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Topic : 01/25 Secrets in the Suburbs

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Created on : Saturday, September 29, 2007, 09:23:47 am
Author : DrPhilBoard1
How well do you think you know your neighbors, your friends and even your child's teacher? It is estimated that four to eight million people in North America are swinging in the suburbs -- mostly middle-class folks from all walks of life. Dr. Phil gives you a closer look at who these couples are who engage in sex with other twosomes. First up, Nita and Walter have been swinging for the last 12 years. They say they are happy in the lifestyle, so why does it cause tension in their relationship? Then, Brent says he has a strong yearning for he and his wife, Renee, to participate in a threesome. Renee says the idea disgusts her, but worries that if she refuses to join in, Brent will leave her. They fight constantly, often dragging their 17-year-old son into the middle of their chaos. Brent says he thinks about having threesomes every other day, but says that his desire is normal. What does Dr. Phil think? And, Dr. Phil viewers weigh in and share their thoughts about the swinging lifestyle. Join the discussion.

Find out what happened on the show.

As of January, 2009, this message board will become "Read Only" and will be closed to further posting. Please join the NEW Dr. Phil Community to continue your discussions, personalize your message board experience, start a blog and meet new friends.

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January 31, 2008, 5:17 am PST

01/25 Secrets in the Suburbs

Quote From: playfullcouple

Happy to give you all the info I can.

 

A liquore license has diferent laws in every city in Canada.  Some cities require you sell liquore and no byob allowed, our city says that if there is any nudity that there can be no sold booze, only what they bring.  it is a tricky thing and often cities change their laws to make it difficult for private social clubs, which is how we are licesed and zoned.

 

As far as people o ntheir best behavoir becasue of their spouses being there, that is swinging, couples, always.  Singles are not consider swingers, they are considered players and singles.  Single people try to have as much sex as possible with who ever they can.  We never allow single men to our club, and that is the case with most clubs.  we do allow single girls becasue they are so far and few between and they are way more respecful then single guys.  If you want to call a single guy a swinger, then every single guy every where would fall into that catagory and any bar where single men are would be a swingers bar to them.  tell me one singlr guy that would say no to sex in any form!  LOL.

 

So, to be clear, swingers is plural meaning that there must be two or more.  couples are swingers, very very few swingers consider single men swingers or play with them.  LAst count, less then 2%.    those two guys that treid to ask you to jioin, are single men trying to get laid.  If you would like to discuss swinging and what it can offer to a singlelady, we would be happy to talk to you as respectful adults that are true swingers.  We know and see about 8 single girls.  That is becasue we respect them, don't push them and listen to their needs.  2/3 of those girls don't sleep with us, because that is not there needs.  so you see, it isn't about sex, it is about friendship, respect and recreation, Sex is not always the end goal.  we have dozens of friends, but only play with 2 or 3 coupls and one girl. 

 

Respect is the most typical and single guys are almost never seen.  If they do act up at a club, then they are asked to leave right now, no second chances are given to anyone ever, couples included and that is made clear the first 5 min hey are at the club.  When you meet on line, people have to sceen their own people.  Some enjoy that as , like you, clubs of any type are not for them.  They prefer a game of pool or darts or coffee and a movie.  Dinner and movies are very very common first dates...lol..for lack of a better term.  wee have done that very regularly.

 

the clubs work well, becasue it is a safe enviroment for those of us that liek the socail aspect of going pout buy ahte the mains stream clubs.  We choose our own music with a juke box, we all bring food and we all get along.  Picture a house party with a dance floor.  Much the same, and no neighbors to wake up as we are all in industrial ares with no night trafic for security and descretion.

 

Also, most of our members all drive new cars and high ticket cars.  Swigning is not cheap, becasue you are so social and go out a lot.  My wife and I are out about 2X a week.  Out kids are just at the age to baby sit and love it whe ntyhe girls can watch their brother.  They get paid and have a night to them selves to watch a movie and stay up late.  when we don't go out, they ask if they did someting wrong...lol.  Now the parent bashers out htere will sy we are bad paernts to leavce our kids alone, but otehr then work and school, every night we are together.  My kids are never on a team I don't coach and we are part of the PTA.  We have never missed a single school play or band recital.  we always take them to school and walk them  home with their friends.  If they have friends around, it is at our house.  Our kids are the most importatn part of our life.

 

My wife and I were both had a first marriage and both had spouses cheat on us and both left us with the a daughter each.  When we met, we were instant family and for over 10 years, all we have done is be parents.  Now, that our kids are are old enough to be alone a bit, we are dateing and being a couple.

