Topic : A Barack and McCain...

Number of Replies: 176
New Messages This Week: 32
Last Reply On:
Created on : Wednesday, February 06, 2008, 08:59:36 am
Author : maxy74

February 5, 2008

For the past eight years under the current Republican presidential administration, we've witnessed America's economic system go from bad to worse. This administration has committed thousands of American soldiers to a war that is not justified because 'weapons of mass destruction' were never found, which is what the United States supposedly went into Iraq for. We all know that Osama bin Laden is alive and well somewhere in the world, and the President has yet to bring this man to justice before the American people to stand trial for acts of terrorism and murder committed on U.S. soil on September 11, 2001. Why? The Bush and Bin Laden families have financial ties, which have existed for many years.

 

Although I believe that our Federal Government is indeed one huge corporation, and there is nothing no President can do whomever he or she may be that will change institutionalized governmental gangsterism, I still believe in some kind of change which is why I voted for Barack Obama today. Like so many Americans, I desire to see a few changes in this country. I'm tired of this Republican-run White House and a bunch of men in power who really doesn't have this country's best interest at heart. I'm tired of making excuses for politicians whose heart has waxed cold toward elderly citizens and the poor. There are far too many churches and Christian (Republican) politicians in the state of Georgia for thousands of people to be homeless. It irritates me to no end that Georgia is a republican state. I am sick to death of some of these silly-ass laws currently in place, which continuously perpetuate institutionalized racism which also includes discriminatory practices, racist/prejudiced attitudes and behaviorism in all facets of American life. I want all Republicans who hold positions of government (local, state and federal) in Georgia to be voted out of office or run out of office.

 

You have caused American taxpayers billions of dollars on senseless projects and wars! You have bankrupted this country to the point that now foreigners devour it in our midst! You have bullied foreign nations to the point that now they hate America and would like nothing better than to see this country's demise!

 

Based on the economic hardships Georgia citizens (really citizens across the entire nation) are currently experiencing, another Republican president for another four-year or eight-year term would not be in this country's best interest. In fact, the powers that be would love to see another Republican president in the White House so that their agenda(s) could continue to be carried out. There are powerful people in this country that wants America to become more economically crippled. They want more terrorist attacks upon U.S. citizens. Why? So they could declare martial law, take away civil liberties, and finally, change the Constitution of the United States in order to establish a dictatorship in this country. This may sound unrealistic, but it's not.



User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
June 19, 2008, 7:33 pm PDT

A Barack and McCain...

Quote From: gwarrior6

 

You can believe whatever you want to believe.

 

I however, DO NOT believe the pin thing is stupid.  Name-calling is the basest form of human discourse, why call those who value patriotism morons?  My father was bothered by the "pin thing", he has a law degree, was invited to join Mensa after taking the LSAT and made the 2nd highest score on his Bar exam.  It's important to my cousin, a petroleum engineer, it's important to my aunt, who teaches medical school. 

 

This is a way to connect with those whom he chooses to serve.  Instead, he'd rather pander to terrorists.  Look, the pledge is a way to connect with those who love our country and would die to protect it.  The pledge was created out of patriotic feelings of national unity.  This is not about conforming, it's about showing respect.

 

Why is it backwards?  To remember who we are?  To remember what happened the day before yesterday?  To forget history, and allow those in power to rewrite it is criminal.  I won't let them.

 

I'm set in my ways because I've actually researched O, and the more I look up, the more I'm positive he wouldn't be the right man for the job.  It's merely a growing confidence in what I believe to be true.  You seem set in YOUR ways too by stating that the pledge "is a stupid, meaningless gesture" and patriotic Americans who want to connect with a potential leader are "morons".  Those are pretty strong statements too.

 

If you don't like or enjoy debating politics, why start a debate by fronting an opposing viewpoint?  I can debate this forever.  Obviously we aren't going to change each other's minds about what we think, and that's okay, we all have the freedom to think differently (wouldn't the world be boring if we were all the same?).  Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them "stupid" or "morons", they look at thinks differently from a separate value system. 

