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Topic : 06/24 Banned from the Wedding, Part 2

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Created on : Tuesday, November 20, 2007, 06:04:42 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 11/27/07) Dr. Phil follows up with a family torn apart when the mother was banned from her only son’s wedding. The bride-to-be, Michelle, said she’d rather burn in hell than let her future mother-in-law, Jane, attend the ceremony, and her fiancé, Jay, stood behind her decision. This sent the entire family into a tailspin, with the best man resigning, the aunt disowning the groom and the wedding planner on alert to call 911 if Jane showed up. The big day has come and gone, and everyone returns to update Dr. Phil with the latest. Were they able to bury the hatchet before the wedding? Jane has gone through a rollercoaster of emotions, and Dr. Phil finds out what has her so mad at him, she even wrote him a scathing letter one week after her appearance. Has Jane done a 180-degree turn since? Has Michelle stopped her “campaign of hate mail” as Jane called it and opened up her arms to her husband’s mother? Share your thoughts, join the discussion.

Find out what happened on the show.

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November 30, 2007, 7:03 pm PST

A challenge, fer sher

Just curious if anyone else noticed the glaring similarities between Michelle & the daughter-in-law from another recent show, Deanna?  Both had issues with their MILs -- issues that seemed to revolve around relationship boundaries . .  Deanna was a lot more self-possessed and Michelle had the teenage eye-rolling thing down pat, but both of them struck me as having a gaping void where their empathy should be. 

I think part of the problem with Michelle & Jay is simply their age.  Both of them are awfully young and as so many have already pointed out, their self-centeredness and immaturity is painful to watch.  I do wonder what their childhoods were (are?) like and whether either of them ever had an opportunity to actually see what a healthy relationship looks like?  It is SO true that we often unconsciously duplicate the environment we grew up in -- if it was fraught with drama, then no surprise that we are drawn to someone who will create that same drama if for no other reason than that's what we know.  If Jay's mother was always front and center with her emotions, then he may never have learned to connect to his own, but does so vicariously through his wife.  I've seen this pattern play itself out so many times.

The whole business of the MySpace tell-all, the cutting up and tossing of the flowers . . . very vindictive and unbecoming behavior, but honestly, I cringe to think I had some similar attitude problems when I was a young bride and I contributed to tension with my in-laws in a way that I wish I could take back now, years later.  The situation was a bit different in that my husband was the one who had the conflict with his mother, but because of my utter unquestioning devotion to him and my inability to perceive him as flawed in any way, I participated in the collusion to keep her demonized and at arm's length.  But after the inevitable divorce (my biggest lesson having been "always pay attention to how a man treats his mother, since that is most likely how he'll treat his wife"), I did keep the door open since there was a child from the marriage, and over time she and I began to get to know each other.  We both had counseling at different stages of our lives, and that made a difference too.  It enabled us to learn to be better, kinder people, and we could start to see each other through softer eyes.  That empathy -- it goes a long way.  Rather than asking "what do I need from this person," turning the question around to ask "what might this person need from ME?" can sometimes, I think, help get past the posturing and the obnoxious behaviors and start to excavate the real layers beneath.  My ex-MIL has been a terrific grandma to my son, and a good friend to me, even though her son -- my ex -- never allowed her back into his life. (He died before our son reached adulthood.)  My ex-MIL was one of my greatest champions in terms of finding that truly right partner -- she promised she would dance at my wedding - and she did!  Looking back, I so regret those lost years between us, but I guess we both had some growing to do.

I think it's wonderful that Jane has taken the initiative with the counseling, and I noticed a marked difference in her during the second show.  I'm not prepared to play "thought police" and cast aspersions on her sincerity, I tend to take people's efforts at making life changes at face value.  Whether her efforts result in a better relationship with her son & DIL is anyone's guess I suppose, a lot depends on their willingness to come down off that lofty perch where they've ensconced themselves.  The dynamics certainly seemed unbalanced on the show, ideally M&J will begin their own counseling and at some point, a counselor or facilitator at some point would work with them as a group.


 
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November 30, 2007, 7:07 pm PST

The price of pride.

The bride, the mother, and the groom all need to weigh the price they will pay for their pride, their need to be right.

