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Topic : 09/01 Custody Chaos

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Created on : Friday, August 29, 2008, 11:59:43 am
Author : DrPhilBoard1
Alienation, slander, sabotage  ... These are some of the ugly extremes ex-spouses go to when fighting for custody of their children. Too often innocent children are used as weapons to exact revenge on a former mate. Melissa and her ex-husband, John, are in a heated custody battle for their 6-year-old daughter and 8-year-old son. Melissa says John is a danger to the children. She says he leaves guns and knives within their reach, and he has locked them outside in the dark. John says Melissa has violated a custody order and kidnapped their children, and that's why he wants full custody. With all the finger-pointing, who's telling the truth? Melissa's mom, Janet, says she fears John could snap at any moment, and she worries for the safety of her daughter and grandchildren. Find out what she says is her biggest regret. And, high-profile attorney Gloria Allred and the director of The National Center for Men, Mel Feit, weigh in. Who do they feel should have custody of the children? You won’t want to miss their heated debate! Join the discussion.

Find out what happened on the show.

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September 9, 2008, 1:43 am PDT

Special Guest?

Well mom & dad are living two different lives and that is what they also want for the children. That is ok as long as mom & dad stay out of each other's head's.
The grandmother needs to stay out of it completely... I have a feeling that is why they're divorced in the first place!
and Dr. Phil if your going to ask a special guest to come in and give their opinion to help, don't bring Gloria Allred into it, all she did was make the matter worse.... in fact she is more unstable than the grandmother!!! and I like the indirect statement of telling Gloria she is a pretty dog.. HA HA HA!!!
What's even funnier is she said thank you... HA HA HA!!!
 
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September 9, 2008, 1:57 am PDT

WHAT!!!!!

Quote From: cdb8868

DR. PHIL MADE SEVERAL COMMENTS TO THE MOTHER IN LAW I DON'T AGREE WITH. HOW CAN HE SAY SHE DOESN'T HAVE A VOTE IN THE CHILDRENS' WELFARE. IN ESSENCE, THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT HE IS SAYING. DOES SHE HAVE A VOTE IF SHE HAS TO PAY FOR FUNERAL ARRANGEMENTS FOR HER DAUGHTER OR GRANDCHILDREN???????? SHE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO VOICE HER OPINION AND BE CONCERNED ABOUT THEIR WELL BEING. I ALMOST ALWAYS AGREE WITH DR. PHIL.....BUT NOT THIS TIME!!!!!! IS SHE SUPPOSED TO STAND BY AND WAIT FOR THE "CHAOS" TO END??????, AND THEN PICK UP THE PIECES?? COME ON....REMEMBER THE PHRASE...."IT TAKES A VILLAGE TO RAISE A CHILD". IT IS SOOOO MUCH HER BUSINESS. I STOOD BY AND WATCHED MY GRANDSON IN A VERY SIMILIAR SITUATION, AND ALL HELL BROKE OUT AND DESTROYED MY ENTIRE FAMILY. RE-THINK THAT ONE, DR. PHIL. WHAT IF IT WAS YOUR DAUGHTER OR GRANDCHILDEN? YOU DON'T HAVE A VOTE? I DOUBT THAT VERY MUCH.

These children aren't the mother-in-laws.. SO YES SHE HAS NO RIGHT TO STICK HER HEAD INTO IT.. now she can give her daughter advise/words of wisdom (if she has any) but that is all.
She has NO right addressing the father in the manner she was on the show, at ANY time. (or the children)
 
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September 9, 2008, 2:53 am PDT

Everyone needs counseling - Even the kids

 Mom and Dad did not talk enough. Grandma had too much time. Both parents need to grow up and see the other side. If the kids are truly in danger, then there should be supervised visits until a licensed professional feels it's safe again. Dad seems a bit extreme with things he does with the kids and maybe parental counseling would be beneficial but don't take custody completely away. That would destroy all parties involved. When kids are involved with guns, they should be triple locked: Trigger locked, Bullets locked & Gun locked. Kids can learn to respect guns in in the presence of parental guidance only. Children don't reason like adults! Accidents happen even when guns are respected. Mom and Dad should be careful of partners in front of children. Both children should have counseling because of the divorce and for any fears they may have with Dad or Mom. The counselor should have the power to take care of these fears. Dad needs to be open to how he may be affecting the children and be willing to hear & change if his children fear him. Mom should stay in the state as mandated. Get a court order if she's that afraid. Mom and Dad need to stop name calling and put the children first.
 
