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Topic : 11/07 Child Abandonment

Number of Replies: 214
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Created on : Friday, October 31, 2008, 04:17:56 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
Abandoning a child is largely considered the worst thing a parent could do … or is it? As an alternative to leaving unwanted babies to starve in dumpsters and alleys, many states have enacted a safe haven law, which provides the option of leaving the child in a safe place, such as a hospital or fire station, with no questions asked. Nebraska was the last state to enact the law; and did so without an age restriction. As a result, there has been a recent spate of parents dropping off grown teenagers to the care of the state! Should an age limit be set? When Courtney, 34, became overwhelmed with caring for her 15-year-old daughter, she says she used the loophole in the law to get her daughter the care she needed. Was this an act of abandonment, or a mother’s last resort?  Next, abandoned at an airport at just 10 days old, Elizabeth was given the nickname “Delta Dawn” by the pilots who found her, and Michael, left in a trash can by his birth mother, was saved by a night watchman. Learn how their lives played out and hear the lasting repercussions of their abandonment. Then, meet Elizabeth, a 20-year-old mother of two who says she is considering giving up her daughters. Would her decision be in the best interest of the children? And, when Maria, at age 16, unexpectedly gave birth on her bathroom floor, she says she stabbed the baby with a pair of scissors. Find out what drove her to such drastic measures. Join the discussion.

Find out what happened on the show.

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November 12, 2008, 3:10 am PST

So True,,,

Quote From: moodymitzy

I am sorry but 14 and 16 you are old enough to know not to kill a baby. I don't care if they felt scared or whatever that is murder. Parents should be to blame also. How could they not know their child is pregnant? How could they not raise their child to know that killing a baby is wrong? Sorry but I do not feel sorry for the ones that killed their babies or left them to die. Now the young mom that is considering giving her children up I feel for.
And to pick upon the point of parents"not knowing" their teen is pregnant -- There are so many signs. It's not just about whether or not she covers her growing belly w/ "big clothes." I suppose there are a few cases where there really are no obvious symptoms, but often the parents are just in denial.

Still, I doubt most parents think that their daughter woudl kill a baby. so I don't know if you can blame them for that part. But  they should have at least paid attention to the signs of pregnancy. Too often parents say things like, "Well, the nausea could have been from a virus" and "the frequent trips to the bathroom could have meant she was drinking a lot with her friends," etc. Yeah, but when you put these and other symptoms together...
 
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November 12, 2008, 3:23 am PST

About Not Judging

Quote From: hopefaithlove

I know where this mother is coming from that was on the show friday.  I have a 16yr-old step-son who has been diagnosed with:bipolar,adhd,ocd.  This child has made our lives pure h---.  At 16 he still pees the bed "because he doesn't want to get up and go during the night".  so therefore i bought him depends to wear to bed.  He threatens me(step-mom),his half brother(whom is 11).  He has made accusations towards me, my family, teachers and other individuals.  We have spent over $50,000 in doctors,therapists,medicines thats just in the last 2yrs.  we have been doing this doctor,therapist and medicine since he was 5yrs old.  My husband is in denial about his son.  My husbands family babies and protects this child and says he would never act like this.  He is now in a home for children he has been there since last january and he HAS NOT changed at all.  He is doing the same behavior there as he did at home.  My husband had an affair last september with a woman who "was just a friend for 20yrs) because he believed his son over me.  I was a wicked step-mom according to him and his family.  Let me remind you my husband drives truck and is never home to know what his son does.  and for his family his family never comes around to see what he does when there are people around this child does not aact like that because he doesnt want them to see his true colors.  There is no help in the state of nebraska for families who face these problems everyday with these children.  The cost of doctors,therapist,medicine is overwhelming.  I had to quit my job 3yrs ago to stay home because of this childs behavior.  And yet, there is another child in this home but he is pushed in the back by my husbands family because he is my son not mine and my husbands he is my child and therefore does not exist to them.

so before judging and degrating a person for doing something that is right for them get the story straight and give support instead of judging and degrating.  until you walk in the shoes of the parents of these children and go thru the h--- that we do yiu have no right judging and degrating.  And it really p-----/me off when the parents are always asked what did you do wrong or what could you have done differently.

when you spend every hour and every day trying to find support and options out there i do believe the parents are doing what they can.

