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Topic : 09/07 Kids Caught in the Middle

Number of Replies: 88
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Created on : Friday, August 31, 2007, 10:24:49 am
Author : DrPhilBoard1
Marriage is too often a war zone with innocent kids trapped on the battlefield. Dr. Phil sounds the alarm on parents who use their children as pawns in their relationships. Vangie had a lover, Dave, for 18 years before she married him last year. There was just one small problem -- Vangie was already married! Her daughter, Danell, was forced to lie and cover up the affair, and now she refuses to accept Dave. Should Danell forget the past and make peace with her mother’s new husband, or does she have the right to resent her stepfather? Then, Denise says Bruce, her husband of 22 years, is such a bully that she left him eight months ago. She says that he badmouths her in front of their kids and tries to pit them against her. Their 14-year-old daughter, Lauren, says he’s called her a pig, a slob and a bitch and has left nasty messages on her cell phone. Bruce says he’s not a bully; he’s just preparing his kids for the real world. What’s behind Bruce’s behavior, and will he and Denise be able to salvage their relationship for the sake of the kids? Talk about the show here.

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September 2, 2007, 9:58 pm CDT

Forgive who?? Mom-Vangie or Her new husband??

 To be a child who has to not only witness adultry, buttaught or forced to  lie aboaut is unforgivalbe to me.. Was this childs feelings and best interest ever cosidered at all??   or  ever taking into account?/ Probably not at all.. This mother should be ashamed of herself for placing herself and her feelings above thsoe of her daughter and then husband.   I see this all the time where the children are left to comfort themselfs, support the parents both emotionally and protect them at the cost of their own child hood and development.. I use the senerio of  " ME! ME! ME!  "as though  you are singing it.  This is what these kind of people think about.,  there own self gratification and satisfaction. Not what is best for this life they brough into the world and have the responsibility to teah and nuture into adult hood.  I do nto think this daughter shoudl fogive either the new step father or her mother for robbing her of a normal, nuturing chidlre hood.  She shouldbe very angry and let them both know with dr. Phil's help[ what this put her though.  Then hopefully, Dr. Phil will get her some help so she does not use this learned behaviour or thinkthsi is the way she shoudl be.




 
September 2, 2007, 10:05 pm CDT

09/07 Kids Caught in the Middle

Quote From: depot25

 

                      When I see things like this it just makes me so sad, and angry!!  How do these parents think?   Who gave them the right to put themselves frist?  I am remarried to a wonderful man, but my ex is still a big part of our childrens lives.  Does he drive me crazy of course!!!  If he didn't we would still be together!!! Do I personally respect him NO, but he Is the father to our two boys who love him.  I respect that!!!  Yes there are days that we have DISCUSSIONS when the children are not around, if we start to yell we stop and one of us will walk away and we will contiune when we both have cooled off.  NEVER IN THE CHILDRENS  EAR SHOT!!!!! 

      How does Dr. Phill do this?  I watch the show and find myself yelling at the T.V.  As parents we are given a ture gift!!!!  no matter what we do our children love us whole hearted.  I had to go through alot of pain and anger, but the worst was when my children would ask why is daddy gone and they would cry (he had an affair and left when my second child was a week old) was I angry yes, but the children don't need that adult stress.  We did alot of hugging and loving and reassuring it was not thier fault we as mommy and daddy let you down and we are sorry.  The mos important thing my parents taught me was always acknowlege the emotion!!!  I would tell my children Mommy and Daddy love you very much IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT.  I know your sad.


All adults going through this-stop thinking of yourself.  This is the hardest thing you will ever do in your life.  GET HELP  it's out there.  Don't even make facial expressions when the children are speaking about your ex the children are always watching and listening.  They need to know they are loved and safe. 

