Message Boards

Topic : 12/25 Parent Trap

Number of Replies: 3786
New Messages This Week: 0
Last Reply On:
Created on : Friday, October 26, 2007, 02:49:00 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

(Original Air Date: 10/29/07) Fraud. lies. conspiracy. They may sound like the latest Washington scandal, but these are allegations of exes at war over child support. Dr. Phil's guests claim they became victims of the perfect crime when they were led to believe they fathered a child that was not biologically their own and were forced to pay. First up, Enrique says he was shocked and angered to discover he was not the father of his youngest daughter, Selina, and that she was conceived during his ex-wife, Maria's, adulterous affair. Maria says he raised Selina but then abandoned her to save money. Why does Maria say Enrique's current wife is to blame for the fractured relationship? Next, 13-year-old Selina speaks one on one with Dr. Phil. Will she decide to let the man she once called Daddy back in her life? Then, Carnell Smith, who uses the online moniker, "Man4Justice," suffered a similar fate to Enrique, and but he fought and won. He says he's tired of seeing women trap men and get away with it. A heated debate ensues between him and feminist attorney, Gloria Allred, who argues that men like Enrique should continue to act as the father ... and continue paying! Talk about the show here.


Find out what happened on the show.


As of January, 2009, this message board will become "Read Only" and will be closed to further posting. Please join the NEW Dr. Phil Community to continue your discussions, personalize your message board experience, start a blog and meet new friends.

User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
October 29, 2007, 12:43 pm PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Quote From: pixie80

 This is so sad on so many levels.  It was bad enough the mother wasn't honest from the beginning & then the father had to go & add fuel to a fire, in my opinion what he did was far worse than what the mother did. because his actions resulted in the immediate life altering emotional scarring of the poor girl. I understand the chain of events that it was the mother that "started it" but he had a CHOICE & that was to cool off, blow some steam. ..think things over & rise above it & do the right thing so that this child wouldn't have to suffer ANYMORE than she was already going to be. he had a choice. & he chose to think emotionally, he rebelled. he wanted to HURT his ex & instead he used the daughter as his target little did he know what infact HE was starting.

I disagree with Gloria Allred this is infact a regular occuring issue in this country. It is sad that people just have no sense of morals anymore. its all about just getting pregnant for whatever reason & just being out right irresponsible. if it gets to be a bigger problem. .to protect men .. maybe they should institute a law where ALL WOMEN have to go under paternity testing of who they think are the fathers of their children, its easy.. it would either be a few guys or just "the one" & also think with such a law women would be more inclined to use birth control or how about just "waiting" I do agree with the men side of this that at some point they should not be held accountable if they have been victimized. on the other hand, if the said father has greatly bonded with the said child. . then to me that puts a different light on the situation. because then it goes beyond child support. then it becomes the emotional & mental well being of the said child. I think in cases like this the men should be free & clear to not pay child support anymore HOWEVER it would need to be made clear to them that they do have an emotional responsibility to the child because that child is attacthed to that man. so..  maybe no child support but with continued visitation. but then you have the dad's that did the un think able like in this case where he takes the child to a park & tells all. like she has any control over any of it. she didn't ask to be born she didn't get to pick her parents. as far as I am concerned maybe he should pay child support. . but instead .... call it "Pain & suffering" for what he has put that little girl through for no good reason other than an attempt to hurt his ex. & it has now had a dominoe effect his own blook daughter doesn't want much to do with him. Can you blame her! thats her little sister. REGARDLESS of whos is mommy or daddy. I don't blame her. he's lucky I am not his daughter, he thinks he hurt my sister. .. .let me tell you. . he would have LOST ALL relationships with ALL kids. How 'bout them apples. this just burns me up how the kids got the worst of it. & all they want to do is argue over a lousy couple of hundred dollars a month. lets see. .  ."childs life" Vs "Money"  hmm. .. "God/God's child vs. money"   & his little attack on his ex. . christianly speaking. . . .. .We ALL SIN. & ALL sins are equal in the eyes of God. she may have committed adultrey & lied, but EVERYONE breaks one or more commandment EVERYDAY. .we all do. .... .even HIM. . .  he aint no Angel either I am sure. "He who hath not sinned cast the first stone" he may not ever committed adultrey but I am sure he "sins" in other ways & that is as equal as whatever sins she has committed. & I am sure there is not a day goes by she is asking God for forgiveness, as so should HE. . doing what he did do his said daughter. he's one to talk. anyway. .. . .I am done there is no real solution to this. not unless they implement laws that protect men. but in the eyes of the law it is not about the men or women it is about the best interest of the child.

