Topic : 12/04 Doomed from the Start?

Once again your were right on with your opinion.  It was interesting to hear the Rev.'s opinion as well.  As a Christian, we are taught to forgive, but adultry is a "deal breaker"!!  I was glad that you moved the lady from her husband, otherwise I'm not sure if she would have made it through the show mentally.  I'm glad that they took you up on the offer to get them help.

First let me say I did not watch the entire show. What I disagree with is this blanket statement that men should not in anyway defend themselves when they are attacked by women. That they should just walk away.

Dr. Phil doesn't recognize that sometimes you need to defend yourself to get in position to walk away. My ex-wife would not allow me to walk away without attacking me, or blocking my exit. I was too young to know I should've just called the police and let them handle it. Young women are far more aggressive than they were in the 70's or before. They do attack, they do get physical, and to leave you have get them off of you. A big reason why my ex is an ex. It didn't make me a bigger man, but it did stop the attack and get me out of the house. It was my blood being spilled, and I'm glad we divorced.

 

My wife and I have been married 20 years, neither of us has ever raised a hand let alone had a harsh word. In principal, I absolutely agree that you don't get physical with a woman, and I also agree all boys should be raised that way, as I was.

 

Women should also be raised never attack their men....but they are not. My ex also got physical in her 2nd and 3rd marraige. You'd hope that no man would ever be that stupid again.  Education doesn't make her better. She is a professor at a major university and has a Phd in Philosophy and she is still an idiot. Now mentally abusing our adult daughter (and getting her to support her mother, because she never learned to live within her means) 

You can't have a reasonable conversation with someone like this. Part of his abuse is the denial, to make you doubt your own perceptions. The link here helped me see some of the techniques my husband was using. http://www.youarenotcrazy.com/ And I also read a book by Patricia Evans on the Verbally Abusive Relationship. It helped me catch on to his techniques so that they no longer have power over me. After almost 25 years, I am free. We are legally separated and I feel like I am actually alive, rather than walking on eggshells. When we would go to counseling, he denied that he was abusive. He said that I was being extreme and exagerating. Now I know that was part of how he maintained power over me. I looked into narcissism and suggested to his therapist that they do a psychological test for that. They said it was probably just depression. Nope! I was right. He is the most narcissistic man some of our therapists have ever seen. Very slick in his self-centeredness. Please keep your son away from him as much as possible. I didn't protect mine enough and now, at 19, I see alot of his father's anger and self-centeredness in him. I have alot of regrets that I didn't leave sooner. It's just in time for you and your son.

Congratulations to you on your long marriage AND your wisdom.

 

As a mother of both a girl and a boy, a high school teacher and a former parole officer, I can tell you that there is a HUGE double standard when it comes to domestic violence. NO VIOLENCE should be acceptable... ever. I have educated my children and those in my classes that nobody has a right to put his(OR HER) hand on anybody out of anger. And when a girl attacks/hits a guy, she is no better than he is if he puts a hand on her. In fact, if she's bright, she'll recognize that the chances of being struck are great. She is at fault if she strikes first (and vice versa). This idea that boys should walk away and girls should get away with violence is non-sense. The police should be called the minute force is used to harm someone or block her/his exit.

 

If more girls/women respected themselves and their bodies, they would not tolerate loser guys. They would not tolerate being hit. Sadly, many young women are growing up in houses where domestic abuse is common, their mothers date and date and date (and move men in and out like funiture) and their fathers walk away from their marital and parental responsiblities. When young people have low self-esteem, they will tolerate much more than they would have otherwise. I blame the parents; it is their MORAL and legal duty to care for their children, protect them and teach them well.

 

As for your comment about advanced degrees, my husband and I may only have our Masters degrees, but we, too, have known some who are educationally brighter (PHD's, etc), but who have no common sense whatsoever. A degree does not mean one is intelligent in life; it simply means one is intelligent in a chosen field of study. And I have two relatives with NO college degrees, but who are academically "gifted" (130 IQ and above), work hard and lead high quality lives. One sells cars for a living (by choice...it's his love) and the other works in a nursing home (by choice...he loves working with the elderly).