 

Being just parents is not healthy for the children.  We were having our troubles and not staying together as a good ouple.  We faught and rarely had sex for 6 years.  But stayed together for the kids.  I nthe last 2 years since we have worked so hard on being lovers again, the swinging thing just happened as My wife started to discuss her sexuality and being Bi.  We did not set out to swing, it found us and for over a year, we hung out with swingers and talked and we had th ebest sex of our life..>ALONE...and still do.  It prgressed with my wife having a friend to talk ato about her sexual feelings towrds same sex.

 

We have had our closest frinds and all of our family tell us that they can not believe how happy our family is thispast 18 months over the last 7 years!  Eveyone that knows us said they thought we would break up 3 years ago.  They are all surprised to see us together and so happy.  They also notice how happy our kids are.  My closest friend came to me, we have been freinds for over 25 years now, back to gradse school, and said he and his girl frind of 6 yers are having issues and he saw me work though a bad time, how did we do it.  I told him we concintrated on us and the rest feel in.  He too had a divorce and a single dad of 2 boys.  He and his girl firnd have married and now have a child and I have never seen him happier.  They go out once a week on a date and remeber to be acouple.

 

So, swingers, the people, notthe act, helped save our marriage.  And we progressed at our pase with no preasures from anyone at all.  Since this, we have bought into a club and we spend 2 hours a week saturday nights meeting new coupels and discussing the club, the lifestyle and what it can offer.  we do also touch on hte negitives, because there are negitives o nthe subject.  But the negitives and positives are both te same, they show the strengths and weaknesses of a couple.  This is not for eveyone, and we liek to point that out.

 

by the way, we are in a city of over a million peiple and we have had over 1000 couples in the past 3 years attend our club.  We have about 200 that are still active.  The averge memebr comes only once every 2 months.  we have 15 couples that are regular as in 3-4 times aever 6 weeks.  there  are 5 clubs in our city.  and over 50,000 people in the city on the Adult Friend finder web site.  So it is active, and not all use the clubs.  Also, our waiting list for interviews to attend our club is now over a month waiting period.  We interview every couple that comes in.  We do turn away about 355 of those that get to the interview stage.  We have an application form to be filled in as well.  we also do back ground checks and ID checks.

 

feel free to email me direct playfullcouple74 at hotmail.

 

We have politicians, Rotarians, Lions, and even a minister as memebers.  you would be shocked at who on your block is doing this.  Since 1 in 10 do swing or at least attend parties or clubs, or like to watch or be on display....you do know someone doing this that is close to you.

 

playfullcouple

I guess it works that way in the USA too.  As the club owners in Ohio spoke of no alcohol allowed in the nude bars.  Im still laughing over that!  Im imaging club owners whipping up a strawberry smoothie while their patrons are watching nude acts.  LOL!!!  ;)

The swinger friend of my husbands was married.  Not a single guy.  Had he been single, I wouldnt have qualified him(and his wife) as a swinger.  As it is only during this discussion that ive learned that singles can, if not often, be part of this lifestyle.

 I guess what im basically wondering is if this lifestyle doesent attract the kind of men(and women) who tend to act (when their spouses arent present) as ive experienced and other posters have.  Im POSITIVE there ARE many wonderful, respectful, kind and compassionate people involved with this!  So please dont misunderstand.  Im just curious if there isnt another side to it as well.  For instance, in the post about "100 ways to know if youre a swinger" one of the lines said "you accidentally squeeze your vanilla friends butt".  Im wondering how typical this is?    In all honesty do the swingers find this kind of thing happens often?

I agree, staying together simply for the kids sake is NOT a good idea!  Ive seen people do this and it seems to cause more harm than good.  Im glad for you and your wife that you were able to find something which helped your marriage and brought you two closer together.  Good for you!   :)

I truley dont think I would be shocked at who may be invovled with this.  I wouldnt care enough to be shocked.  LOL   As long as IM not be treated disrespectfully,  as though im some target- or someones  prey, I couldnt care less about others sex lives and personal sexual prefrences.  Do what you will but harm none is a good description of my life view. 
 
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January 31, 2008, 5:43 am PST

01/25 Secrets in the Suburbs

Quote From: tiffany_2007

I'm not assuming they do have problems, just pointing out that you shouldn't assume they don't have problems, every couple has there problems, and since you didn't know about them being swingers how can you know thy have the perfect marriage?

What does having the perfect marriage have to do with swinging?  I do know my swinging friends don't have the kind of problems that the couples on the Dr Phil show had. 

 

Do you have a perfect marriage?  Does anybody?

