Topic : 06/12 Teacher Sex Scandal, Part 1

Number of Replies: 352
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Created on : Friday, October 26, 2007, 03:01:39 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 11/01/07) Dr. Phil explores a disturbing trend: Female teachers engaging in sex acts with their underage male students. The number of accusations has doubled in the past five years. You've probably heard of famous cases like Mary Kay Letourneau, and Debra LaFave and the recent case of a teacher in Southern California, Meredith Johnson Vincent, who was arrested on suspicion of having a sexual relationship with a 14-year-old boy. Dr. Phil meets one teacher who has chosen to fight back. Joelle Ogletree was a respected high school French teacher until she was accused of sexual misconduct by three of her students. Find out what goes through a mother's head as she faces 160 years in prison. Plus, the Dr. Phil show speaks with one of the boys who says the sexual improprieties absolutely did happen and claims he passed a polygraph examination. When he agrees to take another test for Dr. Phil, what do his answers reveal? Joelle has been banned from even volunteering at her daughter's school because of the accusations. Should she be allowed back in the classroom? Watch and decide: Do you believe her ... or her students? Tell us what you think!

Find out what happened on the show.

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November 2, 2007, 1:43 pm PDT

Where there is smoke there is fire

I believe this woman behaved in a very suspicious way during this show:

 

She decided to take notes during Mat's accusations to avoid a face-to-face moment.  She paid attention to stupid detail like her car headlights or how long was between 2 encounters just to try to proof him wrong.  She was not able to show any emotions.

 

I don't find very difficult for a young man to fail a test on something that happened to him 5 years ago, let alone when the situation was so overwhelming to him at 16.

 

I'll bet you won't take long for her to get in trouble again if they let her back as a teacher.

 
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November 2, 2007, 1:46 pm PDT

11/01 Teacher Sex Scandal, Pt. 1

I feel like she did not have sexual relations with any of the boys in question, however some of her conduct seems a little ify.  Why would a teacher put herself in any situation that would lend itself to question? 

 
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November 2, 2007, 1:50 pm PDT

Dr. Phil, Please Get Off Of The Fence

This poor woman has been victimized in the worse way by FALSE accusations.  I was shocked and disgusted by the manner in which Dr. Phil FURTHER victimized her.  He kept insinuating that if she were truly innocent, she should have been caught up in some sort of fit of rage or anger.  Had this actually been the case, she would have been viewed as irrational or as one who obviously had something to hide or to be ashamed of.  I can only imagine how puffed up and haughty the good doctor would have sounded when saying something along the lines of, "If you're not guilty of any of these allegations, why are you so upset?  This happened long ago so you should have come to terms with it or learned better, more controlled ways of dealing with it by now. "    From all I was able to understand about this terribly unfortunate situation, the woman had ALREADY gone through all of the rage, the anger, the unjustifyable loss of her job, the public humiliation, not to mention the unnecessary strain that must have been placed on her marriage and her family life in general, etc.,  I think she displayed a TREMENDOUS level of class and self restraint (NO THANKS TO YOU, DR. PHIL!) when confronted by not one, but TWO individuals who FAILED a lie detector test.  Even then, Dr. Phil was not nearly as adamant or vigilant about defending the validity of the lie detector test as he is when it has proved that someone is guilty of stealing, using drugs or having an extra marital affair with someone in his/her own age range.  Instead of standing firmly on the test results, he kept on acting as though there was a chance that these boys may not have lied.  My suggestion is that if you're not going to uphold the results COMPLETELY, then STOP using the lie detector tests at all.  It is said that your epolygraph examiners have conducted countless tests and their work/results CAN BE trusted to the point that they would be considered experts in a court of law --or at least this is the impression you've given more than once.  If you truly believe this, Dr. Phil, why NOT just come right out and call it what is is???  A lie is a lie, no matter who is telling it.  If both of those boys had passed the lie detector tests, you'd have had no trouble coming down on that woman with bot feet!  You've had no trouble lighting into other people who have sat on that stage, why not do the same to these boys? The examiner who tested Matt seemed a little miffed --and rightly so, by the fact that you did not openly and completely support his findings.  You stayed on your safe little perch right on the MIDDLE of the fence.  You should have been defending that poor woman who has ALREADY been raked across the coals far too many times.  Had I been the polygraph examiner on today's show, your lack of back bone would have resulted in the ending of my affiliation with you and your show.  Your behavior was shameful and I pray that Robin chose to call you out on this.  You owe those boys the same kind of tongue lashing you'd give anyone else and you owe that teacher an apology.  You did NOT treat her well.  Had this been your mother, wife or some other female whom you love, you would not have wanted her to have been treated the way you handled this lady and her situation.       

