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Topic : 04/12 Twin Tug of War

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Created on : Friday, April 06, 2007, 11:39:40 am
Author : DrPhilBoard1
Allison Quets made headlines around the world when she allegedly kidnapped her 17-month-old twins across the border into Canada this past Christmas. She had given them up for adoption, but did she do so under duress? She now says she suffered from a pregnancy disease called hyperemesis that left her malnourished and sleep deprived to the point of complete exhaustion. See an exclusive interview with Allison from behind bars where she awaits trial on two counts of international parental kidnapping, with a possible sentence of three years behind bars. Then, look inside the life of a woman who is only three-and-a-half months pregnant and so sick with hyperemesis she spends most of her day on the bathroom floor. Plus, find out what all women need to know about hyperemesis: How you get it, how to know you have it, and whether it could kill you or your unborn child. Join the discussion.

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April 15, 2007, 10:11 am PDT

Thank you for the show Dr. Phil!

Dr. Phil,

It has been 3 days since your show on Allison Q / HG has aired and I'm still not sure I am ready to respond, but I know the timing of these emails is what may convince you to continue to shine the spotlight on HG.  I am a 5 time survivor of HG.  I have 2 beautiful boys (8 yrs and 3 mos).  Because I have just given birth (for the last time!), it is still a VERY sensitive area for me to discuss.  No words can express the torture this disease places not only on the pregnant mother, but also on the entire family.  We are all still trying to recover from the HG I suffered for the ENTIRE pregnancy.  It was a very emotional day for us when we watched your show.  I would be very grateful for the opportunity to have another show focused entirely on this horrible disease.

Kimber and I met 8 years ago when I had my first son and she is truly an angel.  We talked (via email) throughout this last pregnancy and I don't know how this would have ended if I didn't have her.  Support and knowledge are the keys to getting through an HG pregnancy.  You can help with both by doing another show.  My horrible story is meaningless at this point...what matters is to know we are not alone in our suffering.  Please help us spread the word.  Thanks for reading....

 
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April 15, 2007, 10:19 am PDT

The nightmare of HG

Quote From: ohplease21

Ok,

 

First of all to all of you who claim to have suffered from HG.  IF it is SO awful (and maybe it is, I don't know) WHY ON EARTH would you keep getting pregnant after delivering a healthy baby?  So many of these posts are "I had HG too, it is so awful, I had it with all 15 of my babies".  Of course I am exagerating, but you get my point.  It apparently wasn't bad enough to dissuade you from doing it again.

 

Second, Allison was not suffering from this disease any longer when she signed the papers....so HG can not be used as an excuse for giving her babies away.  Did ANYONE ELSE on this board griping about the misery of HG place their babies for adoption?  No?  Didn't think so.

 

Third, she kidnapped the children 16 MONTHS later.  So, you are going to tell me that HG made her do that too?

 

Fourth, for all of you spouting the children's "blood right" stay with Allison even though she is obviously unstable, the children were conceived with donor eggs and donor sperm.  SO, if you want to look at it that way Allison is not their "parent" either.  I wonder what the genetic parents would think of this situation if they knew.  Who THEY would want raising these children.

 

Fifth, the adoptive parents are likely not going public because they have nothing to gain by doing so.  They are fighting in a court of law, not the court of public opinion.  They did nothing wrong, why should they have to go on national television and defend themselves?

 

Feel free to keep belly aching about how horrible this "disease" is, I am not saying it's not.  My point is it must not be THAT bad or women would not go through another pg after suffering through it once.  My personal opinion, surprise surprise, is that it is too bad they are only charging her with parental kidnapping.  She should be in prison for life after what she did, but instead she will likely only serve 3 years.  If she gets those children back, it will be a travesty.

I wish that people like you would educate yourselves on HG to relieve your ignorance.  HG really is a horrible experience that haunts those afflicted for the rest of their lives.  I suffered from HG last year.  As much as my husband and I would love to have another child, we have decided that we cannot re-live the horrors of HG again.  I honestly have to say that I am not "strong enough" to endure the nightmare again.  I am amazed by the strength of the women who have suffered with this condition and selflessly decide to put themselves into the same horrible situation again for the sake of bringing more children into the world.  These are some of the strongest women you could ever meet and it hurts to know that there are people out there like you who have decided to pass judgement on those afflicted with this horrible condition.

 
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April 15, 2007, 10:49 am PDT

Allison has been in jail too long......

