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Topic : 10/12 Homecoming Shooting

Number of Replies: 468
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Created on : Wednesday, October 10, 2007, 10:58:52 am
Author : DrPhilBoard1
Early Sunday morning in Crandon, a small Wisconsin logging town, 20-year-old deputy sheriff Tyler Peterson went on a shooting rampage killing six people and critically wounding another before authorities fatally shot him. A part-time police officer, Peterson fired thirty rounds of ammunition on his ex-girlfriend and a group of friends who had gathered for pizza and movies to celebrate homecoming weekend. Who was Tyler Peterson, and what drove him to murder six people in cold blood? What is the profile of a mass murderer, and does he fit the description? How could Peterson have slipped through the system to become a law enforcement officer, and how do we keep it from happening again? Every day, more than 80 Americans die from gun violence.* From the 1999 Columbine massacre to the nation's deadliest shooting rampage in history at Virginia Tech last April, mass shootings in America continue to draw world scrutiny. Be there when Dr. Phil asks the tough questions. If it's happening now, Dr. Phil is gonna talk about it now! Share your thoughts, join the discussion.

Find out what happened on the show.

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October 15, 2007, 4:59 pm CDT

Talk about violence in the culture

We are ignoring the most important part of these shootings. These are boys and we are excepting violence from males as the norm. I watched a great documentary in college that looked at the culture of our society. It particularly pointed to what stands out is what we think of as abnormal. Women who are violent stand out. We talk about them constantly. But these school shootings are all boys. Why aren't we talking about that? Why aren't we talking about all the messages within our society that equates violence with manliness? We need to start addressing the idea of men and violence being normal.
 
October 15, 2007, 6:26 pm CDT

You cut the Lady Profiler off

My wife and I just finished watching the show on the high school shootings.  The Lady Profiler wanted to discuss one of the main issues about what made this idea of killing OK, but you kept cutting her off.  She mentioned that 20-30 years ago this wasnt happening and what has happened to America during that time span but you kept going onto different topics.  You didnt seem like you wanted to get at the root cause but only what can we do to protect ourselves today.  That is important but unless we can get to the bottom we arent going to stop or even slow it down and we will end up living in a state of paranoia.  I would encourage you to visit Ravi Zacharias website at www.rzim.org and click on "radio" then click on the mp3 link by "Let my people think" and then listen to his 3 part series on "The Search for Absolutes in a Pluralistic Society". Ravi is a christian apologetics and philsopher and has some very compelling ideas on secularization, pluralization and privatization.
 
October 15, 2007, 9:35 pm CDT

mechanical object incapable of any action

Quote From: flyrod13

First of all, I want to thank Dr Phill and his staff from not allowing the show to degrade into a 'blame the gun' thing.  A gun, like an automobile, is a mechanical object, incapable of any action without human intervention.  So, shootings of any kind are the result of the action of a person, a human, and the show focused on that FACT.  Good Job!  One of the guests did begin spouting numbers involving guns, but was washed over by more focused attention.  The whole gun thing boils down to education.  It is a Proven fact that 'Bans' on things do not work.  Bans on Alcohol, Drugs, and Prostitution, come to mind.  Just think of the education and councelling on the misuse of drugs could be put in place with just a fraction ot the money spent on so-called drug enforcement.  As for shootings in schools; proper education in the use and dangers of fire arms would go a long way to end it.  Also, concealed carry of weapons (CCW) by school officials willing to do so, would simply put an end to this nonsense.  Consider the Swiss where almost every house has a gun.  No public shootings there.  Common sense says do not mess with him/them, they have a gun!  FBI crime number clearly show that states that have on-demand, CCW laws have significantly lower crime rates that those that don't.   I could go on, but I suggest you read the book 'More Guns, Less Crime'.  His base is the huge number of cases where the bad guy finds himself looking down the barrel of the victim's gun and wisely flees.  These cases Never make the evening news or the print, but do happen.  AS Jack Webb like to say : Just the facts.....

 

Flyrod 

True, true!

 

Thank you for your post and opinion!