SO WHY DOES ENRIQUE HAVE TO PAY FOR MARIAS SINS?  IM SURE HE ACTED OUT OF PAINFUL EMOTIONS, BUT I BELIEVE EACH PERSON WILL BE JUDGED FOR THE SINS THEY HAVE COMMITED NOT BY THE SINS OTHERS COMMITTED  IM SURE ENRIQUE IS HURT TOO AND NEEDS TIME TO HEAL AS WELL AS SELINA. 

 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
frustrated
October 29, 2007, 12:47 pm PDT

Maria Gives Women A Bad Name

 It's women like Maria that gives good women like myself a very nasty name ..... she knew from the start  that this child wasn't his ... but the real father did not want Maria  .... cause he did not loved her or even care for her ... if she knows who the father is .... thats very ignorance ... now the husband he is the victim and the daughter .... he should stay in her life cause she is all he knows ...... he should not paid any child support ... and the law should back him up  ....

 

cause he is not this child father ... he should get into her life ..... cause .... my step dad left me when I was ten years old .....cause he and my mom could not get along ....it cause me to get into a lot of bad relationship .......and bad friends .....I am now in therapy and doing well ....I am not in a relationship .....cause I know I am not ready .....if he could get this message .....I would beg him .....PLEASE!! ... PLEASE!!..... get into her life .....take the baby step .....tell her that its not her fault ....

 

and you did a wrong thing to leave her ......but its was her mom that you was leaving ..... and that you and her are the victims.... and I hope you and your daughter will start a brand new life together....... cause its some very bad men out here ......and you don't want your daughter to act on her pain with these kind of men..... take it from me .....I hope you ,, the husband,, don't have to pay child support  .....and that ,you, the husband, should get her (Maria)  to pay it all back to you ... the law sucks but it really needs to change .... people like her (Maria) should go to prison for being a fraud 

 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
October 29, 2007, 12:48 pm PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Quote From: sgrodgers

Hello I too think that it is selfish to hide something so important as paternity.  Our non bio child has a series of health issues, and this was one thing that alerted her father that she may not be his.  None of the problems she was experiencing was coming from him and the mother said it was him not her.

 

Bottom line, the lie will never get better even with everyone trying to hide the truth.  As the word says the truth will set you free.

 

God Bless!

Hello! I am so sorry you have had to go through this. Your story was so similar to what my boyfriend is going through with his non-biological daughter. He married a pregnant woman, whom he loved very much at the time, took on the baby as his own, never knew who the biological father was for years. The woman had told him she was raped. He and this woman got divorced after 6 years, he paid child support and got his visitations, but not without a fight.

 I started dating this man 5 years ago, and  one of the first things he told me was this part of his life. I told him he needed to tell his 20 something daughter the truth before she found out from someone else. He said he and his ex had discussed this when the baby was born and they had decided that when the time was right, they would sit her down and tell them together. Well, prior to moving back here, from her mother, to find work, 5 years ago, the daughter called and asked her dad if what she found in some papers of her mothers was true, that he was not her biological dad after all. He told her that it was true and that he wanted them to sit down when she got back here and discuss it all. Well, she came back here and they had a talk. She was and still is very hurt by it all. The mother has not told her the truth that she was not born out of rape. The mother is taking the victim stance. It breaks my heart that her mother had something written down somewhere for her to find out the way she did. She looked up her biological father, he wants nothing to do with her, he is married and had other children, but her non-biological dad still thinks of her as his and wishes to remain in her life. He loves her with all his heart. He trusted his ex to do the right thing by not letting her know like that, they would do it together. The ex once told him that he would never have his daughter and since the daughter let the mother back in her life, he doesn't.  I have since have taken myself completely out of the situation cause every time I bring it up to my boyfriend's side of the family, they say she left them, and it is up to her to contact them first. I totally disagree with them. I have gotten know this daughter quite well with her even crying on my shoulder and I love her so much. She is very emotionally scarred from this. I miss her and wish she would seek some therapy and get to a place within herself to know she is a beautiful, loveable, and  wanted person in this world, and so are you. She has two parents, that raised her and still living and yet feels she isn't loved or wanted.  My heart breaks for you and every child on this earth that has or is going through this. God Bless You

 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
angry
October 29, 2007, 12:50 pm PDT

