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Topic : 07/01 "Bring Back My Child"

Number of Replies: 141
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Created on : Tuesday, November 25, 2008, 04:33:50 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 12/01/08) Parents try their best to protect their kids and teach them about stranger danger, but what if your child is abducted … and the abductor is the other parent? Zanni and Christine are former sisters-in-law who say their ex-husbands, George and John Silah, vanished and took their children with them. The mothers haven't heard from their sons in months and have no idea where they are. Why do Zanni and Christine wish they trusted their instincts? Don’t miss the warning signs these moms say they recognized too late. The mothers accuse the fathers of shady business practices, and you won't believe what they say they discovered in their ex-husbands' home! The men are wanted for child abduction and there is a $25,000 reward for their capture. Then, David says he was happily married to Bruna and had a 4-year-old son whom he loved dearly. When he dropped them off at the airport in 2004, he never imagined that would be the last time he would see either of them for years. When Bruna arrived in her native Brazil, she called David and told him she wanted a divorce. David, who was devastated by his wife's actions, has fought tirelessly to regain custody of his son. Recently, this story took a tragic turn. Hear from David's attorney and get insight into his case. And, after losing custody of her 14-month-old, Cecilia went on the run and became a fugitive. She says fleeing was her only option, but now that she's been arrested and has served time, would she do it again? Join the discussion.

Find out what happened on the show.

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November 28, 2008, 2:44 pm CST

Doctor Phil Show.

Back Bring Child Doctor My Phil/Robin. What are  you talking about? What child are you talking aboiut?------

I donot understand that.  See you on Monday December 01st, 2008.  Sincerley Your. Russell Vlaanderen.-

 
November 29, 2008, 12:53 pm CST

bring sean home.

David & Bruna's story is indeed tragic and sad.  Bruna's widower should be FORCED to return David's child to him.  http://bringseanhome.org/index.html
 
November 29, 2008, 11:18 pm CST

IT'S ABOUT TIME THIS TOPIC IS BEING EXPLORED - NOT ALL PARENTS ABANDON THEIR CHILDREN FOR MONETARY REASONS ETC

It is so sad that most people think that a parent who loses a child that is alive does so because they did something terrible.  I agree there are some dead beat mothers and fathers but that is not always the case.  I'm writing to the message board for one reason only which is whoever reads my post just remember if ever you meet a mother or father who cannot see their only alive child(ren) don't go jumping to conclusions that they were a bad parent.  Also, sadly to say, it still occurs to this day that

especially if a mother loses her alive child(ren) that she was a bad person and despicable.

 

My case is unique but the end result was the same as other mothers or fathers like I who were stopped seeing their child(ren).  I live in Canada and in the 1980' the Court System decided that children from ages 10 could go and live with the parent of their choice.  The parent that had custody

could not appeal the decision of the child in front of any Court Judge.  The decision was left entirely to the child. 

 

I had two boys ages 10 and 12 in my custody and the youngest one was brainwashed by his Dad to go and live with him.  My 12  year old was torn between staying with me or going with his younger brother.  I got counselling for both of them and eventually my eldest with a brokenheart decided to go and live with his Dad and brother.  Both of them were much too young to make that type of decision but the law was on their side and their Dad made sure they knew about it.

 

I was allowed visiting rights but the agreement stated that I had to call my ex-husband before going to see them.  I saw them only 3 times after they went to live with their Dad.  My ex-husband got an unlisted telephone number because he knew he was protected by the Privacy Act of Canada. I did go to my ex-husband's home and he called the police who then informed me that I had to get off his property.    I went to see countless lawyers to find out how I could possibly do something about seeing my children.  My only alternative I was told by one lawyer was to abduct them and get a new identity.  My step-dad was willing to pay the money required for me and the children to get a new identity but I refused.  Because I refused such an offer, I was persecuted by family members and friends.  I could not go that route because it meant being on the run for the rest of all our lives.  Knowing my ex-husband I knew that he would do everything in his power to find us.  What good would it have done had I been caught and put in jail. 

 

My two sons are now 39 and 40 years old but their Dad brainwashed them so badly with the idea that I had abandoned them that they still won't have anything to do with me.  It's difficult to compare one with someone else but I feel it is my right to do so here.  Dr. Phil I was the kind of mother your wife Robin is with my two boys.  Of course, I did not have a good marriage as you and Robin do but I protected my boys from their Dad's drinking and would not allow him to scream in the home.  I gave them all my love, time, money etc to my children and I did not deserve to have to go through this. 

