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Topic : 06/12 Teacher Sex Scandal, Part 1

Number of Replies: 352
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Created on : Friday, October 26, 2007, 03:01:39 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 11/01/07) Dr. Phil explores a disturbing trend: Female teachers engaging in sex acts with their underage male students. The number of accusations has doubled in the past five years. You've probably heard of famous cases like Mary Kay Letourneau, and Debra LaFave and the recent case of a teacher in Southern California, Meredith Johnson Vincent, who was arrested on suspicion of having a sexual relationship with a 14-year-old boy. Dr. Phil meets one teacher who has chosen to fight back. Joelle Ogletree was a respected high school French teacher until she was accused of sexual misconduct by three of her students. Find out what goes through a mother's head as she faces 160 years in prison. Plus, the Dr. Phil show speaks with one of the boys who says the sexual improprieties absolutely did happen and claims he passed a polygraph examination. When he agrees to take another test for Dr. Phil, what do his answers reveal? Joelle has been banned from even volunteering at her daughter's school because of the accusations. Should she be allowed back in the classroom? Watch and decide: Do you believe her ... or her students? Tell us what you think!

Find out what happened on the show.

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June 12, 2008, 4:57 pm CDT

I've no leaning toward determining her as a liar

Quote From: sunflyer

 

If you want to know who to believe then read the 80 page transcript of the Administrative hearing.  The boys lied.   I wish the Dr Phil show would not re run segments like this unless they add a period at the end that provides viewers with the complete end of the story.  

 

Here is the link to the transcript.

 

http://www.soah.state.tx.us/pfdsearch/pfds/701/06/701-06-1196-ec-pfd1.pdf

I live in North Florida. There has been a plethora of teachers and teachers' aides who've been accused of inappropriate and/or sexual behavior toward several students. NOT ONE claimed it didn't happen! This world is a trip! Also, I'm a survivor of sexual abuse, a couple of those times with someone in an authority position.

If the boy reads this, it's a real shame that you bring the Lord's name into this! I strongly suggest you take a deep look into your heart.

I believe the teacher. I have kind of a 6th sense about people, probably as a result of growing up in an alcoholic family and all of its undercurrents, and because I've suffered abuse and have some educational knowledge in this area. The woman isn't lying. She's not grasping at straws. If she bothers to read these posts: I am so sorry that you've been put in this position.  So sorry! We so desperately need quality teachers and there's no doubt in my mind that you are one. Add to that the stressors upon your family are criminal! So sorry......Judy

P.S. Dr Phil, your questions about why she seemed so self-contained and attorney-like didn't take in one aspect of the psychology around something like this. People respond in different ways. I, for one, as I did with a professional association hearing board  related to the therapist who sexually abused me,  shut down a lot and coped by keeping it non-emotional.  

 
June 12, 2008, 4:58 pm CDT

06/12 Teacher Sex Scandal, Part 1

Quote From: sunflyer

This happened a long time ago.  If you google her name you'll find numerous pages but the end result is that the boys testimony was found to be lies and her teaching certificate was not affected.  I think it is offensive for DRPHIL to rerun this show because I remember it from last year and he leaves you with the impression that it is difficult to determine guilt or innocence.  If you read some of the excerpts from the TEA transcript linked below, you'll see that the ALJ had no problems finding her innocent of the horrid accusations.  All three of these boys have interesting family backgrounds that tend to imply they were spoiled little rich brats. 

 

 

http://salon.glenrose.net/?view=plink&id=5042

Unfortunately, I think you're right about "spoiled little rich brats"! It has become a badge of honor for snotty, self-entitled teenage boys to brag about their so-called sexual conquests of older women....especially their young, attractive female teachers...and it's indicative of our sick society.

 

And, also unfortunately, it makes it harder when there is a genuine case of misconduct on the part of a teacher, because the victim will be looked upon with skepticism.....and make no mistake...when an underage child is preyed upon by an older adult, whether it's a girl or a boy; whether the child "consented" or not, it's rape! The law says so; simple morality says so....it's rape. A child under the age of 18 does not have the emotional brain development to make that decision...no matter how smart they THINK they are. Hence the statutory rape laws.

 

In this case it has been proven that this teacher is innocent....and that should be the end of the suspicion.  

 

It's not rocket science, people.   

