Quote From: redfeathersWell, first off, I agree with some points you made. Your junior prom date, for example, took advantage of you and that's not fair. However, I do feel that the rest of your post tags women as less intelligent beings who don't know how to handle themselves and need men like you to show them how to act. Not true. The community "saves women from themselves?" I take that as an insult. I don't find rudeness attractive, I don't find a lack of conversation "mysterious," and I've never percieved arrogence as "confidence." In fact, I've told arrogent men that I think they are arrogent and that their egos need to come down several pegs.
When you say "nice women don't use guys they don't find attractive," what do you mean by that? Are you incinuating that all women, nice or mean, just use men? That men are only tools for whatever means the woman wants? I'm sorry, but that sounds like a bit of a generalization to me. Despite all the grand things you've said about yourself, you do have a few bitter-sounding undertones in your post. If you feel that women have never given you the time of day, ask yourself why? What kind of women have you been trying to approach? If you have all this greatness backing you, then why would women turn you down? Have you only tried to talk to beautiful women? Try talking to the ones that would be considered more homely, more often than not, they are the ones that have less of an ego and more of a personality. What I've been hearing a lot about these "pickup communities" is that it's about men learning to approach "beautiful" women. What about the rest that are viewed as "not so" beautiful? Are they not important? Do they not count? I don't believe that "beautiful" should be a term used to describe someone's physical appearance, it should be used to describe what they are like on the inside. Thier personality, beliefs, and ideas.
Not all women are shallow, and you know it. No "IF's," and's, or, but's. I don't percieve sensitivity as weakness, I prefer it. In fact, I became more attracted to my boyfriend the first time I saw him cry. I prefer men who aren't afraid to cry. To me, that means that they aren't too much of a "manly man" to show their emotions. I like that. I don't consider him weak, and I don't see him as needy.
And when it comes to chick movies, that's just what they are, MOVIES. They aren't real. It's not reality. You can't judge real women by scripted scenes. If life were like movies, not only would I be married, but my boyfriend would be an international action spy-hero, I would be living in a gorgeous penthouse with pet lions, a dragon in the living room and a unicorn in the backyard. But life isn't like that is it? Nope.
And not all love movies are geared toward women. How about Atonement? There was more time spent on the male lead's point of view than there was the female lead's. It's a really sad movie, by the way, see it if you haven't.
And saying that "Oh, it WILL work on you," is also a generalization. It sounds as though you think that this method is so powerful over women, that they will just fall into it every time and no matter who a man is, he will always be able to get whatever woman he wants using it. How would you feel if someone said that about using a "method" on you? They didn't consider you personally, they didn't consider your intelligence, they didn't consider how strong of a mind you may have, they just said that it would work on you, you'd be taken in no matter what. Sounds a bit like you've just been called a pawn, a drone, a person who is easily used. You can't make that assumption. You can't assume that something that has worked on some individuals will work on ALL as a whole. That's not fair.
Personally, I think the pickup community can be helpful, and harmful. People like you making generalizations about women make it seem bad. However, I think that really shy men do sometimes need a confidence booster, that's a good thing. If they are given confidence not to hide in the corner and watch things pass by, that's good, but I think that it shouldn't be the confidence to approach just "beautiful women," but ANY woman.
I also think that it would be better to start a conversation with just a freakin' "Hi." That's all I would ask. No pickup lines, no fake stories, no false plugs that could lead to real stories, (one way or another, there IS a level of falsehood to the equation, and the person telling it could choose to just keep going with that and the person listening would never know the truth) because all that seems so fake, like it was printed out on the wall on a cue-card that says "What do you think about (insert subject here) *pause for response* Oh, that's a good idea, etc. etc." I would rather just see a man be himself. I don't see why that's such a hard thing to do. I don't see why men need to talk to other men about how to talk to women. Why don't men talk to women about that? It's not like there hasen't ever been some female influence in their lives. Mothers, aunts, sisters, cousins. You can't tell me that those men never had any of those things. That sure would be interesting to hear. I'm sure they'd have at least one of those things.