 

The good thing is that I am a christian and very strong in my faith.  The first couple of years I walked around like a zombie but I did not take drugs nor drink.  It was very difficult but the one thing that kept me moving on with my empty life was the idea that a person can take everything away from you but if you won't allow them to they can't make you lose your mind.  I held on to that thought.  At first I would repeat that over and over in my mind until I got to believe it.  I recall some days being so exhausted from repeating in my brain:  "He took everything away from me but he will not take my sanity ever". 

 

When my youngest son was around 30 years old he contacted me and things were going along pretty smoothly until his wife got pregnant with my little grand-daughter who is now 6 years old.  Even though my son, of course, was married, he never told his Dad that he was having a relationship with me until his little girl was born.  All hell broke loose when he told his Dad.  I was then forced to walk away from my son, his wife and little girl.  I did not want my grand-daughter to be around all that stress.  I, also, could foresee that I would eventually lose the right to see my grand-daughter and I did not think then nor now I could survive losing another alive child.  I would have loved my grandchild whether it was a girl or a boy but her being a little girl was one of the nicest gifts I ever had.  The reason being is that I am an only child, therefore, never had a sister.  As you can presume I never had a daughter either. 

I am thankful that I was able to hold my little grand-daughter when she was born for at least one hour and unless God intervenes in some way that is the only memory I will ever have of her.

 

I still hang on to the hope that someday my two boys will reunite with me.  I admit a part of me has died but my faith in the Lord has always sustained me.  I never remarried.  I did have a few relationships but I had issues of trust that I can't seem to get rid of. 

 

I would like to say a few words about men whom the world at times call "dead beat Dads".  I agree there are some that deserve this name but from the ones I've met through various ways I have to say that 60% of them do not deserve to be called "dead beat Dads'".

 

Many wives make it so difficult for their husband's to see their children for various reasons that the fathers give up and move on the best way they know how.  I've spoken to quite a few fathers who have told me why should they give money to their wives who won't allow them to see their children.  Also, I ran a day care centre at one point in my life and saw how so many mothers talk badly to their children about their Dads.  I babysat one little girl and boy and they would act up big time when their Dad would want to pick them up to fulfill his visiting rights.  Their mother was a school teacher and she would curse after their father in my home many times to the children.  I finally had to tell her to stop this behavior or else I would report her to the school she was teaching at.  Actually I could write a book about all the verbal abuse children from broken homes get from their own mother. 

 

Losing your alive children I believe is worse than losing one through death.  I may be wrong about this because I never experienced it.  The reason I think this way is because if you lose a child through death eventually you can come to terms that they are not coming back.  Losing an alive child follows you through the rest of your life if you are never reunited with the said child.

 

I'm 65 years old now and I pray constantly that I can go on and live the years I have left in a good manner.  I lived most of my adult life missing my children which I still do.  But my dilemma now is being a grand-mother and not seeing my little grand-daughter.   I feel very uncomfortable around other grand-mothers and it takes the Lord's grace not to be jealous of them, after all, it isn't their fault about my situation.

 

 

I'm here to tell you that I still get flack from all sorts of people who will not believe my story about losing my children.  I swear to you, Dr. Phil, that no one believes my story.  At times when various

people question me about my children, I feel that perhaps I should say I don't have any but I cannot or ever will be able to do such a thing. 

 

The good news is that the law was changed I believe about 8 or 10 years after they implemented it and they had the nerve to send me a questionnaire about how it affected me.  From the things I've read regarding the outcome of Canada implementing such a law at least my children did not try  or commit suicide as some of the other children I read about. 

 

To your guests on your program, I have one word of encouragement to tell you which is stand your ground and don't let this terrible tragedy mess your brain up.  I'm not saying not to take medication for anxiety or depression but hang in there.  If you're a believer of God and the Bible turn to Him and He will walk beside you through all of this terrible ordeal. 

 

I wish to say something to the mothers and fathers who are presently going through a divorce and that is do not ever talk against one or the other to your child(ren).  If I can do this under the circumstances I went through I'm sure you can do the same.  Whatever the reason is that you are getting a divorce don't bad mouth your situation to your child(ren) ever.   

 

Thank you, Dr. Phil, for having a program on this subject.  May God Bless you all who are going through losing an alive child(ren) whether it's for a month or years.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
November 30, 2008, 4:23 am CST

Bring back my child

I waited 32 years to get my child back. She was 35 when I found her last year in October.

I understand the pain any mother has to feel when their child is taken.

No woman can be sure her mate will take their child but when they do they can be sure they will continue to fight, go to jail or do anything to get her baby back.