 

With that conclusion, I want to say that I don't appreciate those (not necessarily you, but other atheists on blogs) claim that Christians or any religious people are "stupid" for believing in a supreme being.  I find that offensive because Christianity is an interpretation of reality, a why to the how.  But that's a debate for another thread, and I don't want to debate it here further.  Merely a statement of how I feel that name-calling is used to browbeat those with opposing viewpoints to side with some atheists (not all).

 

"Name-calling is the basest form of human discourse, why call those who value patriotism morons?"

I don't understand why you keep saying it this way when you KNOW that I've said SEVERAL time that I don't believe that IS a show of patriotism...ok?

I don't think those that value patriotism are morons...I think it's MORONIC that people assume that a person has to wear a pin in order to show patriotism. I was VERY clear on that and you've mischaracterized it yet again.

I think the idea is MORONIC, I don't think people are MORONS...I think it's a silly side issue that people get wound up on and it diverts from REAL issues.

I am sorry I came in here and debated this...but I am not going to let you mischaracterize what I said!!!

I am a TRUE patriot IMO. And I wouldn't wear a flag pin ever. I don't think wearing a pin does anything other than put a hole in your lapel.


 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
chillin'
June 20, 2008, 8:34 am PDT

Last word?

Quote From: PennyLane78

"Name-calling is the basest form of human discourse, why call those who value patriotism morons?"

I don't understand why you keep saying it this way when you KNOW that I've said SEVERAL time that I don't believe that IS a show of patriotism...ok?

I don't think those that value patriotism are morons...I think it's MORONIC that people assume that a person has to wear a pin in order to show patriotism. I was VERY clear on that and you've mischaracterized it yet again.

I think the idea is MORONIC, I don't think people are MORONS...I think it's a silly side issue that people get wound up on and it diverts from REAL issues.

I am sorry I came in here and debated this...but I am not going to let you mischaracterize what I said!!!

I am a TRUE patriot IMO. And I wouldn't wear a flag pin ever. I don't think wearing a pin does anything other than put a hole in your lapel.


 

Mischaracterize what you said?  This is what you said from an earlier post:

 

"I don't believe that any candidate wears a flag pin for any other reason than to pander to morons and insult intelligent folks."

Now it's just the IDEA that's moronic.  That's not a debate point, that's just name-calling to those that value a gesture.


I've made my statement about why we should hold a Congressman running for POTUS to a higher standard, but I don't see a clear, eloquent point from you about WHY the idea is MORONIC.  Patriotism is an idea, showing patriotism through wearing a pin is an idea.   So is reciting the pledge and putting your hand over your heart during the national anthem.  Those are signs of RESPECT, hardly moronic, IMO.  Small gestures can be pregnant with larger meaning. 

 

You could argue that it's MORONIC to just assume that wearing a pin is  purely a meaningless, self-serving  gesture.  You seem to be going to the other EXTREME with it.  You're the one who picked on this trivial point and drug it out to this point.  AGAIN, that's not the only reason I WILL NOT VOTE 'O' during this election

 

It's the liberal ideology that prey's upon the sloth, self-indulgence, and dumbing down of our youth (the latter they've purposely created in a new generation, submissive to a paternalistic government).  In my youth, I dare to be different in not following the Obama lemmings off the same stupid cliff.  I've listed several good reasons I refuse to be influenced by the hype.

 

I'm a patriot too, which is why I refuse to let my country go down the tubes with that candidate.  Is it okay by you if I kick the tires on Obama?   Is it okay to have an opinion that differs from yours?  Or are you in a habit of being condescending to dissenting opinion?  I believe it is a show of patriotism and you don't.  Like I said before, you are entitled to your opinion, this being a free country and all.  And SO AM I.

 

 
User Mood
Good

Message Emote
blank
June 21, 2008, 11:41 am PDT

A Barack and McCain...

Quote From: PennyLane78

"Name-calling is the basest form of human discourse, why call those who value patriotism morons?"

I don't understand why you keep saying it this way when you KNOW that I've said SEVERAL time that I don't believe that IS a show of patriotism...ok?

