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Topic : 06/03 Virtual Chaos

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Created on : Thursday, October 16, 2008, 10:37:46 am
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 10/20/08) Sixty-five percent of American households report playing computer and video games, and surprisingly, the average player is 35 years old. Computer games are supposed to be fun, but when a hobby turns into an obsession, virtual fantasy worlds can ruin lives and wreck marriages. Juli says her 34-year-old husband, Fred, plays computer games all day and ignores his entire family. Fred admits to spending up 10 hours a day in a cyber world, but will he call it an addiction? Fred’s stepson, Brandon, thinks Fred is lazy and that his mom can do better. Then, Brad, 40, was so addicted to games that he spent up to 80 hours a week locked in the basement with his computer. Not only did he accumulate close to $24,000 of debt, his addiction nearly cost him his marriage and his life! Next, Liz found her 21-year-old son, Shawn, dead at his computer from a self-inflicted gun shot. She says that a role-playing game in the virtual world transformed her son from a vibrant young adult into a depressed introvert, which ultimately led to his suicide. Liz founded Online Gamers Anonymous to educate others about the potential dangers of obsessive gaming. Then, when Wendy married a video game designer, she literally took matters into her own hands and started playing herself.  Are you or is someone you love at risk for video game addiction? Log on to DrPhil.com for a checklist of signs!

Find out what happened on the show.

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October 20, 2008, 7:49 pm PDT

A comment from a mom

Many many people are completely missing the point. We KNOW that there are many people who can play casually and enjoy video games and continue to live a balanced life. Somewhere around 90% of gamers can do that. We do NOT have a problem with that. No one wants to ban video games. It would be nice if the designers could design them a little more responsibly now that it has become apparent that 10% of the population is susceptible to addiction to them. Once upon a time, heroin and morphine were marketed irresponsibly to the general public, but then the medical community realized there was a problem. The alcohol, tobacco and gambling industries have become somewhat more responsible about marketing their products, not always voluntarily. No one is saying that video games CAUSE addiction, even though some of the design features are directed at susceptible people, to get them into the game and hold them there. The person who mentioned that people shouldn't "let themselves become addicted" is being a bit unrealistic. I am just hoping that this program at least educated a lot of parents, spouses, teachers, and physicians that there is a problem that might be affecting their children, spouses, students, and patients, and that they might want to learn more about it. I WISH I had seen a program like this or found a site like www.olganon.org before I sent my son away to college. While he lived at home, I did just what everyone in these posts has said to do: Monitor usage, encourage other activities, kick him outside when he had been on too long, make sure he put his studies first, etc. etc. If I knew then what I know now, however, I would have seen the increasing difficulty he had getting off the computer as a danger sign and I would NEVER have let him go to college 2 hours away, to live in a dorm room with 24/7 high-speed internet 2 steps from his bed and classes where nobody cared if he shoed up at all. That little mistake only cost me $13,000 in wasted tuition. If Dr.Phil's program keeps even one parent from making the same mistake, it was well worth airing the show. If our doctor had seen a show like this, they might have asked our son about his gaming habits when they diagnosed him with "ADD" and gave him $150 worth of medication that did not help him. This is what we are trying to achieve. EDUCATION. If you can play responsibly and have a life, good for you, but don't make life more difficult for those who can't.
 
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October 20, 2008, 8:28 pm PDT

Juli ....why are you still with this guy???

SO....I'm a single dad and sitting ehre watching Dr. Phil and watching this episode about your lazy, immature husband playing video games ALL THE TIME...neglecting you & your kids and letting your family fall into despair.

 

I'm also noticing how beautiful and sweet you are. I'm left wondering why your stupid husband is getting to have a great girl like you. Juli - there are many nice, sweet, employed responsible and yes - even handsome & funny....guys  (like me) who would kill or die to have a great girl like you.

 

Juli - if you ever want to talk....drop me a reply. I promise...I'm a normal guy:) Best of luck to you!.

 

J

 
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October 20, 2008, 8:44 pm PDT

10/20 Virtual Chaos

Quote From: mel2nc

That would be great if you have the time. If you have children, work and have a household, there is no real time to WOW.  I understand the game -- my hubby has explained it to me and I watch him play sometimes for awhile, but it takes a long time to play it-- it's not something you can play together for just one hour a day.
Why not? 

