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Topic : 10/29 Gender Confused Children

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Created on : Friday, October 24, 2008, 02:51:47 pm

Author : DrPhilBoard1

Dr. Phil tackles the sensitive topic of children who identify more with the opposite sex. What do you do if your son wants to wear dresses and play with dolls? Or if your daughter tells you she wants to be a boy? Should parents chock it up to being a phase that their children will grow out of, or should they intervene right away? Meet Melissa and Tim, whose 8-year-old son declared himself to be a girl when he was just 3 years old. Now, they allow their child to live as a girl and wonder if and when they should begin hormone therapy. Then, when Mary’s son was 8, he told her he felt like a girl, and Mary allowed him to experiment with dressing as a female. Now a teenager, her son is more comfortable living as a male -- but Mary wonders if she caused his confusion. Joining the discussion are experts with differing points of view: Dr. Dan Siegel, professor and clinical psychiatrist at UCLA School of Medicine, and Glenn Stanton, author and research fellow with the organization Focus on the Family. Is gender identity something we’re born with, or is it influenced by parents and environment? Don’t miss this heated discussion, then talk about the show here..

Find out what happened on the show.

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jeri4him

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January 13, 2009, 5:24 pm PST

God allows it all.....for HIS purpose.

I just watched the show this afternoon about the gender confused children. I DO believe that a big part of the little boys problem is his rude, overbearing mother. The mom on the show today was so disrespectful to the gentleman trying to present their side of the issue. I can't say I understand her grief or anger associated with this particular issue; however, I have, as all of us have, had my own issues in this world. If there is one thing I know for sure...and that is: God doesn't make msitakes. He is in control and nothing happens that he doesn't allow. His ultimate desire is that all of us come to him.....that we surrender to him and HIS WILL for our lives.....that we trust him....learn of him and live according to HIS TRUTH. Suffering is just a part of life. No one has all the answers....It is our responsibility to love our children....no matter what....but, not necessarily to agree, incourage or allow behavior that will ultimately lead to their distruction.

I wonder Dr. Phil....where is your faith? Are you a Christian....or just a good man? I have never heard you acknowlege a personal relationship with a risen savior....I am very disappointed that you allowed the mother today to go on and on about why she thought she was on the show...wasn't she informed? For the first time today, it seemed as though you were a little lost in the content of your show.

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sdennis7

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January 13, 2009, 5:28 pm PST

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: delrose

me too...

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ssfbelly

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chillin'

January 13, 2009, 5:32 pm PST

just be yourself

Quote From: pch2008

I was about to turn off my tv tonight, when I just happened to see a commercial for this topic being discussed on tomorrow's show (oops, TODAY'S show at this point!). I had to set it for my DVR to watch.

How strongly do I feel about this topic? I registered on here just this moment, just so people could read this and hear me out. I am a biological male and always have been. I was brought up in a loving, even church going household and still love my God and hold my faith dear. Why do I say "still"? Because I have this background and "yet" I am transgender as well. If anyone would NOT be like this, it would be someone raised the way that I was!

Yes, I do think that there is the rare case when there is a child that is confused and they are not truly "TG"...however, I think most are TG if they think so. Look at it this way...yes there are cultural influences that are debatable in all this...but if somebody is so very young in particular that is like this (I watched 20/20 with Barbara Walters show a biological boy who was 3 who obviously has not been influenced by society yet subtly or not so subtly...his "brain sex" was very, very obviously female, yet he was born with male anatomy, make sense? For those people that say that God does not make mistakes, you are right....because "these people" are no more "mistakes", than you, than me, or the person (think about it) who is born with Elephant Man Disease and deformed! The very sad thing is that thinking like this keeps people back and does not open minds to even listen, let alone change. My Mom does not even know that I sometimes go out looking like the opposite gender, and she would probably literally have a heart attack if she did....why? Because people raised like I was are "not supposed to be like this". The sad irony is that I used to live right under her roof and hear her say things against TG people, and it was clear that the thought never even crossed her mind that I could have possibly been one of the very same people she talked bad about, not knowing it was her very own son that was TG. My father passed away this month, and went to his grave never even knowing this about me. Trust me...think about it....NOBODY WOULD CHOOSE THIS WILLINGLY. Does a guy wake up and "decide" to put on a skirt and wonder what it feels like? I used to throw away literally hundreds of dollars worth of wigs, skirts, jeans, etc that were my female expression manifesting itself physically in accordance to how I would be thinking and wanting to express myself at the time. This happened multiple times, feeling society pressure, and (very falsely) thinking this would stop "THIS time". Before you know it, you could die before ever living the life you should and accepting it of yourself in the first place! I stopped throwing those things away once I learned about the subject (and yes had therapy to learn that this is who I am and it does NOT go away). I embrace it now for the most part, and just know its part of my thinking process and my personality..and I am so much more happy, relaxed, etc. because of it.