Let's play pretend for a moment here.  Pretend you are the Judge over this "International Kidnapping" case and think about what you would do.  Would you sentence a woman to jail for trying to raise her children or would you come up with another solution?  I know if it were me, I would have given her home arrest and ordered tons of counseling.  But we are NOT the judges and so we need to respect the Judge's decision since he knows all the facts of the case.  That doesn't mean we can't do everything we can to let Allison know she is loved and supported.  She has a website, where people can post on a petition.  We can write her letters.  We can send letters to the Judge that are constructive and educated.  We can learn the laws of each state and how they affect adoptions.  We can Pray if we believe in that.  We can do a lot to make Allison know how much we care about her.  She is a WOMAN and she makes me proud to call myself that also.  She is a MOTHER and once again makes me proud to call myself that also.  She is a FRIEND and I have many friends also.  She is PERSON, A HUMAN, SOMEONE WHO MATTERS and someone who I feel doesn't deserve the treatment she is getting.  Why do we let things like this happen in our society?  Why don't we be more proactive and clarify laws and make it so that Adoption (which is amazingly wonderful thing) is fair to all parties involved.  If the birth mother chooses Adoption with a sound mind and body, then that is FAIR.  But if she is under duress and extreme stress, is that FAIR?  I know I would've made poor choices if I had just had a C-section, struggled to sleep and eat, been hormonally unbalanced, and lacked a well established support system of friends and family.  This is not to say Allison didn't have the support of her loved ones, I just think she needed them more.....  I have personally given birth to twin boys.  Like Allison, they were both breech.  They were both C-section and the recover was extremely difficult and long.  I lived, breathed, and did nothing else but care for those babies.  They had a lot of medical problems and it was scary when they would stop breathing, but I treasured them then, just like I do now.  My mother basically moved in with my husband and I and one day ( a few days into the horrendous schedule of taking care of newborn twins) she woke up and said, "I'm leaving and I'm not coming back."  Of course that wasn't the case, she showed up a week later, well rested and everything was fine.  Thankfully my husband got laid off from his job at that time, and all three of us were able to kindof make things work-but even then we had countless friends and family come over to hold and care for the babies.  After that, I knew it would be several years before I dared get pregnant again.  The twins were not invitro and my fertility is such that I knew twins were a super high possibility again.  So, when the twins were 4 I began being open to getting pregnant again and happily I quickly became pregnant.  The baby, though, was not developing properly and I "just knew" something was "wrong."  The doctors told me he had club feet and it didn't look like he even had hands.  They thought he might have Trisomy 18, since the original blood work came back positive for that fatal disease.  Thankfully, he didn't have that but the doctors told me to gear up for some kind of similar disease.  I experienced prenatal and mild postpartum depression.  I remember my doctor would come to check on me after delivery each day, and each day I told him emotionally I just don't quite feel right.  After three times he said, "Let's get you treated because if we don't, Post Partum Depression will only get WORSE, not better."  SO I said great, although my husband was extremely resistant to the idea.  I can tell you now, that without counseling and medication it WOULD HAVE GOTTEN WORSE.  But instead, it never really got bad at all.  I am one of the lucky ones, though.  I recognized the signs, because while I was pregnant I read the book, "Down came the Rain" by Brooke Shields.  I feel she empowered me to recognize the symptoms and get help quickly.  What a blessing in my life.  But what would or could have happened if I personally didn't recognize the signs and tell my doctor that I needed help?  Allison has said she had PPD and didn't recognize it until much later.  That is so sad to me.  If doctors had followed up super closely maybe this wouldn't have happened.  We will never know.  I do know the doctors are not mind readers though, and we have to be the ones who express our needs to them.  In this case, it didn't turn out like mine.  That makes me sad for Allison.  Does she deserve to be in jail, for making poor decisions?  I don't know.  All I know is she is a WOMAN, and a MOTHER who desperately needed tons of help and love.  I hope you will think about her situation when you JUDGE her.  I know I do-because I lived a similar experience firsthand.  May we all remember we are just doing our best to make it in the world.  I feel everyone has VALUE and can make a meaningful and amazing contribution to our society.  Thanks for reading my thoughts.  You have VALUE to me!
 
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April 15, 2007, 12:45 pm PDT

I don't get it

This disease sounds truly awful - it is sad that anyone has to deal with such illness and such losses. What I do not understand though - did she make the choice to give up the babies while pregnant or afterwards? How long after you give birth does this disease make you unable to make coherent choices (how long for a return to health)?

If someone is deemed legally unable to make rational choices for themselves because of this illness (that is what is being suggested, in order to make these legal documents she signed invalid), should that person be left making choices for their babies on a daily basis, without some kind of aid or medication? This would concern me. If someone was suffering a mental illness that diminished their reason to the point that they were not legally able to make choices, a proxy or someone else would have to make choices about the children I would think? I am not sure how this works, but I would be concerned.

