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Topic : 04/23 The Lost Boys and the Children of the Compound

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Created on : Friday, April 18, 2008, 03:23:45 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
Dr. Phil continues to examine the controversial Eldorado, Texas raid where 416 children were removed from an extreme religious sect known as the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Hear from Eldorado Mayor John Nikolauk, who has presided over the town for 20 years. What are his greatest fears now? Then, Dr. Phil sits down with Franklin and Deloy, two members of the Lost Boys -- young men who leave the polygamous community when they reach the age of puberty. Franklin and Deloy say they had no education past the sixth grade and need help dealing with repressed emotions, especially in the wake of the Eldorado raid. How can they move on with their lives? And, the fate of the 416 children removed from the compound now rests in the hands of lawmakers. Dr. Phil speaks with Gib Walton, President of the Texas state bar and Harper Estes, President Elect of the Texas State Bar to discuss the outcome of the hearings and to sort out custody issues. Plus, find out what you can do to help these children ripped from the only lifestyle they have ever known. Join the discussion.

Find out what happened on the show.

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April 30, 2008, 5:04 pm CDT

04/23 The Lost Boys and the Children of the Compound

Quote From: kennyllc

"I don't know if i have a promble withthe polygamy part of it as long as they adults over the age of 21 and the children are happy healthyat home, go to public, know their rights. and had nothing to do with the FLDS or any kind of compound thing going on. "

 

The problems with polygamy are tremendous, and there is a reason for it being illegal. Not only are the courtroom dramas long and drawn out in divorce cases, but the children of ploygamy are pulled in many different directions. It also becomes a communal mish-mash of unidentified flying objects within the family court system. 

"Duck everybody! Was that another kid flying across the room?!"

Not so funny, but true.

If you think divorce court is bad among 2 individuals, try getting 3 or 4 or 5 or 6, etc.. involved!

The affections issue is yet another legal problem. Adultery is the most common complaint for divorce, and rightfully so. 

The practice of polygamy smacks marital fidelity right in the face, and wrests away the tender affections of marital bliss in exchange for the right to undue sexual gratification with various women. 

Why do these men even bother with marriage at all?

 

Marital fidelity has been smack in the face sence the beginning of time, lol ..... I have to say I don't no much, about how long the marriages last. but I can't tell adults what to do, as for the children, well have you seen many children of today? their parents are to lazy to be parents, they raise themself.

 I really can't debate for it or against it,  its done in secret, so not much to go on, and I'm not talking about the FLDS there I would say I could find many things wrong, but the ones that live it living in the burbs, well  I just don't know.

 
April 30, 2008, 6:20 pm CDT

There's more to it... This is not a Mormon Bash, so read on.

I've made it no secret in earlier posts - that my family moved to So Utah, and 4 years later left with the taste of "Mormonism"  or LDS -  like battery acid in our mouths.  We encountered not only the LDS, and the FLDS, good Mormons and not so-good ones.  We dealt with these people on a daily basis.  I had to wait on the fugitive John Black, as he was called and could feel the evil emanating from him.  Now I know why! 

At any rate, Mormonism whether it be LDS, FLDS, the Kingston Clan or the LeBarons is just one of many religions with blood on it's hands, so that is not my issue at this time.  The argument can go on and on, but just go and live in this area for a month or two as an experiment if you dare. (or have the resources)

It will truly be an eye-opener although it may be different now that the whistle has finally been blown.

  Guys, this has been going on for EVER!  With the "powers that be" in Utah turning a blind eye.  That is what just turns your gut when you live there and see these injustices done in full sight of the law.  The total hypocrisy.   Polygamy is alive and well in Utah.  The issue here is really about child abuse and pedophilia, incest and immoralism in the name of religious freedom.  When the story hit the fan a couple years ago in Colorado City Utah, and Hildale AZ, our family and so many folks were so relieved that someone finally listened.  A group of us "outsiders"  had emailed Oprah and Dr. Phil many many times to no avail and we had tried our best to report the obvious to the authorities in Utah, again with no help. 

MY POINT: A reporter named Mike Watkiss who had been raised in this society was finally able to stir up the authorities with his continual and gutsy reporting on this subject.  Go to www.azfamily.com  The Polygamy Diaries -  This guy is a hero.  Watch the videos and learn.   I would suggest checking out the LeBaron Clan and the Kingston Clan (among others) who practice incest freely within the State of Utah and in Mexico.  Watkiss has just finished a segment on the LeBaron clan this evening... It was astounding even to me.  This thing is wide-spread, and not limited to Texas and Utah. Help needs to come to the rest of these innocents.  Knowledge is power. 

 
April 30, 2008, 6:24 pm CDT

04/23 The Lost Boys and the Children of the Compound

Quote From: kennyllc

Thanks for the link. Although I think Wikipedia winds up with some pretty objective descriptions, it is also an open encyclopedia, meaning that anyone can edit it.