GOD BLESS YOU DR. PHILL I DON'T THINK I COULD DEAL WITH SOME OF YOUR QUEST WITHOUT JUST GIVING THE A V8 SMACK RIGHT IN THE FOREHEAD.
I was one of those kids caught in the middle. I am fixing to be 48 and I know that it wasn't all, but my life has been hell. I found out I am better off without a relationship because I pick abusive relationships, I am a addict, what I mean is that I can get addicted to almost anything just not to feel. My Mom and Dad needed to get divorced. It was needed but then we had to be put through each side of the family talking about the daughter-in-law or son-in-law and each parent does the same, I really hated my Dad as a teenager because things I was told. I got so tired of the arguing I locked myself in the bathroom with a knife, my sister told and My Dad broke in and then turned to my Mother and said, "See what you did." I started smoking regularly at twelve, smoking marijuana, abusing prescription pills, then by fifteen it was alcohol and I drank until I was forced to get sober in 1992, and continued to smoke cigarettes until June 5, 2007. I have been diagnosed with depression years ago. Sometimes people don't belong together but they don't need to seem like enemies and you feeling like you have to choose one. Please in-laws do not put the children in the middle either. both sides of the families should try to get along also. I spent a long time feeling angry at my Dad. I have no contact even with my brother and sisters. I don't know if they are dead or alive. The only one I know for sure is dead is my father. And I learned that only a few years ago. I am close with no one other than my children. My head is still messed up from it all. If you don't put the children first and act civilized with each other the children will be hurt, confused, lost and just doesn't understand why it is their fault.
 
September 3, 2007, 2:25 pm CDT

09/07 Kids Caught in the Middle

Quote From: mpc333

My daughter and son-in-law will not let me see my grandchildren BECAUSE THEY ARE MADE AT ME OVER A MONEY/BUSINESS SITUATION.  I totally feel this is ABUSE of the children.  The last time I did see my granddaughter, she wanted me to stay longer (I was babysitting for a little while - they let me see the kids because they thought I would pay out some money).  My daughter said "NO, SHE HAS TO LEAVE NOW" and my granddaughter started crying and hanging onto me, so I just picked up my things and told my granddaughter that she should just think of me every night before she goes to sleep and imagine me giving her big hugs every night - then I just left her there crying.  How can they do this????????  Besides the fact that she is not letting me see them, there is evidence of physical abuse.  WHAT CAN I DO?  Do grandparents have rights for visitation?
Yes Grandparents have rights to. Though may I ask why the child is clinging to you when evidently you have seen her. What r u putting in that childs mind for her to cry when she has to leave. Could you not make it a better experience for the childs sake. What did you do? Did you do it maliciously and involve the child. I did not have a good relationship with my in-laws but never kept the child from them though they were 3000 miles away. Both our family's live back East. Don't put the children in the middle. I do not feel you are being totally honest about what you said to your granddaughter to start crying and clinging to you. Outrage on what some in-laws do when they don't like the spouse of thier children, and when adult children dont' know how to draw fences, for everyone's sake. You could have made a better impression for the child instead of leaving her there crying, like this is your daughter's child, I wonder what you did. If Mom says leave now, help the child understand that we will see each other again, it's time to go home. Listen to Mommy and you Grandma Butt OUT!!
 