Men should not have to pay

Women like these 2 are the reason why women have a bad rap.  These men have been tricked and duped and should not have to pay any money.  In fact, the women should repay the money to the men!  I can't believe that arrogant and filibustering attorney!  Yuck!  Another reason for attorneys having a bad name.
 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
October 29, 2007, 12:50 pm PDT

Money Trap's more like it...

ugh...My husband and I are in the middle of this right now.  He and his first wife divorced due to infidelity on her part.  He requested a DNA test during the divorce proceedings, and was shot down by the judge.  The direct quote was that the judge "refused to bastardize another child".  UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!!  We are in the process of establishing paternity now (8 years later), and boy is it costly!  We did some research on our end to see if it would be possibly to do this without an attorney, and hit brick wall after brick wall.  Now we're looking at a $2,000 retainer, and that's just for starters.  Why do the courts make it so hard for a father to establish paternity?  If he's writing the check for support, shouldn't he have an honest to God right to know he's paying for his own child? 
 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
October 29, 2007, 12:50 pm PDT

Are you kidding me?

The more I watch this woman, the angrier I am becoming!  She is portraying herself as the victim "....I live with this child everyday...I see her disappointment and hurt..."; as if she's done nothing wrong!  This entire situation is a result of HER infidelity!!!  Why would he NOT assume he's the father-he's in a marital relationship!  This woman's self-righteous behaviour is outrageous!  This does not excuse the behaviour of the "father"!  What was he thinking?????  At ten, a child is not able to process this information!  The other gentleman on the stage with the mother should really be wary; she's amazing-not one hint of shame!  This poor young girl doesn't really have ANY good parental role models!

 
User Mood
Angry

Message Emote
blank
October 29, 2007, 12:52 pm PDT

i can only speak for myself...

Quote From: lighthouseguy

I don't know how one "fixes" these kinds of tragic situations.  BOTH adults behaved in a gross manner and BOTH adults are abusing the children to avoid personal responsibility here.  Maria is an obvious liar and even when confronted with the truth she then resorted to using her children to deflect any responsibility at all for what happened.  She even smiled at her own daughters tears over this mess that she HERSELF created because it gave her an opportunity to glare at Enrique and Mia with a "see what you did" look as if she herself was an innocent lamb.  Funny how she continues to say she never had any idea that Enrique wasn't the father, but admits to the affair in the most roundabout manner possible.  Well, you can't have it both ways.  You can't have an affair and then claim "there was no reason to think he (the husband) wasn't the father.  Obviously, there was plenty of reason to doubt it.  She has clearly shown herself to be sneaky and manipulative far beyond the heat of her affair.

Enrique at least showed what I believe was some sincere remorse over his actions in punishing an innocent child because he got hurt; however,  we adults should NEVER put children in the center of adult problems.  Enrique's conduct was quite unforgivable to reject a child that he brought up as his own.  It matters little if he was tricked or not or if the child really is his or not at this point in their relationship.  I, personally, could not fathom hurting a child in the manner in which he did.  What was gained by that?  The saving of money?  A sense of freedom for him?  Was it worth the price for whatever he thinks he gained?

As far a Mia, Enrique's new wife, goes, it is understandable for her to not want to see her husband be taken advantage of and that initially makes her seems like a good and dedicated wife; however, what was to be really gained by her intrusion into this prior relationship?  I think her motives are highly questionable and she, in my view, exercised poor judgment when one consders the damage done here by her instigation.  As with Enrique, I ask what was gained by her actions?  Was she all about him not paying the money or was it more that she resented his prior relationship with the girls he raised as his own?  Again, all one really has to ask is what was expected to be gained by bringing all this to light?

Shame on all of these so-called adults and I pray that the kids are not hurt more than they already are from these completely self-centered adults who are all consumed by being right, than by doing right.
I am Mia the current wife. I first want to say my heart goes out to Enrique and Selina and everyone else involved. I don’t feel it is my place to tell my husband how to feel about this devastating mess. I suggested the possibility that Selina was not his daughter only after weeks of praying and discussing the topic with my daughter. I had my suspicions in the beginning but chose not to voice them. It was my daughter who talked me in to discussing this with my husband. As my very wise daughter pointed out; Selina needs to know her medical history and her ethnical background, at a minimum. I have never participated in tearing anyone’s family apart. I have compassion and pray for everyone in this situation to find some peace and yes, that includes Maria and the children. It’s my firm believe and wish that Selina should have a trust fund and any child support money should go into that fund for her to do with as she chooses when she turn’s 18. I’ll stand by that! I'll say it again every child deserves to know medical history and family of origin.
 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
October 29, 2007, 12:55 pm PDT

What would I do?

