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Topic : 12/30 Extreme Discipline?

Number of Replies: 237
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Created on : Friday, October 24, 2008, 02:58:01 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 10/31/08) Grounding for two months, withholding dinner, making a child stand at attention for hours or collect rocks in the hot sun … is this basic discipline, or is it too extreme? Trisha fears her husband, Rafael, is destroying their 13-year-old daughter with punishments that are too severe. Rafael says his wife forces him to be “the hammer” because she’s too lenient. Their opposing views on child discipline are putting a strain on their marriage, but what is it doing to their daughter? Hear her heartbreaking diary entries. Plus, what happened in this household that’s been swept under the carpet for far too long? Dr. Phil has a heart-to-heart chat with the teen. Have you ever wondered if your discipline tactics will have a lifelong effect on your child? Are you inadvertently crossing the line into abuse? Grade your own parenting skills with today’s show. Plus, learn discipline guidelines that will keep your children healthy and thriving. Talk about the show here.

Find out what happened on the show.

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October 25, 2008, 10:50 am CDT

I call this child abuse

I call this child abuse, any child should not have to be in the heat collecting rocks or with holding their dinner it is wrong and if one thinks that it is right to have a child out in the heat knowing that a child is left in a hot car what can happen this child could have a heat storke. If the parents really love this child they would not be doing this. Their are other ways to solve bad behavior, Take something away that they like playing with or they cannot have a play date with the friends that she likes to hang out with or no phone calles to her friends what a day or two their are other ways of dealing with behavior then doing what the parents are doing now,Both parents need to go to parenting school and untile they can get a grip on things this child should be living with a grandparent. How would they feel if they were being punish like this and where they

punish like this when they were a child?

 
October 25, 2008, 12:53 pm CDT

OUCH!!

As a child who grew up physically (Mr. Belt and Mr. Hassock) and emotionally (You'll never do/be/complete anything/you're stupid/spoiled, etc) abused, I can attest that I bear very deep scars - more emotional than physical but the physical are there.   Having a child with autism has made discipline difficult and I have had to summon all the creativity I can to "change or modify" behavior.  Discipline is a nonfunctioning word in our house.  Each instance must be dealed with in its own unique way to assure understanding and distinguishing appropriate and inappropriate behaviour, etc.  What works once, may not work again.  To have a child who is extremely intelligent but bound up by autism make for a long and tiring day.  BUT, when you see the light come on or the verbal response positive and the "bad" behaviour no longer there, it's totally worth it all.  I vowed I would never strike or spank my child no yell at her or damage her self-worth and I haven't had to go that route.  Perhaps, throwing atemper tantrum myself in a busy holiday shopping mall to show how horrible your child looks worked better for me than cutting priviledges or taking toys away or limiting TV.  Again, it doesn't work for everyone.  Such things worked for me.  This is just another Dr. Phil show I won't be watching this season.    
 
October 25, 2008, 1:31 pm CDT

children punshiment

this is really child abuse, to let you child collect rocks in the hot sun is  just inhumane. why the hell someone does not make him pick up rocks  so he can see how it feels.and as far as punshing a child by with holding dinner is just plain stupid. this man should be banned from being a parent.children are to be loved and nurchered to become productive adults. punishment  like that can scar a child for life.concer
 
October 25, 2008, 1:52 pm CDT

Doctor Phil Show

Discipline Doctor Extreme Phil. Doctor Phil do you discipline your kids yourself or Robin does it? I think di-

scipline is not a right thing for kids under 18. But if they are over 18 or under 01-06 then go right ahead.-----

See you on Friday October 31st, 2008. Happy Halloween. Sincerley Your. Russell Vlaanderen.-----------------

 
October 25, 2008, 2:57 pm CDT

Yes, it is child abuse

I'm going through something similar.

 

"Rafael says his wife forces him to be “the hammer” because she’s too lenient. "

 

Sounds all too familiar to me. My husband says the same thing. He says I let our daughter walk all over me. And he says it in front of her.

Due to an incident which occurred 2 and a half months ago, he has been removed from our home and now is only allowed to have supervised 2 hour visits once a week with our daughter, and if he acts up the visit is terminated immediately.

He has very little contact with me, and only through email, and only about household decisions or subjects relating to our daughter. Nothing personal, no accusations, no funny business.