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September 9, 2008, 10:36 am PDT

Marine Dad

I know an ex-marine that exhibited some of the same controlling erratic behavior as John. Weand  were afraid to even visit his house. We would get popped in the mouth for smacking, had to stand in corners until fatigued (while reading the bible), he would tie his left-handed sons' hands behind their backs so that they could be just as proficient in basketball utilizing their right hand, as their left. (We are talking between the ages of 6-13). No one could go to school dances or proms, and he only purchased them a pair of shoes per year.  My mother would sneak and buy them shoes to hide, because they were being teased at school. His wife had to sit idly by and not comment, or catch his fiery.  Too me, Melissa has that same fear of repurcussions and has allowed her mother to become her voice. She cannot articulate because she was not allowed to in the marriage.  Grandma appeared overbearing because she is fearful...her daughter and grandchildren have been subjected to that type of abuse for YEARS!!!! This particular ex-marine tells his son now that he is a sissy because he allows his ex-wife to make him babysit. (his own children during visitation) Another son he called a sissy and faggot all his life because he was sensitive and caring. Please don't think these women are exaggerating because I see this man's grown children (ages 31-45) suffer as a result of how their father mistreated them.

 
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September 9, 2008, 10:50 am PDT

Keep GRANDMA away!

This show has upset me enough to register here just so I could express my feelings!

 

Dr. Phil, you should have told Grandma to be quiet!  She didn't even belong on the stage, unless is was an effort to show her obvious guilt in this troubled situation.  She was a right-fighter, to use your phrase, and to believe she didn't trash Dad in front of the children is ludicrous.

 

The children's Mom & Grandma were, IMO, full of hyperbole!  Sure there are concerns with the Dad -- there are real problems with Mom, as well, and HUGE concerns with Grandma.

 

My happily married son are fathers, and they both have guns in their home (safely) and take their kids on 4-wheeler rides -- no seatbelts on because they don't HAVE seatbelts.  They tease and play with the kids. Perhaps a vicious MIL could put the worst spin on my sons' behavior.

 

I feel Mom & Grandma were very smug in their effort to villify the Dad, and he was unfairly treated on the show.  I certainly hope a follow-up show is done with these people.  The audience seemed to applaud only the Mother's points -- was the audience hand-selected by Gloria Allred?

 

I've never been this frustrated after a Dr. Phil show. Why did you not tell the Grandma to shut up??

She controlled and ruined the show!  She should have been put in her place!

 
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September 10, 2008, 12:23 am PDT

09/01 Custody Chaos

Quote From: tashaluv

I hope that Melissa RUNS & takes those kids far away from John & Divorce this guy & get's Full custody! I Lived with a man who was similar to John,had guns & one day held a shot gun to my head & said he was gonna kill me & once ur in that position there is a chance of no return with a person who's not stable. I think Melissa might have seen the real John once she got away to a safe place & opened her ears to what he was saying,what he was doing & that can be a Huge Wake Up Call!!
  I wonder if John spent time fighting in War?
   I hope whatever they do it's the best for those kids...
John DID NOT spend time in war.
 
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September 10, 2008, 4:18 am PDT

We are living proof of PAS

Quote From: silencedmother

One of the most disturbing scandals in the history of our court system has already been  investigated. Lots of people know about it but no one has been able to do anything about it - yet.

 

Around the 1970's, a quack named "Dr". Richard Gardner - who was pro-pedophile - invested large amounts of his time to promote his warped ideas. Just Google Custody Prep for Moms and take a look at their links or articles section. There's a plethora of information about how child abuse cases are mishandled in our family courts- mostly because of Gardner's wacky ideas about children and sexuality.

 

In Connecticut, there is a "regional family trial docket" in Middletown, CT  where the state's family courts send custody cases involving domestic violence and/or sexual abuse. Many attorneys and court evaluators working with those cases call them "contested" or "high conflict" custody cases. However, the custody cases which involve domestic violence and or child abuse are not "contested" or "high conflict" cases. They involve victims of child abuse and domestic violence and, instead of being handled by experts in child abuse and domestic violence, they are handled by pro-Gardner attorneys and court evaluators in an adversarial family court system.