Gender is a very fluid thing. It is NOT always black & white!! It is society that needs to change and understand this, not transgender people...or they will have even more depressed people and suicides on their hands than have already happened for people unsuccessfully trying to "conform" to what is "normal". Gender is so fluid that that is why there are people that go out like the opposite gender part of the time to "let out what society doesnt let them let out" for our rigid social standards and pressures, all the way to the TG people that are out like that 100% of the time.....those are usually the transsexual people where the inclination is so strong, that it is CONSTANT instead of fairly regularly.

Sorry this is so long, but I think at least this needed to be said/vented, at least by me. I am so glad that a respectable show like Dr Phil's (and more and more like them) and talking about this sometimes and less and less exposure for the horrible negative stereotype that certain other daytime shows are like. That is not what the Transgender Community on the whole is like at all!

So again, for those that talk about judging, mistakes, and the like...dont do that too much, because I am living proof that you could have a son or daughter that is TG and you dont even know it, because what you have let your children hear regularly, and at such a young age, already makes them believe they can never tell you the truth about them....and you will never truly know 100% of who your child is.....ever. Sadly, that is my background in my life and so many others with undeserved shame. Fortunately I have a wonderful network of supportive friends that actually listened when I got the courage to tell them about this pat of me, and learned about what I have been through and how I think in comparison and difference to many "normal" people! My sexual orientation is heterosexual still, like most TG, yes....but sexual orientation and sexual IDENTITY are two very, very different things.

Please watch this episode people...you are strangers to me, obviously, and I am ASKING you to watch it...TALK about it with the people you know watch the show. Heck, talk about it with your family...hint to loved ones friends and family that you saw it and open the lines of communication on this...you never know. Most people think they dont know someone like this, when the truth is they often do, but it is "hidden" so much that nobody knows and that is quite sad. ..LIke I said, my family would never guess this about me and frankly they are missing out in so many ways...we are so close, yet they still dont and never will know 100% of me after all of these years...that part of me that NEEDS to be expressing "both sides" (genders).... but I know how close minded they are, and even though I am "their blood", they have likely already made up their mind like so many others seem to do without even hearing the facts. :( If you are interested, look at websites like wikipedia, and keyword transgender. You will learn more and I sincerely thank you for reading this and possibly watching this episode. =)

very sad to hear that your dad really didn't get to know the true you...but I guess he knows now, and I'm sure he loves you just as much.

It saddens me to know that there are families out there that don't give support to their loved ones. What has happened to unconditional love?

I have a transgender sibling, born a girl, now a boy, actually a man, 25 years old now, he made the official gender change announcement to the family and the rest of society just a couple of years ago. He has struggled with it for years,

she always told us when she was just a young child ,that she felt like she was a boy.

This hasn't been easy for any of us, especially him!!!

we accept the change and love him just the same.We all just want him to be comfortable in his own skin.

Who are we to judge?

People don't choose to be this way , they are born this way,

I wish those people in society who have their heads up their as**s, would stop judging others, and accept people for who they are.

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catvlady

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January 13, 2009, 5:36 pm PST

10/29 Gender Confused Children

Quote From: luannholle

I was going to post my own message, but after reading yours, you said exactly what I was here to say! I was FUMING when she started her ranting. The reason she kept going was because the first time she shook her angry finger at one of the doctors she received a small smattering of applause, so she kept it up, grasping for the same idiots to applaud again.

When the one doctor tried to stand up for his point, which we were never allowed to hear, Dr Phil snapped at HIM!! Bizarre. I can't even believe how Dr Phil allowed those doctors to be shouted down and ridiculed. And I am getting very frustrated reading the posts saying we need to learn to be more tolerant....excuse me, this society is so pathetically tolerant about everything, except for the principals that our country was founded on..now that cannot be tolerated anymore.