The great part about a game that never ends is that you choose your own goals.  I know plenty of people who play up to and even less than 1 hour a day.  I mean many people will log on for an hour and just do Player versus Player fights for an hour, or even just chat with their friends and fool around.  Log on and even do some quest content with someone else.  Many of the new world of warcraft dungeons can be completed in under an hour.

I honestly think that the "raiding" part of online games is what creates the view that you need loads of time to play the game, but that isn't a requirement for online games, it's a chosen part of them.
 
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October 20, 2008, 8:46 pm PDT

cure?

Well.....the symptoms fit my 19yr old son to a "T".......unfortunately, Dr Phil did not provide much help on how to kick this addiction.  My wife and I have tried all kinds of things to discourage the WOW addiction, but to no avail.  Had him on a timed program while he was in High School, but now that he's in college, he's on his own.....gotta grow up sometime, but it ain't happening.  Used to be an "A" student.....now on the brink of flunking out (simply because he skips class to play this idiotic game).  Worst thing I ever did was get him a computer game.....it has ruined his life......no end in sight.  He's a shell of his former self, and in complete denial.  Ugh!
 
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October 20, 2008, 8:51 pm PDT

CURE?

Quote From: gamersmom

Many many people are completely missing the point. We KNOW that there are many people who can play casually and enjoy video games and continue to live a balanced life. Somewhere around 90% of gamers can do that. We do NOT have a problem with that. No one wants to ban video games. It would be nice if the designers could design them a little more responsibly now that it has become apparent that 10% of the population is susceptible to addiction to them. Once upon a time, heroin and morphine were marketed irresponsibly to the general public, but then the medical community realized there was a problem. The alcohol, tobacco and gambling industries have become somewhat more responsible about marketing their products, not always voluntarily. No one is saying that video games CAUSE addiction, even though some of the design features are directed at susceptible people, to get them into the game and hold them there. The person who mentioned that people shouldn't "let themselves become addicted" is being a bit unrealistic. I am just hoping that this program at least educated a lot of parents, spouses, teachers, and physicians that there is a problem that might be affecting their children, spouses, students, and patients, and that they might want to learn more about it. I WISH I had seen a program like this or found a site like www.olganon.org before I sent my son away to college. While he lived at home, I did just what everyone in these posts has said to do: Monitor usage, encourage other activities, kick him outside when he had been on too long, make sure he put his studies first, etc. etc. If I knew then what I know now, however, I would have seen the increasing difficulty he had getting off the computer as a danger sign and I would NEVER have let him go to college 2 hours away, to live in a dorm room with 24/7 high-speed internet 2 steps from his bed and classes where nobody cared if he shoed up at all. That little mistake only cost me $13,000 in wasted tuition. If Dr.Phil's program keeps even one parent from making the same mistake, it was well worth airing the show. If our doctor had seen a show like this, they might have asked our son about his gaming habits when they diagnosed him with "ADD" and gave him $150 worth of medication that did not help him. This is what we are trying to achieve. EDUCATION. If you can play responsibly and have a life, good for you, but don't make life more difficult for those who can't.
Sorry....saw a lot of symptoms/problems on the TV show, but no real advice on a cure.  Nothing we've tried with our 19yr old has worked......he's in complete denial and thinks we are overstating the problem.  In the meantime, he's a shell of himself and in danger of flunking out of college (former "A" student).  We need advice on how to resolve this.....the problem has been long-recognized.
 
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October 20, 2008, 8:58 pm PDT

