Topic : 05/20 The Dr. Phil House: Brat Camp

I was very happy to read the post from the person who knew Wendy.  They have had grief counciling and will conitinue to need it.

She lost a child to cancer.  Wonder why she may be grief stricken?  I think it is HEALTHY for her son to see how death hurts...if she were not sad, it would send a message that the death was meaningless to her. 

I hope she gets more help from Dr. Phil, but if anyone expects her to bounce back this soon after burying a child, they really ought to read up on the mourning process.  This was NOT a goldfish floating in the bowl, it was her daughter! 

Maybe both would benefit from a group that has members who lost children to death.  The look in her eyes?  Perhaps we'd all have that look, or worse were we to have walked that road.  She is not a robot, and by ten, a child should be learning compassion for the sufffering of others.

Maybe one day this child will marry.  Will he slap his wife in the face if she mourns the deaths of her parents? 

That behavior is NOT o.k....and there should be no "BUTS".  It is not all right to hit your mother.  Dr. Phil was 100% correct to get that point across...with no wiggle room. 

if you read my message,  1  out of a 100 people are psyhopaths and live normal lives, its a personality disorder that does not mean you'll murder people. psychopaths normally become doctors, lawyers, or go into law enforcement, read up.. you associate a word with what you see on television all serial killers are psychopaths but all psychopaths aren't serial killers.

I love my dog as well,he's treated better then most humans, and i know better then all other animals.
they love us no matter what we do to them, so one must treat them well.
Humans will not love you if you treat them bad in most ways,that's if they have any sense of there self, you know (right in the head).
anyway this quote came from a little boy who dose not know what humans are treated like, much less dogs.
so get real!!!!!

 I agree, too. I don't think the little boy, Noah, was lying when he considered his mother's jab a "hit"...I don't think he was lying to Dr. Phil in any way. Dr. Phil, please listen to this boy. His mother is abusive and this intelligent, articulate little boy is not being listened to and has been so minimized in his life that I can understand why he wouldn't respect his mother much. She seems to be the liar, and I do believe him when he says that she said she hates him and that he's trying to kill her. She is trying hard to keep her rage under control, but her eyes are blazing with anger. I'd love to see her recorded when she doesn't expect it. Dr. Phil, this boy just needs to be HEARD by someone. Don't shut him down.

While I was watching this program I had to leave to go into another room, but I could still hear what was being said. While listening to Wendy and Noah 'argue' it dawned on me that it didn't sound like a ten year old boy and his mother having a disagreement, it sounded more like a husband and wife to me..or boyfriend and girlfriend. We have 'raised' two boys (now in their twenties), at ten years old their lives were much more concerned about playing soccer, friends...winking at the girls (just a little).

I was in the room when he slapped his mother....oddly, I didn't think that she looked that surprised by it...my jaw would have dropped off of my face. It would be interesting to hear if this was indeed the first time he has slapped her, she sure looked rather composed after it happened.

And again just an observation....when she was looking at him? If I hadn't known better I would never have thought that the person across from her was a ten year old child...maybe a husband/boyfriend...an 'adult' adversary perhaps. But certainly not a child that she has brought into the world that has suffered the losses that she knows about...again, just observations.

It will be interesting to see how this follows up in the coming weeks, there sure is lots of pain to go around on this program.

 

Just my opinion of course.

This kid knows EXACTLY what he is doing and EXACTLY what he can get away with...which is a lot!  He is quite calculating and manipulating I must say.  I would not have allowed him to hit me.  This is saying she accepted what he did and there was no consequence for his actions. 

 

I am 50.  I can recall when I was young my mother punished me with a belt.  It took only one time for me to know that I did not want that again.  Too, I respected her words to know that I needed to do what I was told.  I did.  Life was good for me cause she did not have problems with me. 

 

There is a difference between discipline and child abuse.  I think you can discipline physically and it not be abusive.  That is my opinion.  But to let a child get away with slapping his mother in the face is wrong too.

