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Topic : 12/25 Parent Trap

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Created on : Friday, October 26, 2007, 02:49:00 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

(Original Air Date: 10/29/07) Fraud. lies. conspiracy. They may sound like the latest Washington scandal, but these are allegations of exes at war over child support. Dr. Phil's guests claim they became victims of the perfect crime when they were led to believe they fathered a child that was not biologically their own and were forced to pay. First up, Enrique says he was shocked and angered to discover he was not the father of his youngest daughter, Selina, and that she was conceived during his ex-wife, Maria's, adulterous affair. Maria says he raised Selina but then abandoned her to save money. Why does Maria say Enrique's current wife is to blame for the fractured relationship? Next, 13-year-old Selina speaks one on one with Dr. Phil. Will she decide to let the man she once called Daddy back in her life? Then, Carnell Smith, who uses the online moniker, "Man4Justice," suffered a similar fate to Enrique, and but he fought and won. He says he's tired of seeing women trap men and get away with it. A heated debate ensues between him and feminist attorney, Gloria Allred, who argues that men like Enrique should continue to act as the father ... and continue paying! Talk about the show here.


Find out what happened on the show.


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October 29, 2007, 8:40 pm PDT

I was a victum

I thought you show was great as many of your other shows I've seen. I am currently going through a paternity fraud case in Missouri. I was not married to the lady, I wasn't court  order to send child support.  She told me that I wasn't the father and later she told me. I agree that I would assist in supporting the child. She want me to be on the birth certificate and she went through child service and I request DNA. the result came back that I was not the father. Irequest through the court that she pay me back what I've sent her. Its pending now. I can not go into more detal because its pending in court. I was trying to do the right thing since I kept hearing about dead beat dad and by doing so I didn't question her. I feel that since she lie to me that she repay me back what I sent her. Over 12 years!  One out of three that is tested resulted that they are not the father. I didn't have much of a relationship with the child but I tried to send something because at least I felt I owe the child something if I was the father. She had to prove that he was my child and each time she avoid the conversation.
 
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October 29, 2007, 8:42 pm PDT

Parent Trap

Quote From: terrazas1

I am Mia the current wife.  I first want to say my heart goes out to Enrique and Selina and everyone else involved. I dont feel it is my place to tell my husband how to feel about this devastating mess.  I suggested the possibility that Selina was not his daughter only after weeks of praying and discussing the topic with my daughter.  I had my suspicions in the beginning but chose not to voice them.  It was my daughter who talked me in to discussing this with my husband.  As my very wise daughter pointed out; Selina needs to know her medical history and her ethnical background, at a minimum.  I have never participated in tearing anyones family apart.  I have compassion and pray for everyone in this situation to find some peace and yes, that includes Maria and the children.  Its my firm believe and wish that Selina should have a trust fund and any child support money should go into that fund for her to do with as she chooses when she turns 18.  Ill stand by that!  

Mia,

 

No condemnation...but how would you feel if someone came along and changed your child's life forever? You say that you spoke with your daughter before you had the discussion with your husband. I wonder if you considered talking to your spiritual leader? This type of decision should be prayerful and done with much consideration of all of the lives that would be affected.

 

Your daughter no matter her age is your child, she should not have been a part of this decision for you.

 

I wonder if you would do it all over again, if you knew how Selina would be hurt?

 

 

 
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October 29, 2007, 8:42 pm PDT

Was a stepmom, too

From  a stepmoms prospective: I to am married to a man who raised a son for 15 years. The last 2 years I uprooted my daughter and moved her to another state to give my husbands son a better life after we got custody of him. 2 years later, the mother and son decide they want to live together again because she is tired of paying childsupport and the son wants more freedom and we had to many rules. After finding out we were going to fight to keep custody, the mother goes to the courthouse and request a court ordered DNA test. Guess what. We already knew what the results would be because we had done our own DNA test months earlier after hearing Rumors from my husbands son's stepsibilings that my husband was not the child real father. We decided to keep this information to ourselves and seek counseling, but the mother of the child used it to gain custody of her son back. We are currently suing the mother because the son at the age of 15 didn't want to see my husband anymore because after his mother told him the news he stated things would never be the same. My husband lost rights to a child he raised and wanted to continue raising. Yes, Men have the right to sue for every penny when a child id taken from them. Yes, I was the stepmother, but I supported my husband and my stepson when I had the chance. Don't forget, stepparents choose to love a child, they don't do it because they have to. I knew this child wasn't mine, and I chose to buy his clothes, take him to school, take him to the doctor, help him with his homework, let him look at me and tell me repeatedly I was not his mother. I even encouraged him to see his mother when he would get mad at her. My husband now has a void and no amount of money will ever replace that, but If a woman can pull a kid away, then she should have to repay.
 