10/20 Virtual Chaos

Quote From: gamersmom

Many many people are completely missing the point. We KNOW that there are many people who can play casually and enjoy video games and continue to live a balanced life. Somewhere around 90% of gamers can do that. We do NOT have a problem with that. No one wants to ban video games. It would be nice if the designers could design them a little more responsibly now that it has become apparent that 10% of the population is susceptible to addiction to them. Once upon a time, heroin and morphine were marketed irresponsibly to the general public, but then the medical community realized there was a problem. The alcohol, tobacco and gambling industries have become somewhat more responsible about marketing their products, not always voluntarily. No one is saying that video games CAUSE addiction, even though some of the design features are directed at susceptible people, to get them into the game and hold them there. The person who mentioned that people shouldn't "let themselves become addicted" is being a bit unrealistic. I am just hoping that this program at least educated a lot of parents, spouses, teachers, and physicians that there is a problem that might be affecting their children, spouses, students, and patients, and that they might want to learn more about it. I WISH I had seen a program like this or found a site like www.olganon.org before I sent my son away to college. While he lived at home, I did just what everyone in these posts has said to do: Monitor usage, encourage other activities, kick him outside when he had been on too long, make sure he put his studies first, etc. etc. If I knew then what I know now, however, I would have seen the increasing difficulty he had getting off the computer as a danger sign and I would NEVER have let him go to college 2 hours away, to live in a dorm room with 24/7 high-speed internet 2 steps from his bed and classes where nobody cared if he shoed up at all. That little mistake only cost me $13,000 in wasted tuition. If Dr.Phil's program keeps even one parent from making the same mistake, it was well worth airing the show. If our doctor had seen a show like this, they might have asked our son about his gaming habits when they diagnosed him with "ADD" and gave him $150 worth of medication that did not help him. This is what we are trying to achieve. EDUCATION. If you can play responsibly and have a life, good for you, but don't make life more difficult for those who can't.
I think most people realize that this is referring to the group of people who have serious problems with playing the online games.

But these types of shows consistently come on and so rarely do they give any sort of opinion of the other side.  If anything your average gamer is completely ignored in most of these shows, or made to look bad.  This show was a perfect example, the one person who was on the average gamers side was put on at the same time as the woman who had her son die while playing Everquest.  She had a few lines and that was it.

I mean if you want to discuss something like this wouldn't you think it's fair to at least have someone on the show who understands the games while the talk is going on? 
 
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October 20, 2008, 9:03 pm PDT

In the absence of understanding, moderation is the key

Although the show presented guests who have gone overboard, exhibiting behaviors suggestive of addiction, I would like to point out some research results which show that computer game playing has potentially beneficial effects, and therefore public opinion needs to take care not to throw out a barrel of benefit because of a few bad apples.

The military picked up on video game simulations very early for the obvious training benefits in hand-eye coordination, but the same benefit has also been shown in other fields, as it was recently shown that surgeons make fewer surgical mistakes if they play video games routinely, or more specifically as a warm-up to an operating procedure. 

 

http://www.bio-medicine.org/medicine-news/Video-Games-Reduces-Surgical-Errors--u2013-A-Stud-10557-1/

 

For decades cultural cassandras have associated gaming with doom, and I am not talking about the game trademark.  Even more pragmatic folks denounced gaming because it seems unproductive.  And popular expectations for the worse regarding video game playing are little different.  The worst outcomes, however I suspect, would occur in the isolated individuals who are otherwise susceptible to addictions.  Some people are more vulnerable than others.

 

Brain scans of game players show interesting sex differences as well.  For example, Stanford 'researchers have shown that part of the brain that generates rewarding feelings is more activated in men than women during video-game play.'  Therefore, spousal misunderstandings might be exaccerbated by such gender based differences in reward perception.

 

http://med.stanford.edu/news_releases/2008/february/videobrain.html

 

More interestingly, recently there has been comparisons in brain activity between online activities vs. traditional offline activities.  Although the study only targeted online searching vs. reading, rather than video games per se, I would argue a similarity because of the interactive problem solving which it requires.  Interactive online searching, a game in its own right, resulted in increased brain activity in more areas of the brain than reading a book. 

 

http://www.efluxmedia.com/news_Web_Searches_Improve_Brain_Activity_26830.html

 

The last two examples could also possibly suggest how computer gaming may trigger addictive responses in some people since the greater dopamine activation during the activity may habituate some so that the withdrawal of the activity would be felt as profoundly unsatisfying.

 

I also feel more research needs to be done studying brain response relative to the kind of game playing, since there are issues of learning, perception, and problem solving that are different among the game genres, - such as a role-playing game vs. a pure strategy game vs. a twitchy shooter vs. some less competitive but still complex simulation.  After the effect of such differences are determined, it would also be important to know how those gaming interactions alter brain usage and development vs. traditional solitary activities like reading, shopping, carpentry, or such.