That's the biggest thing that gets me about these communities. It's men teaching men about women.
I find it somewhat hypocritical to fault my claim that women are often attracted to the wrong guy---and then in the same breath say that I'M attracted to the wrong women.
The perjoratives I used above were not descriptive of the teachings of the community. They were intended to show the accidental success some jerks have. If you ever had a crush on a guy that didn't know your name---whether you "came to your senses" or not--- you fit the bill.
When I say that "nice women don't use guys they don't find attractive," I'm not implying that they use other guys. But I'm also saying that "not using a guy" and "dating him" are not the same thing. I'm sure you've all been hit on by a guy and then shut him down with pity. Perhaps you reason that "He's not my type, but he'll make some girl lucky someday." Perhaps---but he just made YOU lucky, and you didn't seem to care. I honor you for not taking him for his money, but it's ridiculous to pretend he was attractive when he obviously wasn't.
Perhaps my favorite thing on this board has been the constant refrain of women saying that their husbands or boyfriends do all sorts of self-sacrificing things for them, and it's a huge turn-on. Fair enough, but the men in these workshops are not husbands or boyfriends. That's why they're there. I doubt you started making out with him when he knocked on your door and offered to do the dishes.
Not all women are shallow---except when they have to be. The average beautiful 25-yr-old gets approached by men somewhere around five times a day. Can you imagine that? (If you have no trouble, give me a call). It must be a nightmare. Even if she wanted to give every guy a chance, she can't go on 35 dates a week! So she has to make judgments, and she has to do it fast. I don't blame her.
Saying that ugly girls are just as valuable and beautiful on the inside as their more physically gifted counterparts is completely true---but how can I see that in the three seconds I have to decide which to approach? Should I be biased and assume that outer beauty equates to inner ugliness? I'm sure those of you who consider yourselves attractive would take issue with that. This doesn't mean I have to be mean to ugly girls---I wish them the best and will be nice to them, but "they're not my type, and I'm sure they'll make some guy lucky someday."
When I say that PU will work on you, I don't mean you'll automatically jump into bed with any guy that starts teasing you. No one can take away your power to choose. But I am confident that, if he's good, there's maybe a 90% chance you'll be attracted to him. What you do with those feelings is up to you.
I find laughable the claim that men should work on approaching all women, not just beautiful ones. Trust me, if a guy has the confidence to approach a woman he's attracted to, he can approach any woman. Period.
"Hi" is referred to in the community as the Universal Opener, and it's widely used.
The reason I don't take advice from all the wonderful women in my life is that they answer the wrong question. They tell me how to be a great date or boyfriend or husband, rather than telling me how to get to that position at all. They tell me why they chose a guy, rather than explaining how he even made the draft. And they tell me most vehemently not to be a jerk that uses girls, rather than explaining how he got the power to do that in the first place. Are those my motives? No, and neither are they the motives of 99% of the community---so why handicap the good guys?
Women beware: Men are on the prowl! Some guys win your heart and dupe you for thousands of dollars, while other men learn the slick techniques of pick-up artists so they can get you in the sack! Go inside a classroom where single men are being taught The Mystery Method -- a step-by-step technique on how to meet, attract and date beautiful women. The instructors say this method teaches guys to be more confident. When the students hit the bars, will The Mystery Method help them land a lady? What do the women think of their techniques? Then, meet Ross Jeffries, the self-proclaimed "Father of Seduction." He says he’s taught thousands of men to seduce women through language. Now he fears that he’s created monsters, because many of his followers are seducing woman through deception, and he says that’s exactly what The Mystery Method is all about. A heated debate ensues between Ross and The Mystery Method instructors, Nick and Scott. Is Ross’ technique actually as benign as he claims? And, Victoria says she fell in love for the first time with a guy whom who she thought was the perfect man, until he she says he ended up scamming her out of $100,000. Did Victoria miss the warning signs? How can she pick up the pieces of her broken heart and move on? Talk about the show here.