I have never  tried to edit anything there myself, but you may want to try it sometime yourself just to find out if and how it works.

 I like to get things from the horses mouth too, therefore when an individual will leave his name and relate his life story and experience to everyone at pain of being ostracised by the masses, I tend to believe them more than an online encyclopedia.

I mean, wouldn't you ?

I trust encyclopdia over a story, but that's just my opinion. You just never know if someone says something just because they are angry with the church for whatever reason and then make up stuff about it. I have seen this personally within my own family and then they have admitted to me that is was made up. I just have a hard time without facts.

 

Your welcome for the link! :)

 
April 30, 2008, 6:29 pm CDT

04/23 The Lost Boys and the Children of the Compound

Quote From: getrealtime

Marital fidelity has been smack in the face sence the beginning of time, lol ..... I have to say I don't no much, about how long the marriages last. but I can't tell adults what to do, as for the children, well have you seen many children of today? their parents are to lazy to be parents, they raise themself.

 I really can't debate for it or against it,  its done in secret, so not much to go on, and I'm not talking about the FLDS there I would say I could find many things wrong, but the ones that live it living in the burbs, well  I just don't know.

Yep, I have seen it.  there's lots of polygamous people in the Burbs of Utah.  Many of them are very loving and healthy people, good to their children and wives.  I won't judge that lifestyle, to each his/or her own, as long as NO ONE is getting hurt!  Polygamy and pedophilia are two differnt things, and I think we know that, some of us.  Illegal? Immoral?  That would be PEDOPHILIA, and marriage without consent.....
 
April 30, 2008, 7:05 pm CDT

Disinformation

Quote From: getrealtime

I think we forget about the Mormons who practice the principle in quit not connected to FLDS or any compound, dateline did a report on some who do practice polygamy, who work and pay taxes and live normal lives except for the more then one wife thing, their children go to mainstream school. They just want to live their lives and practice their religion without fear. and thats fear from the LDS and them looking down on them and outing them for practicing the primary Mormon religion.

 

I wouldn't choose the polygamy, I think it is to one sided and that side is for the men in the religion, but I also would have to say if everyone is adults, then it is up to them who they share their bed with. as long as no children are hurt and are educated and know the world around them, and know they have choices in  religion and practices, and free to choose.

 

Veiws change, as we have seen in the gay community, 20 years ago, the idea of two same sex people getting married and rasing children was very taboo, today not so taboo, and they are getting married and having children and living their lives to make themselfs happy in life.

Well, again an open-minded and refreshing view.  It really is so amazing to me that the mainstream Mormon church doesn't understand that their diversionary tactics and denials only hurt the humble and good people of that religion.  Having experienced it directly, it is not the "Mormons" I have issue with it is those tactics that are so very transparent.  The denial of their very core beliefs, and the distance they try to put between themselves and the evil nemesis the FLDS.  I don't know, it's just so cowardly.  But, hey look at the Catholics, Muslims, among other organized religions... and the atrocities there...!  lol.... not to START ANYTHING!   :)  Why is it that the kids always suffer? 

 

 

 

I think I'll remain Galadriel.

 
April 30, 2008, 8:42 pm CDT

04/23 The Lost Boys and the Children of the Compound

Quote From: aurapurple

Well, again an open-minded and refreshing view.  It really is so amazing to me that the mainstream Mormon church doesn't understand that their diversionary tactics and denials only hurt the humble and good people of that religion.  Having experienced it directly, it is not the "Mormons" I have issue with it is those tactics that are so very transparent.  The denial of their very core beliefs, and the distance they try to put between themselves and the evil nemesis the FLDS.  I don't know, it's just so cowardly.  But, hey look at the Catholics, Muslims, among other organized religions... and the atrocities there...!  lol.... not to START ANYTHING!   :)  Why is it that the kids always suffer? 

 

 

 

I think I'll remain Galadriel.

I'm LDS and I don't have anything against the FLDS, in fact I have posted how sorry I feel for these women, because of the extreme man power there. I have a problem with polygamy simply because it's against the law to have more than one wife, and I believe in abiding by the law, but I have nothing against the FLDS people other than the fact that their may be abuse involved, and when I know kids are being abused, then I have a problem.
 