 

Most everyone knows that when a non-family member sexually abuses a child, the child is usually protected. However, most people in this country have no idea that when the sexual predator is the child's father, and when there is a question of who gets custody of the child, our family court system is a place where attorneys and court evaluators freely use Gardner's ideas of "the sexuality of children" and  "parental alienation of 'affection' "  to take abused children from protective mothers to place them with their abusers. 

 

If you are reading this and can do something to investigate and expose "PAS" set-up once and for all, you will be a hero. The set-up has been going on since the 1970's when Gardner first began to offer lectures and publish his weird ideas. No one has been able to do anything about protecting our nation's children from it.

 

Please help in any way you can. Thank you.

Unfortunately PAS is very real.

I am a Noncustodial Mom who has/had gone over 10 years without seeing my oldest sons.

My Ex husband abused me physically and emotionally and it didn't stop when we divorced. He was granted custody of our children and went on to abuse not only me but them as well by with holding visitations. Several years of court battles, false accusations, GAL involvement (one sided), moving and leaving me with no info on my childrens where abouts, etc. made all the matters worse. The courts SHOULD have recognized PAS in that "era" AND it should  very well be recognized now.

Here we are all these years later and R. Gardner is still getting no respect for his "diagnosis" nor treatments for the children/families that have had to go through it. =(

 
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September 10, 2008, 8:33 am PDT

09/01 Custody Chaos

Children don't understand a lot about relationships, but they do understand when you hate half of them. Each parent hates the other and even a two year knows that two halves make a whole. These two went ahead and made two other humans and now they are both doing their level best to damage them. No matter how bad a parent is, children will love them. These two, and a lot of people, have no idea what love means. Neither one of them deserves children, but that is irrelevant at this point. They can learn and make a new start, if they can love more then they hate. Love is doing what is best, and a lot of times it's really hard. No matter how much you dislike your ex  you have to remember that your child loves them. You do what you have to for your kids, no matter how yucky it makes you feel. I like to have little day dreams about sharp, pointy, flaming medieval things falling from the sky onto the heads of people annoying me. It always makes me smile, and then I get on with things. If you give your evil thoughts a place in your head, it vents the pressure and it’s harmless. In other words, keep your ugly mouth shut, and smile till it kills you. Your babies are worth it.
If the father really does have porn and guns laying about then that is something she definitely has to have addressed in court. If she is playing fast and loose with a court order to stay in a certain state then he needs to have that addressed in court. They also need to have a discipline agreement. Both need to realize that they are no longer together and what happens in each other's house is none of their business, as long as it's not illegal or dangerous. Everyone has different morals and you cannot impose yours.
Custody is never static, and should always start as 50\50. It can be adjusted as needs change. I wonder if they could learn to behave if their children were ordered into foster care.  How much do they really love them?  From what I’ve seen one parent is usually less involved, and the situation resolves itself.  One day children will be adults and realize that parents are just flawed humans like they are. Hopefully they felt loved by both parents.
 
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September 10, 2008, 12:56 pm PDT

Melissas Mom & JohnJohn and Maddies Meemaw here...

Quote From: drumlord30

here is my last input ok u don't even ******* know john or melissa i do and just because im john's friend doesn't mean im on his side but yeah i see what gos on in that house and i have seen just about all of what i want to see from her so if u have a problem with that then i guess u can just deal with it cause ur input doesn't matter in this situation mine does cause i have seen what  this woman puts her children through
 It is so obvious you are lying here because...Melissa has had nothing to do or say to John since she left in December.  You are his friend, he has lied to you, you have believed him.  Just by the way you talk tells us all that you are just like John, in fact, you MAY be John.  Nothing goes on in that house, not as far as Melissa is concerned.  BTW, YOUR input doesn't matter in this discussion either, you are a liar or have been sadly misinformed by John.  John is a VERY convincing liar, we know firsthand.  You are just making yourself look so foolish by saying you TRULY know him and by defending him.  It is so interesting that everyone liked Melissa until John started making up all his lies and sob stories.  Why don't you be a real man and call me and discuss this.  Ask John for my number. 
 