 

He was making our daughter cry at least once a day, and then giving her a hard time over it. He verbally abused both of us, and I kept making justifications for why he was doing this. When people in public asked "what's with him?" I would say he was having a bad day, or he had lost his job or something to try and justify his behaviour. I blamed myself a lot too.

 

Our daughter is 6 years old

 

I really hope this mom and her daughter get the support, help and love they need, and this man gets out of their home, gets into therapy and take an anger management course.

 

I can't wait til Friday to watch this episode.

 
October 25, 2008, 6:22 pm CDT

What Crock to say he is forced to be the hammer"

I can imagine that his father was the *hammer* with him because his mom was too lenient? It is ridiculous to be a *hammer* on a child. You don't *hammer* discipline. A child has to be taught not *hammered*.

 

How can one have a desire for a child then try to *hammer* life into them? One never learns anything this way and more than not can turn the child into a drug abuser, street walker etc. and yes..suicide.

 

You want your child to learn, think of how you would have wanted your parents to teach you, help you when you did things wrong because when we are children in learning process we do not realize the full extent of what we do wrong. I realize many things I did when I was a child and teenager..that I fully didn't know what I was doing was wrong.

 

Spanking, hitting, depriving food, etc doesn't help. There is a right way to do things and a wrong way..the problem is that we get manuals how to take care of anything we buy but we never got one to be a parent. We are just thrown into life and parenting not knowing what we are doing and thinking what we are doing is right..yet it isn't because we do not fully understand how to be a parent because we were not *taught*  to be one.

 

I truly believe that there should not only be prepartions to be married but also what it is to be a parent. Then maybe people would think about it before having children and be prepared. We all just get married, have kids and not knowing more than we did when we were kids knowing right from wrong.

 

If we did then no parent would have trouble with their kids and no kid would get into trouble or have to be *hammered*.

 

 

 
October 25, 2008, 6:30 pm CDT

Discipline or Abuse?

I grew up in a household where discipline consisted of the belt or grounding.  I was once grounded for a total of 6 months.  Yes it was extreme and I still bear emotion scars as a result of my childhood.  At the same time as an adult I have come to realize that my parents did the best they could with what they knew.  Discipline I feel must be dished out with a measure of love.  My own children were disciplined when needed but they never doubted for a moment that they were loved and as adults themselves that's something they often say.  I would have to say that discipline needs to be corrective not just a punnishment.  A fine line but one each parent needs to find for themselves and their child.
 
October 25, 2008, 6:55 pm CDT

discipline differences

I don't believe in letting a child go to bed hungry or picking up rocks in the heat either. I do however believe in grounding a child if need be. My mother grounded us and even spanked us. we all (4 of us) turned out just fine.  Sure we all had our share of teen problems but, my mom fought and yes, we thought she was completely nuts!! Our friends thought she was also!! My mother also went up against drug dealers and lord knows what else. I myself have had to deal with a child with the wrong crowd syndrome and she went to a girls home, for a while anyway. she is grown now and what she does from this point on is her doing. It is out of my hands as far as her choices in life.  If she can't stand on her own to  feet then she can move back home, show respect and live by our rules to a point. My son is going to be 11 in a couple of months and he gets grounded for grades, not cleaning his room and other things. as soon as he cleans his room he is ungrounded, his grades come up he is allowed to go ride his bike, play the play station ect. but, as far as abuse, no i don't believe in that. my husband is the easy one in our house. He does to much for our kids and it drives me nuts. I beleive you can also do to much for a child and they turn out to be kids in the world that are lost, and confused and have no idea on how to get a long in the world. they can't even support themselves because some one has always done it for them. If kids do not have some sort of good disapline just remember who will be making the desicions on our lives in the future!! these kids without a clue on life.
 
October 25, 2008, 11:45 pm CDT

Extreme Discipline

I think the bottom line is that opinions differ as to what's considered "extreme".

 

Grounded for two months:  That doesn't make any sense whatsoever.  I would tend to believe that after the first few weeks, it all becomes routine and the child isn't even going to feel as if s/he is even being punished.  However, if one of our kids did something extreme, I may enact a punishment while on Summer vacation such as no sleep-overs, no birthday parties, etc.  In other words, nothing extra-curricular.

 

Picking up rocks in the heat:  It gets into the 90's in our town and add in the high humidity we often have, yes it can feel extreme.  However, if I needed to mow our lawn and it was littered with rocks, you can bet I would have our 12 and 10 year olds out there helping me.