How was she coerced into giving up her babies? It does not seem like there was anyone forcing her. Were they harassing her, or showing up at her home? What is this ex boyfriend like? I don't understand the coercion part.

While there may not be a cooling off period for adoption (for babies under 6 months), she came back three days later (the same amount of time given as a cooling off period for babies over 6 months) and signed the papers again. Is the problem that three days is not enough of a cooling off period?

I guess I feel bad for the adoptive parents, I cannot imagine investing the sort of love it takes to raise a child only to have that child taken away. The children do not understand why they were suddenly taken to away from the people they have bonded with and the experience must have been traumatic. I know adoptive parents and their daughter really loves them. There is no doubt in the girl's mind that these people are her parents and love her, and to be taken away from them would be truly upsetting for her.

 

 

 
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April 15, 2007, 12:58 pm PDT

Gag

I was talking with another HG survivor yesterday and she told me that while she was pregnant, she had people fake gag to make her sick.

 

I had someone do the same thing. My MIL would repeatedly fake gag to make me sick. What is even worse, we know another woman who suffered through HG and she has done it to her too.

 

I am wondering if there are any other women who have gone through HG and had the same experience.

 

These people don't realize how cruel this is. Even if you are having a good day, this could be enough to send you spiralling to the toilet. They just don't realize that they are jeopardizing your health and your baby's health by doing this,

 
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April 15, 2007, 1:17 pm PDT

04/12 Twin Tug of War

Quote From: justnancy

I hadn't thought of it that way, but that's got to be what's going on caring mothers are looking at Alison with their 'mommy empathy' and failing to see the risk involved.  Meanwhile, the children need care and thankfully they are receiving it from the adoptive parents.  I'd hate to see those children staying in limbo for years, getting bounced around while Alison tries to get herself together.

 

I could see the adoptive parents taking one look at Alison and one look at those adoptive children and being absolutely heartsick at the prospect of the twins spending a life with her.  A raving, unstable woman can seem like a monster to a tiny child.

"A raving, unstable woman can seem like a monster to a tiny child."

 

What in the world gave you the impression that this woman was "raving"? I'm sure Allison did not have the energy to rave.

 

Allison spent time with her children for 48 hours, every few weeks... she had visitation rights. From the pictures that were taken with Allison and her children together, I really don't see how anyone could think these children viewed their mother to be "like a monster".

 
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April 15, 2007, 1:26 pm PDT

Please dedicate a whole show to HG!

Hi Dr. Phil,

     Thank you for the show on Allison Quets and hyperemesis.  The show was difficult to watch because I am an HG survivor and I have  a beautiful daughter to show for it.  I cannot imagine not having her in my life, so I can't imagine the pain Allison is going through.  I suffered for five months while I was pregnant, right up until I delivered my daughter.  Remarkably, I recovered right away and was able to care for my child completely, just as I wanted to.  Allison did not recover right away, she had 2 babies to care for, and it didn't sound like she had a lot of support.  That adoption attorney should be disbarred. Please tell me he or she is under investigation.

I think you should have another show about HG because there is much. much more to cover about this subject.  Also, judging from some of the ignorant messages on your forum, there needs to be more education too.  Thank you so much for what you have done and what you

continue to do.

 

 
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April 15, 2007, 1:56 pm PDT

04/12 Twin Tug of War

Quote From: itsme_cat

I wondered the exact same thing. 

 

I know not everyone has a great support system, but Allison did have a sister that we know of, and maybe more people to help her.  I wonder where they all were too. 

 

My mother moved right in with me for about 3 months after I had my son in 2003.  I did not have HG, but I had congestive heart failure and nearly died right after he was born.  I had and still have VERY high BP as a result of my pregnancy and needed a lot of help in the begining. 

BTW, my son also needed surgery on his kidney when he was 2 months old, and that piled on top of my own illness, nearly did me in.   I thank God for my husband, and my mother and the rest of my family.  They really stepped up.  My son was actually living with his godparents for the first week of his life while I was in the ICU!

 

I really hope Allison gets well, and some sort of justice can be found.  It is a tough situation. 

I  have to tell you that many women have a great social support system before they develop HG. The problem is that many of these people do not understand the illness... and this support can fade away. 

 

I am sure that even though you were very ill that you were probably able to function enough to have a conversation and handle someone being near you without feeling like thier smell or movements were making you more sick.

