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Topic : 12/30 Extreme Discipline?

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Created on : Friday, October 24, 2008, 02:58:01 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 10/31/08) Grounding for two months, withholding dinner, making a child stand at attention for hours or collect rocks in the hot sun … is this basic discipline, or is it too extreme? Trisha fears her husband, Rafael, is destroying their 13-year-old daughter with punishments that are too severe. Rafael says his wife forces him to be “the hammer” because she’s too lenient. Their opposing views on child discipline are putting a strain on their marriage, but what is it doing to their daughter? Hear her heartbreaking diary entries. Plus, what happened in this household that’s been swept under the carpet for far too long? Dr. Phil has a heart-to-heart chat with the teen. Have you ever wondered if your discipline tactics will have a lifelong effect on your child? Are you inadvertently crossing the line into abuse? Grade your own parenting skills with today’s show. Plus, learn discipline guidelines that will keep your children healthy and thriving. Talk about the show here.

Find out what happened on the show.

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January 6, 2009, 7:50 pm CST

12/30 Extreme Discipline?

Quote From: effiejean

I was watching tonights episodes and thought it interesting that the guest was being labeled a child abuser. I think the dynamics of this family were laid out in the first few sentences - the father is not home a lot and is not a part of the daily routine. When he enters the picture he is seen as a n outsider, which he undoubtedly feels, therefore he tries to assert his presence and opinion. One of the points of contention was the night he made her sit without food for the entire night. If you listened to the story you would have heard he told her she could get up when she was ready to talk and she CHOSE to spend the night on the couch. With that being said, it is not UNBELIEVABLE that he said "I am going to break you" because they are in such an obvious power struggle and he is trying to maintain his authority as a parent. His wife has good intentions but the fact the child knows that she would leave him if they continue to fight just lets the child know he doesn't have to listen. This poor kid doesn't have an issue with her father, she has an unbelievable and unfortunate history. They need counseling and other help but to vilify the father and make it his fault is sad.

I just find it unfortunate that if this were a different show Dr. Phil would be telling them that they are the parent and when you have a disrespectful and unruly child you have to stand your ground. He isnt beating her, he isn't trying to undo her emotionally - he is obviously trying to maintain control. If this family is guilty of anything they are guilty of not noticing she is going through something important and band together.

I agree she needs nurturing but that is not contusive with the environment between the parents. They are at odds and that is where the child will find security in themselves and learn about positive relationships.

 

Bottom line, to say this is as simple as my dad is a hard-ass and that is the root of all evil for this girl is simple minded and ridiculous. The entire FAMILY needs help and no one is doing right by this girl.

I agree, the child is down right disrespectful and just her father's daughter, He is adament about his discipline and the rules he has set in the home and she is just as stubborn about breaking them and has the nerve to attempt to call in reinforcements to see it her way...Its a mess. But absolutely not abuse.
 
January 6, 2009, 7:54 pm CST

12/30 Extreme Discipline?

Quote From: barney0968

what is going to happen to this country as the children take it over?  For all those bleeding hearts out there in America please think where this country is going by allowing a child to control his or her parents. That is what is slowly happening.  There is no justice for parents, what a child say goes.

 In this incident there was two seperate situations in this topic -  the  alleged sexual abuse of the daughter and the father;s discipline practice. This country was built on the family and the children listening to the parents. the father in this topic gave his daughter a choice on sitting on the couch or doing what he wanted - it was her choice to stay there and miss supper. but, maybe we should really be looking behind the scene could it be that the daughter is stubborn towards the father in some type of sub-conscience way because of the sexual abuse. Parent are open to neglect and abuse charges at every turn, so much that America gave Child Protective Services the same immunity as the District Attorneys.( they can use innuendos,fragments of statements, and push a child into making a statement that he is afraid or cried

to make a case. This is getting to be big business.  We need to make our child respondible for their actions, .

I agree, the child is down right disrespectful and just her father's daughter, He is adament about his discipline and the rules he has set in the home and she is just as stubborn about breaking them and has the nerve to attempt to call in reinforcements to see it her way...Its a mess. But absolutely not abuse.
 