 

Standing at attention for hours:  Again, after a while, I think the point would be lost and it would become routine.  I feel the same way about "time out".  I almost ordered a time out chair for our 2 year old, but when I saw it came with a timer that goes up to AN HOUR, I declined.  By the time a child reaches the age of needing to be in time out for an entire hour, their butt will be too big to fit in the seat!

 

Going to bed without dinner:  I truly can't fathom sending any of our kids to bed hungry.  When I spoke to our pediatrician about our 10 year old son's poor eating habits and his demands to eat something other than what's prepared almost every night, she told us to tell him to eat what we fix, or don't eat at all!  I responded with "And what if he goes to school and tells his teacher he's hungry because we didn't let him eat dinner and they call CPS?"  Her reply was, "Well they could tell by looking at him that he's NOT starving!"  While I do agree since he's a little overweight, I was surprised by her response.  Instead of telling him "all or nothing", we opted to slightly alter dinner items so that there was at least one thing he would eat.  We also insisted that he at least try the others.  Our situation with him leads us to believe that he has Sensory Integration Dysfunction, but since the pediatrician did not diagnose him with this at the common age of 4-6, she does not want to think it's an option.  However, his OT at school disagrees.  He has been treated for ADHD and on meds for it since he was 3 1/2 years old and I now wonder if we've traveled the wrong path for 7 years.

 

Lifelong affects of discipline:  I think it depends on the person.  Some grow up with the scars, while others still have the fresh wounds.  I was often treated as "the red-headed step-child" that I was.  My step-dad called me names like "biggin's" and "tubbo" and often spanked us with his hand or belt way too hard and for far too long.  While I do get enraged at times, I never haul off and knock down any of our 4 kids like it was done to me and my siblings.  I am definitely a victim of physical abuse as a child (just like my step-dad was), but our kids are not.  The cycle does not necessarily repeat itself.  I grew up hating him and vowing to never be like him.  In that aspect, yeah my childhood sucked.  But, it taught me to learn at a young age what I did NOT want in life as a grown up.  My husband of almost 13 years has never laid a hand on me or verbally abused me.  I knew what I wanted in a man and more importantly, what I did NOT want, and I got him.  Unfortunately for many of my high school friends, they didn't know a bad man as kids, so they got 'em when they became adults.  One friend had a boyfriend for over 10 years who constantly abused her mentally, verbally and physically.  When her MS got so bad that she became wheel-chair bound, he would still run up and choke her and/or hit her.  The only reason she's no longer with him now is because she hung up on 9-1-1 after he charged at her with a knife, flailing it in her face, and the police came.  He got so mad at her after getting out of jail that he left her.  If she had her way today, he would be back in the house teaching their 12 year old son even more ways to walk all over his mother (including calling her names).

 
October 26, 2008, 1:37 am CDT

Oh my goodness

This story is so sad and the effects on the child could be tremendous.Discipline is supposed teach and nurture a child not to be abusive.I have oftened wondered on how my displine effects my children but for the most part my disipline at this time is talking through things and sometimes a referance to the loss off a priviledge..which i carry though with if needed but my children are 8 and 10.I think that the punishement this child is getting will lead her to resent not just her father but also her mother.For a child to be treated this way and a mother to no do anything...this must have happened at some time as there are examples of the fathers so called discipline this child must feel some what alone and uncared for.I am glad she is seeing Doctor Phil and that there is hope for this yound teen.

Personally my parents were quite strict but their often punishment was to send me to my room as i was not born to them but came from an abusive situation where i was often left unattended to when i was a baby and needed attention..the isolation was the worst thing my parent could have done to me and has had effects on me now and has made me very aware of the way i discipline my children.I have another child who is turning 13 and her now ex step mother used to put her in her room at the age of 5(after i myself had been in a fire accident  and was in hospital)My daughter was traumatised of course by what her mother had been through.I soon noticed that sending my daughter even too her room was not having a good effect on her rather she would physically pull her hair out so i told my daughter when she had said or done something that wasnt right that she needed to sit by me for awhile and think about her actions then after a little time we would talk about it and work through it...about an apology or what was necessary to show that she understood what she had done was not right and that she would try not to do it again.

I really hope this family get the help and listen to the advice they need.

 
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