 
Admittedly then, given the high neurologic reward computer game playing provides, it could be a double-edged sword in the brain development of children, highly developing some responses but causing developmental delays in other areas.  Some studies show kids who already exhibit addictive traits might also exhibit delayed development particularly in social skills when they get hooked on games without guidance.  Unsurprisingly, excessive gaming can turn kids into high-functioning but aggressive nerds.

 

In Silicon Valley, such a nerd might be seen as a positive role model, and it's also probably not far from the personalities of the greed-obssessed hypercompetitors of Wall-Street.  So is it wise to completely discourage it?

 

Despite my cynical innuendo and the apparent drawbacks, I believe the benefits are still there.  I think any interactive computer activity, whether online with others through persistent discussions such as these, in multiplayer role-playing games, or in solitary game-playing that fortifies spatial perceptual skills and problem solving, has the potential for enhancing brain development.  Perhaps one day enlightened game design itself will knowingly yet still subliminally direct game players toward balanced neurologic stimulation and development.  Until that future arrives however, What is missing today is a cultural foundation that can help guide people around the pitfalls.

 

 

 

 
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October 20, 2008, 9:04 pm PDT

10/20 Virtual Chaos

Quote From: dude6902

Well.....the symptoms fit my 19yr old son to a "T".......unfortunately, Dr Phil did not provide much help on how to kick this addiction.  My wife and I have tried all kinds of things to discourage the WOW addiction, but to no avail.  Had him on a timed program while he was in High School, but now that he's in college, he's on his own.....gotta grow up sometime, but it ain't happening.  Used to be an "A" student.....now on the brink of flunking out (simply because he skips class to play this idiotic game).  Worst thing I ever did was get him a computer game.....it has ruined his life......no end in sight.  He's a shell of his former self, and in complete denial.  Ugh!
I'm just throwing this out there, but he doesn't need a game to ruin his life.  I went to university and dropped out of my first two programs because I just wasn't ready for it.  I now have a graduated 3.9 gpa diploma and I'm working on my Bachelors.  My online games didn't cause it, even when I quit the game for a while I just found other things to avoid actually doing my work.


 
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October 20, 2008, 9:16 pm PDT

Gaming isn't a total bad thing.

In your show today it seemed like you made Gaming look like a bad thing.
Many people look at Gaming as a stupid mindless thing that doesn't help you at all, Like sitting in front of the TV all day watching movies and shows. Gaming has its down-sides. Such as addiction. But it also has it's upsides. It helps jog your mind FAR more than people may believe. I think if you sat down on a computer and played a REAL game you would see how much focus, determination, and skill it takes to succeed. Sure, it may not give you a physical workout, but it most definitely works your brain.
Not to mention it can be extremely competitive.
I think it was CNN that did a study a while ago that showed kids that played video-games succeeded more in certain field than kids that didn't.
 

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October 20, 2008, 9:31 pm PDT

10/20 Virtual Chaos

I'm 16 years old, currently a junior in High School. I've been playing video games since I can't even remember, and honestly I don't feel the urge to play games, it's a hobby not a need. I'm not claiming it's impossible to become addicted to games, I mean there are cases to prove essentially the point. But when one attempts to say that these games are "real life" or that these characters are "real" then that's when you've moved from aiding to insulting. Of course these characters aren't real, it's obvious to anyone, unless of course psychologically there is something wrong in which these players develop emotional attachments to their virtual characters. In that case, they've moved from addiction to delusion and aren't healthy mentally anyways. But I watched this episode and when one of the guests was criticized for believing these things are "real" it was a bit insulting. It's hard to get an idea of what the game becomes for most players. I don't actually play World of Warcraft or any MMO's because I'm a bit more fond of action myself, but I understand what my friends mean when they talk so in-depth over these characters. It's something they're good at, they like that feeling of being capable to achieve something, maybe it's filling that missing part of them that desires to achieve but can't, I'm not certain. But when one attempts to criticize someone for truly believing literally that a character is real, that's not solving anything, that's insulting and mocking that person. I'm all for these programs and reaching out to the audience addicted to gaming in general, but please take some time to talk to these people and realize that sometimes what you're saying isn't helping it's only making them feel worse because they can't be understood.
And no, I'm not some punk kid who plays games all day. I'm a top ranking student who plays tennis and performs in theatre at my school, so this isn't some game addict defending game addicts. This is some teenager with a better grasp on what gamers my age and probably older truly feel than that of many parents and other misguided adults.
 
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