 

Even women who have partners also find themselves abandoned. How can you keep up a healthy relationship if you have to constantly beg the person not to come near you... not to eat food in front of you... not to talk about food... constantly ask them to shower and brush their teeth... only to tell them that it wasn't good enough... they still smell to you and it makes you vomit. How can you keep up a normal relationship if you can't even stand for your partner to sleep in the same room, or even let them hug you?

 

This is a very stressful disease for the families as well as the women going through it. You can hardly even begin to imagine even just the financial costs that can be incurred. If the insurance companies refuse to pay for your meds, the situation can be very stressful indeed.

 

Here is a link to walgreens for the cost of a prescription for Zofran.

http://www.walgreens.com/library/finddrug/druginfo1.jsp?particularDrug=Zofran&id=11006

 

A bottle of 12 pills (4 mg each) costs $354! That is over $29 per pill! This pill is taken every 8 hours. ... That would come close to $90 per day! (Some women only need 2 mg every 8 hours, some need up to 8 mg or more every 8 hours!). You can just imagine how much this can add up over say an 8 month period. We are talking thousands upon thousands of dollars. ...People usually think to put money away to buy a crib... but who thinks they may need over $20 000 for pills?

 

People just do not understand why you can not even call them to thank them for helping you. They may begin to feel unapreciated even though they are greatly appreciated and they are your lifeline. People also have an understandable tendancy to get caught up in their own lives too.

 

Another thing is that people think that once you deliver and you no longer vomit, that you are just fine. They do not understand that it also takes time post partum to recover from HG's effects.

 
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April 15, 2007, 2:06 pm PDT

04/12 Twin Tug of War

Quote From: patcren

No, you only paid attention at that time.

The last two years for her have been like being a captive in some crazy horror movie. Yours eyes would be twitching too if you were in jail...shackles no less...when you should be home taking care of your children. She NEEDED help when those kids were five months old, not someone to snatch them from her.
I just don't buy into this consummate victim stuff, especially when it comes at the expense of children.
 
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April 15, 2007, 2:08 pm PDT

04/12 Twin Tug of War

Quote From: astrid07

This disease sounds truly awful - it is sad that anyone has to deal with such illness and such losses. What I do not understand though - did she make the choice to give up the babies while pregnant or afterwards? How long after you give birth does this disease make you unable to make coherent choices (how long for a return to health)?

If someone is deemed legally unable to make rational choices for themselves because of this illness (that is what is being suggested, in order to make these legal documents she signed invalid), should that person be left making choices for their babies on a daily basis, without some kind of aid or medication? This would concern me. If someone was suffering a mental illness that diminished their reason to the point that they were not legally able to make choices, a proxy or someone else would have to make choices about the children I would think? I am not sure how this works, but I would be concerned.

How was she coerced into giving up her babies? It does not seem like there was anyone forcing her. Were they harassing her, or showing up at her home? What is this ex boyfriend like? I don't understand the coercion part.

While there may not be a cooling off period for adoption (for babies under 6 months), she came back three days later (the same amount of time given as a cooling off period for babies over 6 months) and signed the papers again. Is the problem that three days is not enough of a cooling off period?

I guess I feel bad for the adoptive parents, I cannot imagine investing the sort of love it takes to raise a child only to have that child taken away. The children do not understand why they were suddenly taken to away from the people they have bonded with and the experience must have been traumatic. I know adoptive parents and their daughter really loves them. There is no doubt in the girl's mind that these people are her parents and love her, and to be taken away from them would be truly upsetting for her.

 

 

__________________________________________________________________________

"How long after you give birth does this disease make you unable to make coherent choices (how long for a return to health)?

If someone is deemed legally unable to make rational choices for themselves because of this illness (that is what is being suggested, in order to make these legal documents she signed invalid), should that person be left making choices for their babies on a daily basis, without some kind of aid or medication? This would concern me. If someone was suffering a mental illness that diminished their reason to the point that they were not legally able to make choices, a proxy or someone else would have to make choices about the children I would think? I am not sure how this works, but I would be concerned."

 __________________________________________________________________________

 

I would like to address this specific part of your quote.

 

HG is not a mental illness. Just because you have HG does not mean that you have diminished mental capabilities. You can become severely depleted though and then may have a difficult time making decisions. Not all women get to this point with HG. Good medical treatment to stay hydrated and good meds (to alleviate physical symptoms) go a long way to help HG from getting to this point. That is why it is important that people get educated about HG... so that women can get proper treatment.

 

Another point I would like to make (along the same line of thought) is that Allsion made poor decisions under duress... not under psychosis.

 

One if the most frustrating aspects of this PHYSICAL ILLNESS is that people often erroniously see it as someone being crazy!

 
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