 
October 16, 2007, 5:53 am CDT

10/12 Homecoming Shooting

We have children in our society that no one knows what to do with. This is happening at our schools because that's where the kids feel so wronged. It's their place to socialize and connect with the world. But it's not always a positive things. Some children can't connect. They can't fit in. They feel like outcasts. It will only help to breed these kids of situations and for whatever reasons, the schools aren't getting it. I know they're not psychiatrists, but there are times when listening to the kid's parents doesn't go along with their plan. With the makeup of our society changing, they need to make some changes and become flexible enough to meet these kid's needs. The problem we're having getting an appropriate placement for our son may have been resolved with a Supreme Court ruling on 10-10-07 that just came to my attention. Our son is diagnosed Bipolar and Asperger Syndrome. Asperger Syndrome is an Autism Spectrum Disorder. The court ruling was in a case filed by a parent on behalf of their son in New York. The decision stated that parents do have the right to challenge school IEP's if they are demonstrably inappropriate for their child. This will require schools to either write an appropriate IEP for the child or pay for private schooling without having to "try out" the school's IEP first. This is the battle we've been having so hopefully we can begin to make some headway with them now. When children are in a regular education setting and they cannot process the world around them as the other children do, they are in the wrong setting. That can only serve to lower their self esteem, especially as they get older and begin to realize they are different from the other kids. Depression is a part of both Asperger's and Bipolar. Stress is not a good thing for these children. With 1 in ever 150 children diagnosed with some form of Autism Spectrum Disorder, the schools need to become more sensitive. With Aspergers, these kids do not connect with others in a normal way. Other children are more like objects than playmates. They cannot read social cues to know what is appropriate. They can only judge things by what they know, what they are going through or what they have been through. They cannot predict outcomes if they haven't experienced it before. They are compulsive at times. And often, as our son puts it, even if he knows he's not supposed to do something, he still does it at times, "if his minds tells him it's ok". I told him one day he's getting older, he needs to start trying to change some of that thinking and start trying to follow the rules we put in place because they are there to help protect him. His response was, "I like the way I think." These are the children who are being overlooked, and more so if the parents have the kids where they behave well outwardly at school. On the surface they may look like everything is all right, but inwardly, it may not be. If the adults around him aren't in tune with that, then it can snowball rapidly, especially if it slips into the mania part of the Bipolar Disorder. Mania feels good to him. He can feed himself with a false sense of self importance that, in his mind, raises him above all others around him. Feeling superior feels good, even if it's short lived. With so many children with these types of disorders, the educational system needs to impliment some changes. If not, more and more of these children are going to grow up with a feeling of hopelessness and despair. Could these children be in part what we are dealing with in our society? I can't say for sure, but I can see that how that level of depression and feeling like they are different, and that their very best attempts are inadequate, could spawn an individual who would throw up their hands and say "I give up". Are these the ones who get up one day and decide to go out hunting humans? I think we all need to start fighting for these kids' rights. It's not just our son, it's 1 in every 150. The eduactional departments need to start helping instead of turning a blind eye. It's hard to get them interested in letting you help in school with the kids when they think you are the enemy because you tell them they are wrong about your child's needs; but they think that they know him better than we do. It's so frustrating. It's not just for me and mine. We all need to see and begin to understand what is going on. Our kids are all going to live in this world together when we are gone. They need us to help them prepare for that at every level. With the Autism rate alone being 1 in 150, it's a good place to start because these children do not see the world around them as we do. They do not process things as we do. They can be taught some life skills that will help but everyone has to be on the same page and be consistent to help the child understand it. Left to themselves, these children are perfectly happy just the way things are. And if we do nothing to try to help them, what happens when they are grown? I'm not trying to rail on the schools, but it's time for change if we're going to make this better. I'm praying that we can. and, by the way, guns are the end results, not the main issues. Yammering about guns won't change what's building inside these children. That's what we need to figure out how to do something about.
 
October 16, 2007, 8:55 am CDT

Thanks Readmore

Quote From: readmore

Intelligent and concerned parents LIKE YOU will make our schools SAFER. Thank you so much for caring.

 

My high school has a police officer on campus, daily.  Some schools have metal detectors at their entrances.  Schools discuss RESPECT; but  these measures will NEVER totally eradicate violence.

 

We still have fights, knives, guns in backpacks, and other problems. Why?

Because anger is secretive, until it explodes.  Then we call for help!  It is sad when it comes too late.

