Topic : A Barack and McCain...

I had to research this. There is no incident of Obama refusing to say the pledge. There is a video of him without his hand over his heart at a Steak Fry (?) event while the National Anthem was being sung. Although, military code states the hand should be over the heart unless you are in military attire, historians have stated that this practice has been debated and dying out for a while. Actually, ALL the people in the picture are violating the code as they are not facing the flag, but holding their hands to their hearts with their backs to the flag. 

The whole issue is moot. It never happened.

OK, you have a point, not wearing a pin doesn't mean you aren't a patriot.  I am sure we all understand that part. 

Now lets change it a little.  Say someone who is wanting to marry you says to you that they want to be your husband but doesn't want to wear the wedding ring or have vows because it isn't important to their love for you, they just want to go in and sign a certificate to become your husband.  Would you trust that he loves you beyond doubt?

Obama wants to move into the head of our country.  He doesn't want to say the pledge.  His refusal to wear the pin isn't as important as the not saying the pledge in my eyes.  The pledge is a promise made to the country that you accept this country as your own, as your only country, much like wedding vows are a promise to accept this person as your own, to become one with him/her.  If he is unwilling to take these vows with the pledge, I question why, and how could we want him in the most powerful position in our country.  The pin is like a wedding ring, you wear it to show others that you have given your allegiance to that country.

Apparently, you require an answer from me since it was MY post. Here is what I stated...

ANYBODY can stick a pin on their lapel or mindlessly recite words. Both are simply superficial acts devoid of meaning unless the individual applies some sort of meaning.

What part of that stirs such anger in you? On 4th of July, my husband and I stayed in as our kids go to bed long before any fireworks would have started. I guess we should have dragged them out dead tired and cranky to shout our allegiance from the rooftops. I guess we are simply not as patriotic as whomever spent the night shouting about America, partying hard, and leaving their firework debris all over the road.

I even heard a group singing God Bless America.  You know, the shallow hypocrites.

It would be highly offensive for ME to sing that or any song to anybody. I'll gladly leave that show of patriotism to the Canadian Celine Dion who is often paid to sing God Bless America and the National Anthem at televised events.

What does it matter though, talking about superficial practices if it isn't worthy criteria.

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Those things are NOT, in and of themselves, worthy criteria for judging someone's patriotism or any other characteristic. Do you not know people who go to church simply to be seen going to church? I my goodness, I am not wearing a pink ribbon...I guess that proves I do not support breast cancer awareness! I have no bumper stickers on my car...I guess I am just one of those people who don't stand for anything!!

What you wear, sing, recite, etc. has NO real meaning UNLESS you apply, through actions, meaning to the SUPERFICIAL. Are you so simple that you would divide people into two categories?? Wears pin = patriotic....doesn't wear pin = not patriotic.

Very good analogy!

I don't have a major problem with him not wearing the pin, maybe it's because my husband doesn't wear his ring, I guess that's an issue for another board LOL. I do however have a problem about him not saying the pledge. I didn't even know he refused to say it, I guess I should read the earlier posts. Was that covered in the mainstream media?

My father in law who use to teach middle school at a low income school once told me that when his students refused to stand for the pledge he would tell them as long as the government is paying for their lunch they better stand and give honor to that flag. Yeah he was old school, but don't worry he's no longer teaching.

What is Obama's reason for not saying the pledge? If he is elected is he going to have a problem with saying the oath of office? 

Mine doesn't either because of his job, but he did say the wedding vows and had he not been willing to do that, he wouldn't be my husband!  What about yours?  Did he say the vows? 

I used the wedding ring as an example showing that it is a show of the vows made.  If Obama didn't want to wear the pin, it wouldn't be so bad, but the not wanting to say the pledge is a whole other thing.  He wants to be head of our country, he shouldn't have a problem pledging to it.  Just like a minister who wants to work for God, shouldn't have a problem with prayer.

I had to research this. There is no incident of Obama refusing to say the pledge. There is a video of him without his hand over his heart at a Steak Fry (?) event while the National Anthem was being sung. Although, military code states the hand should be over the heart unless you are in military attire, historians have stated that this practice has been debated and dying out for a while. Actually, ALL the people in the picture are violating the code as they are not facing the flag, but holding their hands to their hearts with their backs to the flag. 

The whole issue is moot. It never happened.

I, along with so many others have received the email of the picture of Obama not putting his hand on his heart and read how he refused to say the pledge and show respect during the anthem.  I should have researched it as you did, thank you for doing so.  I did research it after your post and agree that this is one of those emails that go around seeming so true but wasn't the whole truth.  They say that there probably is another flag off to the side and that is why they are all facing that direction, but this site has him saying the pledge in the opening of the senate also.  You proved your point and I had it to you for being smarter then I am by doing the research.  I am sorry for being party to the misrepresentation of this issue.

here is where you can find the research for any who want to see it with their own eyes.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/anthem.asp

I, along with so many others have received the email of the picture of Obama not putting his hand on his heart and read how he refused to say the pledge and show respect during the anthem.  I should have researched it as you did, thank you for doing so.  I did research it after your post and agree that this is one of those emails that go around seeming so true but wasn't the whole truth.  They say that there probably is another flag off to the side and that is why they are all facing that direction, but this site has him saying the pledge in the opening of the senate also.  You proved your point and I had it to you for being smarter then I am by doing the research.  I am sorry for being party to the misrepresentation of this issue.

here is where you can find the research for any who want to see it with their own eyes.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/anthem.asp