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Topic : News, Politics and Current Events

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Created on : Wednesday, November 28, 2007, 05:18:57 pm
Author : pennylane_78
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January 31, 2008, 1:52 pm CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: baeiouy

I was wondering what are peoples main issues when they are looking at a candidate?

 

I have to say mine is illegal immigration.  It is truly scary that lack of knowledge people have on the subject and how poorly it is being covered by the newspapers.  I can not tell you how tired I am reading about how we dont want immigrants in the USA.  There is a huge difference between someone who comes here legally and ones that dont.

 

It also amazes me that lack of coverage on how much having illegals in the US cost the citizens/ LPRs of this country.  On average we are looking at between 2-5 billion dollars a year.  If we actually fix one issue, such as this, can you imagine how much money we could actually save and other issues can be helped too.

 

Not to mention how scary that we dont know who actually is in the US.  I was recently home and my mom was telling me about how this woman from Afghanistan came over to the US, became an overstay (hence illegal), ended up paying someone to marry her, to be legal in the US.  She was highly seek-ed out by both the FBI and CIA because of where she was from.  What happened is that she actually was sending secrets back to Afghanistan.  She of course is going to trial and most likely will be convicted.  Also, one of the people that flew into the Trade Towers started out as an illegal and then got a student visa. 

 

It is really scary that people just dont care about this issue.

 

Funny you should mention this issue.

 

Is it an issue that concerns me? I live in FLORIDA;  absolutelyl!!. Floridians (and Californians, Texans, et al.) were dealing with it long before it was making news in the rest of the country. Do I think any of the proposed solutions from either side of the aisle will do much? I doubt it highly. The presence of 12 million (give or take a couple million) "undocumented workers", "illegal aliens," or whatever term one chooses to apply did not happen overnight. The last "solution", roughly 20 years ago, does not seem to have improved matters much, either. Even though the post 9-11 stakes are higher (or one would think), it is unclear to me that any of the proposed solutions would really address the legitimate concerns you discuss about folks with ill intentions overstaying their visas. So I am a tad cynical, rather than apathetic, about "reform."

 

The really sad thing is that those who do attempt to play by the rules often get screwed. I have seen this first-hand among highly educated and skilled former colleagues. 

 

From your post history, as well as your current message, I take it you have more of an interest than the average layperson?

 

Prof

 
January 31, 2008, 2:02 pm CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: loretta24

Main issues?  I'm not sure I can point to any one issue but big ones for me are the environment, cleaning up the mess in Iraq (I don't how at this point we can pull out completely immediately), the economy and getting back on track financially (huge deficit needs to be cleaned up).

 

I wonder if immigration issues are covered more in border states.  I don't live in one but you are right, we hear very little in the press.  Our current situation needs to be fixed in my opinion.  If we allow those who are here illegally to become citizens it seems to be a huge slap in the face of those who have been going about it the right way.  I'm am not anti-immigrant but do feel that rules need to be followed and to award citizenship to those who went about it illegally is wrong.  Maybe the rules need to be changed, maybe not.  If you have any links to articles which address this issue I would be interested in reading.

 

We are a country of immigrants, at one time or another (unless you are a Native American) a member of our family tree was an immigrant.  I believe that they are important to our country but we do need much better control of our borders.

 

I'm not sure that people don't care about the issue as much as the fact that the press would rather make issue about really important stuff like Hillary tearing up and how Rudy's Florida strategy (heavy on the sarcasm).  I personally want to know more about the issues and less about the petty crap that goes on.   

 

Hi, Loretta,

 

Now that I've gotten my immigration soliloquy done, I can address the first question of the original post.

 

I don't have any "one litmus test" issue, either. I'd say the environment and economic issues are big ones for me. Like you, I don't see how we could pull the troops out of Iraq anytime soon; IMO, we are looking at a time frame of decades. None of the candidates has all the "perfect solutions" that I would like to see; I crossed my fingers & hoped for the best when I cast my ballot the other day.

