My son and law and his twin brother both, to different extremes, admitted to trying alot of  the things they were not exposed too because they were "tabboo".  They also say they were easily talked into things because they were gulable.  The twin decided to go into the army because then he would have guided structure again but still drinks a lot because, he says, after being sheltered the "real world" is alot harder than he ever learned.

This is the case in another family that I know, all 3 boys have trouble adjusting even though they were always involved in sports.

Another family with 7 kids has a wonderful mother who is an accredited teacher, admits that thier older kids lack the socialization skills and this makes them intraverted in social situations.

     I was brought up in public school and survived just fine.  My oldest was in public school for 3 years before we decided to homeschool her.  She was diagnosed with dyslexia and also anxiety due to the bullying she was put through daily by one little boy (his mother was a teacher there).  I was still not sold on homeschool until they put my daughter with an above average iq (according to drs testing) into special education for half the day.   The school explained to me that they had no program specific to her needs.  They said this was better for her "self esteem" rather than struggling with the rest of her class in spelling and math.  We took the summer studying about dyslexia and homeschooling too.  We have been homeschooling now for 3 1/2 years and we really enjoy it.  They all have a social life outside of the home.  We have church, awanas, 4-h and much more.  My children can interact with people of all ages and backgrounds.  They are very outgoing and polite.  I am not saying that homeschooling is for everyone.  I just know it is right for us.  We are going to continue with the younger kids too.  As they get older, like into teen years we will discuss going back to public school if they want.  We have given them the skills to live in the real world because that is where we teach them, not in a stuffy classroom full of boundaries.  As for the unschooling matter, I cant reply to that...I have no understanding how it works.  We use quality books, similar to the school system...with alot of extras...and we test weekly so that we know where we need to work harder.  The best part of homeschool is you can make each child work at his or her best and individualize each persons lessons....noone is boxed in or left out.  I understand that there are kids out there in homeschools, unschooling, and even public schools not getting what they need...We just need to pray for all of the children...They are getting left with a big mess from us and need to have tolerance and kindness taught no matter where they get they education.

Many of the problems facing public schools simply cannot be fixed BY public schools. There are too many hands in the pot, too many politicians trying to make their mark by "fixing" schools with greater accountability and more senseless legislations, and not enough personal responsibility for students or parents. Furthermore, we have disrespected the role of professional educator to the point that the best graduates do not want to go into teaching. It will take a cultural shift to change the course of public education.

 

I wholeheartedly agree and really I think this is why so many people are turning to alternatives like homeschooling. 

That's how my dad showed it to me.  In Genesis, follow the order of what God created and you will find it in the same order that the scientists claim for cross-species evolution.   This was the fundamentalist Christian ideology that i was taught.  God doesn't have to create and then stop.  He has much more power than that.   

 

My personal opinion is that evolution has been absolutely proven, however cross-species evolution has not and it is an important distinction.  One is shown obviously in breeding cattle to be more lean or produce more milk... and the other is still theory where an amoeba becomes a fish (that is really dumbed down, but you get the idea).

 best suited for many gifted kids.  I attended the national convention for the Gifted and Talented a couple of years ago and sat through a couple of seminars, and what was being recommended was essentially unschooling, but within the school walls.  Just fill up a room with resources and let them go, because they are so driven to learn that they WILL learn.  The teacher is to be more of a mentor.

That's what most unschooling looks like in this country, and from the many unschoolers I have met (some of whom now have children doing well in college), this is what it looks like for them.  I haven't met any so far, in 6 years of homeschooling, whose kids are "failing".

I put that last in quotes because how can just casual contact affirm that your cousins (as in the case of the poster whose aunt unschools) are failing?  I know that in my DH's family, they are very anti-homeschooling.  CONSTANTLY my kids are given little verbal pop quizzes, and not necessarily over something they've studied.  Sometimes they'll ask my kids a question at a family celebration where the kids were just playing hard with their cousins, or it's already late and they're tired; either way they weren't necessarily thinking academically at the moment.  On my daughter's fifth birthday, when she was reading on a first-grade level already and had been only four the day before, my husband's grandma handed her a card written in cursive and told her to read it.  She couldn't read cursive, just having turned five that day!  But Grandma persisted for the next TWO YEARS insisting that she couldn't read, and telling me EVERY SINGLE TIME we talked that I needed to put her in public school.  Well, on her sixth birthday she was reading on a third-grade level--but still had trouble with cursive.  On her seven birthday she read on a fifth grade level.  And could read cursive, so now Grandma says she can read but is now convinced she's behind on everything "because she didn't learn to read for so long!"  Never mind that she's actually way AHEAD in every way, and we've studied things they don't cover in public school.

Many homeschoolers study a slightly different program than the public schools cover, like starting with ancient history, perhaps including New World history (Incans, etc.); teaching formal logic to Jr. High age kids; more foreign languages.  We did this.  When my oldest was second grade age, we'd covered ancient history (Mesopotamia, Egypt, Greece, Rome) and by Thanksgiving were dealing with the fall of Rome, the rise of the Vikings and Germanic tribes, etc.  We had read a little bit about American history but not much.  DH's family was just so upset he didn't know much about the Pilgrims.  Were they quizzing his same-age cousins on what they knew about Plato or Caesar?  Nope.  But somehow his education was lacking because he hadn't done those things on their time table.  Even though he was reading on an eighth grade level and was currently interested in robotics and DNA.

My point, with illustrations, is that just casual contact doesn't give you a feel for what a child knows.  My kids learned loads while following an interest: not just about that area, but many areas that touched on it.  But providing resources and opportunities is what makes this style of learning work.  We started out unschooling, because it works particularly well for young gifted children.  We now are a little more structured.

It's not only the basis of unschooling, it should be the basis of LIFE!  During summer vacations, I see parents providing their children with fun things and even though neither child nor parent is aware of it, educational things.

Parents, regardless of whether they want some label of public school, private school, homeschool, or unschool, need to facilitate their children in LIFE.  I feel sad for the people purplepenny has referred to, it must be heartbreaking to watch.

For some, it may to be given a break, for others, it may be to let their kids goof off in a craft club, for others it may be to let them study ancient Egypt and write letters to their Egyptian pen pal.

When I had my first child, I took her home from the hospital, and my prayer was that, every day I would provide her with everything she needs.  Between the natural process of life, and of course, parental guidance, we managed to make it, and make it beautifully.

Nobody questions the trust  that a parent has when holding a child in their arms, sometimes for the first time ever, that they'll be able to do right by them.  When a parent expresses doubt, the answer is often, "No worries, you can do it."

And yeah, kids often are the greatest BS detectors, and they are extremely bright and sharp.  Such wit and growth can often come at inconvenient times! haha (and I am not just talking about "gifted children")

"This is also why students are not taught grammar in high school."

Or logic in Jr. High and High School.

"...can teach whatever nutty thing they want"?  What, are we all supposed to have GroupThink now?  (That's from the novel 1994).  As adults, we know that there are lots of areas of debate in everyday life.  Why not teach both sides of something--including the "nutty" other sides of an issue?

First time I've heard private schools accused of teaching "nutty things".  I guess that's why Ivy League schools tend to look to them...

Very true, but then I tend to think of unschooling simply  as life.