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October 29, 2007, 8:42 pm PDT

Parent trap

And as for Gloria Allred I have one question for her when does a woman do anything wrong?  What Ms. Allred is teaching all of the young women of the world, Is to be deceitful as long as you can get away

with it.  Wake up Ms. Allred Enrique  and Celina are the victims here, and that gentleman who paid 11 years of child support should be reimbursed by the woman who lied about his being that child's father and forced to pay back support to him.  Or serve jail time.for fraud and theft.

 

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October 29, 2007, 8:42 pm PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Quote From: puccini7

i toldly agree with dr phil that the vitcim is the child, but the father also is a vitcim. he believed for 9 yrs that was his daughter. he loved her, took care of her ,wiped her nose and eyes when she cried. the father was 100 percent betrayed. he knows he has no rights because she is not his blood. the games the mother could play. she has already played alot of games. i do not believe the way the daughter was told was right. but i also believe that  the child is not his and he should not be emotional are fiancial responsibile for her. if he choses to do so great! what a man! but how many women take on  a stepchild and pay childsupport when they get a divorced? the women love the child but they are not held responsible. i am a woman who raised 2 kids with no finanical help from the father. i did not trick anyone in to taking on of my babies.  i think the mother is the villian. the new wife is taking care of  and looking out for her new life right or wrong. i really wish  all the best the beautiful young women who was betryed by both mom and dad.. hopefully she will focus on school and go to college and show the all. best wishes

This is not a "stepchild" he's "taking on".  This was the daughter HE RAISED.  What does this say about fatherhood???  If we expect nothing from men as fathers, it's little wonder they deliver very little at times...

 

I'm sure NEITHER daughter considers herself to have had the role of "stepdaughter".  This is a crucial point.  Stop trying to solve the problem for the adults (father) in this case when it's the consequences that abandonment creates for the CHILD that you should be considering.  Adults are in a FAR better position to handle injustice than a child is.  There is no comparing the two things.  It sucks that Enrique got duped.  Agreed.  But this shouldn't color what the correct reaction on his part should have been, (to stand by his daughter emotionally and financially).  I'm not suggesting forcing him to do so.  He doesn't deserve her.  I'm merely trying to frame the problem for what it is today -- a problem of a child being abandoned by her father -- and how UNJUST that reaction was.

 
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October 29, 2007, 8:43 pm PDT

I agree 100%

Quote From: yaoldmaid

This show seemed one-sided to me.  Dr. Phil you really messed up!!  The loud-mouthed "high-profile" lawyer you had on the show was so out of line.  She jumped all over Enrique and said NOTHING to the non--caring, cheating supposed mother of Celina!!  Why didn't anybody (besides Enrique's new lovely wife) jump all over that smirky-faced, money hungry whore of a mother???

I am a regular viewer of your show, Dr. Phil, but boy did you burst my bubble!!   I cannot believe that you didn't bring up the fact that Celina seemed a little bit brain-washed by her horrible mother.  Everything she responded to you in the "chat area" was a staged and rehearsed performance of Maria , the supposed mother.  Did you not sense that?  And how come these kids aren't angry at their mother's stupidity??  Why and how can they trust that woman at all?  How can SO MUCH blame be put on that hurting father while the jealous Maria digs her claws in for MONEY AND ONLY MONEY and no one else see this???   I am so fired up mad about this show!!   I wanted to jump thru the TV, get rid of the loud-mouthed attorney and focus on how hurt Enrique was and is, and that the only way he knew how to deal with the "surprise" situation was to handle it the best way he did.  Celina will survive...he gave her enouh influence and love that she will get through it fine.   I wonder why the courts aren't taking custody of the girls away from that lying, greedy, heartless woman!!!

You are 100% right.  I'm very disappointed with Dr. Phil having brought that loud mouthed money hungry lawyer on the show.  There were two real victims here and not enough emphasis was put on that.  I know how hard adultary can be, how devastating and how it can destroy someones life. He should have made a better choice about continuing to see the child and  Dr. Phil should have offered the father and daughter some type of counsdeling to try and repair the damage, yet he offered nothing.  Dr. Phil, I know your an advocate for children and for women but when wmoen are wrong, they shouldn't be made out to be some great mother.

