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Topic : 06/04 Grandmother vs. Mother Custody Battle

Number of Replies: 476
New Messages This Week: 0
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Created on : Friday, October 31, 2008, 04:11:46 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 11/04/08) Type your discussion here.How do you determine if someone is fit to be a parent? Should someone who is dependent on others for monetary help have the right to raise a child? Should someone the courts rule unfit as a parent ever be allowed to regain custody? What should you do if your parenting skills are called into question by a family member? Dr. Phil's guests are feuding mother and daughter, Barbara and Nicole, who have been battling for six years over the custody of Nicole’s son, Ethan. Barbara says she needed to take full custody of her grandson because Nicole was and is still not fit to be his mother. Barbara says she provided all the essential items when Ethan was first born, and when he needed surgery, she offered to cover the child under her health insurance. Nicole says she signed what she believed to be a temporary custody agreement to provide for her child's well-being, but says she was tricked into signing her rights away as a mother. Did Barbara have ulterior motives? Hear what Nicole's lifelong friend thinks. Then, Barbara claims her daughter broke the law to get her son back. Barbara currently has custody of the boy and claims that Nicole is a pathological liar, an inattentive parent and was living in deplorable conditions. Find out what the court documents show and what Nicole's former landlord has to say. When Dr. Phil proposes a plan for moving forward, which woman hesitates to participate? And, Nicole hasn't seen her son in more than four months. Will Barbara agree to let mother and son spend time together? Join the discussion.

Find out what happened on the show.

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November 4, 2008, 9:27 am CST

Grandmother is wrong

What makes Barbara think that she is qualified to determine whether or not Nicole is or isn't a fit parent?

You can see that she clearly just wants to hold onto Ethan.  When Dr. Phil asked her about the Social worker she didn't want to hear that.  She wants to make Nicole look bad so she can keep Ethan- plain and simple.

 

In the end the child is going to want to be with his mother.  I see all of these posts about unfit parents and 99% of them are dealing with drug addicted parents.  Nicole doesn't have a drug problem.  It's not right!  This is her child, her baby and it's her job to raise him and no one should be standing in the way.

 
November 4, 2008, 9:49 am CST

grandmother ???????

if asking for help in any way from your parents means you are not a fit parent, or leaving a house without washing from top to bottom.  this world is in alot of trouble. i think this grandmother has NO intention giving him back to his mother.  if i was nicole, i would get my son back, legally, then i would live far away from her mom, so she could have a normal life with her son and not be judged in every move she made. i moved back in with my parents and got alot of help along the way from them, and never once did i feel my mom was going to steal him from me, i feel really sorry for  nicole, and yes she has know that she will have some hard times in the future, but she should'nt have to worry about losing her child every time something goes wrong.  grandma -- be a grandma and  act like one too.  if you loved either one of them, you'd be trying to help them be together and to be happy. and  go down to the family services and look and see what a real neglected/abuse child looks like.  GOOD LUCK NICOLE
 
November 4, 2008, 9:57 am CST

11/04 Grandmother vs. Mother Custody Battle

Quote From: mommyfighting

I am 27 years old.  My ex-mother used to watch my daughter while I went to work.  One day when I finished work and went to pick up my daughter, she refused to give her back.  Then she bounced my daughter back and forth between her and my ex-husband.  From that time on, I have been accused of everything under the sun.  I had gotten remarrried and then they started accusing him of all kinds of crazy things as well.  ALL OF THE ALLEGATIONS WERE UNFOUNDED and they still got away with it.  Sch. County courthouse had us all attend psy. evaluations 4 times.  All of those reports came back with the fact that my daughter should be with me.  The bio father is a drunk.  My ex-mother is all about control.  Yet, the courthouse just keeps allowing them to get away with everything they say.  I have had it.  This has been going on for four years now.  I completely understand all of the feelings that come with this issue. The court claims that this is all about the child's best interest, yet they have not done anything at all for her best interest.  I swear that they don't care that a 5 year old little girl suffers everyday....

What should have been done was when you went to the ex mother in laws to pick her up and she refused to give her back, police should have been called and she wouldn't have had a choice but to give her back.  She was guilty of interfering with custodial parents rights.  If you didn't have custody then you should have gone right to a lawyer and started the process of it.  In any case if the split up just happened and no one had legal custody yet, a grandparent could not keep a child from the parent.  All this would have been avoided had you called the police then a lawyer to make a emergency temporary custody order. 