September 4, 2007, 10:55 am CDT

I miss my grandchildren

Quote From: sundeigo

Yes Grandparents have rights to. Though may I ask why the child is clinging to you when evidently you have seen her. What r u putting in that childs mind for her to cry when she has to leave. Could you not make it a better experience for the childs sake. What did you do? Did you do it maliciously and involve the child. I did not have a good relationship with my in-laws but never kept the child from them though they were 3000 miles away. Both our family's live back East. Don't put the children in the middle. I do not feel you are being totally honest about what you said to your granddaughter to start crying and clinging to you. Outrage on what some in-laws do when they don't like the spouse of thier children, and when adult children dont' know how to draw fences, for everyone's sake. You could have made a better impression for the child instead of leaving her there crying, like this is your daughter's child, I wonder what you did. If Mom says leave now, help the child understand that we will see each other again, it's time to go home. Listen to Mommy and you Grandma Butt OUT!!
Of course you may ask.  I have no problem at all telling you exactly what is going on.  The whole situation started during tax season.  My son-in-law and I purchased some real estate together.  When it came to tax time we agreed that to get the maximum tax benefit from the properties it would be best to put 100% of the deductions on his tax return because I have no taxable income due to a disability , even though he did not pay for any of the expenses that were claimed on his taxes.  When I asked him to give the money back to me for the business that was credited to his tax return so I could pay the mortgage, he told me I was crazy and that he didn't owe me any money.  He stopped talking to me back in late March/early April.  I called them a short while later and said that $1,500 was not worth ruining a relationship over and that we could work it out later.  Then the issue of mortgage payments came up.  I have paid for everything for 2-1/2 years and he has not paid a penny.  We are each 50% owner.  I have been drawing money out of my retirement account to keep the mortgages paid (lack of rental income) and can no longer do so.  When I asked my son-in-law to contribute to the mortgage payments he told me to stop calling and asking for money and has not spoken to me since.  They finally agreed to let me see me grandchildren the beginning of August because we were facing foreclosure issues on 2 houses and they wanted me to pay the mortgages and thought if they let me see the children I would pay the money.  So when I did see the children, my granddaughter didn't want me to leave.  My granddaughter asked her mother (my daughter) if I could stay a little while longer and my daughter said "No, she has to leave NOW".  That's why my granddaughter was crying.  I HAVE NEVER SAID A SINGLE THING TO MY GRANDCHILDREN ABOUT THEIR PARENTS OR THE SITUATION - however, I cannot say what my daughter has told them.  I would NEVER say anything against they at all.  I do not believe in putting the children in the middle.  When my granddaughter asked me if I could stay I told her she would have to ask her mother and that was my daughter's answer - NO - SHE HAS TO LEAVE NOW.  I had absolutely no choice.  But before I left, I did tell my granddaughter that I would see her soon and that when I was hugging her that she should remember me every night - that before she went to bed she should feel my hugs every night before she went to bed - that I was always with her even when I'm not there.  THEN my daughter called me and once again told me I would NEVER SEE THE KIDS THE REST OF MY LIFE (because I didn't have the money to make the payment at that time) and I'd better cherish the pictures that I have of them because they were the last I would see of them.  THIS IS ALL BECAUSE I WOULD NOT GIVE THEM MONEY.  I live on a limited income because of my disability and can no longer drain my retirement account.  My son-in-law has a prestigious job as a Chief Financial Advisor and has potential for unlimmited future financial income.  I can no longer support them or the houses, and do not feel like I should be punished because I said no to giving them money.  I am not trying to punish them by any means, but I have no one to take care of me and no other means of future financial stability other than my retirement money - from which I have already contributed over $85,000 to the homes and just cannot afford to do so any more.  I feel if they can take 6 vacations in 1-1/2 years, remodel their kitchen, and spend other money on themselves, then they by all means can take responsibility for the other financial obligations that they have made commitments to.  I think it very inapproppriate that you are blaming me and telling me to "BUTT OUT" when you have not a clue as to the selfishness and immaturity of my daughter and son-in-law.  Had my son-in-law not thrown a "hissy fit" in April and stopped talking to me, we would not be in this financial bind with the houses.  He cancelled a refinance a the last minute, which has now cost us a great deal of money.  So maybe it's time for YOU to BUTT OUT until you know the whole story.  I have given everything but blood to them and the only time they let me see the children is when they want money.  This is EXTREMELY  INAPPROPRIATE TO PUT THE CHILDREN IN THE MIDDLE AS PAWNS.  They are innocent and should not be punished because I won't give my daughter what she wants.
 
September 4, 2007, 3:13 pm CDT

children who rage--Sociopaths??

I recently read 'the sociopath next door' by Martha Stout, ph.d.

The Tues Sept show was shocking and thought provoking and made me think of my sister, she lives with me and my husband. My sister displays many of the conditions in the book and perhaps this 10 year old boy has been diagnost with these.

The absence of a consence, no feelings of guilt, no concern for well-being of others, friends or family. A sociopath does not struggle with shame, not one in their whole life. They have no shame about being selfish, lazy, harmful or immoral. The concept of responsibity is unknown and they don't mind being a burden. Others are just gullable fools. Add now a strange fantasy that your psychological makeup is radicaly different from other people. They seem to have ice water in their veins. You are just an 'it' and they seldom consider your condition. They have no internal restraints. These are but a few 'symptoms' of a sociopath. More frightening is that perhaps as many as 1in25 people are sociopaths. Sociopaths can become Psycopaths as well. That is not always the case. do you know anyone that has this cool unaware of others persona?  My sister IS this type person. She had 5 cats, feeds when she feels like it, now 4 cats as one die at the Vets with extreme kidney failure. My sister just called the vet and said 'well just put her down and I will come by later to pick 'it' up. She sleeps an enormous amount of day time and stays up all night. Her secretism borders on paranoia. I am not sure she can/or won't move out of my home where she has been for the past 10 years.  Linda .