 

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October 29, 2007, 8:44 pm PDT

I am angry

Dr. Phil and all I am angry,

My husband and I are going through the exact same thing. There is a woman who claimed to have his child 16 years ago. He found out aboout it 8 years ago when he was arrested for a child support warrant. He was declaired the father by default. He has NEVER signed the birth certificate, He has NEVER been in the childs life at all. His license had been suspended and he has lost his job before due to failure to pay child support. We have had our taxes taken, we have spent money on lawyers and have requested appeal after appeal. All with no avail. He has always maintained that this boy was not his child. The mother  of the child finally agreed to a DNA test at an independent lab. Sure enough the child was not his. We then filed a new appeal based on the new evidence and again we were denided. All the mother has to do is go to Juvenile court and stop this order. She refuses. She is getting free money  from a man that has a real family with his real children  and she does not care. I am angry, mad , pissed off and frustrated. Her son hates her for lying to him all his life. She made him think that my husband was his father and that he didn't  want anything to do with him. The boy has called our house and begged to live with us and would ask to speak to our children etc. beforfe the DNA test. The system does not hold women accountable. All the state cares about is recooping funds for walfare from men that have nothing to do with it. We need a better system. I get upset everytime i think about what we have been through because a heartless  lier. All that boy wanted was a father and his mother took that away from him with her lies.

 
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October 29, 2007, 8:44 pm PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Quote From: dkbroderick

I only caught the last 20 minutes of this show tonight, but I can say that I formed an opinion right away, just from the little bit I watched. The child should be completely left out of the problem here, and shouldn't even be involved to KNOW that Enrique was not her real father, until she was mature enough to know the truth.

The problem here however, lies with the mother. She was extremely selfish in both having an affair, and then letting Enrique pay child support when the child wasn't his. People really need to learn to be responsible for their actions and to think of other's feelings. She hurt both her child and her ex husband by being a cheat, a liar, and then taking child support fully knowing the truth.

NO man should be forced to pay child support for another man's child.

However, Enrique, should have continued being the father as he always has, and just informed his ex wife that he would no longer support with money. Any monetary support would need to be voluntary.

He should always show his daughter love and be committed to be there for her. You don't  just walk away. It was no fault of the child's that her mother was devious.

No matter how the issue was brought to light.. if the mother hadn't of been selfish, none of this would have ever happened. Karma will always come back to bite those who deserve it. This woman got to be called a fraud on National TV. Hopefully she learned something.

Gloria Allred, has no clue. She was arguing about how men don't pay child support and that is the real problem in America.. Well, Gloria my dear, that wasn't what this show was about. She shouldn't have even been on there, she just made herself look bad.

well said. 
 
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October 29, 2007, 8:46 pm PDT

Judicial Role Models Set Bad Examples

It is time to learn what our rights are so we are not victimized by a system with a heart.  Fathers all across America and caught in a legal struggle with traumatizing and deep emotional impacts on their lives and those around them.  Talking to fathers from "sea to shining sea" I hear and come face to face with the grief, confusion and devastating financial consequences imposed by the very people they trust -- child support, attorneys and the very courts seeking truth.

America's fathers are angry, shocked and amazed at the hardhearted, callous and indifferent representation they receive at the hands of the judicial and social systems.

Where have I gone wrong and what did I do are the questions mostly asked.  Little wonder fathers blame themselves and accept guilt in a valiant effort to keep the family together.  After all, isn't this the job of the husband?  And then the very people and agencies fathers turn to for help, guidance and that ever so rare word -- truth.  And in a shocking and alarming awakening with little warning they find they are in a battle generated by a system out of control.   Time and again it seems the very foundation of their lives are shaken and the justice and truth for all, the very fabric of our beliefs and relationships as individuals and a society, seem to be only words on paper so old they are considered ancient texts.

It is time to know our legal rights.  With knowledge comes confidence.  With confidence comes action.  With action comes results.  So does it seem so far fetched to have the outlandish idea that I can learn, educate my self,prepare a plan and represent myself.  When I talk to fathers struggling to make ends meet while the legal system strangles their finances, I know it sound like a suicide mission to even consider representing yourself.

It interesting and telling point of the show pointed out the very fact of self representation of representation of counsel.  Carnell had been through the battle and displayed heartfelt understanding and personal insight gained only from experience.  Professional Counsel had a hard time making sense out of the whole thing and even charged off in the wrong direction.  By the way, this is a typical tactic employed in court by attorneys and magicians alike.

Thank you, Carnell, for your wisdom and loving guidance to all concerned.  I agree with, Dr. Phil, that the interests of the children comes first, but it does not seem to be a paramount consideration in our child support and legal institutions.  I personally know fathers depriving their current children to meet unmerited child support obligations.  Let's go to the source of the problem.


 
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October 29, 2007, 8:47 pm PDT

What can we enforce?

On this show it was said that these men should be required to continue their support payments because the child was more important. She said that the child needs to know this man she has thought to be her father will not abandon her. First of all, the two ideas are different. It is possible to be a father figure without paying child support. And secondly, and my biggest point, is that even if a man desides not to stay in that childs life, however wrong it may be, this is not something that we or the courts have any say in. Child support or not, we cannot force any man or woman to be there for their child or anyone elses. That is a decision they must make and live with. The law was never intented to force people to do what is right, but to keep them from doing what is wrong!
 
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