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September 10, 2008, 12:59 pm PDT

Melissas Mom & JohnJohn and Maddies Meemaw here...

Quote From: senior_editor

 To Mom:
You made several mistakes here: 1)You agreed to a divorce in order to help defraud your collective creditors; 2)You also agreed to remarry him after cleaning up your collective finances; 3)You let YOUR mother get in the middle of your relationship with your husband; and 4)You allowed your mother to convince you to take the opportunity at hand to permanently bag the family and marriage all together.

First, you are no better than your ex-husband for agreeing to file in order to defraud creditors. You are NOT the more upstanding person because you have an equal responsibility for your fraudulant actions.

Secondly, you betrayed your husband by NOT keeping your word to remarry after things were cleared up. I understand that it may have been an ideal opportunity for you to not have to struggle with him to actually get divorced if you wanted. But there was no indication on the show that you ever wanted out of your marriage to him. You stayed married to him for at least 8 years while know of his ways; why was there no effort to leave? I understand the fear of his background. I was married to a nut with a cabinet full of high powered guns; but he also knew he should not challenge me in the area of gun use because I have no problem rounding up brothers and uncles to take him behind the barn. I find it hard to believe you would stay with a man that you deeply feared.

Lastly, and most importantly to mom..... IF you love your kids [and I believe you do, then WHY on earth would you EVER let your own mother into the middle of your marriage to create and stir up a constant family drama? Your children will not calm down [even if you get sole custody...I know, I have sole custody UNTIL you get YOUR MOTHER OUT of the entire situation. She is a trouble maker. I'm sure she loves you, but SHE LOVES THE DISCORD MORE..... She will never stop telling horror stories to your children; she will never let anything die, pass or be forgiven..... Frankly, she needs her butt kicked!  ..... Again, unfortunately I know too well what I am talking about here.....we have had to kick out my ex-mother-in-law AND my mother just to give our child an opportunity to truly love all of us..... We do not leave him unsupervised with ANY of the grand parents, and all of the grand parents are cut out of our family's conversations and decision making.


To Dad:
You say you love your ex-wife and would like to remarry her.  Well, frankly, you need to ACT like you mean it. You have some serious and deep apologies to make to her. My husband made similar comments as yours concerning child birth. Your wife put her full soul into bringing your children into the world and this is the best you can do? You think you are justified or funny to say demeaning things about the birthing process or her body? You can NEVER expect her to DESIRE you when you have only horrible things to say about her. A husband's ugly comments about his wife's body NEVER quite leave the wife's mind. You should not expect a quick or easy healing; in fact, you should not expect anything from her at all. YOU should be the one to approach her with a contrite spirit and ask forgiveness...... and IF she agrees to try to forgive you, don't be an ass and go behaving and speaking to her in the same manner next week, next month or next year.  Examine your heart, prayerfully and continually until heaven moves on your behalf.

You, dad, have some real issues about your manhood and your sexuality. If you love your wife and your children, then invest the time and effort to seek healing.... Oh, and I know this may be unpopular, but try the throne of God rather than the counselor's chair. Direct communications with heaven will yield positive results that no man on earth can adequately provide. And don't kid yourself to think that your problems will all be healed over night or quickly. Prepare to spend several years seeking permanent solutions. Your children and your wife [IF she ever agrees to be yours again deserve a dad who isn't always replaying twisted images in his mind when he interacts with them.


To Grandma:
Shut your hole; keep your opinions to yourself completely; and don't expect to be consulted or have information given to you. If your daughter wants to love her ex-husband [or remarry him while heaven works out healing in his heart and life, then that is between them. NOTHING about this family concerns you; not even where the grandchildren are spending their time. You know that dad has no explicit abuses toward his children, and you are cooking up this crap and stirring the pot constantly by keeping everyone upset all of the time. IF you love your daughter, then shut up and give her peace. IF you love your grandchildren, then shut up and give them peace while mom and dad work out their problems. YOU HAVE THE MOST TO LOSE...... I have an ex-mother-in-law JUST LIKE YOU, and to this day she doesn't get to visit or know anything. We do not visit, and her other children and grandchildren do not visit. And, my dear grandma, that's what a meddling spirit and a non-stop mouth will get you.


 That you are a senior editor to a Christian publishing house scares the BeJesus out of me! 
 
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