 

It would seem to me, though, that a relationship that allows couples to explore and indulge ALL they're sexual fantasies would probably be be relationship where the participants are predisposed to "not sweat the small stuff" what ever that may be,  in that relationship and therefore be happier individuals in that relationship.

 

One poster, a few days back, explained it really good.  It takes a certain personality to be able to "swap" and not view it as something wrong or deviant and evil.

 

A long time ago, my friends in Germany reminded me how prudent people in America are.  So, I soppose, most of what is posted on the topic doesn't surprise me.

 

 

 
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January 31, 2008, 8:34 am PST

01/25 Secrets in the Suburbs

Quote From: momisme2

A nude bar selling Jamba Juice instead of shots?? That is too funny! LOL

I would think most women who go to bars, wearing a little black dress or not, are looking to be hit on by men, no?


Yes if the girls are dancing nude all they sell is *fruit cocktail* juice in a glass, if you have a liquor lic dancers must have thong and pasties, pasties are now a thin layer of liquid latex.

 

If you wanted to dress up sexy, little black dress, just for your hubby and go out for a drink and dancing where would you go?

 

In this part of the world most bars have a theme i.e. sports, cowboy, Latino, gay, biker, dike, fern, or hotel each has it's own type of patron.

 

Most of the hotel bars here are single pick up bars and a sexy dressed woman will be hit on going to the restroom or if the hubby goes to get a drink at the bar when he comes back some single male is at his table chatting up the wife.

 

For us as a couple the cowboy bars were the worst, lots of single guys, lots of beer, lots of rude remarks.

My wife never felt comfortable there and as we were out for a night of fun for us. Same held true for the biker, gay, dike, Latino, sports bars and the common factor was drunk single guys in groups of three or more. The macho, showing off for his buddies bull.

 

Then we found the swingers bar .... all couples, wife is right there so the guys are respectful, no one thinking a dance is an acceptance of going home with them, if my wife is hit on it is by another female who is with her husband and knows that it is a couple to couple deal.

 

After going to that bar for a few years on a regular basis for our Saturday night date we ended up owning one for two years. We had lots of couples who never got into swinging who would come to our bar because on Sat. nights there were very few or no single guys. The few select single guys knew the rules of respect and that NO MEANS NO so even the non-swing couples felt safe to be playful even if it was only each other.

 
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January 31, 2008, 9:09 am PST

01/25 Secrets in the Suburbs

I guess what I'm basically wondering is if this lifestyle doesent attract the kind of men(and women) who tend to act (when their spouses arent present) as ive experienced and other posters have.  Im POSITIVE there ARE many wonderful, respectful, kind and compassionate people involved with this!  So please dont misunderstand.  Im just curious if there isnt another side to it as well.  For instance, in the post about "100 ways to know if youre a swinger" one of the lines said "you accidentally squeeze your vanilla friends butt".  Im wondering how typical this is?    In all honesty do the swingers find this kind of thing happens often?

I am not sure if I would say the lifestyle brought it about because for me it was not until we owned a swingers bar but I do find myself giving more hugs than handshakes now. I am not much of a butt squeezer and before owning the bar I was not much of a hugger. We were in the lifestyle for 15 years before we owned the bar and I guess the hugging increased a bit from the lifestyle but took a major leap after owning the bar. I also hug my wife more now.

 
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January 31, 2008, 9:16 am PST

porn = swingers

Quote From: bellaroz

regarding the swinging lifestyle;  just more evidence that the world has gone bonkers.  I agree that people who swing are immature, & have low self-esteem.  More than that I believe it is part of an ADDICTION that begins with porn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 
I have seen evidence that porn, does lead to swinging, when the person gets addicted to sex.  No judgements, we all have our vices.  It is not natural on any level.  However, we do what we learn, and WE DO BETTER, WHEN WE KNOW BETTER.
 
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January 31, 2008, 9:36 am PST

OMG!

Quote From: alabamacouple

 