 

When I look at my beautiful grandchildren I know that I would give up the need to be right, rather than not see them. I would find a way to get along with the devil himself if that's what I had to do to be able to hear them laugh, see their beautiful smiles, and feel their wonderful hugs: and when I hear "I love you, grandma", that's the real capper.

 

My husband had an ex-wife and two children when we married. We proceeded to have three children. The ex-wife re-married and had three beautiful daughters. Through the years we all got along because the children were all siblings of my step-children. I couldn't have known how much of a blessing that would turn out to be.

 

I am now a mother-in-law, and I was a daughter-in-law.

 

When I was a daughter-in-law:

My mother-in-law had some faults, and she had some wonderful traits. She came as a package, I had to accept the whole package if I wanted to have her wonderful traits in our lives. She was a wonderful grandmother to all our children. It would have been such a horrible loss not to have had her in our lives, especially if that loss was caused by my petty pride, or my need to be right. My children remember all the good years they had with their grandmother, the stories that only she could tell them, the love that only she could give them, they won't remember whether I was right or not in an argument.

 

I held my mother-in-law's hand when she drew her last breath, and it broke my heart to lose her.

 

I am now a mother-in-law:

I love my son so very much, and was so close to him all through the years. He was the one that would open up to me, when he came home from a date, or when a girl had dumped him and broken his heart. We were emotionally very close, and that ended when he took a wife. Of course I missed the talks we used to share, but I understand it. He has a life partner to share his emotions and talks with, and that's as it should be. Our roles have changed. My daughter-in-law is his emotional support, and if she isn't, then that is between my son and his wife, that's no longer my role to play. My son loves me and needs me as much as he ever did, just in a different way.

 

My daughter-in-law is an outstanding person. She has given me three of the most beautiful, sweet, intelligent and loving grandchildren any grandmother could hope to enjoy. I love my daughter-in-law, but if I didn't, I would find a way to get along with her and show her respect, if for no other reason than out of respect and love for my son and grandchildren.

 

I have lost my parents, my in-laws, my husband, and my stepdaughter to death. I have no regrets about a second I spent with any of them. I think of how much I would have missed with them had I let pride and the need to be right take all that love and sharing away from me. Because of my mother-in-law, and my husband and his ex-wife, I now have not only my children and grandchildren, but the ex-wife's children in my life, her children and our children are all one family. I would have lost all of this had I cut my mother-in-law out of my life.

 

When my husband's ex-wife died, I sat by her bed and told her what wonderful children she had raised, and that I loved her. She looked at me, squeezed my hand, and smiled. I left the room crying.

 

I would tell these people to look at the big picture. A little bit of forgiveness and respect goes a long way, I know, I've been there, I've been forgiven, and I have forgiven, it works.

 

Sallygoodin

 

 

 

 
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November 30, 2007, 8:06 pm PST

Therapy

Quote From: tweekie64

I am a mother in law and I really felt very sorry for the mother of the son. The girl that he was marrying really was very "mean spirited!" I don't know how things could be fixed unless the bride would learn how to respect other peoples feelings! When the children come along, it will only get worse because they have started out on the wrong path. The mother always holds the key to the gate.
I was disappointed that only Jane saw a therapist.  Michelle and Jay need to seek professional help too.  Then all three go together and get things straigtened out before any children are involved.
 
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November 30, 2007, 8:20 pm PST

Get along

Quote From: sallygoodin

The bride, the mother, and the groom all need to weigh the price they will pay for their pride, their need to be right.

 

When I look at my beautiful grandchildren I know that I would give up the need to be right, rather than not see them. I would find a way to get along with the devil himself if that's what I had to do to be able to hear them laugh, see their beautiful smiles, and feel their wonderful hugs: and when I hear "I love you, grandma", that's the real capper.

 

My husband had an ex-wife and two children when we married. We proceeded to have three children. The ex-wife re-married and had three beautiful daughters. Through the years we all got along because the children were all siblings of my step-children. I couldn't have known how much of a blessing that would turn out to be.

 

I am now a mother-in-law, and I was a daughter-in-law.

 

When I was a daughter-in-law:

My mother-in-law had some faults, and she had some wonderful traits. She came as a package, I had to accept the whole package if I wanted to have her wonderful traits in our lives. She was a wonderful grandmother to all our children. It would have been such a horrible loss not to have had her in our lives, especially if that loss was caused by my petty pride, or my need to be right. My children remember all the good years they had with their grandmother, the stories that only she could tell them, the love that only she could give them, they won't remember whether I was right or not in an argument.