January 6, 2009, 8:04 pm CST

12/30 Extreme Discipline?

Quote From: chicagogal123

This makes me so angry that everyone is so against Rafael and that he is being made to feel that his punishments are "too extreme."  Rafael - YOU ARE DOING THE RIGHT THING FOR YOUR DAUGHTER! 

I was EXACTLY like Rafael and Trisha's 13-year-old daughter, and my father was exactly like Rafael.  Her story mirrors mine almost exactly.  I can't even count how many times I was sent to bed without dinner.  How many times I was called stupid, fat, etc.  How many times I had to go out in our front yard in the summer to pick every dandelion out, and then get pulled around the yard by my hair to every dandelion I missed.  How many times I was grounded for A-'s (in honors classes)!  I even got a B+ in gym one time and was grounded for a month.  I have been hit, slapped, have had things thrown at me by my father, etc.
He also always said of my mother, that she "let us kids walk all over her."

And hearing their daughter's words and thoughts brings back all of the feelings I remember having at the time as well.  I hated myself, I hated my father, I wished I was dead, etc.  I also was the oldest of 3 (I have 2 younger brothers), and he always seemed to be hardest on me.

However, looking back now that I am 30, my father did absolutely everything right.  In the end, he raised a very straight, honorable, honest, and intelligent daughter.  That is what it is all about.  After witnessing how I (and my brothers) have turned out, I I have learned that parenting through fear WORKS.  I graduated with straight A's from high school, and with straight A's magna cum laude from a very prestigious university.  I was always on honor roll, and was well-rounded, very involved with sports and music.  I have NEVER even tried drugs, smoking, or alcohol.  I never slept around or even had pre-marital sex.  Now I have a great job and own a house with my loving husband. 

Rafael - keep it up.  Even though your daughter may not realize it now, you are doing the best thing for her.  I wish I could take back the feelings of hatred I had for my father when I was Rafael's daughter's age.  I just wasn't old enough to realize at the time that he was doing the absolute right thing to raise a great daughter.  If your child is terrified of you, you are probably raising a great kid.  Unless you want your kid getting terrible grades, drinking, smoking, on drugs, and sleeping around, discipline and fear are key.  I only wish all parents understood what Rafael and my father did.

I agree, the child is down right disrespectful and just her father's daughter, He is adament about his discipline and the rules he has set in the home and she is just as stubborn about breaking them and has the nerve to attempt to call in reinforcements to see it her way...Its a mess. But absolutely not abuse.

That which does not kill us will most diffently make us stronger, wiser, and respectful, in life...She should be thankful to have a working father who is no ttoo tired to request daughterly affection, a mere hug?????How stubborn is that after he has busted butt everyday to put a roof over thier heads, food on the table...Lord have mercy....Pray for this Family and this Child..Oneday she will learn that He only loved her and she was His favorite...by the time and Love He has taken to show her mere RESPECT.

 
January 6, 2009, 8:55 pm CST

12/30 Extreme Discipline?

Quote From: amylyn2b

While watching this show, I found somethings I believed to be harsh punishment.  But clearly in a way, I can tell this girl is stubborn.  See, her dad says he tries to teach them to have respect, when a child is spoken to, especially from their parent, they should respond .  She comes in from school, he says hello, she doesn't say anything back, did anyone hear that?  So therefore, he told her to set on the couch until she says hello to him.  She chooses to not say a word,  I can't believe the stubborness here and no one see's it.  SHould she have to stand at attention for 2 hours, I think that is harsh, but the lady on the show says time-out should be one minute per year age,.  she is 13 years old, she isn't going to care about 13 minutes,  thats over in no time to a girl her age.  Now I sit my 4 year old down for 4 minutes. no big deal, thats a long time for him...  But come on, not for a 13 year old.  What does this man do, I don't think he is that bad of a father really, I know alot more people that are way worse.  Should he call her names, no, but let me ask one question, did you do everything right raising your kids.  I know I have made many mistakes, I applaud this man and woman for at least realizing some things are not right with their parenting, I hope they are on the right path to better parenting,..  And I sure hope they get their daughter some counsilling for her to deal with the pain from being raped.  I was really shocked the parents did nothing here.  That is probably a lot of this girl's problem...  Anyway, remember how a 13 year old can be stubborn...  I think their is a little of this going on.  I think Mom was trying to say that when she was trying to tell them that not all of it was being told... 
I agree, the child is down right disrespectful and just her father's daughter, He is adament about his discipline and the rules he has set in the home and she is just as stubborn about breaking them and has the nerve to attempt to call in reinforcements to see it her way...Its a mess. But absolutely not abuse.
 
