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Topic : 12/25 Parent Trap

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Created on : Friday, October 26, 2007, 02:49:00 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

(Original Air Date: 10/29/07) Fraud. lies. conspiracy. They may sound like the latest Washington scandal, but these are allegations of exes at war over child support. Dr. Phil's guests claim they became victims of the perfect crime when they were led to believe they fathered a child that was not biologically their own and were forced to pay. First up, Enrique says he was shocked and angered to discover he was not the father of his youngest daughter, Selina, and that she was conceived during his ex-wife, Maria's, adulterous affair. Maria says he raised Selina but then abandoned her to save money. Why does Maria say Enrique's current wife is to blame for the fractured relationship? Next, 13-year-old Selina speaks one on one with Dr. Phil. Will she decide to let the man she once called Daddy back in her life? Then, Carnell Smith, who uses the online moniker, "Man4Justice," suffered a similar fate to Enrique, and but he fought and won. He says he's tired of seeing women trap men and get away with it. A heated debate ensues between him and feminist attorney, Gloria Allred, who argues that men like Enrique should continue to act as the father ... and continue paying! Talk about the show here.


Find out what happened on the show.


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October 31, 2007, 7:22 am PDT

ARE YOU KIDDING ME??

I just wached this show on TIVO!! Why isn't anyone pissed at this mother? She has NEVER thought about this child and her feelings now has she? When did she ever sit with herself and think about what this CHILD would feel when the truth came out about her biology? The truth always does in time and she is the mastermind laughing all the way to the bank. She did not love her husband enough to honor her marriage so who could expect for her to allow herself to put her child first and think that the truth is what is best? She has only thought of herself. I have lost all respect for Gloria! Poor Salina....but I don't blame her father for acting out of anger. Her mother should have thought about this out come before she let it get to far. I think giving the money paid would be the right thing to do and for her to goseek the biological father because he is also deserving of the TRUTH
 
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October 31, 2007, 7:26 am PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Quote From: captkwp

   AFter a divorce my exwife , got preg. with the guy who was involved with her while we were married.

However, The guy went about his marry way and left her holding the baby. I had already had 2 wonderful girls by my exwife too. I decided right away that even though the baby she was carrying was not mine and she would be brought into this world without a dad. I would try my best to fill that roll the very best I knew how.    I ended up adopting her, she is my daughter, there is no difference  between her and my other children. I love all my girls the same, See anybody can make a baby but it takes a man to raise one.

Also the girls have a very good mother, It was bad choices me and her mother made in our marriage. Thats not the childrens fault. I look at my last daughter as a gift from God, what joy she brings to us. She also has a step mother who loves her very much too.  I don't believe in divorce, alot of people get hurt through divorce LIKE KIDS.

KWP

The difference between you and Enrique is that you were given a choice and you made the right one for you, he didn't have that choice.

 
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October 31, 2007, 7:35 am PDT

Are you kidding me??

Gloria....don't quit your day job!! Maria, you created this entire mess. What the hell did you think was going to happen when the truth about what YOU did came out. Time tells all and you sat up there like you were some sort of motherhood royalty. Cudos Mia!! I think someone needs to contact the biological father because he deserves the truth as well. She may be able to lie to herself but she can't to millions who feel for Enrique! Poor Salina, her MOTHER did a bang up job of ruining her perfect little world. She should be the one to hang her head in shame!
 
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October 31, 2007, 7:36 am PDT

Well Said!

Quote From: anhonestwmomen

so you don't want to know the truth about such imporant things in your life? come on....would you want to pay for someone else's lies? or not know who your daddy was? give me a break!
Thanks for the post! 
 
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October 31, 2007, 8:01 am PDT

Totally Disgusted

I watched this show and I was absolutely disgusted with Maria.  I was literally screaming at the TV.  I am disgusted with the fact that she so blatently and flat out decieved this man into PAYING for a child that is NOT his.  If you want to have an affair, have one...if you want to get a divorce, get one.  But do NOT create a child and make them pay for your stupidity and also do not make someone else  PAY money for anything they did not sign up for.  It is hard enough to afford things these days and to have the added extra burden of paying for a child that does not belong to you if just so screwed up on MANY LEVELS. 

 

I don't agree with the way he handled telling the poor innocent child and what I think would have been a nice thing to do is continue the relationship with her but not financially support her because it is not his responsibility.  AND, if Maria was any kid of a stand up woman she would have agreed to that...instead she proved to be completely selfish.  If she was SO worried about her financial support then go hit up the real father for the money.  She didn't even give that man the opportunity to know he has a daughter.  I'm glad I was sitting at home for this show and not in the audience cause I don't think I could have contained myself from yelling something out.