 

About the notes written in code by the teacher: this lady is just that, a lady in every sense of the word.  She did NOT strike me as one who would prey upon children, nor did she strike me as one who would knowingly set out to humiliate one of her students.  I personally believe she wrote the notes in code so as NOT to cause any major embarrassment for Matt.  This ungrateful, out of control, immature BOY did not accept this gift for what it was.  I have no doubt that he sat up at night twisting and manuvering his way around until he came up with the right words to damage this lady's reputation, her credibility and her career. 

 

Dr. Phil, you even went as far as to state that the boy who was on the telephone with his mother could be viewed as believable because he was able to provide a detailed account of what he said happened when describing the so called sexual encounter with his teacher.  I attribute this to good preparation/coaching by his attorney and possibly even his mother.  It is no secret that lawyers prepare their clients PRIOR to heading off to court.  He probably held onto all of the tips and pointers he'd been given in preparation for taking the stand and he simply regurgitated them on your show. 

 

I simply CANNOT be made to believe that there is ANY teenage boy who would actually feel guilty about having been involved in a sexual encounter that was NOT an act of rape --especially with an older, experienced and attractive woman.  BOTH of the boys in this so called situation claimed to have participated willingly, now all of a sudden, we are to believe that they can honestly state (and feel) that it was wrong.  One even had the unmitigaated gall to throw his christian beliefs into the mix.  My question is, if his beliefs were strong enough to compell him to come forth afterwards, why weren't they strong enough to compell him to keep his body parts to himself altogether.  It is one thing that he claims to have been surprised by her first alleged seduction move, yet he went back for more.  That's not even close to being realistic.  It sounds to me that these boys are saying exactly what they believe their families would want them to say.   I just hope there is at least one person in each boy's family who is more concerned about truth than public appearances and that this person will be able to influence the boys to expose their lies and face the consequences of their actions. 

 

My guess is that this entire situation was motivated by two things jealousy and greed.  My understanding is that this was originally reported by a female student as a result of her personal feelings of discomfort surrounding the manner in which this lady dressed and wore her hair.  It would not surprise me at all if this female student may have had feelings for one of the boys who was supposedly involved and instead of returning her affection, he revealed that he had feelings (crush on) for the teacher and this bothered the girl.  Perhaps the girl heard one of the boys say something inappropriate to or about the teacher and threatened to tell on him, so he chose to turn the situation around and make it look as if he were the victim.  The girl, who probably liked the boy in question (and may have then felt she would now have a chance with him) chose to do whatever it took to boot the "competition" out of the picture.  What better way to get rid of her than to have her fired.   I'm amazed that no one made mention of what this girl stood to gain by reporting this teacher for changing her hair and style of clothing --nor did anyone mention if the girl happened to have dated eithr of the boys involved at any point in time.  There is truth in the old adage, "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned."  This can also true of young girls.  I think the female student's actions were motivated purely by jealously or envy.  After all, the way a woman wears her hair says NOTHING about how effective she is as a teacher.  If her clothing had truly been suggestive, provocative or inappropriate, I have no doubt that this matter would have been addressed FORMALLY by someone in an administrative position at the school.  In addition to being addressed, it would have been documented in her personnel file.  The greed part comes into play when these boys (most likely led by attorneys hired by their families) thought they could get some money out of this woman and her family.  I have no doubt that if their larger than life sized witch hunt had been successful, they'd have been poised and ready to pounce on the next set of deep pockets (the school system itself).  The teacher AND her family has suffered greatly.  They should be REWARDED in a MAJOR way for the suffering and the humiliation they've been subjected to.