April 30, 2008, 9:09 pm CDT

Gentle

Quote From: friendlygal

I'm LDS and I don't have anything against the FLDS, in fact I have posted how sorry I feel for these women, because of the extreme man power there. I have a problem with polygamy simply because it's against the law to have more than one wife, and I believe in abiding by the law, but I have nothing against the FLDS people other than the fact that their may be abuse involved, and when I know kids are being abused, then I have a problem.
Yes, your posts (that I've read)  have been gentle and attentive to other's views.  It is such a serious situation, and it seems you might represent the LDS community in a way that is refreshing.  We are all sorry for the women and children there's no doubt of that.  Kids are being, and have been abused withing the confines of Utah for so long, with the mainstream LDS leaders turning a blind eye, saying "Oh! they were excommunicated!"  "We have no responsibility!" I sincerely pray that the folks like you may start to speak out, and saythat the LDS leaders must step up and lend a hand out to the sisters and children.  They are descendants of the handcart  trek, whether LDS, or FLDS, the heritage is still there.  :)
 
April 30, 2008, 11:59 pm CDT

04/23 The Lost Boys and the Children of the Compound

Quote From: aurapurple

Yes, your posts (that I've read)  have been gentle and attentive to other's views.  It is such a serious situation, and it seems you might represent the LDS community in a way that is refreshing.  We are all sorry for the women and children there's no doubt of that.  Kids are being, and have been abused withing the confines of Utah for so long, with the mainstream LDS leaders turning a blind eye, saying "Oh! they were excommunicated!"  "We have no responsibility!" I sincerely pray that the folks like you may start to speak out, and saythat the LDS leaders must step up and lend a hand out to the sisters and children.  They are descendants of the handcart  trek, whether LDS, or FLDS, the heritage is still there.  :)
Thank you for your opinions. I still stand by the fact that the FLDS are not a part of the LDS church in any way. But I also wanted to add that even if we went to help them they wouldn't except help, because they look at the outside world as evil, us included because we do not share their views. It's so sad! It's almost as though no one can reach them except that looney toon Warren Jeffs!
 
May 1, 2008, 6:03 am CDT

04/23 The Lost Boys and the Children of the Compound

Quote From: friendlygal

I trust encyclopdia over a story, but that's just my opinion. You just never know if someone says something just because they are angry with the church for whatever reason and then make up stuff about it. I have seen this personally within my own family and then they have admitted to me that is was made up. I just have a hard time without facts.

 

Your welcome for the link! :)

Out of the mouths of babes!  My daughter made a good point to me. she knows a girl in school, that is Mormon, and she is picked on all the time about her religion, like how many mommys do you have, stuff like that, from kids that their parents never taught them any better. So what I'm saying is, I guess its a knee jurk reaction for Mormons to defend right off the bat.

 

This is a board to debate, which I did. All my facts came from sources that where non bias at lease 4 different souces saying the same thing, never was I using my debate to change your mind on what religion you choose to put your faith in. All religions lie because all religions have mans hand in it,  Its only because the Mormon religion was in the formate that it was debated, I would never walk up to a Mormon and start a debate about their religion with them. that would be rude!!! everyone has a right to their religion.

To make a long story short,  the boards are to debte, if someone puts their religon out there, it will be debated and they will get info they may not want to hear.

 

Its to be debated and not hated, I do not hate your religion, I think it has a colorful past, and its a new religion as far as religions go. there where lds members who did post saying they know their religion and they know what it stand for today, and they love it, and who can debate that.

 

I just wanted to debate what I thought was fact, I myself have never found the need in defending my faith, but then again, I'm sure that if it was in my face all the time maybe I would.

 

 

 

 
May 1, 2008, 6:06 am CDT

THAT'S My Point

Quote From: aurapurple

Yes, your posts (that I've read)  have been gentle and attentive to other's views.  It is such a serious situation, and it seems you might represent the LDS community in a way that is refreshing.  We are all sorry for the women and children there's no doubt of that.  Kids are being, and have been abused withing the confines of Utah for so long, with the mainstream LDS leaders turning a blind eye, saying "Oh! they were excommunicated!"  "We have no responsibility!" I sincerely pray that the folks like you may start to speak out, and saythat the LDS leaders must step up and lend a hand out to the sisters and children.  They are descendants of the handcart  trek, whether LDS, or FLDS, the heritage is still there.  :)

LDS apologists come here and talk about those people like they are the plague, while their very heritage is absolutely  the same. The reverence toward these prophets and saints is precisely the same also.

Not only that, just because they live in a compound in Texas, it doesn't nor has it ever confined child-molestation through polygamy to El Dorado Texas. It has been proven through references on this board that polygamous child-molestation has been sanctioned by the state of Utah as late as 1997, while I also don't trust that the LDS church truly excommunicates all the adherents of such a lifestyle.

The LDS zealots on the net have been trying fervently to scapegoate polygamy ever since the appearance of the FLDS in the public eye. It is a disinformation campaign at best. 

So far as leaving to each his own, well, we could put a great big HIS in the middle of that sentence, because these children they marry in order to HAVE THEIR WAY of polygamy are coerced by them and their parents of Mormon heritage.

 

Polygamy was once called "the most holy doctrine" by Brigham Young who is still revered as a great prophet and church leader of the past.

 
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