I don't think those that value patriotism are morons...I think it's MORONIC that people assume that a person has to wear a pin in order to show patriotism. I was VERY clear on that and you've mischaracterized it yet again.

I think the idea is MORONIC, I don't think people are MORONS...I think it's a silly side issue that people get wound up on and it diverts from REAL issues.

I am sorry I came in here and debated this...but I am not going to let you mischaracterize what I said!!!

I am a TRUE patriot IMO. And I wouldn't wear a flag pin ever. I don't think wearing a pin does anything other than put a hole in your lapel.


Penny, I respect  that you don't like the flag pins, and do not recite the Pledge. But, how can you say that the idea is MORONIC but not the people? I wear a flag pin and I recite the pledge and I am not a moron. I don't see how you can separate the two. I wear a flag pin because I love the flag and all it stands for to me. I recite the plege because I believe in the words with all of my heart. How can you say that the idea is moronic but that on the other hand, the people who practice these things are not morons?

 
User Mood
Touched

Message Emote
blank
June 21, 2008, 2:19 pm PDT

Not Exactly

Obama's Not Exactly's: 1.) Selma Got Me Born - NOT EXACTLY, your parents felt safe enough to have you in 1961 - Selma had no effect on your birth, as Selma was in 1965. (Google 'Obama Selma' for his full March 4, 2007 speech and articles about its various untruths.)

2.) Father Was A Goat Herder - NOT EXACTLY, he was a privileged, well educated youth, who went on to work with the Kenyan Government.

3.) Father Was A Proud Freedom Fighter - NOT EXACTLY, he was part of one of the most corrupt and violent governments Kenya has ever had.
4.) My Family Has Strong Ties To African Freedom - NOT EXACTLY, your cousin Raila Odinga has created mass violence in attempting to overturn a legitimate election in 2007, in Kenya . It is the first widespread violence in decades. The current government is pro-American but Odinga wants to overthrow it and establish Muslim Sharia law. Your half-brother, Abongo Oba ma, is Odinga's follower. You interrupted your New Hampshire campaigning to speak to Odinga on the phone. Check out the following link for verification of that....and for more.
Obama's cousin Odinga in Kenya ran for president and tried to get Sharia Muslim law in place there. When Odinga lost the elections, his followers have burned Christians' homes and then burned men, women and children alive in a Christian church where they took shelter.. Obama SUPPORTED his cousin before the election process here started. Google Obama and Odinga and see what you get. No one wants to know the truth.

5.) My Grandmother Has Always Been A Christian - NOT EXACTLY, she does her daily Salat prayers at 5am according to her own interviews. Not to mention, Christianity wouldn't allow her to have been one of 14 wives to 1 man.

6.) My Name is African Swahili - NOT EXACTLY, your name is Arabic and 'Baraka' (from which Barack came) means 'blessed' in that language. Hussein is also Arabic and so is Obama.

Barack Hussein Obama is not half black. If elected, he would be the first Arab-American President, not the first black President. Barack Hussein Obama is 50% Caucasian from his mother's side and 43.75% Arabic and 6.25% Af rican Negro from his father's side. While Barack Hussein Obama's father was from Kenya , his father's family was mainly Arabs.. Barack Hussein Obama's father was only 12.5% African Negro and 87.5% Arab (his father's birth certificate even states he's Arab, not African Negro). From....and for more....go to.....
http://www.arcadeathome.com/newsboy.phtml?Barack_Hussein_Obama_-_Ara b-American,_only_6.25%25_African

7.) I Never Practiced Islam - NOT EXACTLY, you practiced it daily at school, where you were registered as a Muslim and kept that faith for 31 years, until your wife made you change, so you could run for office.
4-3-08 Article "Obama was 'quite religious in Islam'"   
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=60559 <;

8.) My School In Indonesia Was Christian - NOT EXACTLY, you were registered as Muslim there and got in trouble in Koranic Studies for making faces (check your own book).
February 28, 2008.  Kristoff from the New York Times a year ago:  Mr. Obama recalled the opening lines of the Arabic call to prayer, reciting them with a first-rate accent. In a remark that seemed delightfully uncalculated (it'll give Alabama voters heart attacks); Mr. Obama described the call to prayer as "one of the prettiest sounds on Earth at sunset."  This is just one example of what Pamela is talking about when she says "Obama's narrative is being altered, enhanced and manipulated to whitewash troubling facts."