1. You are wearing wristbands in most of your vacation photos.
2. Half of the numbers on your cellphone are listed only by screen names.
3. You are running out of reasons to tell your coworkers why you can't go out with them this weekend.
4. You have over 100,000 frequent flyer miles on Air Jamaica.
5. You know most of your friends' names only as couples (Rich and Joy, Frank and Jen) but you don't know their last names.
6. You go to a convention with three huge suitcases, yet are wearing the same outfit when you return as you did when you left.
7. You had already seen pictures of your friends naked before you ever met them in person.
8. You position the computer screen in your home office in such a way that your children can't possibly sneak up on you.
9. You can't remember the last time you had pubic hair.
10. Before traveling somewhere on business or to visit relatives you look up couples in the area.
11. You worry about explaining to the neighbors why 10 couples show up on a Saturday night carrying over night bags and don't leave until Sunday afternoon...
12. You never open your garage door until you're in the car with the doors closed.
13. Your gynecologist wonders why you're asking for birth control when he knows that your husband has had a vasectomy.
14. Your hot tub has never had a bathing suit worn in it.
15. Your sex toy collection costs more than your china set.
16. Your wife has a shirt that says: "I Like Girls Too."
17. You have a strippers pole in the middle of your den.
18. You giggle at the golf course when someone asks if they can join your foursome.
19. The last thing you typically do at a party is search for your wife's thong.
20. You've hugged your friends goodnight while naked.
21. You hear the word "Playmate" and your first thought is not "Playboy"
22. The word "slut" has become a term of endearment.
23. You carry lube as often as lipstick.
24. Your choice in new carpeting is heavily based on which type won't give you rug burns.
25. You've taken your Liberator with you to a dinner party.
26. The term Vanilla isn't just a flavor to you anymore.
27. You have a full-length mirror in your bedroom... On your ceiling.
28. You are constantly encouraging your kids to spend the weekend at friends' houses.
29. You don't think twice about wearing a short skirt, high heels and fishnets when there is three feet of snow on the ground.
30. Your wedding reception has an after party.
31. You go to Las Vegas, but never gamble or leave the hotel.
32. You panic when your friend's digital camera goes missing.
33. You've invited friends over and watched porn.
34. You've invited friends over and made porn.
35. You've watched someone do a tequila shot off of your wife's bare ass.
36. Your friends know what brand of condom you prefer.
37. You wake up in the morning and find that half of the cloths on the floor don't fit you or your wife.
38. Your kids think it's normal for adults to have sleepovers.
39. A hot tub is considered a necessity not a luxury.
40. You believe in Unicorns... Because you've actually ridden one.
41. You leave the kids at home when you go to the toy store.
42. You've taken photos of yourself with your head out of frame; And it was on purpose.
43. You can't decide which of your three naughty schoolgirl outfits you should wear this weekend.
44. You always keep a supply of condoms, lube and clean hand towels by your bed... And your guest bed... And your couch in the living room.
45. The employees fight to take your order at the One Hour Photo.
46. You frequently use the term "Friends of friends" when explaining how you know certain people.
47. You know which of your outfits looks best under a black light.
48. You have an entire closet devoted just to themed outfits.
49. You place a want ad that reads: "Wanted: Reliable babysitter who is willing to stay till sunrise and doesn't ask any questions."
50. You ask the sales man at the furniture store which type of upholstery best repels semen stains.
51. The staff of Hedonism III sends you birthday cards.
52. You come home with that, "There's Something About Mary" hairstyle.
53. The babysitter wonders why you are always already wearing your full-length coat when she arrives.
54. In the gym shower you're the only guy with shaved balls.
55. You know the most flattering angle at which to photograph your genitals.
56. Half of your vacation photos were taken in your hotel room.
57. You have a free place to stay in almost all the fifty states and several cities in Europe.
58. You've closed your e-mails with "Bi Bi".
59. You can expertly identify the tactile differences between every type of breast implant ever created.
60. On Christmas, there are certain presents that can't be opened in front of your family.
61. You know exactly which of your friends are allergic to latex.
62. Your vanilla friends ask why they are never invited to your parties.
63. The movie "Swingers" was a huge disappointment to you.
64. It's an unwritten law that you can't call any of your friends on Saturday or Sunday until at least 3 p.m. so you don't wake them up.
65. You've become especially good at operating your digital camera with one hand.
66. At your "normal" parties no one can go into the basement because you're afraid someone will notice the sex-swing.
67. You're constantly afraid that visiting relatives will pop-in one of your home videos that you forgot to hide.
68. You make bets with other swinger friends about how long it will take to corrupt your cute vanilla girlfriend.
69. You're in a public place and you swear you hear someone shout your screen name.
70. Before introducing them to your visiting family, you pull your friends aside and say, "OK, here's how we know each other..."
71. You start having withdrawals after two days without internet access.
72. When someone asks where you're staying on your trip to Cancun, you pretend that you can't remember the name of the resort.
73. You ask a girlfriend to teach you: "That thing you do with your tongue that my husband enjoys so much."
74. In the middle of sex with your spouse, you ask someone else to take over for a minute while you go to the restroom.
75. You are more concerned about a pimple on your privates than on your face.
76. You come back from vacation and you have a tan, but no tan lines.
77. The first thing you do checking into a hotel is to ask for a lot of extra towels.
78. All the men bring their wives to your bachelor party.
79. Making it an early night means getting home before 3 a.m.
80. You've handed out business cards to people, but the cards have nothing to do with your occupation.
81. Your sexual fantasies never last very long... Because they keep coming true!
82. You are hanging around vanilla friends and you absentmindedly squeeze their butts.
83. You erase your computer's browser history and cache every time you leave your office.
84. You buy lap dances for your wife... And vice versa.
85. You own a double-headed dildo.
86. You're still smiling on Monday morning about something you did on Saturday night.
87. You're at the market, and the only things in your basket are condoms, breath mints and Red Bull.
88. On vacation you set aside time to stage a bunch of photos that are acceptable to show to your family.
89. After 25 years, people still ask if you're newlyweds.
90. You've had sex with more people since you've been married than you did when you were single.
91. Going to vanilla bars ranks right up there with a root canal.
92. The only time you go out with your vanilla friends is when you're on your period.
93. Your husband has lipstick on his collar and he smells like another woman's perfume and it brings a smile to your face.
94. On Monday morning you are glad to go back to work so you can get some rest.
95. You spend the whole week before your parents arrive calling all you friends telling them not to call your answering machine while your parents are in town.
96. You get really tired of not making it to McDonalds before they quit serving breakfast Sunday morning (on your way home).
97. You have an entire external hard-drive devoted to nothing but your party photos.
98. You spouse is having an orgasm, while you are busy in the other room discussing the stock market.
99. You spent twice as long on your online profile than you did on your resume.
100. If you are reading this and laughing because many of these describe you...

