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Topic : 10/29 Gender Confused Children

Number of Replies: 1316
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Created on : Friday, October 24, 2008, 02:51:47 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
Dr. Phil tackles the sensitive topic of children who identify more with the opposite sex. What do you do if your son wants to wear dresses and play with dolls? Or if your daughter tells you she wants to be a boy? Should parents chock it up to being a phase that their children will grow out of, or should they intervene right away? Meet Melissa and Tim, whose 8-year-old son declared himself to be a girl when he was just 3 years old. Now, they allow their child to live as a girl and wonder if and when they should begin hormone therapy. Then, when Mary’s son was 8, he told her he felt like a girl, and Mary allowed him to experiment with dressing as a female. Now a teenager, her son is more comfortable living as a male -- but Mary wonders if she caused his confusion. Joining the discussion are experts with differing points of view: Dr. Dan Siegel, professor and clinical psychiatrist at UCLA School of Medicine, and Glenn Stanton, author and research fellow with the organization Focus on the Family. Is gender identity something we’re born with, or is it influenced by parents and environment? Don’t miss this heated discussion, then talk about the show here..

Find out what happened on the show.

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November 1, 2008, 5:22 pm PDT

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: seenfff

       For the basis of point, I will just use male to female as an example. You can substitute if your child is Female to Male easily enough. Before I begin, I have a major point to make here.

     If you are responding to defend your decision, I must question your decision making. Defensive responses are often indications that there is doubt in your decision. If you made a sound decision, you have nothing to be defensive about.

1) Has your child ever referred to herself as a woman with male sexual organs?

2) Has your child ever referred to herself as a male?

3) Did you ever ask your child what she see's in a mirror?

4) Did you ever check on your child's psychological maturity with a Psychratic Professional?

5) Did you influence your child in any form? If so what did you do?

6) Did you want a daughter or son?

 

      Below are the questions that directly relate to your present situation.

1) Do you feel that she is psychologically ready to coup with society with the decision to alter her genitials?

2) If so, what have you done to prepare your child's entrance into society?

 

      If I have gotten the wrong impression, I would very greatly appreciate the correction. Otherwise, I am very concerned.

Wow.  Not getting *concerned* from you.  More like you're surveying your kingdom, wanting a lowly servant to please you.

 

 

This woman owes you nothing.  She does not have to satisfy you by filling out *your* questionare.  No parent would ever take such a life altering experience lightly.  I have no doubt she's covered ALL of your questions and ones you have not even entertained,  before coming to a very difficult decision for the sake of her child. 

 

 

Now go get a newspaper, roll it up and smack yourself on the nose with it.  I hope you greatly appreciate the correction.

 
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November 1, 2008, 5:32 pm PDT

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: efffy_

It's hard to tell sometimes if people are being serious because you cannot see body language, but humans have body hair as a left over from our monkey days. Evolution doncha know. As for man boobs, all men have nipples because we all start out as female. Boobs are fat, so if you're fat you have bigger boobs. It's really very simple.
I was being sarcastic Effy.  
 
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November 1, 2008, 5:33 pm PDT

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: tina_socal

 Time and time again in this discussion, well meaning but uninformed people have insisted that gender variant people are simply "confused" and all they need to make that confusion go away is to be immersed in activities and behaviors that reinforce sterotypical behaviors associated with their birth sex.

And despite the repeated claims that "once they turn 18 they can choose to do whatever they want", in reality families, friends, churches, employers and society in general do not stop trying to "cure" the non-transitioned individual by suggesting that he is just confused and can make it go away by immersing himself in stereotypical gender roles and "acting like a man".

So since all the tonka toys and cap guns and crew cuts didn't already work, he is then faced with adopting stereotypical *adult* gender roles and behaviors, and the two most obvious ones are:

get married

have kids

So the transperson, who is desperate to try ANYTHING that might make his suffering go away and make him "normal" takes this advice in good faith, gets married, has kids...and eventually learns that just like all the other stuff he tried as a kid, it doesn't work and the feelings persist.

When he can no longer keep up the sham and comes clean, it absolutely can wreak havoc on the life of his family...but it is the height of hypocrisy to them blame the transperson for making a good faith effort to do what he has been told his entire life will "fix" him...if any blame lies with him at all it is in listening to family, church and society rather than listening to his own heart and mind.

Add to this the fact that family, chuch and society in general all tell gender variant people both implicitly and explicitly that their feelings are shameful and should be kept hidden, and you have a situation where meeting people who would love and accept them regardless of their gender expression cannot happen in the atmosphere of openness and honesty that good relationships are built on. Once again by accepting the advice and admonitions of others in good faith, the transperson is doomed to either live a lie and eventually disappoint their partner, or forgo *ever* having any intimate relationships and the joy, satisfaction and comfort they bring.