9.) I Was Fluent In Indonesian - NOT EXACTLY, not one teacher says you could speak the language.

10.) Because I Lived In Indonesia, I Have More Foreign Experience - NOT EXACTLY, you were there from the ages of 6 to 10, and couldn't even speak the language. What did you learn, how to study the Koran and watch cartoons.

11.) I Am Stronger On Foreign Affairs - NOT EXACTLY, except for Africa (surprise) and the Middle East (bigger surprise); you have never been anywhere else on the planet and thus have NO experience with our closest allies.

12.) I Blame My Early Drug Use On Ethnic Confusion - NOT EXACTLY, you were quite content in high school to be Barry Obama, no mention of Kenya and no mention of struggle to identify - your classmates said you were just fine.

13.)An Ebony Article Moved Me To Run For Office - NOT EXACTLY, Ebony has yet to find the article you mention in your book. It doesn't, and never did, exist.

14.) A Life Magazine Article Changed My Outlook On Life - NOT EXACTLY, Life has yet to find the article you mention in your book. It doesn't, and never did, exist.

15.) I Won't Run On A National Ticket In '08 - NOT EXACTLY, here you are, despite saying, live on TV, that you would not have enough experience by then, and you are all about having experience first.

16.) Voting "Present" is Common In Illinois Senate - NOT EXACTLY, they are common for YOU, but not many others have 130 NO VOTES.

17.) Oops, I Misvoted - NOT EXACTLY, only when caught by church groups and Democrats, di d you beg to change your misvote.

18.) I Was A Professor Of Law - NOT EXACTLY, you were a senior lecturer ON LEAVE.

19.) I Was A Constitutional Lawyer - NOT EXACTLY, you were a senior lecturer ON LEAVE.

20.) Without Me, There Would Be No Ethics Bill - NOT EXACTLY, you didn't write it, introduce it, change it, or create it.

21.) The Ethics Bill Was Hard To Pass - NOT EXACTLY, it took just 14 days from start to finish.

22.) I Wrote A Tough Nuclear Bill - NOT EXACTLY, your bill was rejected by your own party for its pandering and lack of all regulation - mainly because of your Nuclear donor, Exelon, from which David Axelrod came.

23.) I Have Released My State Records - NOT EXACTLY, as of March, 2008, state bills you sponsored or voted for have yet to be released, exposing all the special interests pork hidden within.

24.) I Took On The Asbestos Altgeld Gardens Mess - NOT EXACTLY, you were part of a large group of people who remedied Alt geld Gardens. You failed to mention anyone else but yourself, in your books.

25.) M y Economics Bill Will Help America - NOT EXACTLY, your 111 economic policies were just combined into a proposal which lost 99-0, and even YOU voted against your own bill.

26.) I Have Been A Bold Leader In Illinois - NOT EXACTLY, even your own supporters claim to have not seen BOLD action on your part.

27.) I Passed 26 Of My Own Bills In One Year - NOT EXACTLY, they were not YOUR bills, but rather handed to you, after their creation by a fellow Senator, to assist you in a future bid for higher office.

28.) No One on my campaign contacted Canada about NAFTA - NOT EXACTLY, the Canadian Government issued the names and a memo of the conversation your campaign had with them.

29.) I Am Tough On Terrorism - NOT EXACTLY, you missed the Iran Resolution vote on terrorism and your good friend Ali Abunimah supports the destruction off Israel.

30.) I Want All Votes To Cou nt - NOT EXACTLY, you said let the delegates decide.

31.) I Want Americans To Decide - NOT EXACTLY, you prefer caucuses that limit the vote, confuse the voters, force a public vote, and only operate during small windows of time.

32.) I passed 900 Bills in the State Senate - NOT EXACTLY, you passed 26, most of which you didn't write yourself.

33.) I Believe In Fairness, Not Tactics - NOT EXACTLY, you used tactics to eliminate Alice Palmer from running against you.