My step-son has threatened me with a knife and my son.  He has my son so afraid of the dark, afraid of leaving my side because of the crap that he has said and done and threathened to do.

So dont judge and degrde a person for doing what needs to be done.

First, let me offer my sympathies on your situation. Also, I thinkit's a good thing that this boy is now in a special home. I am sorry that you husband seems to have turned to another woman b/c of all this, but if your stepson is truly as you describe, then you and your son are better off with the stepson out of your house. Oddly enough, he is probably better off too, b/c eventually, they may be able to help him. But if not, at least, thank God, the rest of the familyi is now spared the daily suffering.

I agree that we have to be careful about judging when we'renot facedwith the situation ourselves. And I know the mom with the 15-year-old was just trying to get some help for her daughter. In another post, I wrote how there is so much help available, but that was a genreal statement. I realize that in some states and in some individual cases, there is not so much help out there. Also, sometimes the help available costs more than the family can afford. So they have to reach out another way.
 

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November 12, 2008, 12:31 pm PST

Abandonment?

I watched the show on the 7th where the young woman wanted to give her kids up for adoption because she wants to give them a "better life."  In my opinion, kids need both parents a father and a mother.  I was raised in a single parent home and I do not believe that one person can do the job.  My mother was the breadwinner and did the best possible job one female can do.  Yet, my younger brother really didn't have a full-time father that was a role model for male behavior.  I would not call this an abandonment.  A child is 150 percent give.  She was only a teenager the first time she got pregnant by someone she met on-line?  She should seek some counseling in her area and make a decision based on what is best for all the individuals involved and do not insinuate that she should keep her kids.  Emotionally, who is filling a single parent's emotional basket?  Many adoptions now are open and people hook up after the child is an adult. 
 
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November 12, 2008, 12:52 pm PST

Saftey of the Kids.

The safe haven laws need to be adjusted for older children. These people who want to drop there children off are not going to be good parents to these children. It is important to allow these children to grow up in a good inviroment. These children need our help. Those who dont want to or cant care for there children need a place to take there children. Children are better off with people who will help.
 

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November 12, 2008, 4:51 pm PST

To Melissa

Melissa,
 I was 15 when I gave birth to my first daughter and 20 when I had my second. I chose to raise the girls as opposed to abortion or adoption. I would love to reach out to you and help. I understand how frustrating parenting is and when you are young and have kids we are trying to figure out life and how to raise our children. I live in Michigan and hope you live close. I would love to help you whether you live close or not. If you need someone to listen or need advice (nothing compared to Dr. Phil's) lol... I am telling you things will get better. You chose to raise your kids and not abort them for a reason. You love them and you can make it.. You just need support. Email me if you need to talk.

Kendalanna1199@hotmail.com
Jessica

 
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November 14, 2008, 9:06 am PST

Hi mellain!!

Quote From: mellain

You got it. That was ALL I was trying to show in coming on the show. I wanted other young mothers to know that it is not easy and that all the responsibility is on us. The men can still be free and it's okay because it's the social norm, but if we even feel like we need help look at how we are treated. I asked for help and half the viewers ridiculed me. Where is my family you all ask? I have none within 4 hours of me. Neither can I move closer to them. Even if I did, there isn't much they could do.

I don't want to give them up. I wanted help. Now I have DYFS (children's services) at my door asking me if I abuse or neglect my children, wanting to take them from me. I do not hurt them. I take extremely good care of them, I am nice to them, I put them before myself. I am finishing up my second semester at college right now and I have enrolled in next semester as full time again. I will not be giving up my education. Even if 'miss nevada' in the audience thought I was selfish for going to school and she thinks 'it's all about me' it's not. My children need me to do this, they need me to take this opprotunity and be in school and get a degree so I can at least do something better for them than I could without it, working wal-mart and waitressing just to make ends meet.

The father of my first child is almost 30 now, I just turned 20. I did not know what I was doing at 16 as well as I thought, but he did. With that said, I know I made mistakes but I am doing the best I can. None of you are going to adopt my children. I can do this. I just needed help.