I realized after posting my previous message that some might wonder what I would do since I noted my intense anger towards all of the adults in this situation.  I won't pretend to give a clearcut answer as I have never been in this situation and can only guess what I would do  based upon my personality and  moral convictions.  I would like to believe that I would do the following:

1) I would continue paying the support and, if the law allows, with specific payments made for the child's direct well-being and not leave it up to the already unreliable and dishonest mom.  If that can't be arranged, I'd probably pay regardless.  My thinking is this. . . If I had already raised this child as my own for so long, I have NOTHING to gain by cutting myself off from her and EVERYTHING to lose.  Not paying child support for a child that is not "biologically" mine could never offset the emotional hurt I would inflict on an innocent child by pushing her aside and invalidating my relationship with her.  I, personally, could just never do that to a child.  I see nothing to be gained there other than breaking the heart and spirit of a child in order be "right" and save money.  Neither reason holds much weight to me when compared to the damage it would have on a child to just walk away.

2) I do believe it is necessary for the truth to come out.  I don't believe in living a life of lies.  It isn't a question of not letting the mother "get away" with something and it wouldn't be a question of me just feeling better with the truth out in the open even though I have to admit that I, would personally need that, it is more about the child knowing the truth.  Children have rights to in all this and every child has a right to know who his or her father REALLY is and who had played the role in the absence of the real one.

There are all sorts of appropriate ways to reveal that truth.  Throwing it out on a trip to the park and then dumping the kid at home later is probably not the path I would take or the path I would recommend to anyone.  I think under the guidance of a professional counselor, or family minister, or by the parents who come to an agreement on the safest, kindest and most effective way to reveal this ugly truth the child will benefit in the end even though the initial blow will be very hard.  I very firmly believe that love does conquer all and that even this kind of ugly truth can have benefits it is revealed with love and support for the child.   In fact, it can be the basis for the healing process for all concerned and it might even strengthen the family bonds.  I know that I would probably be thrilled that a man not really my father thought enough to raise me as his own and continue to love and support me in spite of the ugly truth that I was the result of an affair.

It is important to note that this can also be done without demonizing the mother in this situation.  I grant you that I would probably hate this woman for doing what she did, but I would fight like all hell to not hurt the child because of that.  The problem in this case is that the mother has been effectively let off the hook here and took NO responsibility here whatsoever which lead to so much unnecessary anger for which her children suffered greatly.  I would expect her to own up to what she did and the reality is is that her children can benefit and learn from her mistake.  It is not about brow beating her and being right.  Our children can sometimes learn best from when we adults mess up, but we HAVE to own up to our mistakes for that to happen.  I saw little movement this way by the mother, Maria, in this story who took the most elongated path to admitting to the affair, but then wants everyone to believe that she couldn't imagine she got pregnant form it.  Is it really so hard to own up to a stupid action?  It's not like the truth isn't out already.

Well, this is just my view of things and I'm willing to certainly admit that this is how I would LIKE to handle the situation.  I'm well aware that the extreme hurt involved in all this can easily blind anyone to the best path to choose.  All I can say is focus on what is best for the kids and leave personal agendas out of it.


 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
confused
October 29, 2007, 12:57 pm PDT

Carnell is 100% right

What a world we live in!  I can't believe anyone would think a man should pay child support for a child he didn't father!  That's insane!  I agree with Carnell.  Let that man who raised that child have a role in a child's life but don't make him have to pay to have that relationship.  That child isn't for sale!  That mother chose to sleep with more than one man at a time without telling Enrique and she should have to either go after the biological father for the money and/or get a job or two to support her own kids.  It is NOT right to make a man pay for another man's child!

We need to start making women take responsibility for their promiscuity.....not reward them by punishing innocent men!  I guess Gloria Allred thinks we need to start getting every baby DNA tested just in case???  That's nuts.

As a woman, I find it digusting that these females would do such a thing!! 
 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
October 29, 2007, 12:58 pm PDT

Parent Trap

I think that the mother should be financially resposible for taking care of the child, considering the should know who the father of their kids are. I get tired of seeing these women who do that to men. I'm a woman and it really irritates me that they do that to the child. They can't expect to hide such a thing for a long time. They need to find the biological father and have him pay child support and not back child support because it's not his fault either that the mother lied to everyone. I think though if you were the father for a long time at least keep the bond and relationship but the financial problems should fall on the mother's shoulders.
 
First | Prev | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 | 30 | Next | Last