 

As for that lawyer lady...she does not have a clue.  NO ONE, man or woman, should have to pay the price, whether it be money, time, emotions or otherwise for something that does not BELONG to them without full knowledge of the full situation.  If you are woman/man enough to have an affair and create a life...you should be man/woman enough to do the right thing and tell the TRUTH...nothing bad comes from telling the truth...people and lives and bad things are produced from LIES...people need to take responsibility for their actions.

 
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October 31, 2007, 8:02 am PDT

I AGREE!!!!

Quote From: yiannsthegreek

AMEN TO THAT!!!
 
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October 31, 2007, 8:03 am PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Quote From: dragonheart

Not that  I am a lawyer but after reviewing that particular statute it does not seem to be of any actual help anyways. They have a lot of counters against itself  in the satute as as whole and alot for you to do on your part as far as proof of burden. But the main point though as far as that goes is that how can a woman whom natually have a child be a factor. For they have the child and there is no questions of maternity of that. Now this only applies to natural births and c-sections. Now exceptions to this are concerns of baby switching. As far as artificial insemination it still boils down to the fact that the DNA is still the mothers without question and the big question here is the DNA of the male. I do not know the actual stand on invetro though to elaborate on that part. In all fairness this should be included into a statute whether it be this one or another if it already has not been covered somewhere. On the other hand though as far as being equal the mother is the one whom carries the child not the father or named paid child supporter which is usually the male let us face the truth here but some cases involving women wrongly paying child support as well (I have seen this personally). So the woman's maternity is not usually in question because of having the child naturally whereas it could be any sperm to have contributed to the DNA of the child.  I am not trying to imply anything bad or stereotyping of women at all. I am just refering to the cases of possible parental fraud where fidelity is the question. This may be one of the reasons why this statute was based. I do not know that for sure though. Try also looking at the laws/statutes of maternity if you can find them and parental rightsas well as your civil rights just in case you need to represent yourself. I personally think you are going to need to know all of them in your fight. And if your lawyer has not explained them to you yet try and get his explanation as well if at all possible of both sides of the coin objectively especially of the constitutional law and florida statute 742.18. Please read all of it you are going to need to know all of it for yourself. http://www.floridalegalanswers.com/statutes/index.htm is the webite for Florida statutes. I hope you win your case but the real problem with most things  especially concerning the fathers end ( but not limited to ) is how is it going to actually be treated.  As far as case law not much exists as far as your situation of where it has been with a positive outcome. What I have stated above for the woman carrying the child is weak at best though. You will need to combine that with a whole lot more unless something breaks your way.  You have got lots more studying and researching to do.

 