What happens when this boy starts to have male hormonal changes and his feelings change?? She has made such a big deal about this is she going to allow him to return to being a boy and how will his classmates accept this? Boy, won't that be a mess.

Maybe next time both sides of the story will be able to share their opinions and maybe actually be allowed to speak.

doesnt sound like to me you have a clue. i think you answered your own question in there about Dr. Phill. i think it is about acceptance, not ignorance.

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epiphanyzen7

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January 13, 2009, 5:41 pm PST

Of Course Heterosexuality is Natural: If not for that none of us would be here!

I think the mother is in serious denial and extremely defensive, which tells me she did not do everything she could have. She didn't have an intelligent thing to say, yet she wouldn't stifle. For her to think the doctors that are trying to give kids a chance at a normal life (without being judged and victims of hate crimes) are hate driven is asinine. Dr. Phil, I love ya, but shame on you for not intervening and allowing BOTH sides to plead their case. I think the "opposing" doctors got two sentences in? The woman doesn't (and neither did most of the panel apparently) realize that the "opposing" doctors have MORE compassion. Transgender people are treated terribly by much of the public, and I don't think that is going to change. She even said that the kid's father is no longer in the picture. My biggest fear is what this leads to, which is sex change operations.

I'm tired of seeing these people that claim they cannot be happy in the gender that they were born as. As much as I sympathize with these people, I cannot help sympathizing SO MUCH MORE with the "guinea pigs" that made sex-change technology possible. "The ends DO NOT justify the means."

During the holocaust, a lot more went on than mass murders. There were several doctors using Jewish people in their twisted experiments to test human capabilities. Some tested the human's tolerance of cold (they would deliberately freeze people to see how cold they could get before they got hypothermia, frostbit, died, etc.).

Nazi doctors also gave sex changes to people who did NOT request them (they did this to CHILDREN). It was done to people without anesthesia or any pain killers. I just hope that God was there to take away their unimaginable pain.

I don't know for sure, but one can only logically come to the conclusion that the current technology for sex-change operations came from these heinous practices on innocent CHILDREN! How else did they progress in this field? On animals? Well, that is not any better. They feel pain too!

Don't you dare accuse me of being hateful, just because I think something that extreme is BLATANTLY WRONG! Because I sympathize with someone other than YOU!

I want you to do one thing. Study up on the holocaust atrocities, read about what happened to young human beings, and stop feeling sorry for yourself! Find out about Nazi doctors such as Joseph Mengele. You obviously don't think enough of others.

I publicly ask you, God, please strike be dead before I am cured from any illness that a cure was found by torture of others. My life is no more valuable than theirs. In Jesus' name, Amen.

P.S. I am aware that the Bible tells us to pray in private, and for the most part I do.

P.S.S. Children are very impressionable, they can be molded and shaped in a number of ways, just as the Nazi's were. It's funny that people say they were born one way or another; we do not remember the first four years of our lives so who knows what we were subjected to.

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cutie_en_masse

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January 13, 2009, 5:42 pm PST

10/29 Gender Confused Children

I am unbelievable angry right now!! I can't believe that those two gentlemen would believe that being 'trans-gender', a lesbian, or gay in not natural and that you, as a parent can guide them away from that!! And another thing, as a single mother, I am outraged that they would say a boy being too close to their mother makes them gay or trans-gender in some way! That is just crazy!!

I'm sorry but if a child is gay or trans-gender, I can't possibly see how that is the fault of the parent!

My son is 17 and we are close, and has has very little contact with his father through out his life, and he's straight. So I think those two gentlemen theory is a load of nonsense!!

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diedraparks

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surprised

January 13, 2009, 5:45 pm PST

Gender Confused??