 

Now, I would have my lawyer push for a lawyer for the child's rights.  That would be an independent lawyer that has no ties with either you or the child's father appointed by the court or child services.  They will look over the evaluations and decide on which is the best place for the child.

 

It is a shame that people see children as possessions instead of humans and do not put the child first.  I hope that you get this all settled soon.

 
November 4, 2008, 10:10 am CST

TT'S LIKE WATCHING MY EXACT SITUATION( almost!):-(

I am also 25 and was tricked!!!! My journey has been too long and my heart is broken for my baby boy! But I will NEVER give up on giving him the life he deserves!!! And that includes me raising him. I have always wanted him to have his mom and dad and everyone get along and give him all the love in the world! But his father had a bad drug problem and as much as i prayed I could change him and give my son a normal life, a long hard effort prooved I couldn't. And I am aware now that being so young at the time made me nieve to the facts! At this time, his family got children services involved when he beat me up( first time) and he was taken from me. Which the day before I had a plain ticket to go be with my family and remove myself from the situation. But his mother was gona do anything to stop me from leaving with her ONLY SONS child and I couldn't see it at the time. My family had just moved out of the state so I didn't have much of a choice on who to let keep him safe until it could be resolved, so his grandmother was a lot better for him then foster care! I remember a service worker telling me it could take 60 days to resolve and that seemed like iternity! He was 4 months old and had been away from me for the first time the night before for only a few hours. And now he's 4 years old and i'm still fighting. To make a long story short, i have learned that his families intentions weren;t ever to give him back! And I trusted them! I have never sighned anything giving my rights away, AND I NEVER WILL! But the people involved in doing what's best for my son has not! The court system has been HORRIBLE and when I finally figured out that the only way I was gona get myself strong again after the long fight with children services(2yrs) was to go be with my parents, sense I had NO family support close by, was so young, and had smacked against the last brick wall and was unable to pick myself up again. It was by far the hardest decision I have ever made and i'm not sure where I got the strength but thank God I did! Because I feel stronger now then I ever have! I couldn't possibly imagine being away from him for longer then a day, which a day was EXTREMELY hard. But now I had to leave the state and try to find a way to get my life back together? This was the hardest lesson iv'e EVER learned too! I couldn't possibly put myself in front of my baby! He was and is my heart, life, world! Nothing was more important then him!!! And that's the lesson... I HAD TO put myself first!!!!!!! The most important person in his life is his mother. And if i'm not the very best I can be, then I couldn't be the best mother that he deserves. I had to love myself first, and as much as i love him!!! It took me a lot longer then I ever wanted to figure this out and to get myself ready for the biggest fight of my life! I SOOO DISLIKE calling it or reffering to it as a fight, but unfortunatly that's what it's turned into:-( She told me before I left that she was getting TEMPORARY GUARDIANSHIP to get children services out of the picture and when I got things situated in my life she would return him to me.. IT WAS A HUGE LIE!!! They got legal custodyIt was her intention from the BEGINING to keep him! She always wanted another child and her husband wouldn't give her that because he has 2 children from a previouse marriage. She waited to have her son, to do it right, and is a very wealthy realtor. But her son turned out to be a drug addict, women abuser, and have seriouse temper control problems. And now she wants a 2nd chance. I made him and carried him for 9 months and he's my God given right! And I don't understand how if she loves him(truely), then why wouldn't she want him to have his mother raise him if she's capable?? And know how important it is?? I didn't come back demanding them to give him right back. I wanted all of us to get along and work it out for HIM to have a happy, half way normal life. To transition him in a way that it wouldn't affect him in the least bit. And for ALL of us to be part of his life raising him. As much as those people have done to hurt me, my son loves them and I would never take that from him! But he deserves, as much as I do , to have me in his life more then 2 days a week, 8 hrs a day! Which is what they agreed to going on almost a year now:-( I tried getting a guardian appointed and they have not contacted either of us ( or done a home visit) and then made a decision to drop the custody motion. And the judge made my son have the same guardian that was involved when children services was. And on top of it all, the person that was the reason for him being taken and was the threat to him gets to live and raise him as if nothing even happened! Don't get me wrong, he deserves to have his father in his life as long as he's not hurting him in any way, but he also deserves to have his mom in his life more then i'm being allowed!! It's the little things that i miss most! And the small things that so many take advantage of! Just being able to wake up in the morning with him lying next to me and having the morning routines like making him breakfast and making sure he has a healthy lunch packed:-) And being able to be involved in his school and big decisions having a say so. And being able to take him to visit my grandfather up north and taking him to Disney World for the first time, or ever? Every single first has been taken from me and the saddest part of it is that we'll NEVER be able to get this time back! But I can only hope and pray for a better future and i'll NEVER give up on getting him back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If it takes taking it to the steps of Washington, i'll find a way:-)
 