 
June 12, 2008, 5:03 pm CDT

Bravo!

Quote From: jewelsf

You SHOULD regret the hurt that you have knowingly or unknowingly inflicted upon his wife!!!!!!!!  How can you post on here so casually about having an affair with a married man? Instead of defending the teachers you should be apologizing for your behavior. The married teacher should also be ashamed of himself too. Not only has he violated the marriage vows that he took but he also has violated his position as a teacher. It makes NO difference that you were of age! You were still his student and he was still your teacher. A teacher should never have sex with a student no matter what the age of that student is. He should be fired! And let's forget, he should be divorced. Shame on you for what you have posted here, shame on you for having no regrets, and shame on you for saying that even though it is now over you wouldn't take it back. Your teacher/lover gives men a bad name and you give women a bad name!

Where have all the morals gone....long time passing?

Where have all the morals gone....long, long time ago?.........

 
June 12, 2008, 5:15 pm CDT

06/12 Teacher Sex Scandal, Part 1

Something to me sounds really fishy about this hole sex scandel.
 
June 12, 2008, 5:21 pm CDT

06/12 Teacher Sex Scandal, Part 1

Quote From: jewelsf

I felt the same way about Dr. Phil questioning her demeanor. I even posted on this subject alone. I totally agree with you on that. I haven't been able to watch the entire show, I'll watch it again so I can't make any opinions about the guilt or innocence yet, but I had to reply on this particular subject. I felt he was wrong in asking this. I feel it comes down to common sense why she is acting the way that she is. Lawsuits that drag on or accusations that drag on can wear you down, you have to be strong, especially if your right.

As for her demeanor.....you're right, things that drag on and on and on definitely can wear you down. I'm sure she was methodical and calm because, in order to defend herself she had  to be!! If you lose your train of thought in court you lose your cool...and then it all goes south.

 

I'm the same way. People think I'm so cool, calm and collected in a crisis.....and I am...(later, after it's all over, I may fall apart privately.) But I've had many people ask me how I can be so rational and calm when they think I should be throwing a hissy fit.....they don't know how I'm feeling inside!  I'm just fortunate enough that I'm able to deal with crises and tough situations by putting emotions aside and using logic and common sense. I just know nothing can be solved by falling apart.

 

I believe it's the same with this teacher.

 
June 12, 2008, 5:30 pm CDT

Wow

    I note that this is old, but like I said in a different topic. I don't watch much tv. I start and stop with Dr. Phil, sometimes, Simpsons, Family Guy, Two and a Half Men, and Mega Disasters. And Monday night Jay Leno.

 

    This is disturbing on so many levels that it's unreal.

 
June 12, 2008, 5:42 pm CDT

06/12 Teacher Sex Scandal, Part 1

Quote From: usa_2425

Something to me sounds really fishy about this hole sex scandel.
This "hole" sex "scandel"?  Is that a pun? (It's "whole" sex "scandal"...that's what spellcheck is for at the top of the post header....use it or look ignorant.)
 
June 12, 2008, 7:57 pm CDT

Never ever have I ever

I don't know if you have ever played the game I just noted.....it is not something I knew about until my own children taught me.   It is not just your normal everyday ordinary game.......It gets quite personal.  When she mentioned that she had done that - that just blew my mind.  Things come up that most people don't want to even mention/discuss and/or reveal.  That was just enough to tell me that something else was going on.  You should have asked her would she play that game with her own children?????  Not unless you really want to know the truth.  Something is wrong with this whole picture. 
 
June 13, 2008, 5:24 am CDT

Did anyone see yesterdays news?