Gender by definition refers to genetic chormosomes and chromosomes determine the gender be it male or female. There may be genitals that get crossed but chromosomes do not. You either have male or female chromosomes. Gender identification is a state of the mind or how one thinks about oneself. Obviously we don't all think alike or act alike or want the same things, otherwise it would be a boring world to live in. I am an adult female, I lived a number of years in younger days as a homosexual. I had strong upbringing with Christian principles that I definitely rebelled against. The involvement in homosexuality was not a result of rebellion but a sexual opportunity that presented itself at the age of 8 years old. I became comfortable with it during years that dating relationships weren't so easy. Thourgh my experience I met many people both male and female that were a part of that lifestyle. Some thought they were born in the wrong body, some thought parenting errors had motivated them to be homosexual, others believed it was simply a choice. My personal thought now, these many years and much wisdom later, is that it is more mental and spiritual than anything else. Being homosexual is no different than being addicted to porn or a drug user, legal or illegal. Our mental state can be out of order from birth, or it can be created by parenting or by choice as we grow and mature. There are people born with addictive personalities and tendancies, that doesn't mean they are destined to be a durg addict. We choose our paths in life whatever they are. The actions of the mom on today's show were inexcusable. She was not there to present her thoughts and beliefs and hear the same of others. She was angry and unreasonable. She said she was not interested in being a part of the conversation and he thanked her for excusing herself, but she joined right back in. She should have let her yes be yes and her no be no and she might have carried more validity in her opinion. An adolescent cannot possible make those kind of life long decisions for themselves. Otherwise, what is the purpose of parents? Just let all 4 to 16 year olds run our society and see what happens. I have heard Dr. Phil say numerous times, the brain is not fully matured until about the age of 25. I wonder how old the mom was when the child was 4????

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inspired2write

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January 13, 2009, 5:51 pm PST

Let nature run its course

Love your child for who they are. Trying to force your child to choose a sexual identity can result in resentment and the distancing from family. Let's focus on educating the society to be more understanding and accepting. Love and acceptance is a beautiful thing. I believe the reasons for sexual identity issues are far too complex to be put on parenting alone.

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parkerco

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January 13, 2009, 5:51 pm PST

frustrating show

Quote From: mark15

I got the same impression. In fact, before I knew who they were, I thought they were a gay couple and one was going to announce he was a girl.

I'm not here to bash them. In fact, I grew up listening to Focus on the Family. I listened to everything James Dobson had to say. Of course, this was when i didn't have cable tv, the internet wasn't a household word...But, it seemed to me that James Dobson was one of the few pioneering Christian psychologists who helped fuse psychology with the Bible. Before then, preachers everywhere were slamming their fists on the pulpit and screaming, "Depression is a sin! Get over it and let others see Jesus in your life!" This made me believe that my own problems were sinfully wrong, yet I couldn't shake them. Later (and yet years ago) I was to be diagnosed with Bipolar ...then, recently reworded from "Manic-depression" for the bad connotations that were attached. The term was so new, that when I was diagnosed, I didn't even know what it meant.. I was horrified to find out what it did mean. Focus on the Family really helped me through all that.

Fastforward to the present; the message I kept receiving from this team was that they see "this...this...and this..." in all kids who are gender-confused. This implies that the mother could have prevented this.

However, you may be right. If she had given them a chance to talk, they may have opened our eyes a bit and allowed us to see how they really can help. They did look like they wanted to say something else, but were spending that time defending themselves..

I have no side on this issue. I decided long ago that I wouldn't make decisions on anything I'd never experienced personally. I'm just commenting on the general frustrations of the mom.

I enjoyed your reply. I tried to read a Dobson book once and I think it started out with him getting into some sort of power struggle with a dachsaund and getting his belt out after it and I closed the book.

I consider myself conservative and I appreciate groups who try and keep family values going. Like you I have no opinion on this subject. I was such a hopeless tom boy as a girl. I can kind of relate to kids not wanting anything to do with toys that go with their gender. I wanted only cars and trucks and dirt. Someone brought up an interesting point in an earlier post. They said, if the brain starts out female and when exposed to testosterone becomes male, what happens in the 20% or so of females that want to be boys? What is going on with their brain? Shouldn't they just want to stay female? Again so many questions.

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sallykk

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January 13, 2009, 5:57 pm PST

I support Toni

Quote From: sdennis7

We didn't even get to hear their side though!!! All i heard was toni going BLAH BLAH BLAH

Toni's frustration was understandable - the Focas on the Family guys, supposedly the professionals, were patronizing and uppity, I would have stood up to them as Toni did. Dr. Phil....you did not handle this discussion well, the subject is just too complicated and extremely important to try to do both sides in 40 minutes. Please consider doing a series of disucssions to cover all sides of this issue. This topic needs to be covered in a straight forward manner so leave your ego in the Green Room.

Further, I did not know the Focas on the Family was religious based.....that gives them even less credentials.

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