That's a pretty good sign that you are a swinger!
I am laughing so hard I can barely breathe!!!!!  LOL
 
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January 31, 2008, 11:15 am PST

secrets in the suburbs

Quote From: cfnamier

I always love it when swinging comes up as a topic.

 

My wife of 33 years and I have been together since 1968, we work together owning two small businesses, we do lots of volunteer work, and on Saturday nights we go out for our date night.

 

We go to our local swingers bar to dance with each other and other couples we know, we have sexy fun, we flirt, we laugh, we have a ball. About one time every two months we have such a great time with another couple we go to either our house or theirs and play sexy games, strip poker, naked twister or the like.

We have sex, it is just an extension of the fun we have.

 

Before i get blasted for being controlling in any way, I certainly do not force her to do anything. She likes to dress sexy and she loves to flirt, I don't have any problem with her doing so. She was beautiful and sexy when we started dating and she is beautiful and sexy today.

I'm really happy to see that the lifestyle has treated you and your spouse well! Good for you two!!!!

 

open minded 1965

 
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January 31, 2008, 11:16 am PST

01/25 Secrets in the Suburbs

Quote From: farmgirl7

I have seen evidence that porn, does lead to swinging, when the person gets addicted to sex.  No judgements, we all have our vices.  It is not natural on any level.  However, we do what we learn, and WE DO BETTER, WHEN WE KNOW BETTER.
I'm curious what you mean by "evidence".  Do you mean something you have witness within your life or some kind of case study?  I haven't seen anything but that doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.
 
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January 31, 2008, 12:29 pm PST

01/25 Secrets in the Suburbs

Quote From: nikkiciao

No one can sit  and say it doesn't  ever  run through their mind what it would be like to enjoy the company of someone else other than your mate?  Actually to swing you have to be extremely confident and sure of yourself.  As much as people don't like to admit... we are sexual beings ....meaning we can feel, touch and smell with our bodies and actually enjoy it.  Sometimes we like variety and different experiences and yes that includes sexually.  So to be confident with your sexuality means not to be afraid of your feelings and thoughts..and yes desires.....

I have got a question for you people.  Do you think about your after life?? Do you consider what morals are? Do you consider what the Bible says about adultery. which this is.. 1 Corinthians 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, not idolaters, nor ADULTERERS, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind. 1 Cor 6:10 Nor thieves, nor

covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. Just curious if ever a thought is given to where your soul will spend eternity???

 
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January 31, 2008, 1:18 pm PST

01/25 Secrets in the Suburbs

Quote From: jfergie2

I have got a question for you people.  Do you think about your after life?? Do you consider what morals are? Do you consider what the Bible says about adultery. which this is.. 1 Corinthians 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, not idolaters, nor ADULTERERS, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind. 1 Cor 6:10 Nor thieves, nor

covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. Just curious if ever a thought is given to where your soul will spend eternity???

Either God will forgive me my sins or he will punish me for them ..... His choice

 

I figure I have either already damned myself or I haven't .... His choice

 

My choice is to be a swinger and enjoy sex, I haven't killed anyone and I love my wife and kids

 
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