Quote From: myrbeach1

While I believe that some of this may occur.  We have to ask ourselves how much of it is nothing more than a modern day witch hunt.  Our kids are learning about sex at an earlier age that generates curiosity.   The outlet for the curiosity is fantasy dreaming.  How much of this goes from that to real life?  Boys have to outdo their peers, so how easy is it to turn fantasy into reality.  What boy wants to admit he lied and look vary bad in front of his peers?  Most of them would rather save face and push the lie until it can be proven that they are lying.    The morality level in children these days are lower than previous generations.  There is no fear of repercussion for lying, accusing, etc.  Also, we should consider some of it as a revenge thing.  maybe they didn't get the grade they wanted or felt they deserved.  Maybe the teacher embarrassed them in front of the class.  Maybe they got one to many detentions.  More than likely it's the outdo your friend thing.  Another take is that we also train our children at an early age about inappropriate touching and spend a lot of time looking for signs of abuse.  In some extreme cases, parents grill their children so hard that the child admits the abuse in order to get the parent to stop harrassing them. Just giving another point of view.
I was watching the news yesterday and they had a report on about a student who sent an email to some of his teachers. A couple of them decided to take it up with the police because they were very frightened. The email stated that if a teacher gives any student in the class a failing grade at the end of the semester the teacher who did it would have their "Spine severed"! After investigating this the police found out which student this was. I don't know what is going to happen to this case yet but it shows how some of the student body thinks nowadays. When I was in school we would have never imagined something such as this. I find it appalling!!!!!!!!!!!!! So I think it's not a far leap for a male student to fantasize about an attractive, young teacher and to want revenge if she has embarrassed him in some way or just simply rebuffed his advances. Or for even no reason at all except to look good to his friends. I certainly cannot deny that this has happened before, we've all seen it on the news, but I don't believe EVERY accusation that comes along. I have one more point that I want to make about the female teachers who do in fact have sex with young male students. Yuck!!!!!!!!!!!! I do not know how any grown woman can find a teenage boy attractive and desirable. Call me odd but I prefer for my men to actually have hair on their chests first. I don't want to run my hands down a teen boys body and feel baby soft skin, I prefer my men to already have gone through puberty and I especially don't want to hear a guys voice change right in the middle of passion! Maybe I'm just one of those weird women who prefer a real man, one who is already all grown up. Even when I was a teenager I wasn't attracted to boys my own age, I'm in my early 40's and my husband is 59. Yes, I prefer it that way!!!!!!!!!!
 
June 13, 2008, 6:42 am CDT

not surprised

Im not surprised at all abut her situation. It's trully not her fault. I use to be a teacher in a small town in Texas. I was never accused of a sex scandal. My kids were second graders. But the other teachers on my team called my kids stupid, can't learn, and that they arent smart enough to pass. One teacher even physically harrassed one of my parents. She yelled at her as well. I was a victum of everday verbal harrasment by my coworkers for two years!  My class heard the other teachers demoralize me as well. When my class out shined theres on a benchmark test they told the principal that I must have given them the test answers cause theres no way my kids could pass a test. The principal wanted to retest my class but didnt tell me nor the parents. When the parents found out the parents got upset. They contacted the school system concerning everythiign that had happened. I went to the assistant superintendent for help. But instead of the teachers being investigated I was placed under investigation. I had all the evidence on my side and even Tony Conners was my attorney. I was told by the school to resign or my contract would be pulled. I opted to resign. Mr. Conners and I decided to fight the decision. When we went to the assistant superintendent for the meeting. He verbally attacked Mr. Conners then through us out of the building. The assistant Superintendent called the cops. The cops told us they were afriad the assistant superintendent was going to hit us with his fist. Mr. Conners was going to go to TEA (Texas Education Agency) concerning the assistant superintendents behavior but come that Monday the assistant superintendent left to school district all of a sudden and moved to Las Vegas. I decided to settle with the district instead of pursuing this any higher. I didnt do it out of guilt. I did it cause I was too burned out and frustrated.

My hubby had a promising job and he left it. We decided to move out of state. We moved to Kentucky where he has a better job. I'm not teachign anymore. I decided to run our buisness instead.

Many people don't undertstand why teachers in small towns dont stay around. Well for Texas its because of instnaces like hers and mine. If your an outsider and you try to trully give the kids hope and a future then you will be accused of something thats not true. I was fortunate I could get out. But this lady had to go all the way.

The attitude of the boy didnt surprise me either. In my case when the teachers were presented withthe truth they still calimed they were right. They even made up more allegations that were false just to prove them right. Mr. Conners proved our case was true but because my proof showed the truth they got angrier and continued to say "well Mrs. Espinosa is wrong. We are right she just makes things up." Thats just the way they are in small towns in Texas. You cant show them the truth cause they just dont want to see it.

Let me tell you. I faced even more harrasment after the settlement. In order to keep my sanity I had to be cool and collected just like this teacher on the show. In the end I was glad to say goodbye to that town. It hurt to be there.

Allison

 
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