November 4, 2008, 10:16 am CST

PLEASE READ DR.PHIL! TT'S LIKE WATCHING MY EXACT SITUATION( almost!):-(

I am also 25 and was tricked!!!! My journey has been too long and my heart is broken for my baby boy! But I will NEVER give up on giving him the life he deserves!!! And that includes me raising him. I have always wanted him to have his mom and dad and everyone get along and give him all the love in the world! But his father had a bad drug problem and as much as i prayed I could change him and give my son a normal life, a long hard effort prooved I couldn't. And I am aware now that being so young at the time made me nieve to the facts! At this time, his family got children services involved when he beat me up( first time) and he was taken from me. Which the day before I had a plain ticket to go be with my family and remove myself from the situation. But his mother was gona do anything to stop me from leaving with her ONLY SONS child and I couldn't see it at the time. My family had just moved out of the state so I didn't have much of a choice on who to let keep him safe until it could be resolved, so his grandmother was a lot better for him then foster care! I remember a service worker telling me it could take 60 days to resolve and that seemed like iternity! He was 4 months old and had been away from me for the first time the night before for only a few hours. And now he's 4 years old and i'm still fighting. To make a long story short, i have learned that his families intentions weren;t ever to give him back! And I trusted them! I have never sighned anything giving my rights away, AND I NEVER WILL! But the people involved in doing what's best for my son has not! The court system has been HORRIBLE and when I finally figured out that the only way I was gona get myself strong again after the long fight with children services(2yrs) was to go be with my parents, sense I had NO family support close by, was so young, and had smacked against the last brick wall and was unable to pick myself up again. It was by far the hardest decision I have ever made and i'm not sure where I got the strength but thank God I did! Because I feel stronger now then I ever have! I couldn't possibly imagine being away from him for longer then a day, which a day was EXTREMELY hard. But now I had to leave the state and try to find a way to get my life back together? This was the hardest lesson iv'e EVER learned too! I couldn't possibly put myself in front of my baby! He was and is my heart, life, world! Nothing was more important then him!!! And that's the lesson... I HAD TO put myself first!!!!!!! The most important person in his life is his mother. And if i'm not the very best I can be, then I couldn't be the best mother that he deserves. I had to love myself first, and as much as i love him!!! It took me a lot longer then I ever wanted to figure this out and to get myself ready for the biggest fight of my life! I SOOO DISLIKE calling it or reffering to it as a fight, but unfortunatly that's what it's turned into:-( She told me before I left that she was getting TEMPORARY GUARDIANSHIP to get children services out of the picture and when I got things situated in my life she would return him to me.. IT WAS A HUGE LIE!!! They got legal custodyIt was her intention from the BEGINING to keep him! She always wanted another child and her husband wouldn't give her that because he has 2 children from a previouse marriage. She waited to have her son, to do it right, and is a very wealthy realtor. But her son turned out to be a drug addict, women abuser, and have seriouse temper control problems. And now she wants a 2nd chance. I made him and carried him for 9 months and he's my God given right! And I don't understand how if she loves him(truely), then why wouldn't she want him to have his mother raise him if she's capable?? And know how important it is?? I didn't come back demanding them to give him right back. I wanted all of us to get along and work it out for HIM to have a happy, half way normal life. To transition him in a way that it wouldn't affect him in the least bit. And for ALL of us to be part of his life raising him. As much as those people have done to hurt me, my son loves them and I would never take that from him! But he deserves, as much as I do , to have me in his life more then 2 days a week, 8 hrs a day! Which is what they agreed to going on almost a year now:-( I have hired an attorney and am doing what I can. Which if I still don't get anywhere, i'm gona ask for Dr. Phil's help. I 'think' him talking to them of the importance of him having me raise him might be the only hope?? I tried getting a guardian appointed and they have not contacted either of us ( or done a home visit) and then made a decision to drop the custody motion. And the judge made my son have the same guardian that was involved when children services was. And on top of it all, the person that was the reason for him being taken and was the threat to him gets to live and raise him as if nothing even happened! Don't get me wrong, he deserves to have his father in his life as long as he's not hurting him in any way, but he also deserves to have his mom in his life more then i'm being allowed!! It's the little things that i miss most! And the small things that so many take advantage of! Just being able to wake up in the morning with him lying next to me and having the morning routines like making him breakfast and making sure he has a healthy lunch packed:-) And being able to be involved in his school and big decisions having a say so. And being able to take him to visit my grandfather up north and taking him to Disney World for the first time, or ever? Every single first has been taken from us and the saddest part of it is that we'll NEVER be able to get this time back! But I can only hope and pray for a better future and i'll NEVER give up on getting him back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If it takes taking it to the steps of Washington, i'll find a way:-)
 