 

I did not wait for the school board to figure this out. I acted responsibly to protect  my students and myself when I decided to keep my door LOCKED when class is in session.  I have had no kids killed in my room.

 

I took IMMEDIATE STEPS to be PRO-ACTIVE.  I could PREVENT an armed intruder! 

 

I told my students that I have a covenant with their parents:  to keep you safe on my watch.

This is such a small but critically important thing to do.  INSIST YOUR SCHOOL TEACHERS DO THIS!

 

What you can do at home: 

 

1.  Talk with your kids NOW about these current events.  THEY WANT TO BE HEARD.

2.  ASK them what THEY think we should do.  They have great insight for dealing with other kids.

3. KNOW your own kids.  What is going on in their lives?  Their rooms?  Their friendships?

4.  BE PART OF YOUR KIDS' LIVES by spending time DOING THINGS TOGETHER!

  (Gangs and boyfriends and pregnancies happen because kids are lonely and need to belong.)

5.  BE INTERESTED, not controlling and authoritarian.  They want loving parents, not wardens!

 

IF YOU OWN GUNS, decide NOW to be responsible owners.  Are they LOCKED UP?

Is ammunition LOCKED in a separate area?  Or are guns some stupid, "macho" display?

 

MAKE SCHOOL SAFETY A PRIORITY.  Schools have thousands of kids to protect.  You do not.

Parents MUST do their part to be partnered with the school and its staff.  If you do not know what is going on with your child at school, you need to step up and be a parent.  You know your own child---or should!

 

If your student is angry, depressed, frustrated----NOTICE and ask them if they need to talk! 

 

TAKE TIME FROM YOUR HECTIC LIFE TO REALLY DEMONSTRATE LOVE FOR YOUR KIDS!

 

Talking, listening, playing together is what they are all wanting, at any age.

 

My high school students (girls and football players) hug me when they see me!  We like each other!  :)

  

Good luck with this!  Get safe practices in place----and let's keep communicating with our great kids!

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have already started implementing some of your ideas.  You are an asset to our discussion.
 
October 16, 2007, 9:36 am CDT

Families in Crandon our prayers are with you!!

First of all my thoughts and prayers go out to all who are affected by this.  I do believe that in Wisconsin they don't require a psychological examination. I think that all police officers should have this done. I live in Green Bay, Wisconsin and I think that they do a psychological exam before they hire you on as an officer.  There is to much gun violence going on now.  With the school shootings going on and Green Bay just convicting the three boys involved with East High School plot to do harm to other students.  We need to put an end to all this violence.  Some people will say that I am not being realistic but something has got to be done.  My daughter goes to East High and knowing that things could have been different if some brave student didn't turn those three in.  So my heart goes out to the families in Crandon, Wisconsin.

 

 
October 16, 2007, 9:48 am CDT

I know why people SNAP!!

I sent an email over the weekend trying to describe  the anger I felt after getting home from yet another unpleasant experience. You see, the smallest thing can bring a person to loose it completely. No one takes a minute to think that they may be dealing with someone who has gone through it maybe seconds before this person is standing in front of them. I am a 43 year old black ,American, disabled,plus size woman, now already the odds are against me but I don't allow this to stop me. I have been through so many things that the average person can not even fathom but when I have to deal with day to day situations it's always magnified 1000 times because I'm taking care of my parents as well. When I am subjected to, rude,ignorant, nasty, condescending and disrespectful individuals. Just for that second I can feel myself leave my body in order to deal with the over abundance of rage. All it takes is one word, a gesture to send a person over the edge. People who deal with the public should take 30 seconds to think before they demean, humiliate and disregard the person they're talking to and that includes family and friends.
 
October 16, 2007, 11:12 am CDT

10/12 Homecoming Shooting

Quote From: fwwright

Do these kids get these guns strictly onthier own or is it a family owned gun? If they did get it on thier own then how do they get weapons of WAR not just a hunting gun? I do not understand your logic. If the gun is not readilly available when you are in a very upset mental state then it can't be used toget rid of the frustration.
What I was trying to imply is tha the guns were all basiclly illegally obtained. For those who have the permits for the guns there needs to be more responsiblity. Lets keep them away from these kids. It's just nuts that a mentally impaired child can obtain so many high powered guns. They obviouslly didn't get them for their own protection. They got them hoping to kill their classmates and teachers. That's not why we have the right to bear arms. I get pissed off a work here and there but I'm not going to kill my coworkers! I would rather we not have that right that was when some nut looses it he/she can't go out and kill the first ten people he sees. They are readilly avalible. You can buy them on the streets. That's a huge factor in these cases. Most guns these kids get their hands on and kill other kids with most likely were bought off the street.
 