34.) I Don't Take PAC Money - NOT EXACTLY, you take loads of it.

35.) I don't Have Lobbyists - NOT EXACTLY, you have over 47 lobbyists, and counting.

36.) My Campaign Had Nothing To Do With The 1984 Ad - NOT EXACTLY, your own campaign worker made the ad on his Apple in one afternoon.

37.) I Have Always Been Against Iraq - NOT EXACTLY, you weren't in office to vote against it AND you have voted to fund it every single time.

38.) I Have Always Supported Universal Health Care - NOT EXACTL Y, your plan leaves us all to pay for the 15,000,000 who don't have to b buy it.
 
 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
June 22, 2008, 12:02 pm PDT

A Barack and McCain...

Quote From: PennyLane78

Ok...look, I really don't like debating politics, it's not my thing most of the time. I prefer the religious debate board.

No offense but you seem to be pretty set in your ways about this...and since I don't enjoy these discussions you can have the last word.

I just wanted to comment on the pin thing...it's stupid.  It's a stupid red herring load of bull. Who cares if someone isn't wearing a flag pin. I don't.

I don't think the pledge or a flag pin have anything REAL to do with our country or what it stands for. I never have. Even when I was a good little 15 year old I refused to say the pledge, I refused to stand for the national anthem...I think it's silly and I think it's a bit backwards as to what this country stands for.

And, it's my lovely right to believe so.

My question is.... If Oboma isn't willing to pledge his allegence to our country, what country IS he pledging his allegence too?  It is said that if someone wants to distroy the United States, they can do it from within.  I think that this is possible, if Oboma gets in, I think it is probable.

 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
June 22, 2008, 3:04 pm PDT

A Barack and McCain...

Quote From: housewife52

Penny, I respect  that you don't like the flag pins, and do not recite the Pledge. But, how can you say that the idea is MORONIC but not the people? I wear a flag pin and I recite the pledge and I am not a moron. I don't see how you can separate the two. I wear a flag pin because I love the flag and all it stands for to me. I recite the plege because I believe in the words with all of my heart. How can you say that the idea is moronic but that on the other hand, the people who practice these things are not morons?

I'm not Penny, but I'll share my two cents on this. I don't think it is moronic to WEAR a pin, but I agree that it is moronic to assume you can judge someone's patriotism based on whether or not they wear a pin or recite a pledge.

 

ANYBODY can stick a pin on their lapel or mindlessly recite words. Both are simply superficial acts devoid of meaning unless the individual applies some sort of meaning. Many people are quietly more patriotic and concerned for our country than those who shout their allegiance from the rooftops. For me, it is kind of comparable to religion....it seems like the people who need to shout about their religion the loudest are usually the most shallow and biggest hypocrites when it comes to putting their religion into practice.

 

I think no better or worse of someone for superficial practices. It simply isn't worthy criteria.

 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
chillin'
June 23, 2008, 7:22 am PDT

Flag pin....

Quote From: PennyLane78

"Name-calling is the basest form of human discourse, why call those who value patriotism morons?"

I don't understand why you keep saying it this way when you KNOW that I've said SEVERAL time that I don't believe that IS a show of patriotism...ok?

I don't think those that value patriotism are morons...I think it's MORONIC that people assume that a person has to wear a pin in order to show patriotism. I was VERY clear on that and you've mischaracterized it yet again.

I think the idea is MORONIC, I don't think people are MORONS...I think it's a silly side issue that people get wound up on and it diverts from REAL issues.

I am sorry I came in here and debated this...but I am not going to let you mischaracterize what I said!!!

I am a TRUE patriot IMO. And I wouldn't wear a flag pin ever. I don't think wearing a pin does anything other than put a hole in your lapel.


 

I forgot to mention, in my last word, that during an ad for Barrack Obama, he WAS wearing a flag pin.  So first he refuses to wear it to pander to "morons" and insult "intelligent people", now he does it.  So I guess he's insulting the "oh-so-high-IQ" of those who look down on Americans who value it and panders to the "moronic" chunk of America (more people than I think you realize).  Again, my argument is that it IS an act of patriotism in and of itself, because it's morale boosting to both Americans at home and troops abroad. 