November 4, 2008, 10:20 am CST

11/04 Grandmother vs. Mother Custody Battle

Quote From: jewelsf

Are you kidding? You must be a very bitter person to tell all men who are going through a divorce to walk away from their children. My brother got a divorce from his wife who was and is an unfit mother. Yes, it took a while for him to get custody of the children, because the state of Texas does seem to lean on the mother's side, but he prevailed and eventually won custody. He refused to give up and allow "HIS" children to be raised by a woman who only wanted to party and had gotten into drugs. Oh, I almost forgot, she also threw their two little girls out of the house once with nowhere for them to go and no way to call their father. They were only about 11 and 8 at the time sitting on the street corner with little suitcases. So give up? I don't think so! And BTW, my husband got custody of his 3 teenage children when his wife left him. He wasn't about to allow her to take his children away. To be honest, she really only wanted custody of the one girl and didn't want the boys. My husband refused to allow that to happen to his children and they also never knew that their mother didn't want the boys. A Hero? My husband is a hero! Not once has he ever spoken a bad word against his ex in front of the children, even now that they are grown. He doesn't believe in that. The only thing that is really important here is to do what is best for the children. As we all know, they didn't ask to be brought into this world.

You must have lots of MONEY.  yes, I'm very bitter.  Poor, honest, loving fathers don't have a snowball

chance in hell of getting so much as visitation with his children if he doesn't have lots of money.

 

These children will be able to make there on choice soon.

We are waiting.  The children wants to be with there Dad, but MOM has the most money.

 

 

 
November 4, 2008, 10:24 am CST

11/04 Grandmother vs. Mother Custody Battle

Quote From: racecar

My daughter & grandson have lived with her boyfriend for 5 1/2 months.  He is not my grandsons father.  The boyfriend drinks alot, is never home, etc.  My daughter has come crying to me about his behavior more than once plus her behavior was changing.  I tried to determine if it was out of frustration or what.  In the meantime, I care for my grandson while she is at work, etc.  She was very short tempered, always tired, had no money, said my grandson was evil, she couldnt take it anymore, didnt know her life would be run by a 3 year old, etc.  My grandson told me of things her boyfriend had done to him, I took this information to her and she called my 3 year old grandson a liar.   I kept trying to talk to her about things but she would "go off" on me in front of my grandson.  I confronted her two weeks ago about things I "saw", drug paraphenalia, etc. in the basement, she denied it, then when I said lets go look she bodyslammed/attacked me.  She said she would call the police, I said please do but she called her boyfriend so I called the police.  This is a straight A student with a full ride to college behaving completely out of character and had been a good mother previous to living with this boyfriend.  In a nutshell, the police came, she wouldnt let them in unless they agreed to blame everything they found on her boyfriend and leave her out of it, etc.  Now I have seen my grandson twice in two weeks for an hour at his soccer games.   He doesnt know what happened that day because luckily I had put him down for a nap.  I tell him I love and miss him very much.  He tells me he loves me and misses me.  I don't know when I'll see him again.  I was trying to help and talk to my daughter, care for my grandson while she was working, etc.  I BELIEVE I HAD A RIGHT TO TELL HER WHAT SHE WAS DOING WAS WRONG AND THAT IT WASNT A SAFE ENVIRONMENT FOR HER AND HER CHILD WITHOUT BEING ATTACKED AND KEPT AWAY FROM HER AND MY GRANDSON.  The whole thing is a nightmare, Im very concerned about my daughters mind and my grandsons emotional wellbeing, etc.  How hard that must be for him not knowing why Im not around anymore.  He is the best little grandson in the world.  But when he kept crying and saying he didn't like his mommy anymore, I felt the issue should be addressed with her. 

