Topic : 09/04 Violent Kids

Although the show hasn't aired here yet, I've read the postings so far. The possible culprits that have already been named, such as mental illness, simple "bad parenting," working mothers, materialism, nutrition, a society that is angry in general, angry parents, ad infinitum, MAY, to one extent or another (or some combination of several), be operative in an INDIVIDUAL'S case. IMO, it is too easy to point a finger at one potential factor ar another and declare that "THIS" is the problem in today's guests, or with "problem children" in general. Certainly, a qualified mental health pro (such as the good Dr.) can get to the bottom of a specific situation more accurately than we "armchair psychologists!"

 

For all of you who pine for the "good old days," please consider that in those "good old days," a child who showed those behavior problems might well have been thrown into an institution, be it military school, home for the "mentally deficient,"  or a psychiatric hospital, never to be heard from again by their "perfect" families. Nowadays, parents are expected to somehow know which specialist to see (pediatrician? psychologist (behavioral? Jungian?)? psychiatrist? nutritionist?), which questions to even ask (and if the specialists disagree, figure out whose advice to follow), follow these new directives, and hope to goodness their insurance will pick up the tab. Much more daunting, isn't it?

Several years ago I had a boy in my class -- fourth grade -- who told me some horrific things that he had done to animals. He told it in a really matter-of-fact way as if it was nothing unusual. First I asked him why he had thought I would want to hear things like that. Then I realized that he didn't know the enormity of what he had done. I turned my reaction into a science lesson, comparing the nervous system of the animal (cat) to that of a human. I explained that the cat had felt the same pain that he would have felt if someone had done that to him. He was so shocked at the information, and burst into tears, crying, "I didn't know..." I couldn't imagine someone not having explained something like that to a child, given nine years to do it, but it apparently happens. Happily, this boy didn't grow up to be a criminal.

You don't need to spank or otherwise assault kids to teach them right from wrong, and it scares me to read messages like that one.

We have five children. The two older ones are find, upstanding young adults who did well in college, the two teenagers seem to be happy and have never been in trouble at school or with the law, and the youngest one was recognized as his class's citizen of the year.

In otherwords, they all seem well-adjusted, and none of them are a behavior problem. Yet we never spanked any of them.

The key isn't beating on kids; it's respecting them as human beings created by God, listening to them, setting a good example and giving kids the gentle guidance that's needed.

There still are no guarantees, and we still have to get to the teen years for one of our kids! But teaching kids that hitting kids solves problems isn't the way to go.

Ponder when this is taking place:

Imagine what would happen to Cole if this wasn't 2007, but 1907, perhaps into the '50s.

1) He'd be chained in the basement, mental institution, etc.  A family "secret".

2) Imagine what would happen to him in a  non-medical situation where he would be analyzed and diagnosed as possessed by deamons and an exorsist.  I'm not condemning anyone who feels as though I'm speaking against any form of religion. It's not so. I'm merely pointing out (objectively) what would (or could)  have happened before now.

 

i have had probs with my youngest son who is 6 yrs. now.  started when he was 2 and i can honestly say...he has took quite a few years off my life due to stress i'm sure.  we finally spent 3 months everyweek with a child psychologist...and i literally was told it was all my fault.  she said it was the way i taught him to react...its just so difficult to stay calm,..and other ppl are telling you "just spank the kids...old fashioned spanking"...i literally had to sign a contract stating i would not spank, or yell until the next visit, i signed it, adn so did my son.   all in all, after i was taught some wonderful calm techniques in treating him and discipling him he really made a turn around.  he isnt perfect...they said he has ODD but he doesnt need meds and has no signs of ADD/ADHD...cant wait to see this NEW episode...