I would have but didn't have the chance.

Our relationship is long distance, we have seen each other only twice and I have met her husband and my grandchildren so atleast knowing is a relief.

We look very much alike and I am happy just to know she is only a phone call away.

My son from my marriage is hateful, and mean and says things like " if she really knew you she wouldn't like you" and this is from a 25 year old man who lives at home and is abusive to me and his father.

My other daughter hates my relationship with her because her half sister has the perfect life and she has a life that is difficult because of her own choices.

I never knew her father would take her but once he did I worked years to find her and would go through it all again and done it differently if I had the chance but since my female family members who became parents have never without being married gave the child the fathers last name unless they were married and then didn't even marry unless they had clear signs that it would be something worth taking that chance.

We learned it was better to raise a child alone then suffer from having a child taken away from them.

I made the mistake of giving him too much power.

I also made the mistake of trusting him too much.

I learned from those mistakes.

It was a hard lesson but atleast now I can talk to my first born and I am a lucky woman to have found her.

 
December 1, 2008, 1:35 am CST

You can't win

Quote From: canadianlady

It is so sad that most people think that a parent who loses a child that is alive does so because they did something terrible.  I agree there are some dead beat mothers and fathers but that is not always the case.  I'm writing to the message board for one reason only which is whoever reads my post just remember if ever you meet a mother or father who cannot see their only alive child(ren) don't go jumping to conclusions that they were a bad parent.  Also, sadly to say, it still occurs to this day that

especially if a mother loses her alive child(ren) that she was a bad person and despicable.

 

My case is unique but the end result was the same as other mothers or fathers like I who were stopped seeing their child(ren).  I live in Canada and in the 1980' the Court System decided that children from ages 10 could go and live with the parent of their choice.  The parent that had custody

could not appeal the decision of the child in front of any Court Judge.  The decision was left entirely to the child. 

 

I had two boys ages 10 and 12 in my custody and the youngest one was brainwashed by his Dad to go and live with him.  My 12  year old was torn between staying with me or going with his younger brother.  I got counselling for both of them and eventually my eldest with a brokenheart decided to go and live with his Dad and brother.  Both of them were much too young to make that type of decision but the law was on their side and their Dad made sure they knew about it.

 

I was allowed visiting rights but the agreement stated that I had to call my ex-husband before going to see them.  I saw them only 3 times after they went to live with their Dad.  My ex-husband got an unlisted telephone number because he knew he was protected by the Privacy Act of Canada. I did go to my ex-husband's home and he called the police who then informed me that I had to get off his property.    I went to see countless lawyers to find out how I could possibly do something about seeing my children.  My only alternative I was told by one lawyer was to abduct them and get a new identity.  My step-dad was willing to pay the money required for me and the children to get a new identity but I refused.  Because I refused such an offer, I was persecuted by family members and friends.  I could not go that route because it meant being on the run for the rest of all our lives.  Knowing my ex-husband I knew that he would do everything in his power to find us.  What good would it have done had I been caught and put in jail. 

 

My two sons are now 39 and 40 years old but their Dad brainwashed them so badly with the idea that I had abandoned them that they still won't have anything to do with me.  It's difficult to compare one with someone else but I feel it is my right to do so here.  Dr. Phil I was the kind of mother your wife Robin is with my two boys.  Of course, I did not have a good marriage as you and Robin do but I protected my boys from their Dad's drinking and would not allow him to scream in the home.  I gave them all my love, time, money etc to my children and I did not deserve to have to go through this. 

 

The good thing is that I am a christian and very strong in my faith.  The first couple of years I walked around like a zombie but I did not take drugs nor drink.  It was very difficult but the one thing that kept me moving on with my empty life was the idea that a person can take everything away from you but if you won't allow them to they can't make you lose your mind.  I held on to that thought.  At first I would repeat that over and over in my mind until I got to believe it.  I recall some days being so exhausted from repeating in my brain:  "He took everything away from me but he will not take my sanity ever". 

 

When my youngest son was around 30 years old he contacted me and things were going along pretty smoothly until his wife got pregnant with my little grand-daughter who is now 6 years old.  Even though my son, of course, was married, he never told his Dad that he was having a relationship with me until his little girl was born.  All hell broke loose when he told his Dad.  I was then forced to walk away from my son, his wife and little girl.  I did not want my grand-daughter to be around all that stress.  I, also, could foresee that I would eventually lose the right to see my grand-daughter and I did not think then nor now I could survive losing another alive child.  I would have loved my grandchild whether it was a girl or a boy but her being a little girl was one of the nicest gifts I ever had.  The reason being is that I am an only child, therefore, never had a sister.  As you can presume I never had a daughter either. 