October 16, 2007, 11:13 am CDT

10/12 Homecoming Shooting

Quote From: fwwright

Do these kids get these guns strictly onthier own or is it a family owned gun? If they did get it on thier own then how do they get weapons of WAR not just a hunting gun? I do not understand your logic. If the gun is not readilly available when you are in a very upset mental state then it can't be used toget rid of the frustration.
What I was trying to imply is That the guns were all basically illegally obtained. For those who have the permits for the guns there needs to be more responsibility. Lets keep them away from these kids. It's just nuts that a mentally impaired child can obtain so many high powered guns. They obviously didn't get them for their own protection. They got them hoping to kill their classmates and teachers. That's not why we have the right to bear arms. I get pissed off a work here and there but I'm not going to kill my coworkers! I would rather we not have that right that was when some nut looses it he/she can't go out and kill the first ten people he sees. They are readily available. You can buy them on the streets. That's a huge factor in these cases. Most guns these kids get their hands on and kill other kids with most likely were bought off the street.
 
October 16, 2007, 1:44 pm CDT

BEAUTIFUL DIAGNOSIS!

Quote From: mtreewoman

After watching the show on the school shootings, I was concerned with the "answers" the "experts" came up with. A book on what to do in a crises at school is, in my opinion, like shutting the barn door after the horse has already escaped.  I believe we need to be proactive years before these kids get to the point where they are so frustrated and angry that they want to kill people.  We  adults have made so many mistakes in the last 10-15 years, and now we are starting to see the results of our stupidity.  We allow children to be disrespectful to everyone-parents, teachers, and each other with absolutely no consequences for that behavior. We have taken phys ed out of schools so kids can no longer burn off their stress and excess energy in physical excertion. Nor do we encourage physical activity outside of school. We have a society that eats mostly junk-no nutrition, just fat and sugar- filled overprocessed garbage.  Then take into account our TV programming  that is so loaded with advertising urging us to buy! buy! buy! all kinds of useless junk and worthless "foods" that a friend of mine from Russia says our TV ads remind him of how Russian propaganda was there 15 years ago, which is a scary thought.  The buy! buy! buy! mentality of TV has created a society where the majority of both parents have to work to afford the things they're talked into thinking they must have resulting in kids being left home alone, ignored and unsupervised, to watch violent, disrespectful, rude and crude TV programming, or to play violent, bloody, crude and disrespectful computer games.  Add to this the growing number of single-parent homes with no mom or no dad and kids who feel somehow it's their fault that mom or dad left. Then consider that the majority of kids I know have absolutely no responsibility around their homes--they don't have to help care for their homes, help prepare meals, work in the yard, or even make their own beds and I believe that the combination of all these things creates a society with kids completely lost, feeling useless, worthless, bored and out of control. Parents I know seem to think that their kids will just somehow pick up the things they need to learn, like self-control, responsibility, self-respect , a good work ethic, cooking, laundry, child care and everything else automatically without them having to be there to teach them these things. I believe that unless and until these basic issues are corrected, the problem with kids killing kids will continue to escalate. No handbook on how to deal with a crises in school is going to help.  The shots will have already been fired.

Thank you for an eloquent and articulate DIAGNOSIS of these INTER-RELATED SOCIAL PROBLEMS!

 

YOU gave us all the HANDBOOK, in this message, of our adult "HOMEWORK" assignment!

 

WE CAN DO THIS!    THIS IS DO-ABLE!    

 

Let's start, one day at a time, CLEANING UP OUR HOMES, literally, side-by-side with our kids!

The "chores" at hand range from housework to classwork, from work to play!

Kids need models, partners, adults to TEACH them how to clean up after themselves, be responsible, cook, clean, study, relax, play, communicate--in other words, mature into FUNCTIONING PEOPLE.

 

There was a time, in our country, when families really did share in the work, together.   WE CAN DO IT! 

 
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