 

I held my mother-in-law's hand when she drew her last breath, and it broke my heart to lose her.

 

I am now a mother-in-law:

I love my son so very much, and was so close to him all through the years. He was the one that would open up to me, when he came home from a date, or when a girl had dumped him and broken his heart. We were emotionally very close, and that ended when he took a wife. Of course I missed the talks we used to share, but I understand it. He has a life partner to share his emotions and talks with, and that's as it should be. Our roles have changed. My daughter-in-law is his emotional support, and if she isn't, then that is between my son and his wife, that's no longer my role to play. My son loves me and needs me as much as he ever did, just in a different way.

 

My daughter-in-law is an outstanding person. She has given me three of the most beautiful, sweet, intelligent and loving grandchildren any grandmother could hope to enjoy. I love my daughter-in-law, but if I didn't, I would find a way to get along with her and show her respect, if for no other reason than out of respect and love for my son and grandchildren.

 

I have lost my parents, my in-laws, my husband, and my stepdaughter to death. I have no regrets about a second I spent with any of them. I think of how much I would have missed with them had I let pride and the need to be right take all that love and sharing away from me. Because of my mother-in-law, and my husband and his ex-wife, I now have not only my children and grandchildren, but the ex-wife's children in my life, her children and our children are all one family. I would have lost all of this had I cut my mother-in-law out of my life.

 

When my husband's ex-wife died, I sat by her bed and told her what wonderful children she had raised, and that I loved her. She looked at me, squeezed my hand, and smiled. I left the room crying.

 

I would tell these people to look at the big picture. A little bit of forgiveness and respect goes a long way, I know, I've been there, I've been forgiven, and I have forgiven, it works.

 

Sallygoodin

 

 

 

You said you would do anything to get along............excuse me..........Michelle stopped Jane in her tracks every time she has tried to get along.....Michelle does not want to get along.....she is selfish thinks only of herself....treats her husband Jay like he is her puppet on a string....do as I say and want.......this situation is so upsetting........It is easier for Jay to cow cow to Michelle....he thinks this is the way to keep peace....he is denying himself a mother and everything else in life......Dr. Phil you need to help this boy before his wife ruins their children too ......He is  enabling her....he needs some back bone........he needs some help .and support to know what to do in this situation.......
 
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November 30, 2007, 8:39 pm PST

One thing I haven't seen discussed

One thing I haven't seen discussed here is:

 

I call you a name, you call me a name- Okay

 

You send me flowers when I say no contact- I cut them up- Okay

 

But what offense equals you don't get to come to your only child's wedding?

 

The size of this particular penalty is HUGE.  The lobs traded don't  and haven't added up for this.  And this is where Goldilocks's sees she's not going to win this round of the fight and pulls out the machine gun instead of the fly swatter and blasts away.

 

Totally overkill-buzz- foul

 
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November 30, 2007, 9:12 pm PST

Unbelievable!

Dr. Phil was way too nice to this girl. She is an immature, controlling, combative, and disrespectful little wench! I think she should have been told like it is. She is young and immature, newly married to her young and immature husband who didn't have the cajones to stand up to his fiance and have his mother at the wedding. His mother has done nothing that warranted her from being banned from the wedding. Considering the divorce rate among people under the age of 25 this one should last oh maybe a year or two. And we all know what will happen then. Husband will run to his mother with his tail tucked between his legs when his lovely wife either cheats or pushes him over the edge. This girl does not want to have a relationship with her mother in law no matter what she says. No one with half a heart would go through with a wedding knowing that they were the reason that the other side of the family was not in attendance. She doesn't want to share her husband and that is the bottom line. She called her mother in law immature but she is the one that cut up a dozen roses......that was not only immature but disrespectful. Not only to the mother in law but her now husband.  This couple clearly needs to GROW UP and GET OVER IT! Who cares what she has said! Didn't anyone ever teach her about sticks and stones! She is trying to control her mother in law just as much as she controls her husband. No one is worth risking a relationship with your parents! He WILL resent this woman someday and realize what precious  time and
moments he has let slip by. (I'm sure his next wedding will be
wonderful!)
 