 

I thought I was the only one SICK of hearing about Hillary's lacrimating! LOL

 

One thing I should clsrify from my last post -- I do think a border fence would be an excellent place to begin. It can't be a total solution, but it would be a start to gaining some semblance of control of the border.

 

Prof

 
January 31, 2008, 2:05 pm CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: loretta24

Main issues?  I'm not sure I can point to any one issue but big ones for me are the environment, cleaning up the mess in Iraq (I don't how at this point we can pull out completely immediately), the economy and getting back on track financially (huge deficit needs to be cleaned up).

 

I wonder if immigration issues are covered more in border states.  I don't live in one but you are right, we hear very little in the press.  Our current situation needs to be fixed in my opinion.  If we allow those who are here illegally to become citizens it seems to be a huge slap in the face of those who have been going about it the right way.  I'm am not anti-immigrant but do feel that rules need to be followed and to award citizenship to those who went about it illegally is wrong.  Maybe the rules need to be changed, maybe not.  If you have any links to articles which address this issue I would be interested in reading.

 

We are a country of immigrants, at one time or another (unless you are a Native American) a member of our family tree was an immigrant.  I believe that they are important to our country but we do need much better control of our borders.

 

I'm not sure that people don't care about the issue as much as the fact that the press would rather make issue about really important stuff like Hillary tearing up and how Rudy's Florida strategy (heavy on the sarcasm).  I personally want to know more about the issues and less about the petty crap that goes on.   

 

We are a country of immigrants, at one time or another (unless you are a Native American) a member of our family tree was an immigrant.  I believe that they are important to our country but we do need much better control of our borders.

 

The difference is, such as with my family, we came over here legal, hence they were immigrants.  There is a huge difference between immigrants and illegals.  One we actually know who is in our country, do background checks on them in this country and their former country etc and then illegals who knows.  I find it very very scary.

 

I also think something very bad is going to happen.  People are not happy and if the government doesnt start to change something it is not going to be pretty.

 
January 31, 2008, 2:12 pm CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: profmaryann

Funny you should mention this issue.

 

Is it an issue that concerns me? I live in FLORIDA;  absolutelyl!!. Floridians (and Californians, Texans, et al.) were dealing with it long before it was making news in the rest of the country. Do I think any of the proposed solutions from either side of the aisle will do much? I doubt it highly. The presence of 12 million (give or take a couple million) "undocumented workers", "illegal aliens," or whatever term one chooses to apply did not happen overnight. The last "solution", roughly 20 years ago, does not seem to have improved matters much, either. Even though the post 9-11 stakes are higher (or one would think), it is unclear to me that any of the proposed solutions would really address the legitimate concerns you discuss about folks with ill intentions overstaying their visas. So I am a tad cynical, rather than apathetic, about "reform."

 

The really sad thing is that those who do attempt to play by the rules often get screwed. I have seen this first-hand among highly educated and skilled former colleagues. 

 

From your post history, as well as your current message, I take it you have more of an interest than the average layperson?

 

Prof

Dealing with it, I see a solution but no one really wants to take a stand and do something.  For example here are some of the things that must happen.

 

1.  Penalize employers that hire illegals.  Such as 1000 dollars for each person that is not legal.

2.  Our borders have to be strengthen, whether that means more people or a fence, dont know.  Did you know that the Mexican Government and Police actually shoot at Border Patrol and come into the US with different kinds of machine guns.  Nice I know.

3.  Start deporting all convicted people.  With strengthen borders it will be hard for them to come back in, if ever.

4.  The people that are in the US, they get nothing or they have to pay out of pocket, no health care, no schooling, no housing etc, nothing.

5.  Change the Constitution that no longer allows people born in the US to be USCs.  We are the only country that still does that.

6.  Have everyone on the same page, meaning Federal, State and Local government.

7. Penalize people that are involved in marriage fraud.  There is an actually amount, but it usually is never enforced.

8.  No more TPS, Refugees or Asylums.  I enjoy when people fear for their life going back to their home country and then once become an LPR they head right back home.  It is a joke.

 

These are just a few things that need to change.