 

Let's focus for a second on an issue that holds a little more weight- Energy Independance (assuming you came back to read this post, but for anyone reading it).

 

McCain wants to lift the moratorium on offshore drilling as an option.  This is wise in so many ways.  First of all, in the short term, it would pose a threat to the foreign oil market, and Saudi's would be more willing to negotiate the price per barrel.  This is exactly what happened during the 70's oil crisis, and before rigs were even constructed, we were able to negotiate lower prices.  In the long term, it would increase our economy and aide in re-constructing the middle class and we would begin to reap the benefits of domestic drilling, driving prices down even further.  It's a process, and if we start now, we can stop the price of gas before it reaches $10/gal. 

 

Unfortunately, the Congress/House, with the Democratic majority shut down Bush's efforts last week because of arguments of inefficiency (read "special interest groups"), despite the fact that it would be remarkably efficient.  Too bad.

 

Barrack's plan is to install a oil company profit tax (windfall profits tax), lowering revenues for the shareholders (you, me, Americans, not just the CEO's).  Also, they want Saudi Arabia to pump more oil from it's reserves, continuing dependancy of foreign oil, putting America at the mercy of OPEC. 

 

I believe we'd be better off with McCain's plan, so that's another reason I won't vote Obama.  I know the youth of America feel obliged to vote Democrat because it's "cool", but I'm not backing down to the peer pressure like a kid at the popular table in high school.  I think as much as they play the "race" card for Obama, they also discredit McCain because of his age.  So in addition to it being a case of reverse racism against McCain, they're also agist against someone with the possibility of cleaning up America.  Ronald Reagan was 70 when he took office and ended the Cold War.  So superficial reasons shouldn't drive an election. 

 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
June 23, 2008, 2:32 pm PDT

A Barack and McCain...

Quote From: housewife52

Penny, I respect  that you don't like the flag pins, and do not recite the Pledge. But, how can you say that the idea is MORONIC but not the people? I wear a flag pin and I recite the pledge and I am not a moron. I don't see how you can separate the two. I wear a flag pin because I love the flag and all it stands for to me. I recite the plege because I believe in the words with all of my heart. How can you say that the idea is moronic but that on the other hand, the people who practice these things are not morons?

Meh, forgive me, I worded myself badly and a bit too passionately.

I think that caring about these little things are just diversions from real issues, and I think that too many people get caught up in this stuff and ignore the important stuff.

That is all I meant, and I apologize for not wording it better.
 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
June 23, 2008, 2:35 pm PDT

A Barack and McCain...

Quote From: julie1418

I'm not Penny, but I'll share my two cents on this. I don't think it is moronic to WEAR a pin, but I agree that it is moronic to assume you can judge someone's patriotism based on whether or not they wear a pin or recite a pledge.

 

ANYBODY can stick a pin on their lapel or mindlessly recite words. Both are simply superficial acts devoid of meaning unless the individual applies some sort of meaning. Many people are quietly more patriotic and concerned for our country than those who shout their allegiance from the rooftops. For me, it is kind of comparable to religion....it seems like the people who need to shout about their religion the loudest are usually the most shallow and biggest hypocrites when it comes to putting their religion into practice.

 

I think no better or worse of someone for superficial practices. It simply isn't worthy criteria.

Thanks...you worded it better than I as usual.
 
User Mood
Happy

Message Emote
blank
June 23, 2008, 2:37 pm PDT

A Barack and McCain...

Quote From: grandmashari

My question is.... If Oboma isn't willing to pledge his allegence to our country, what country IS he pledging his allegence too?  It is said that if someone wants to distroy the United States, they can do it from within.  I think that this is possible, if Oboma gets in, I think it is probable.

I don't see saying the pledge as an automatically or inherently "patriotic" act...I don't think that just because he's not saying these over used words that he's pledging  to ANOTHER country...

You think it's probable that if Obama becomes president he'll ruin the US?

Wow...
 

First | Prev | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | Next | Last