 

As for domestic violcence, as someone once said, "Love does not hurt." If it's painful, it's not love. GET OUT! And RUN, don't walk, if children are involved. We parents owe our kids at least that much.

I agree to some extent; however, sometimes it's not a "mistake" (which is a one-time thing). Sometimes it has to do with PATTERNS OF BEHAVIOR. There are those who mess up (and who are TRULY remorseful) and it's obvious they will never ever mess up again. But many who cheat have long histories of cheating. As Dr. Phil states, "Past behaivor is the best indicator of future behavior."

 

Some of us don't have it in us to cheat. I would be honest with my husband (if I fell in love w/ someone else...although I would never place myself in that situtation) and I would file for divorce. Cheating is a big hurful lie and I respect myself and my husband too much to lie.

 

My husband and I have been married 19 years. We are the best of friends, lovers, parents, etc. We love to spend our free time together and our family is truly blessed. We both come from families with NO divorce. We are strong Catholic families who attend mass together every Sunday, are very involved in church groups and spend our free time volunteering for charitable organizations. My husband and I know that marriage has its up and downs, but that our committment to God is #1 in our lives.

 

Sadly, we have had friends who have gone thru divorces. One friend married a man whom she had had an affair with. She was wife #3. Her marriage to "the dog" lasted just 2 years before he cheated on her. There was little pity for her (she was "a dog" too for helping him to cheat on his previous wife). But now she has moved on and she is doing well, he continues to "cheat" on wife #4 and as long as STUPID WOMEN don't "judge" him, he'll continue to hurt others while being so selfish. Let's face it, this man doesn't make "mistakes." He has made cheating a way of life. He IS a "dog." He's a selfish, immoral, hurtful dog!!!

Great post. Yes, what does it say about us when we pick losers. We cannot like ourselves or respect ourselves very much when we choose these guys. The problem with many women (and men perhaps) is that we move on to new people before we have worked on our own selves. We will continue to pick the same losers UNTIL we change who we are on the inside.

 

My sister has always dated losers. She has been married to one for 16 years. She is about ready to call it quits, but we all know that she will simply move on to the next loser. She has yet to deal with WHY she picks these types of guys. Until she does, there's little hope for her. We've tried to talk to her about changing herself (we can't change the behavior of others, but we can change how we react to it).

 

I have always picked great guys (minus one I dated for 7 months 2 decades ago). It's hard for me to understand why my sister tolerates what she does, but it is not uncommon. Too many women are like my sister. Too many women don't feel they deserve more and they don't like themselves enough to demand more! I think a fear of being alone is a huge part of why they SETTLE.

Your post is a well written post.  I am glad that you got away from your abuser.  Daughters and sons alike should be taught that you do not hit other people.  I agree that a man does not have to take abuse by virtue of being born male.  You need to physically restrain someone who is physically attacking you. 

 

Dr. Phil is a good ole Texan- a southern gentleman married to a southern lady.  I agree that men are stronger and it does not make for a fair fight, but you have the right to stop the abuse.  You aren't talking about a Scarlett O'Hara slap on the face- you are talking about physical abuse.  That is just as unacceptable from a woman.  You did good to make her your ex.

In no way do I think cheating or abuse is acceptable.  However, I strongly believe the woman in his episode is lying.  Perhaps he isn't an angel, but I really believe she is exagerrating the truth.  Her "trembling" was intentional, she couldn't squeeze out a tear -- though she tried hard, and she had this smirk on her face the whole time.

 

Am I alone in thinking this??

Did it ever occur to Dr. Phil that the wife might have been putting on an act?  All that trembling.....give me a break!

 

Also, I don't trust ministers who run "mega-churches". 

I am sitting here watching the show and I am in shock. There life is a mirror of mine. Right down to all the names and the lies he is telling. I am sick right now. I am hearing what I live. I am so desperate to get help too. I am so disgusted by men like him and my husband. they get away with there behaviour and know that they can because we are trapped in this marriage. I don't have the family to leave and stay with. She should never take him back. Leave and don't look back he will never change. Take it from me after 18 years of marriage I am still living in the same nightmare. I have stayed and tried to give him every chance to change. It will never change. They don't have to.  I am trapped and he knows it.