 

I firmly believe that there WAS some MAJOR molestation that took place here, but it was neither at the hands of , nor due to ANY fault of this INNOCENT teacher.  On the contrary, SHE WAS THE VICTIM.  She was emotionally raped.  She is in no way to blame for any of the maddness that has ripped her life apart and it is certain that her reputation will be difficult, at best to repair. 

 

I believe that people have an inner sense of what is right and wrong.  This teacher apparently knows that there will come a day when her own children will be old enough to understand all that has gone on in this case.  Her children will be able to look at their mother with a sense of pride because she conducted herself in a respectable manner.  I could see the hurt in her eyes, but thanks be to God, she does NOT appear to have allowed hatred to seep into her heart.  That would be a burden that would be almost as heavy as the weight of sin and guilt that will follow these boys until the day that they FINALLY choose to speak up and tell the honest truth about the fact that this woman did NOTHING harmful or wrong to ANY of them.    

 
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November 2, 2007, 1:58 pm PDT

BOYS ARE LYING

I KNOW A LOT OF TEACHERS CARRY ON WITH BOYS BUT YOU CAN TELL THESE BOYS ARE LYING AND OF COURSE THEY WANT EVERYONE TO THINK THEY HAD SEX WITH THIS TEACHER BECAUSE IT MAKES THEM LOOK BIG AND ITS HARD WHEN ITS HER WORD AGAINST THEIRS AND IF IT REALLY HAPPENED, WHY DIDN'T THEY COME FORWARD WHEN THEY HAD SEMEN TO TEST.  THEY JUST WANTED TO BRAG BECAUSE THEY KNEW IF THREE CAME FORWARD, IT WOULD BE HARD TO DISPROVE.  SHE HAS BEEN THROUGH TRIALS, HUMILIATION AND MORE AND THEN THEY CATCH ONE BOY IN A LIE AND HE BACKED OUT, BUT THESE TWO WILL GO TO THEIR GRAVES LYING BECAUSE THEY HAVE LIED SO LONG ABOUT IT, IT WOULD BE BAD FOR THEM TO TELL THE TRUTH NOW.  HE CANNOT KEEP A STRAIGHT FACE AND IT'S A SHAME THESE BOYS HAVE RUINED HER CAREER JUST SO THEY COULD LOOK LIKE BIG SHOTS.  IT MAKES ME SICK  HOW THEY HAVE GOTTEN AWAY WITH KEEPING HER OUT OF THE SCHOOL AND HOW THOSE PEOPLE IN HER TOWN TREAT HER AND I THINK THEY ALL SHOULD GO TO HELL IN THE END.  I HAD SOMEONE YOUNG SAY THEY HAD SEX WITH ME WHEN I WAS YOUNG AND HIS MOTHER CAME TO MY HOME TO TELL MY MOTHER AND IT NEVER HAPPENED AND WE STOOD UP TO THEM AND TOLD THEM, BUT THE MOTHER BELIEVED T HE SON BECAUSE MOTHERS WILL ALWAYS PROTECT THEIR SONS EVEN WHEN THEY ARE VERY WRONG, SO I KNOW THIS CAN HAPPEN AND ALL ALONG THE BOY JUST WANTED TO ACT LIKE HE HAD DONE SOMEONE AND BRAG ABOUT IT AS BOYS WILL DO.  HE IS A LIAR AND OF COURSE THE UGLY BOY WOULD WANT EVERYONE TO THINK THIS BEAUTIFUL WOMAN WOULD GIVE HIM ANY ATTENTION AT ALL.  SHE COULD HAVE ANY MAN SHE WANTED AND SHE PICKED THIS UGLY RED HEADED BOY?  I AM NOT BUYING IT FOR A MINUTE-BUT NOTHING IS EVER FAIR IN THE REAL WORLD. 
 