Now as for the show I too feel Enrique was wrong for the way he handled it with Selena. But on the other hand he was emotionally distraught due to the recent news. The feelings of betrayal of the father are very intense. I know all too well on that but never once walked out on our child and will not ever. In turn it is still no excuse to in fact take the action of just walking out on the child. Nothing excuses that in my opinion. Though he does have remorse for tht decision he made and wants to make ammends. As for him to be paying child support on a fraudulent bases I disagree on that.  As far as Maria goes all because you give birth does not make you a mother. Like much as is said about the relevancy of the sperm it takes more to be a father than just sperm donation. Well on the other side of the coin it takes more than just giving birth to be an actual mother in turn. A real mother does have the child's best interests in mind not one that is just using it a ruse for personal gain. And that is exactly what Maria is doing. Playing a very hurtful game not to just Enrique but mainly to Selena her own daughter. Knowing the whole time that he was not the father but would be the one to pay not the real bio father. Unknown if the bio father actually knows he has a child with her but he at some point in her life needs to be held responsible. But Maria due to her deceit still cheats him out of making that informed decision. Thus she is a playing a game with him too. Maria is a very selfish person and one thing that was not covered in the show why is it that Maria really did not have to answer for anything. In fact it was all diverted to Enrique and his wrong doings for the most part. Leaving him to constantly defend himself as that tactic is so widely used to keep someone that is trying to do the right thing in defense mode so the real actual issues never get resolved and the one causing the problem never has to be held accountable for their bad actions. Like in this case Maria. She has a lot of explaining to do to her own daughters Selena and her sister. It is obvious all she is about is getting the child support money otherwise she would of voluntarily of stopped it for Enrique and went after the real bio father. She also needs to pay Enrique back all the money he has paid her plus interest. And pay for counseling for her children now too. As for the legal aspect of this There definitily needs to be some changes in the legal system. Especially when it comes in regards to the way the treat one party unfairly. And let us facr facts here people usually the male (father in most cases though there are some women treated unfairly too and usually they are good mothers too. )  But it is quite a bit more towards the male end. Neither party should be treated unfairly not put orders upon them that are unfair. And I find it funny that when the courts keep the best interests of the child in that there is almost always child support attached unfairly. Is it in the best interest of the child to keep one of the parties in poverty for the sake it is in the best interest of the child. While this in fact creates resentment, feelings of unjusfulness, anger and frustration consistantly. Thus the courts themselves are in fact creating ill will by forcing one in this position while usually the liar profits. The fact is both parents need to be able to live not just the one. And both parties can have JOBS for both parties to support the child financially. And in so doing creating this ill will the liar that is profiting now feels empowered and hense feels untouchable and constantly creates problems for the party trying to do the right thing. The child sees this and thinks that lying to profit for yourself is okay and this in facts teaches the child to do this behavior and that it is acceptable. Now that is not too say this will happen in most cases but does create the breeding ground for it. And this is in the childs best interest HOW? In essence hurting the child's welfare. But anyway that is just my opinion to be fair and honest on both parts for the best emotional interest of the child. And if one or the other is not and it interferes with the well being of the child well then the person(s) causes this needs to suffer the consequences and not profit from it. Maria needs to makes ammends as well as Enrique. Enrique seems sincere about trying to make up for his really big behavioral mishap. In turn though there has been (from my point of view) some programming of Selena by the mother from the way she just talks about what the father did wrong and did not even approach about the mother. And quite obvious this lady (if you can call her that) loves to play these games because she has no consequence to pay by law and will use any means necessary to do it including programming her own daughter so she can keep gaining from it. Hopefully one day Selena will rebound and realize what he mother did was wrong then the real healing can begin if that is possible in this case. And what about the hurt this has cause the sister as well. After all she is a victim of this too. No real mother or father would do this to children at all. But all too often this happens. In conclusion though Maria should be able to be charged with felony fraud and have to pay restitution. She also demeans true womanhood. No true woman I know would do what she has. She is also denying other bio father family members either a grandchild, uncles and aunts as well as any cousins or possible other brothers and sisters a relationship. The real father needs to be founds and given information to make his own informed choice of what is going to do next. And last I fear the new husband with Maria as well. Sounds to me like he is about t be the next victim. Remember if he adopts Selena he then becomes legally responsible for the child. Not that it would be a bad thing for the sake as far as Selena concern but then that (if there is a divorce between them) means he will be paying child support to her. But it is a difficult position to be a stepfather to some one else's child too. Something else I know well. But I hope Selena gets two loving fathers out of all of this. Although the adoption would relieve Enrique of the financial end but he is against the adoption. Why perhaps? Could it be because he fears that he is going to lose any chance of a relationship with Selena if that happens. Which tells me he is not really thinking of the money. If he was he would of just immediately supported that notion.  And Hats off to Mia which is Enriques new wife. She is just looking out for her husband as a good wife does. She probably had an idea of what this would all mean before it was brought up. In her defense as well it was in fact that something that needed to be done. Although I think it could of been all been brought up in a much better way. But In Mia and Enriques defense they probably could not talk to Maria or even convince her to bring it up the right way because of her fear of losing the paycheck. And believe me that is all Maria is concerned about. So how could they bring it up the subject matter in an appropriate way involving the mother. So everyone here that is bashing Mia for her part needs to stepback and put yourself in her shoes with it..  

 Thanks for your input. I have spent hours learing this new law ( FL 742.18). Her fighting equal rights is crazy! How much hurt does she want?? The sad truth is my ex knows it is her daughter, she was born 100% natural.

  We divorced in 2001 and I started a new relationship in 2004 that my ex became jealous of , that is when, out of trying to hurt me she said implied our daughter was not mine. Otherwise it would still not know the truth. When I had a dna done I was in total shock! Now she just says to bad your name is on the birth certificate and your paying. I have tried to be strong for the innocent child and assure her of my love, but at the same time explain to this 15 year old what is being stolen from both of us. Half her identity is wrong, she needs her medical history she has already had some problems that could maybe be better identified, she could have half brothers or sisters, My ex took away the bio families rights to know a very sweet beautiful girl. There are just so many wrongs here. My love will always be there for her, but no matter how much you love someone you cant change DNA, and there are certain things love cant take care of.