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November 30, 2007, 10:58 pm PST

The Pot Calling The Kettle Black

Quote From: deedee100

WHAT'S THE MATTER, SOUNDS A LITTLE TOO MUCH LIKE YOU, TOO!   GOT YA!

And you think Michelle has issues?  That she "needs a good spanking?"

 

WOW.

 

Most people post thought provoking, respectful comments on this message board.  I believe that is why these discussions were created, to share opinions to promote better understanding.  I have learned a great deal from several people who have posted.

 

But I'm sure you'll have something to throw back after these comments!  The maturity level astounds me!

 
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November 30, 2007, 11:54 pm PST

Word of warning to the couple

Cut the ties now.  My mother said that she would change and has changed.  That might last a small amount of time but it will come back around when they least expect it.  I have a mother that was psycho like this.  When my daughter was 5 she took her pettiness and jealously out on my daughter.   At that point all ties were cut but not without hurting an innocent child.  It is almost 4 years later and my daughter still talks about what she said to her.  Don't get me wrong.  I have in my heart forgiven her but will never put my daughter in a situation that she can mentally hurt her like that again. 

What bothers me most about this mother in law is that when they started bringing up things that she said and she denyed it she started in on "lets forget about the past and move forward".  She wouldn't answer questions about her past actions and words but took every opportunity to put down her DIL's and Son's.  Bottom line is be very careful  and guarded with the relationship is you go forward with it.

 
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December 1, 2007, 6:38 am PST

Still inconciderate!

I beleive everyone should be given the chance to change! I think the daughter in-law is still inconciderate; The son needs to stand up for himself. Let by gones be by gones. They have a future that can bring them so much more positive memories instead of holding a grudge. The mother has worked hard from the last episode and she was explosive; hopefully things have changed for the better for all. I can relate to family fueds. It's sad when we waste so much time on negativity. Some thing good should come out of it.

CKLS1

 
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December 1, 2007, 7:38 am PST

Yes!

Quote From: kim780

I thought what you said and how you put it was great. Really clear and not mean or nasty to either side. I could not agree more with you. Although the mil ( as I said in previous posts) was maninpulative, jealous and bitter..............it doesn't mean she is that way. She came across that way because of fear. She is a single parent of her only son and scared of what this marriage means. She is clinging so hard because fear is causing her to do that. She sees Michelle as the enemy because she has come along and the son loves her and wants a independent life....which the mil hears as i do not need you anymore. That is so far from the truth................but she needs to figure that out on her own. ( not allowing her to the wedding was harsh and sad, but unfortunately there may not have been another way at that point for them)

 

The dil Michelle came off as clingy, hard headed, abrasive, controlling and lacking empathy..........it does not mean she is that way. She sees the mil as trying to prevent her new life........................she needs to figure out that the mil only has power if it is given to her. 

The mil has to achknowledge what she did and let Jay's other family members know he is not evil and lying. And his new wife is not evil..........they need to step back look at the past without dragging it full force into their future.

 

Also I may mention to everyone reading this the "list" of 15 things that people hated. MY husband and I  have a written guideline with my mil. It does list things for her not to do................but mostly it is a guideline to ensure mutual respect and love on both sides. The guidelines is actually a common thing suggested by therapists when a relationship has gone so far off course and there is a desire to get it back on track. With guidelines you can stop focusing on what not to do when together, because it is in writting so everyone is aware..................and start concentrating on rebuilding a relationship......eventually the " guidelines" go away

but they served their purpose. I think many people misunderstood the guidelines and found them offensive. I do understand that when you first hear of them but my husband and I found them extrememly helpful and so did my mil once she stopped feeling offended and like we were treating her as a child. It was not our intent. I honestly believe without the written guidelines we couldn't have moved past things as well as we did..........................once written you can stop dwelling on them.  

You are so right with this! I guess if you have never been in this situation, one would be quick to judge Michelle. When you are in the heat of battle, you do and say things that you would normally never do or say. Also, when you have exhausted all of your options like FIRST trying to discuss things in a rational manner (they don't listen), you scream and yell (they don't listen), you threaten (they don't listen), you write letters (they don't listen). They continue their destructive behavior, and say "I can do whatever I want"!  You get to the point where you so say enough! That's it! We're Done! That is the point I believe Jay and Michelle are at. If want to have a relationship that works, yes, they have to write down the guidelines. Because she will not get it any other way!
 
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