But I want to say something to all mothers everywhere:

we don't need to give up who we are as individuals for our children, we don't need to be isolated in order to raise productivechildren. We CAN go to school. We don't need to work 2 dead endjobs to bring in an income. We can suffer for a little to get aneducation and use it to have careers, and this short period of timewith less money will not permanently damage our children. It's for thegreater good, and not just for ourselves but for the welfare andfutures of our children. We don't need to be silently suffering inbetween the walls of our homes, decorating and baking, afraid to have anight out once a week because we will be looked down upon for not being'real mothers.'

A real mother is someone who balances herself AND her children.

I'msick of society telling me what's going to make my children happy. I'mnot saying we be selfish, but we cannot lose ourselves. Our lives arenot 'over' or given up for our children. Certain activities, yes, butnot all. Certain ways of acting, yes, but not all. We can't move alongas fast as non-parents but we CAN get a degree, we can earn a position,we can.

Just because you work a full-time job at, say, Pizza Hut, does this makeyour life devoted and revolving around the company? Or do you getbreaks during shifts? Don't you get vacation time? Don't you have otheremployees working with you at any given time to get the job done? Howis being a full-time parent any different? We need breaks, we need asupport system, and when we aren't working we need to take off our'aprons' and honor student bumper stickers and be who we are as PEOPLE.

Without society telling us we're terrible human beings for it.

Youdo NOT need to isolate yourself just because you had children. But thisdoesn't give you an excuse to be out partying more than you are home ordoing activities that can hurt or influence your children in a bad way.This does not give you the right to total freedom from yourresponsibilities. That is not what I am advocating. I am speaking for the mom's who are scared of being themselves, whohave tried to go out once a week and had a man or an old-fashionedmother tell her she is selfish and uncaring of her children.

Ifyou isolate a mother, you take away her light. Without that light shecan't lead her children in the direction of happiness. You keep amother feeling trapped and she WILL take it out on her children, shewill lose her patience, she will raise troubled people. More often thannot.

I want to change this. For all the real parents out therewho love their children, who did give up their life. You don't need togive up all of it.

Parents are people, too.
I'm glad you poasted a quote with my comment.... I thought maybe you would be even more upset about the turnout of this than you are. It seems like you taking everything like a trooper! I e-mailed you at the e-mail address you provided in your other post. I don't know where you're located but if you ever need someone to talk to I'm here! Even if it's just to "vent" lol. I hope things get better for you soon and stay strong b/c things will get better... you are determined.... and theres nothing stronger than an educated and determined mother! :D One day your little girls will be able to say "We may not have had all the money we would have liked but we had our mother, and she was strong, devoted to us, and did everything she could to make sure we had what we needed. Now, shes a successful woman with a career who we look up to and love very much!"
 
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November 14, 2008, 11:28 am PST

National Guard Youth Challenge

I was married for 20+ yrs when my huband had a "mid-life crisis" and dumped me and emotionally hurt my teenage children. My kids and I had a lot of problems, but thankfully for my daughter and I, we found a wonderful counselor. My 16-17 yo son was another story. I tried everything. Things got ungly and he started doing things like lighting fires in the house, running away and being mean and trying to intimidate me and my daughter among many other things. He was diagnosed as Oppositional Defiant and Conduct Disorder. As a last chance I heard about the National Guard Youth Challenge program and made the decision to send my son there. Although it is a military style program, the kids are not required to go into the military when they complete the 6 month program. My son quit talking to me for over 6 weeks. He was very hurtful and hateful to me, then something changed. He is now First Seargent and the top Cadet. He is getting college scholarships and has been tutoring other kids in the program at his instructors request. He will graduate with his GED on December 7, 2008 and is starting college in January.  I have my old son back and he is happy again. This program has been a blessing. I am very thankful and I am glad I did not give up, even though everyone around me wanted me to.
 

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November 14, 2008, 1:58 pm PST

Giving up your children

I just want to say to Melissa I would like to adopt her children if she wants to give them up.  I have been very happily married for 14 years and have been through 8 miscarriages and several fertility treatments.  My husband and I want to have children badly.  I am now 42 and my husband is 41.  We were considering adopting but financially we can not adopt now until we save more money to do it.  I am scared about adopting from another country and I am scared to adopt in the US because I do not want my child taken from me in case the original birth parent wants the child back.    All I know is Melissa is very fortunate to have 2 children.  I would give anything to have 2 children or at least 1 child right now. Holidays are very depressing for us because we cannot share it with anyone so we usually leave town and go somewhere to get away from the fact we cannot celebrate Christmas, New Years, Halloween, Thanksgiving with a child.  We would give a child a terrific loving home.  My husband and I are both the only child and he only has his mom left.  Both of my parents are deceased so I do not have anyone.  My husband's mother desperately wants to be a Grandmother before she dies.  I do not know if this will ever happen.  By the time we have the money saved up we will probably be to old.  I love children very much and I am disappointed that I can not have any on my own.  That is all I have to say..
 