January 8, 2009, 11:36 am CST

my gut reaction

My first reaction to this fathers demands that his daughter give him physcial contact was that he had abused her sexually. I am not sayiing that he did only what stuck out in my mind like a red flag. Why would you punish a child for not having given you a hug? this father was saying he would be devastated if she felt he didnt love her but when that became obvious he had virtually no reaction. This girl needs serious intervention if not this child WILL  kill herself. I am a survivor of sexual abuse and Dr. Phil is dead on when he says it changes who you are. It becomes a part of you. I think the fact that no reports had been filed, no doctors visits had been followed through shows me something is wrong in this whole mess. I suspect the father by the way he acted. He smirked throughout the whole show. The mother was useless she didnt protect her daughter. Then if that isnt bad enough she destroys her trust by telling the father going againest her specific wishes. This child needs to be taken out of this house. If not the next place this girl will be is the local cemetary. Somebody get on this immediatly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
January 8, 2009, 11:43 am CST

Finally

Quote From: hummingbirdb

I registered just to submit this message. The Dad creeps me out every time he says he wants his daughter (whom he's abusing) to hug and kiss him. He doesn't mention good communication or enjoying each other's company as a measure of her love for him. He said at least 3 times he wanted her to "hug and kiss" him. Is the Dad the "family friend" who accosted her on the couch? Dad made her sleep there! This Dad needs more than retraining in discipline techniques. I hope the therapists explore whether or not his interest in his daughter is unhealthy. The mother would do nothing to protect the daughter from the father's unhealthy actions. The mother's betrayal is greater cruelty than the father's abuse.
Finally someone put down exactly what I was thinking. I am surprised dr. Phil didnt pick up on it. Of course he has to be very careful on what he says on camera. I totally agree with you hummingbird you hit the nail on the head all the way around. I must add also that when he said in the first part of the show she wouldnt hug him, my immediate reaction was that he was sexually abusing her just by her adverse reaction to it. I didnt know till later that she had actually been abused. Somebody needs to help this poor girl. She doesnt need to stand at attention, SHE NEEDS ATTENTION !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
March 20, 2009, 2:06 pm CDT

Missing the point!

Quote From: blessedfouse

I agree, the child is down right disrespectful and just her father's daughter, He is adament about his discipline and the rules he has set in the home and she is just as stubborn about breaking them and has the nerve to attempt to call in reinforcements to see it her way...Its a mess. But absolutely not abuse.

That which does not kill us will most diffently make us stronger, wiser, and respectful, in life...She should be thankful to have a working father who is no ttoo tired to request daughterly affection, a mere hug?????How stubborn is that after he has busted butt everyday to put a roof over thier heads, food on the table...Lord have mercy....Pray for this Family and this Child..Oneday she will learn that He only loved her and she was His favorite...by the time and Love He has taken to show her mere RESPECT.

Did you even listen to what this poor child was going through?  For a 13 year old to seriously consider suicide means there is something VERY WRONG happening.  Severe discipline or punishment does not make one stronger or wiser, only more doubtful of themselves - especially when it comes to dealing with teens.

I do my best to tell my teen daughter as often as possible that she is smart, fun, and a pleasure to be around so her confidence is boosted.  I only wish parents would understand that kids are a gift and not a commodity to be used as a status symbol to make themselves look better.  And respect is a two way street; if I respect the rights of my child they will respect me and what I have to say and teach them to guide them through a successful and happy adult-hood. 

I only hope this poor little girl gets the help she needs (and her parents) so they can all lead happy and fullfilling lives.
 
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