I was in a similar situation when my children were very young.  My son I believe was 3 and my daughter was about 8 months old.  Their father left me for another woman and I was devestated so I started drinking very heavily.  I stayed drunk every night for about 6 months.  My mother was watching my kids while I was out drinking with my friends.  I never did any drugs it was just drinking.  My mother came to me and said if I didn't get it together and start being a good mother again that she would take me to court herself and take my kids away from me.  That was my wake up call.  I never drank again and I started being the mother that I had always been.  My kids were and still are my whole world.  And in the back of my mind I knew that even when I was drinking so bad.  Maybe you should just try to talk to your daughter and tell her that if she doesn't get it together and start putting her son first then you will take whatever action you need to take and get him and then maybe in the future when she decides she would rather be a mother than a girlfriend then you will give him back.  That is a very hard call because you love them both so much.  Maybe it will make a difference.  Keep me posted and I will keep you, your daughter and your grandson in my prayers.
 
November 4, 2008, 10:25 am CST

11/04 Grandmother vs. Mother Custody Battle

Grandmother may have started out with good intentions, but now that the mother seems to have things under control, it's time for Grandma to back off. The only way the mother can prove herself is for grandma to let her.  All I know is when Ethan saw his mom, he looked extremely happy to see her and hugged on her like he didn't want to let go. Grandma... let mom have her little boy back.
 
November 4, 2008, 10:34 am CST

No doubt

Quote From: rondacarter

if asking for help in any way from your parents means you are not a fit parent, or leaving a house without washing from top to bottom.  this world is in alot of trouble. i think this grandmother has NO intention giving him back to his mother.  if i was nicole, i would get my son back, legally, then i would live far away from her mom, so she could have a normal life with her son and not be judged in every move she made. i moved back in with my parents and got alot of help along the way from them, and never once did i feel my mom was going to steal him from me, i feel really sorry for  nicole, and yes she has know that she will have some hard times in the future, but she should'nt have to worry about losing her child every time something goes wrong.  grandma -- be a grandma and  act like one too.  if you loved either one of them, you'd be trying to help them be together and to be happy. and  go down to the family services and look and see what a real neglected/abuse child looks like.  GOOD LUCK NICOLE
I moved back in with my parents after my divorce from my kids father and my parents have helped me financially and emotionally.  And God knows I have made plenty of mistakes with my kids because after all they definitely do not come with an instruction booklet.  But through it all my parents have NEVER tried to be my kids parents and I never feared them trying to take my kids.  They have given me money, support and plenty of advise.  Thank goodness I was smart enough to listen to my parents since they've already raised me and did a pretty dang good job.  I will do the same for my kids if they need my help but I will never try to control their lives and their relationships with their children.  Isn't that what parents do?  Don't they help their kids no matter what?  You don't stop being a parent just because your kids turns 18 or because they have kids.  I'm almost 40 years old and my parents still help me to this day when they can.  But in turn I help them when I can.  My parents have never asked for anything in return.  I think Barbara needs to get a life of her own and just be the grandmother.  From what I understand that's alot funner than being the parent.  My mother's motto is, "If I had of known that being a grandmother was so much fun I would have done that first".  I could not image saying anything cruel or ugly about one of my kids and I certainly couldn't imagine hurting them emotionally.  I'm with you on this one!!!! Nicole has got a long road ahead of her.
 
November 4, 2008, 10:59 am CST

11/04 Grandmother vs. Mother Custody Battle

Quote From: chedrick

I am confused about who you are. You said your the father But keep replying saying YOUR DAUGHTER when Ethan Is a boy they are talking about? I am Confused. Inform me
i am the father of kaitlyn. thatsme21 are 2 different people, meaning the mother and father. she wrote hers and i wrote mine. we are still together but are just in the same situation as nicole and babara. we are no relation to them just tellin our story
 
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