 
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October 31, 2007, 8:06 am PDT

Sorry, but you are wrong

Quote From: pikachusmom

Mia is not an outsider and will you pick a side and stick to it.  You say the law is right in assuming that a child born of a marriage is presumed to be a child of that marriage regardless of who the actual father is and yet you mock the other guy for not requesting a paternity test.  You yourself said that "Every man has a right to request paternity test" but if he is assumed to be the father than whats the point of the test since the husband, although not bio. father is assumed to be the father since he was legally married and will still have to pay child support.  No the laws are not there to protect the best interest of the child since that child will never know his actual father and will only receive the full anger and resentment  of the ex-husband for having to pay child support that he should not be paying. 

Thank you for sending a response to my post but I believe you are wrong in your statement that Mia IS NOT an outsider.

 

I have been a paralegal for 15+ years, working primarily in family law, and I think I've just about seen/heard it all.

 

I'm sorry but Mia's only standing, as far as our courts here are concerned, is that of Enrique's wife.  She has no right or standing in custody or any other matters involving Enrique's parent/child relationship, either with his daughters OR his ex-wife. She's nothing but a trouble maker, but hey, that's just my opinion...

 

Over the years I have known only two men in a similar situation.  They had been paying child support for years for a child BORN OUT OF WEDLOCK to an ex-girlfriend.  Years later they found out, by whatever means, that the child wasn't their biological child.  They called our office because domestic relations refused to cancel their child support obligation.  The  first question I had was: "Why didn't you ask for a paternity test as soon as the mother filed for child support, when the child was born?"  I received vary vague answers to that question.  My point in making the statement regarding paternity testing is "when in doubt, check it out".  In other words, ASK FOR A PATERNITY TEST AS SOON AS THE CHILD IS BORN, OR THE MINUTE THE MOTHER FILES FOR SUPPORT, DON'T WAIT MONTHS/YEARS AND WONDER!  On the very first DAY of a support hearing, if a punitive father DOESN'T request a paternity test and just agrees to pay, the court PRESUMES that this person admits paternity and that's the way it will stay.  That is how the assumption of paternity is made by the courts in the first place.  I feel sorry for them, but...

 

In addition, in making the statement regarding paternity testing, I am NOT referring to children born OF A MARRIAGE, I only refer to children born OUT OF WEDLOCK.  Married people don't take each other to court for child support unless they separate.  Even then, a married father cannot question paternity. 

 

I was involved in two cases where men filed for custody of a child born of an adulterous relationship. In both cases the mother (adulterer) was still married and cohabitating with her spouse.  The court refused to hear both of those cases because the cheated on SPOUSE refused to CONCEDE PATERNITY OF THE CHILD regardless.  They are the true heros in my book.

 

BTW I, personally, have never been involved in a case where a married man separated from his spouse and THEN requested a paternity test.

 

 

 

 
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October 31, 2007, 8:12 am PDT

identity theft

Thanks for your input. I have spent hours learing this new law ( FL 742.18). Her fighting equal rights is crazy! How much hurt does she want?? The sad truth is my ex knows it is her daughter, she was born 100% natural.

  We divorced in 2001 and I started a new relationship in 2004 that my ex became jealous of , that is when, out of trying to hurt me she said implied our daughter was not mine. Otherwise it would still not know the truth. When I had a dna done I was in total shock! Now she just says to bad your name is on the birth certificate and your paying. I have tried to be strong for the innocent child and assure her of my love, but at the same time explain to this 15 year old what is being stolen from both of us. Half her identity is wrong, she needs her medical history she has already had some problems that could maybe be better identified, she could have half brothers or sisters, My ex took away the bio families rights to know a very sweet beautiful girl. There are just so many wrongs here. My love will always be there for her, but no matter how much you love someone you cant change DNA, and there are certain things love cant take care of.

  I will always have a relationship with the child, but my ex needs to understand she deserves no rights when it comes to this issue any longer. Its only been about what my ex wants, No One else. She knows who the bio dad is and sad but true he is much better of financialy than I. She has just always has some scary obsession with me and I dont know why??

 
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October 31, 2007, 8:14 am PDT

10/29 Parent Trap

Quote From: fairycandle

Many of the readers are making judgements without hearing the full story .  First, do we really know if the wife really knew?  They may have had sex with her within a short period therefore the wife wouldn't know. I do feel that when she became pregnant that she tell her husband,so he could make the  decision on  what he wanted to do.

I do feel strongly that HE should NOT have to pay child support.  The wife should have the bio dad.

 

 

Ummm, duh!  The wife admitted on National TV that she knew from the start.  She lied from the beginning.  Pay attention before you make comments.

 
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