 
September 5, 2007, 3:22 am CDT

Marriage Originally Was ...

                                Marriage Originally Was ...

 

Marriage today involves a piece of paper a (Marriage License) that a Government deems solidification of a Marriage, along with various types of celebrations.

 

I have searched on the subject  of the Origin Of Marriage. We can not argue with our human history.

 

A Marriage originally was made with a Gentleman presenting a well prepared Marriage Contract to a Discreet Lady. Once signed she was bound to the Marriage Contract for life.

 

Marriage Contracts were a legal and binding document.

 

Also written on a Marriage Contract could be important life sustaining necessities such as Houses, Lands, Money and many other things given to the Married Couple.

 

The couple had no romance, that could have come later during the Marriage. They most likely didn't know each well either.

 

Girls grew up dreaming of their Wedding Day and grew up wanting to be Married.

A Marriage Contract  was very important to a Woman of the time. It meant security for life.

A Marriage Contract charged the Woman to only have sex with her Husband the rest of her life.

 

Today's Marriages have their roots in the Marriage Contract.

 

History presents the Reason why Men came up with Marriage Contracts.

 

At this juncture in our history unfortunately work for Women was sparse. Women were extremely promiscuous (as an avenue of survival). Promiscuous Women utilized their Private Parts as Bargaining Units with Men in order to get or to take money, food, clothing, temporary logging from the Men of that time.

 

I'm sure you clearly see why a Marriage Contract was developed by Men. I'm also sure you can see that, if it weren't for the Marriage Contract created by Men, there would have been no such item as Marriage Certificates today.

 

Hence the Marriage Contract taught Women to be Self-Controlled. The Marriage Contract contended that Women by Law were to be Sexually Exclusive to her Husband only for life.

 

One last item, it was Women who brought the Notion of Romantic Love into Relationships.

 

If you do not believe this, than I insist you do some research into the Origin of Marriage.

 

This is written for information purposes.

This is Not written as an attack or as a personal attack on either Gender.

This was written to share with good people.

This was written to stimulate positive conversations and discussions.

 

Respectfully yours- Hollywood777

 
September 5, 2007, 3:16 pm CDT

09/07 Kids Caught in the Middle

Quote From: hollywood777

                                Marriage Originally Was ...

 

Marriage today involves a piece of paper a (Marriage License) that a Government deems solidification of a Marriage, along with various types of celebrations.

 

I have searched on the subject  of the Origin Of Marriage. We can not argue with our human history.

 

A Marriage originally was made with a Gentleman presenting a well prepared Marriage Contract to a Discreet Lady. Once signed she was bound to the Marriage Contract for life.

 

Marriage Contracts were a legal and binding document.

 

Also written on a Marriage Contract could be important life sustaining necessities such as Houses, Lands, Money and many other things given to the Married Couple.

 

The couple had no romance, that could have come later during the Marriage. They most likely didn't know each well either.

 

Girls grew up dreaming of their Wedding Day and grew up wanting to be Married.

A Marriage Contract  was very important to a Woman of the time. It meant security for life.

A Marriage Contract charged the Woman to only have sex with her Husband the rest of her life.

 

Today's Marriages have their roots in the Marriage Contract.

 

History presents the Reason why Men came up with Marriage Contracts.

 

At this juncture in our history unfortunately work for Women was sparse. Women were extremely promiscuous (as an avenue of survival). Promiscuous Women utilized their Private Parts as Bargaining Units with Men in order to get or to take money, food, clothing, temporary logging from the Men of that time.

 

I'm sure you clearly see why a Marriage Contract was developed by Men. I'm also sure you can see that, if it weren't for the Marriage Contract created by Men, there would have been no such item as Marriage Certificates today.

 

Hence the Marriage Contract taught Women to be Self-Controlled. The Marriage Contract contended that Women by Law were to be Sexually Exclusive to her Husband only for life.

 

One last item, it was Women who brought the Notion of Romantic Love into Relationships.