 

Also, there are only 250,000 employment based visas and you would be shocked to see the amount that goes to people as fast food cooks.  Really you can not find anyone in the US to do that?!?! 

 
January 31, 2008, 2:32 pm CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: baeiouy

Dealing with it, I see a solution but no one really wants to take a stand and do something.  For example here are some of the things that must happen.

 

1.  Penalize employers that hire illegals.  Such as 1000 dollars for each person that is not legal.

2.  Our borders have to be strengthen, whether that means more people or a fence, dont know.  Did you know that the Mexican Government and Police actually shoot at Border Patrol and come into the US with different kinds of machine guns.  Nice I know.

3.  Start deporting all convicted people.  With strengthen borders it will be hard for them to come back in, if ever.

4.  The people that are in the US, they get nothing or they have to pay out of pocket, no health care, no schooling, no housing etc, nothing.

5.  Change the Constitution that no longer allows people born in the US to be USCs.  We are the only country that still does that.

6.  Have everyone on the same page, meaning Federal, State and Local government.

7. Penalize people that are involved in marriage fraud.  There is an actually amount, but it usually is never enforced.

8.  No more TPS, Refugees or Asylums.  I enjoy when people fear for their life going back to their home country and then once become an LPR they head right back home.  It is a joke.

 

These are just a few things that need to change.

 

Also, there are only 250,000 employment based visas and you would be shocked to see the amount that goes to people as fast food cooks.  Really you can not find anyone in the US to do that?!?! 

Most of these things are already on the books in one form or another, nor are they unreasonable. In fact,  enforcing what's on the books is an excellent place to start, IMO, before additional clumsy "solutions" are enacted. The folks who would scream at that prospect are those who are profiting from the current lax enforcement of existing statutes! Natch, they have the lobbying power.

 

Is #5 correct as written? I'm not sure what you mean by this. Also, please explain your abbreviations/acronyms, as most of the rest of us have no idea about the references. Thanks.

 

Re your last paragraph, if that is true, I find it disgusting. We struggle to get Ph.D. level biomedical scientists, physicists, etc. into our research labs (US-born kids are NOT going into these fields in great numbers, and have not for decades), but we give H-1Bs to burger-flippers??!!? AARGH.

 

Prof

 
January 31, 2008, 2:39 pm CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: profmaryann

Most of these things are already on the books in one form or another, nor are they unreasonable. In fact,  enforcing what's on the books is an excellent place to start, IMO, before additional clumsy "solutions" are enacted. The folks who would scream at that prospect are those who are profiting from the current lax enforcement of existing statutes! Natch, they have the lobbying power.

 

Is #5 correct as written? I'm not sure what you mean by this. Also, please explain your abbreviations/acronyms, as most of the rest of us have no idea about the references. Thanks.

 

Re your last paragraph, if that is true, I find it disgusting. We struggle to get Ph.D. level biomedical scientists, physicists, etc. into our research labs (US-born kids are NOT going into these fields in great numbers, and have not for decades), but we give H-1Bs to burger-flippers??!!? AARGH.

 

Prof

Re your last paragraph, if that is true, I find it disgusting. We struggle to get Ph.D. level biomedical scientists, physicists, etc. into our research labs (US-born kids are NOT going into these fields in great numbers, and have not for decades), but we give H-1Bs to burger-flippers??!!? AARGH.

 

Oh yes, it is very sad.  The problem with H1Bs is that there are people in the US that would do the job, but they can hire someone else and not pay them as much.  I have seen this happen before.

 

Employment base visas are pretty much gone right away.  There is a lot of fraud when it comes with it.

 
January 31, 2008, 4:13 pm CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: baeiouy

I should have phrased that better.  As long as you, parent, are a USC/LPR, child is one.  I was talking about people that go on a plane 9 months pregnant to have the child here because they know that the hospitals can not send them away.  Once the child is born here, they stay forever.  Also, the so called midwives that give birth in the middle of the desert.  Can not prove either way.