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November 14, 2008, 8:26 pm PST

Safe Haven for Infants Only

I am very concerned about the suggestion that safe haven laws include older children and teenagers. As I understand it, the safe-haven laws are designed for mothers who were caught off-guard, frightened, and unprepared to raise a child.

Although there will always be exceptions, I am concerned that the safe-haven law will be abused if expanded to include children and teenagers. In particular, I believe that such an expansion of the law will create a mentality that parenthood is a commitment that can be terminated - just as one can fire an employee, people will think that it is acceptable to "fire" their children!

Furthermore, there is a large difference in the psychological consequences of being given up as an infant (and then adopted by loving parents), and being rejected as a child. As an illustration, consider children in the foster care system. They are frequently abandoned by one set of foster parents and sent to another. (Of course, the term "abandoned" is not used.... the PC term is "failed placement" -- all just semantics!) The consequences are highly apparent. Contrast these kids with those adopted as infants - there really is no comparison!

In all, I believe that having Safe Haven laws for children and adolescents will lead to a spate of child abandonment, and serious psychological consequences for those children - and thus severe consequences for our society as a whole.
 
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November 15, 2008, 12:54 am PST

Adoptee Devotes Past Decade Encouraging Other Adoptees

Thank you for sharing adult adoptees Elizabeths and Michaels journeysthrough the complex emotions of being relinquished, orphaned and adopted. Adoptees sadly are often misunderstood because others cannot fathom how an adoptee who has gained a family and a home could struggle internally. ( Many are labeled as "ungrateful" or disrespectful when they express any desire to understand their adoption or to search for their birth family or story ) When adoptees feel judged or "bad" for their normal desire  to explore their adoption heritage, many bury their complex feelings, questions and shame and forfeit  needed healing.
.   As an adoptee, I was blessed to be placed in a loving and caring home at 9 mos of age.  Though I knew my adoptive parents love, my inner challenge was to weave through the complex feelings related to my birth parent's relinquishing their parental rights.Most  adoptees, regardless of whether they were adopted into a loving home or not, have an inner longing to learn the truth about their birth parents and circumstances surrounding their birth and adoption. Before they were adopted, they were orphaned first and THIS is the area of pain and unresolved loss in many adoptees- especially those in closed adoptions. I personally found healing and wholeness through attending an adoption triad support group and through faith in God and prayer. By meeting other adoptees and birth parents, I felt a kinship with others who shared common threads of pain and loss in their adoption journey. The group fostered a growing understanding about birth parents and how truly difficult and heart wrenching  their decision was for them. (Prior to these meetings, I had never met a birth parent and so I held a negative and incorrect stereotype of all birth parents and their "callous" decision not to parent.) I learned the truth of my own adoption story through a reunion with my birth sisters.  This life changing opportunity allowed me to exchange my former incomplete/ incorrect birth and adoption narrative (and my wrong perceptions of it ) with the truth. By meeting so many birth parents I witnessed the love and pain in their selfless decision to chose thelife-giving option of adoption.
 In the book of John in the Bible the passage, "You shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free became my reality. My overwhelming gratitude for my healing and transformed identity in God's plan and purpose for my life launched me into a ministry to encourage other adoptees, birth parents and adoptive parents. For over a decade I have facilitated an adoption triad support group in the western suburbs of Chicago to provide a safe place for adult adoptees and birth parents to share their journeys and complex feelings. Attendees find fellowship with others on the journey, and take advantage of the adoption resources and lending library provided.
I hope you will consider having a future show focused on adult adoptees and the extreme challenge they have in feeling permission from others to find closure and healing from their past. This is often due to their not wanting to "rock the boat" and the fear of losing their adoptive parents approval and love. The loyalty many adoptees feel towards their adoptive parents and the fear of alienating them by addressing their own inner needs immobilize them from seeking specialized counsel, adoption support groups that can lead to healing and wholeness.
 
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