 

If you do not believe this, than I insist you do some research into the Origin of Marriage.

 

This is written for information purposes.

This is Not written as an attack or as a personal attack on either Gender.

This was written to share with good people.

This was written to stimulate positive conversations and discussions.

 

Respectfully yours- Hollywood777

Here, in the rural South, there seem to be plenty of  women still using their private parts as a bargaining chip. If for nothing other than room and board. That, IMO, is behind many temporary live-in arrangements.

 
September 5, 2007, 8:15 pm CDT

My parents were divorced

Quote From: bridgetteknox

My oldest Children saw their dad in 2004.  Before that he hadn't seen them since 2001 when our 3rd child had just turned 1.   Now my son is 7 he hasn't seen him since.  My 7 year old doesn't even know him.  When my two oldest 15 and 13 saw him in 2004  He came up and gave them a hand shake said hi and walked away.  My brother asked him why haven't you seen the kids.  He said his wife wouldn't allow it,  he married her so he would have a place to stay, and she would put him out if she knew he was over seeing the kids.  He has a daughter he had I think in 1996, and she misses seeing her brothers and sisters.  He has an older daughter, she just turned 18 and he has cut her off.  He didn't even go to her graduation.  She keeps in contact with my kids.  I think it is really pathetic when someone can come along and mess up a relationship between a man and his kids.  She knew when she met him he had kids.  If she couldn't handle it then she should have went on her way.  They were there before her, they are kids.  My children get straight A's in school.  They are active in band.  He is really missing out.  One day he will need them before they need him.  I teach them to keep going and make something of themselves.  Whatever decision you make in the future regarding your relationship with him is up to you.  They are sick of missed birthdays, Christmas, band concerts and even surgeries he didn't even show up for.  My daughter has already received a full scholarship to a University and she is just in the 10th grade.  They see me working hard to support everything they do and take care of their needs.  I am always going to be their positive role model.

What you say here could almost mirror my family.  I had no respect at all for my father, and all the respect and admiration in the world for my mother. She held the family together and was our moral compass. She treated folks with honesty and respect, and was respected by others in return. Dad was a joke. He was an alcoholic, a gambler, and couldn't hold a job. While he didn't physically abuse us or our mom, he would argue with mom a lot. I suppose you could say he abused us in that he didn't fulfill his obligations as father and head of the household. He didn't teach us work ethics or good manners. Mom did. At least it wasn't a messy fight. There were no court battles over anything, including child custody, and my sister and I never felt it was our fault. We were just glad when dad left the household since that ended the fights between our parents. But my sister and I never married, which we both blame on our parents' divorce.
 
September 6, 2007, 12:36 am CDT

bully bruce

hi Dr. Phil

 

i think Bruce really needs ur help he should feel grateful that he came to you and u accepted him and his problem.

 

Bruce you really need to get over what ever you think will do good to your children. you are not helping them but destroying them.

 

in some way at some time, they will wonder what kind of a father you have been, just when you get to dissapoint or even fail them.

 

and one other thing that woman is your WIFE,  you need to show her respect so that your siblings can do the same. remember, she too can turn your children against you, its just that she knows its not a good thing. not for anyone.

 

THANK YOU SO MUCH DR. PHIL YOU DOING A GREAT JOB, GOD BLESS YOU!

 
September 6, 2007, 6:00 am CDT

using children in a divorce

Quote From: bagle1979

i think that people should not be abuse children at all because it is not right for then to so that at all to them that makes it not ok for them because i had to happen to me and i have to pay for it the rest of my life and i seen happen to kides i think partents should not do that to children at all. that is my throught on it and they should not have children if they are abusive towards them selfs that my story and it is not right for a child to go through it at all

When my husband and I decided to separate and then get a divorce, we both knew we would always be parents to both our children and to any grandchildren we would have in the future.  We talk more now than when we were married and get along just fine.  I travel quite a bit and when I am in town, I go over and cook just so I can spend time with my son and my daughter.  I call my ex-husband if I haven't heard from my children in a few  days and he keeps me informed.  Since we were married and his family was my family and vice versa, we update each other on how other family members are doing.

I wouldn't have it any other way.  Life is too precious and children are a gift to be treasured.  Both of my children understand and have no problem at all with how we have handled this situation.

 

 
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