Just want to make sure I understand....are you saying that if an illegal gives birth within the US that child should not be automatically considered a US citizen?  While I agree that I don't like that loophole, what if one parent, lets say the father is a legal US citizen?  What would prevent someone from claiming that the dad is a USC?  It would probably be cost prohibitive to DNA every baby.  Not saying that it is right but just hard to actually implement.
 
January 31, 2008, 5:50 pm CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: profmaryann

Hi, Loretta,

 

Now that I've gotten my immigration soliloquy done, I can address the first question of the original post.

 

I don't have any "one litmus test" issue, either. I'd say the environment and economic issues are big ones for me. Like you, I don't see how we could pull the troops out of Iraq anytime soon; IMO, we are looking at a time frame of decades. None of the candidates has all the "perfect solutions" that I would like to see; I crossed my fingers & hoped for the best when I cast my ballot the other day.

 

I thought I was the only one SICK of hearing about Hillary's lacrimating! LOL

 

One thing I should clsrify from my last post -- I do think a border fence would be an excellent place to begin. It can't be a total solution, but it would be a start to gaining some semblance of control of the border.

 

Prof

Hi Prof,

 

Well I can now say thank you to the state of Florida for sending Rudy packing.  I'm still trying to forgive you all for 2000 but I digress ;) just joking btw.  Back to Rudy, when I was a resident of New York he drove me nuts, I could not have handled 4 years of dear Rudy.

 

None of the candidates are my ideal either.  Since I can only vote in the Democratic primary I have Hillary and Obama to choose between.  There are some things that I agree and disagree with both of them, I have changed my mind almost daily.  Today Obama is looking good though.

 

 

 
January 31, 2008, 7:03 pm CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: loretta24

Hi Prof,

 

Well I can now say thank you to the state of Florida for sending Rudy packing.  I'm still trying to forgive you all for 2000 but I digress ;) just joking btw.  Back to Rudy, when I was a resident of New York he drove me nuts, I could not have handled 4 years of dear Rudy.

 

None of the candidates are my ideal either.  Since I can only vote in the Democratic primary I have Hillary and Obama to choose between.  There are some things that I agree and disagree with both of them, I have changed my mind almost daily.  Today Obama is looking good though.

 

 

Loretta,

 

You're quite welcome; glad to help out. =) LOL  I actually watched the Rep debate here last week. Rudy gave me GAS. A couple of his answers --  I just wanted to throw something at the set in retaliation!

 

We also sent Edwards home -- OK with being down to 2 to choose from? ;)

 

What is gonna get SCARY is if there is no runaway Dem nominee after the primaries are over. See, Florida's punishment from the DNC for holding its primary "too early" (never mind that our Lege is Republican-controlled) was that our delegates won't be seated, as in none of fifty-seven. Hillary has already said she'll fight for FL's delegates to be seated (Gee, it wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that she WON, would it??).

 

If it's too close to call, it could get ugly, and good ol' FloriDUH will be at the center of it, AGAIN.

 

Prof

 
February 1, 2008, 6:47 am CST

News, Politics and Current Events

Quote From: loretta24

Just want to make sure I understand....are you saying that if an illegal gives birth within the US that child should not be automatically considered a US citizen?  While I agree that I don't like that loophole, what if one parent, lets say the father is a legal US citizen?  What would prevent someone from claiming that the dad is a USC?  It would probably be cost prohibitive to DNA every baby.  Not saying that it is right but just hard to actually implement.

Let's say that you are a USC and your spouse is not.  Your child is born overseas.  Your child is automatically a USC if you can prove certain things, such as being in the US for a certain amount of times.

 

If both parents are USC and child born aboard, child automatically becomes USC.

 

One parent USC and one parent not.  There is a law actually dealing with this.  If the people are not married it lands who has custody of the child.  If the non-USC, then the child is out of luck.  Of course that can change as long as it is done by a certain birthdate and yes if they people are not married, they have to prove DNA in order to get the child citizenship.  I have done cases like this before.

 

These are already covered in the law.  Everything that you are talking about. 

 

 
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