I am thankful that I was able to hold my little grand-daughter when she was born for at least one hour and unless God intervenes in some way that is the only memory I will ever have of her.

 

I still hang on to the hope that someday my two boys will reunite with me.  I admit a part of me has died but my faith in the Lord has always sustained me.  I never remarried.  I did have a few relationships but I had issues of trust that I can't seem to get rid of. 

 

I would like to say a few words about men whom the world at times call "dead beat Dads".  I agree there are some that deserve this name but from the ones I've met through various ways I have to say that 60% of them do not deserve to be called "dead beat Dads'".

 

Many wives make it so difficult for their husband's to see their children for various reasons that the fathers give up and move on the best way they know how.  I've spoken to quite a few fathers who have told me why should they give money to their wives who won't allow them to see their children.  Also, I ran a day care centre at one point in my life and saw how so many mothers talk badly to their children about their Dads.  I babysat one little girl and boy and they would act up big time when their Dad would want to pick them up to fulfill his visiting rights.  Their mother was a school teacher and she would curse after their father in my home many times to the children.  I finally had to tell her to stop this behavior or else I would report her to the school she was teaching at.  Actually I could write a book about all the verbal abuse children from broken homes get from their own mother. 

 

Losing your alive children I believe is worse than losing one through death.  I may be wrong about this because I never experienced it.  The reason I think this way is because if you lose a child through death eventually you can come to terms that they are not coming back.  Losing an alive child follows you through the rest of your life if you are never reunited with the said child.

 

I'm 65 years old now and I pray constantly that I can go on and live the years I have left in a good manner.  I lived most of my adult life missing my children which I still do.  But my dilemma now is being a grand-mother and not seeing my little grand-daughter.   I feel very uncomfortable around other grand-mothers and it takes the Lord's grace not to be jealous of them, after all, it isn't their fault about my situation.

 

 

I'm here to tell you that I still get flack from all sorts of people who will not believe my story about losing my children.  I swear to you, Dr. Phil, that no one believes my story.  At times when various

people question me about my children, I feel that perhaps I should say I don't have any but I cannot or ever will be able to do such a thing. 

 

The good news is that the law was changed I believe about 8 or 10 years after they implemented it and they had the nerve to send me a questionnaire about how it affected me.  From the things I've read regarding the outcome of Canada implementing such a law at least my children did not try  or commit suicide as some of the other children I read about. 

 

To your guests on your program, I have one word of encouragement to tell you which is stand your ground and don't let this terrible tragedy mess your brain up.  I'm not saying not to take medication for anxiety or depression but hang in there.  If you're a believer of God and the Bible turn to Him and He will walk beside you through all of this terrible ordeal. 

 

I wish to say something to the mothers and fathers who are presently going through a divorce and that is do not ever talk against one or the other to your child(ren).  If I can do this under the circumstances I went through I'm sure you can do the same.  Whatever the reason is that you are getting a divorce don't bad mouth your situation to your child(ren) ever.   

 

Thank you, Dr. Phil, for having a program on this subject.  May God Bless you all who are going through losing an alive child(ren) whether it's for a month or years.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I read your story very carefully and feel extremely sad for you. I hope one day things will work out for you. I realize that what you wrote is merely a summary of your experience which no doubt is a lot more complicated than that. Your concluding comments made me wonder that maybe in some way you were/are misguided (however good your intentions) in suppressing what you really feel about your ex-husband to your children. The problem could be that your 'silence' means that you are in effect 'guilty as charged' in their eyes and just confirms what their father has been telling them for so long. It's a dilemma I think for many people in your position, but I still think children should be able to understand and make up their own minds if presented with objective arguments from both sides. You have to stand up for yourself and your rights. As for your children, they are adults who should take responibility for their own feelings and actions. As well as having been severely mistreated by your ex-husband, you have also been the victim of a grave miscarriage of justice, the Canadian legal system should be made aware of the consequences of such an ill-conceived law, by your example.  I wish you a happy and peaceful life.
 