 

When children get to the point as that of Noah, they will SAY AND DO anything to look right.  He is a liar.  So you put the law into a child's hands who is capable to such lies and then you have innocent parents being reported to CPS, and it was nothing but lies.  This was the very case on Desperate Housewives this week. 

 

Again, this is where there is a huge diference between discipline and abuse.  Sadly, all of this has been neatly placed into ONE catagory that makes life frightening for parents who are not abusive.

Now thats funny  lol...................you two online Docs telling eachother why their diagnoses is wrong !!!

 lol..................................................................leave the kid to the real Doctors!!!!

This is the first time I've ever been moved to post a message on one of these boards, but I could hardly sleep for thinking about little Noah.  First of all, let me say I don't have time to go back and read everything that's already been said, so forgive me if I'm parroting someone else.

Yes, Noah was out of line when he slapped his mother.  But, did anyone else see the desperation in that child's face?  Hear his pain?  I totally believe him when he says that his mother is in denial about the hitting, slapping, and cruel behavior she inflicts on him when no one is watching...when the cameras aren't rolling.  Maybe the 'nudges' weren't as hard as he perceived them to be on the plane....(and yes, maybe his slap was harder than he meant it to be,) but that child is at his wit's end! 

Who are we to judge how much it hurts when a mother inflicts physical pain on a child?  Not all pain is physical, and that child is in real pain.

He is screaming for help!  He said on camera...I am doing everything I can do to get someone to hear me..to get some adult to listen to me, and believe me.  I was crushed when Dr. Phil blew him off by saying 'You lied so now I'm not going to believe anything you say.'  That child was deflated...hopeless.
That, after telling him that his response to 'why are you glad you're here?,' sounded 'rehearsed.'

I'm fully congnizant of the mother's grief and need for counseling after the death of her daughter.  I understand her need for help, and I know that Noah is a pain in the rear.  But she is a classic example of passive aggressive behavior.  She looks at that child with such hatred!  I could see it, and you KNOW he can see it!  She didn't even who any emotion when he slapped her.  She looked at him as if she'd just won some kind of battle.  It was horrifying.

Imagine how he must feel.  Imagine living in that woman's home knowing every day that she never loved you as much as she loved your sister, and now that sister is dead.  Imagine the fear of being left alive with her grief.

I wanted to go get that little boy and swoop him up in my arms and hug him and tell him that it wasn't his fault that his mother didn't love him as much as his sister...wasn't his fault that he was NEVER going to be loved as much, and that there was never going to be anything he could do to change that.

All he wants it just whatever love she CAN give him....but she can't even show him a little love.  She's too deep within her own black despair to see that she is killing his spirit, killing his soul.  It's no wonder that he strikes out the only way he can.  He is helpless against her.

I pray that Dr. Phil (or Robin!) will see what is really going on here, and reach out to this child, and tell him that someone believes him.  Help his Mother....get her the help she needs, but get that child away from her before she harms him any more, or he does something to himself that can't be reversed.

If my son were to ever raise his hand to hit me, I would have knocked him on the ground and he would have to have had help to get up.  I understand that he 'wanted to show her how it felt' but, I'm sorry.  How I was raised, you wouldn't dare do that--you wouldn't even dare dream about doing that!  How disrespectful!  But you know what, I don't blame him in a way, because had the mom done what she was supposed to have done from the time he was old enough to understand, he wouldn't have had the guts to do something like that.  I know Dr. Phil doesn't believe in spanking, but I do.  I don't believe in abusing, but I do believe in discipline.  And what that child needs is a good old-fashioned butt whipping!

Hi Wendy,

Our daughters went to preschool together. I am Stephanie's mom. I am so sorry for your loss and for the problems that you and Noah are having. If you ever need a place to go, someone to talk to, or just a place to sit for a while. Maybe even some respite for Noah. I am in the same place and listed in the phone book. You can always get a hold of the school they can find me too. You both will be in my prayers.

 

Diana