I have a set of twin boys that are now 25 years old.  They started acting this way when they were around 5 yrs. old.  I divorced their dad when they were 1 and he still does not have much to do with them.  Anyway I took them to Doctors and Child Developement Doctors(Mental)  Finally after quite awhile they diagnosed them with ADA.  They were put on the medication and after a few months they were stilll the acting the same.  They(the Doctors did more test and found nothing.  They left them on the Medication.  Anyway nothing seemed to help, I even tried counseling with them when they were older.   To this day they still act out towards each other or loved ones.  One twin attacked my husband with a knife and the police had to be called, he was arrested, but know charges were filed(would make matters worse).  That was 2 months ago and now he acts like nothing happened.  My other twin has sole custody of my 20 month old Granddaughter and uses her to punish me if he does not get his way.  I have not got to see my Granddaughter now for over 2 weeks.    I am at wits end, things do not change as they get older!  I am still afraid of them both.  Has anyone else gone through this or is going through this????  Please let me know.     Thank-You

Dr. Phil, I read an article about your comments on video games.  Could Cole be learning this behavior that way?  Maybe not 100%, but it could be one of the reasons.

 

The parents need to be consistant, yes, I agree, but what about other ways Cole is learning behaviors from?  He uses violence, threats and pain.  In video games, the victims don't display pain.  They're destroyed or blown to bits.  Cole sees the consequence, not feels it.  He pushes a button and the good guy, bad guy, kittens, puppies or whatever is destroyed.

 

I remember your interview with Larry King.  I can send the article I read. 

 

Pearlhanna

My name is TonHanner.  My son is very violent tempered. My mom and dad have adopted my son and they have video tape of his behavior. It dont take much to set off his temper and they have had him to several drs. but they dont seem to help. they even had him taken from them by the welfare because he almost bit my mothers finger off. i need some help or information if u can give it i would greatly appreciate it.

 

 

 

                                                                           Thank You

             

                                                                            TonHanner

It seems we all need degrees to be parents now, it is daunting to hear some people, and then to listen to Doctors (those little ADHD questinares are a joke ) sometimes parents don't know where to turn.

I think though it has to start from day one, with routine (even young babies benifit from knowing what to expect and when ) and consistancy (if its not okay to do today it won't be okay tommorrow , and the privillages will be taken away each time ( my daughter ended up with a bare room when she was six, things would disappear with each offense committed ).

I still say you don't have to beat a child into submission (isn't that the same as bullying ?), though I have slapped their rear ends, to my shame, I have since apologized, they're still pretty good kids though.

As far as ADHD, what I found helped us, take it for what its worth, was to get the boys involved with sports, great outlet for that excess energy, and it gets them off the couch win, win.

But I would beg parents, don't settle for a diagnosis made within ten minutes after filling out this Questionaire, it was explained to me by a child neurologist, this was a guideline, of COMMON signs, but each case can exhibit different behaviors, and not all children will show the same signs in the same way (contrary to popular belief, ADHD does NOT MEAN that a child is destined to be a career criminal, and that they will not be able to function in society, they do and can when given the tools to help them ), and yes sometimes you have to be tough and they can be the most frustrating children going, but like other children they are loving and charming, and parents of these childre (myself included) love them like their other children, warts and all.

I have got to say that I have never seen anything like this in my life. I can only hope that these parents can see some light at the end of the tunnel very soon. I didn't realize until this very show on this very day that my husband and I were better parents than I have ever in my life thought that we were. We were always together on things(whatever it was dicipline, advice, everything that you face with kids) I think that we were very fortunate that we did agree on things. And we were consistent in things. I never knew that these things were that important.(Call me an idiot, but I truly didn't realize the importance until this very day.) I'm not trying to say anything bad about these 2 sets of parents. My heart goes out to them. It's still hard to digest that things can get that out of control. In all the families I've met through the years I've never witnessed anything close to this. You know , I have just been very blessed in my life. I always try not to take things for granted, but I didn't realize just how blessed I have been in the area of parenting until today. I am so thankful. Again I hope these parents can get some peace in thier lives. It's very hard to raise kids and I felt like I was stumbling through a minefield lots of times.(Many, many times) I'm glad we all got through it pretty much unscathed.