December 1, 2008, 7:17 am CST

The Court system isnt all that reliable

I understand how this mother feels...I have not lost my children to abduction but i have lost my 16yr old to an alcoholic whom i left to get her out of that situation.  I have been thru the court system and unless you have more money than God to pay a lawyer you can not and will not be heard in a court of law.  This mother did a heroic thing when she fled with her daughter. Mothers have a sense when it comes to what is going on with their children.  I believe she was doing what she thought was right and to pull time for such a thing just shows right there what the court system is made of.  There are mothers out there that do not care for their children, do drugs, set a bad example and pretty much abandon them and neglect them in that way and they still have their children because no one really cared enough to do anything about it.  I give a million kudos to the woman on the show.  She did what she thought was the best and obviously she tried going thru the court system and nothing was done to rectify the situation.  Which is usually the case in a lot of court cases.  People who do not have alot of money or resources to get the court to see what may be best for a child and to me that is sad.  I watch my little girl everyday have to deal with the effects that an alcoholic daddy can cause.  I was the daughter of an alcoholic father and it breaks my heart to know i worked and tried for 6 years to show her that a woman does not have to live like that and she runs to him instead.  So if i had the chance or the resources to take my child and make a better life for her until her dad got sober i certainly would do it.  I cant even get her dad to help with the second child as far as child support or anything else.  So if this lady felt like something was going on I commend her for taking the bull by the horns and making a statement.  Good luck to her! I think she deserves to have her child in her life! She obviously cares alot about her and would do anything to keep her safe!
 
December 1, 2008, 8:06 am CST

What's right?

  • As a mother, I am sad to see that we as a country elect people who do nothing about international abduction cases. I completly empathize with the man who's son is in Brazil. I think our system should make the (not really step-father) return this child to his biological father.There was no reason this should go on. It is cut and dry.  As a step-mother. I have also seen the court system be abused by liars and manipulators who just want the upper hand. As well as abuse. For the one's who have done no wrong. Adults deal with outcomes better than children. They are the ones hurt by lies, abuse and neglect. It effects their whole life. It should all be for one reason only. That is...The best interest should be of the child. Take all of the information from both sides, all of the evidence from both sides. Not fabricated evidence. School records. Health records. Let the child speak (if they are old enough) Take all of that into consideration before anyone takes a child from either parent. If judges would take time to review everything instead of listening to very little. I think alot of outcomes would be different. It seems to be all boiling down to one thing in today's society. POLITICS!! It hurts the children...not the politicians!!
 
December 1, 2008, 8:52 am CST

BRING SEAN HOME

Thank you for presenting David Goldman's story!! It is time that David and his son, Sean, are reunited once again. He has been through a lot over the past 4 years and to see this finally coming to light is encouraging. Please direct your listeners to the www.bringseanhome.org website, which has a lot of information and ways to help. The more of us that reach out and do whatever we can to assist David the better. You have certainly assist this effort.
 
December 1, 2008, 10:23 am CST

Re : Mom on the run

Quote From: tina12061969

I understand how this mother feels...I have not lost my children to abduction but i have lost my 16yr old to an alcoholic whom i left to get her out of that situation.  I have been thru the court system and unless you have more money than God to pay a lawyer you can not and will not be heard in a court of law.  This mother did a heroic thing when she fled with her daughter. Mothers have a sense when it comes to what is going on with their children.  I believe she was doing what she thought was right and to pull time for such a thing just shows right there what the court system is made of.  There are mothers out there that do not care for their children, do drugs, set a bad example and pretty much abandon them and neglect them in that way and they still have their children because no one really cared enough to do anything about it.  I give a million kudos to the woman on the show.  She did what she thought was the best and obviously she tried going thru the court system and nothing was done to rectify the situation.  Which is usually the case in a lot of court cases.  People who do not have alot of money or resources to get the court to see what may be best for a child and to me that is sad.  I watch my little girl everyday have to deal with the effects that an alcoholic daddy can cause.  I was the daughter of an alcoholic father and it breaks my heart to know i worked and tried for 6 years to show her that a woman does not have to live like that and she runs to him instead.  So if i had the chance or the resources to take my child and make a better life for her until her dad got sober i certainly would do it.  I cant even get her dad to help with the second child as far as child support or anything else.  So if this lady felt like something was going on I commend her for taking the bull by the horns and making a statement.  Good luck to her! I think she deserves to have her child in her life! She obviously cares alot about her and would do anything to keep her safe!
I haven't seen this program and can only rely on what has been written on this site. I've a question for the mother, Cecilia who went on the run with her child after suspecting her ex-husband of harming her daughter. It didn't say whether she went to a doctor or other medical professional to certify that the bruising, etc.  happened following an unsupervised visit. Would this medical certificate be admissable in court and be the proof she needed to gain custody of her child ?
 
December 1, 2008, 12:10 pm CST

Help David Goldman's website

If you would like to help David Goldman and see Sean Goldman returned to his biological father, please log on to www.bringseanhome.org

 

 
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