As for "confusing" children, when a parent transitions early in a child's life or before having children the kids seldom have any lasting problems with it at all- mostly because their heads haven't been crammed full of bigotry and intolerance yet, and they learn the true nature of the transgender parent as someone who loves and cares for them.

Besides that, transitioning usually allows a person to lose much if not all of the anger, sadness and depression they have been burdened with their entire life, as well as getting rid of the clumsy, fake approximations of the gender behavior that was expected of them. In the case of male born TS's this false "masculine" persona often involves being cold, aloof, quick to anger, insensitive, overbearing, intolerant, drunk, etc., none of which makes for a good parent...

SO many male born transpeople hide their natural tendencies to be warm, kind, sensitive, caring, thoughtful, etc. because they are deathly afraid to show any sign of stereotypical "feminine" traits, lest their true nature be revealed...once again, something that people like many on this board are convinced is the answer/cure to their problems- repress it, hide it, pretend it doesn't exist... "just act like a man".
Thank you Tina, well said.
 
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November 1, 2008, 6:01 pm PDT

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: efffy_

I had this whole big message ready to go when I realized it's pointless. I think everyone should be encouraged to be who the are as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else. You don't, and that is so sad I have no real words for it. I am sick and tired of people being bashed, killed, hurt, abused, belittled, and degraded in the name of some ancient fairy tale. The only thing I believe in is love. I feel so disgusted by the attitudes I'm going to donate extra money to PFLAG right now, of which I am already a member.
I agree completely, well said.
 
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November 1, 2008, 6:35 pm PDT

Yes, You Have Indeed..

Quote From: zookeeper1

I do not mistreat no one.  You are judging me, and you don't know me to be talking about me like this.  I bet you wouldn't like it if I judged a transgender or transexual.
And, now in denial over this. Re-read what you have written regarding transgender, gender different  individuals. What one writes is an extension and expression of who they are.

Regardless of our sense of gender, sexual orientation, genitalia, political beliefs, values, morality or etc...
We are all members of the human family and share far aspects of being human that are in common than diffferent. But, our slight differences have been used to drive fear, hatred and anger in many individuals at a primal level. We all want to be loved and accepted for who we really are. Part of life's journey and challange is to learn and discover who we really are, not what others expect who we should be. This is a very basic aspect of freedom. Compassion for others and accepting them for who they really are without imposing your beliefs upon them goes a very long way to helping this world become a better, more peaceful place for the human family that we all share together.
 
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November 1, 2008, 7:41 pm PDT

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: zookeeper1

efffy,

        I was being sarcastic.  You got closer than TYLER1.  I disagree with you about men starting out as females.

I didn't read any of your comments leading up to this. I was just amusing myself. Disagreeing  about scientific facts is your privilege.
 
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November 1, 2008, 8:55 pm PDT

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: tyler1

I was being sarcastic Effy.  
Sarcastic is my mother tongue... I was just amusing myself... I think boobies is funny. Which is maybe kinda sad since I'm a middle aged woman and not a 12 year old boy. I'll put on my serious face. >:-(

 
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November 1, 2008, 8:59 pm PDT

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: havasumoma

Just want to say a personal thank you for mentioning and donating to PFLAG.

 

Kim Pearson

President, PFLAG Transgender Network

You're welcome. It's a sensitive issue for me. My best friend killed himself after he was outed to his bible thumping fire and brimstone biological units. We were 16.
 
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November 1, 2008, 9:53 pm PDT

Sad but true

Quote From: efffy_

You're welcome. It's a sensitive issue for me. My best friend killed himself after he was outed to his bible thumping fire and brimstone biological units. We were 16.
It is so sad that this sort of thing has to happen. I speak with many youth who feel that their parents love God more than they love them. What a CHOICE for a child to have to make. I know that Jesus taught compassion. Turning your back on your child is not compassionate.
 
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November 1, 2008, 10:04 pm PDT

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: havasumoma

Like I have said many times in the past few days "Walk a mile in my shoes"!!!

 

Some folks just need things tied up in tidy packages and wrapped in black and white. Shades of gray frighten them. I'm finding this conversation is becoming tedious.

 

I usually try to focus my educational efforts with folks who are more in the middle than those on the far right because I see the possibility of movement. Not sure why I'm beating my head against this particular wall. I think I am hoping that for every person who is posting against supporting these kids there are 50 who are only reading and maybe, just maybe, they will hear what you and I are saying.

Yes, I agree totally!  If things aren't either black or white, shades of gray throw people into a tailspin!!!!  Very well said.
 
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