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November 2, 2007, 1:59 pm PDT

11/01 Teacher Sex Scandal, Pt. 1

Quote From: lweinmann

My thoughts exactly, if that had been a man sitting in the chair would have Dr. Phil said why aren't you crying?  He couldn't get past the fact she was strong and she is standing upright for the truth......Children and mental health?????.....let's look into what families, school systems and villages hide about mental health.  She is so innocent - I do hope that school district has to pay her lots of $'s.
I felt the same as you two and so did my husband.  Everyone deals with things differently.  She has been dealing with this a long time and maybe all those emotions that would make you cry and lose composure are gone.  I felt he attacked her because he thought she should react a certain way.  Shame on him....he is in a profession that should recognize that not all people react the in the same way. 
 
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November 2, 2007, 2:03 pm PDT

11/01 Teacher Sex Scandal, Pt. 1

Quote From: clizstuart

At the previous high school that I worked at, I was "harassed" by a male student. He continually asked me for money, he wanted to know what I thought about his looks, and he continually asked me to date him. I complanied to the department chair and to school administrators. The vice principle told me to humor him. I find nothing humorous about a 17 year old boy coming on to a 40+ year old teacher. Administration refused to stop the harassing behavior because the student was ESL ( English second language ) and special ed. Because of being ESL and in special ed, he brought in a huge amount of money to the district in government funding. That is why they tolerated his behavior and ignored my complaints.

I really feel for the teacher that you had on todays program. She is showing a great deal of courage to come forward with this. I wish that I had as much courage as her.

 

Why didn't you go to your association??????????????????????////
 
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November 2, 2007, 2:11 pm PDT

11/01 Teacher Sex Scandal, Pt. 1

Quote From: damara1210

There is no excuse for having any type of relationship with a student. Teachers are teachers of school work. Sex Education is for the parents to teach, and you so not ever engage in it with a minor child for any reason. Sick Sick people, and I think this would not have happen if the first case had been treated with very harsh puinshment like they do with men. These women need their rights as parents totally and forever removed from them. They should never be allowed near anything younger than 21 years old, PERIOD.

I THINK THAT MATT IS A LIAR !

 

A 16 YEAR OLD THAT HAS HAD SEX 1 TIME --- HE COULD ONLY HOPE FOR 10 MINUTES  OF ORAL SEX

 
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November 2, 2007, 2:16 pm PDT

Sex & Students

Once again I found Dr. Phil to be judgemental. Just because the teacher didn't get all emotional when telling her side of the storey Dr. Phil said " Well if it was me......." I found her telling of her side calm and factual. She was just trying to state the facts. Some women do not have to get hysterical and and show " emotion" when defending themselves.

Regards, Penny Pearson

 
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November 2, 2007, 2:34 pm PDT

Sex & the Students

Day 2 Dr. Phil once again told the teacher he just didn't understand how she was reacting to the confrontation.  In my opionion she was just trying to state facts that disputed the students testimony.

Why does Dr. Phil think he knows how everyone should act in such situations.

Regards, Penny Pearson

 
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November 2, 2007, 2:37 pm PDT

Don't assume you know how someon "should" act

I have substitute taught for years and worked with youth in church for years as well. I have loved those kids and wanted nothing but the best for them and always been completely appropriate. In fact I have never even been concerned about my coduct because those thoughts have never entered my mind. The truth is kids do lie...and they lie big about stuff you would never believe...I have seen it before. I have had some students  who had a crush on me that I was aware of and I always blew them off, thinking they were harmless. Now I can totally see how something simple, taken out of context, can put a teacher in a very precarious situation if a child were ever to get an imagination. For instance putting an arm around the student walking down the hall seemed completely natural and harmless, but seeing how eager people are to judge and how easily things can be taken way out of context truly frightens me. People are still innocent until proven guilty right???? Man this was very eye opening.
 
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