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Topic : 01/23 Behind the Headlines

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Created on : Friday, January 16, 2009, 02:56:58 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
Dr. Phil takes an in-depth look at unbelievable news stories that have captivated millions. Adam Herrman, 21, vanished from his Kansas home 10 years ago, but his adoptive parents, Doug and Valerie, only reported him missing last month! Dr. Phil talks to the young man’s biological parents, Gerri and Irvin, who haven’t seen each other in 22 years. What do they think happened to their child? Who’s to blame for the disappearance of Adam Herrman, and is there any chance that the young man is still alive? Nancy Grace, the host of Headline News, weighs in. Then, millions were inspired by the safe landing of USAirways Flight 1549, also dubbed the “Miracle on the Hudson.” Three passengers, Brad, Joshua and Denise, say they’re thankful to be alive, but they’re still haunted by memories of that fateful day. How can they deal with the psychological affects of the plane crash and move on with their lives? Join the discussion.

Find out what happened on the show.

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January 24, 2009, 5:56 pm CST

Adam Herrman

I am writing in regards to the Adam Herrman case.  I am sure, as this case is explosive and definately disgusting you will revisit this case, I want to straighten out some things.  Please feel free to consult a legal consultant in the state of Kansas to verify what I am stating.

The biological mother had eight children that the state of Kansas removed.  She stated that it was all because there were black and blue marks on her daughter.  The reason that eight would be removed over one child is that in the state of Kansas, if your parental rights are terminated to one child, that is grounds to terminate rights to any and all future children.  They can take the child from the hospital and you never are able to see them.  That is how Kansas child in need of care laws are written.  She may have never harmed the other children in her home.  That is why her Kansas children were taken, but she has two that reside with her in Colorado.

Additionally, I am not sure at what age the children were removed initially, however, in Kansas, once the state removes a child from a parent's custody, the case is turned over to a private subcontractor.  When the state of Kansas released child custody cases to a private contractor, the system became irrevocably (in my humble opinion) broken.  If you want to know who failed this child, the focus needs to go from the top on down.

NOW, I will be open and honest in this letter so that you know why I am so very familiar with the laws of Kansas and how they work.  In 1997 I moved to the state of Kansas with my former husband and two daughters (we were from Nebraska).  My oldest daughter (who is now 14, but at the time was 2 1/2) is ADHD to the extreme.  I suspected something was different with her from about the time she was one, because she was constantly into everything (and I have three children, this was definately not normal behavior).  We would put her down at 1am in the HOPES that she would sleep until 5 or 6am.  She would raid our food, eat to gorging, throw what she didn't on the floors, counters, what have you.  In Nebraska, we had a great support system, as my family was there, and my mother and I spent a lot of time together, so it wasn't so bad.  We moved to Kansas, and that wasn't the case.  We were alone.  We were low income family, two high school graduates, but not educated enough to get employment that was enough to support a small family.  We applied for day care benefits, but as we were both working, we were determined to make too much.  Not enough to live, but too much to pay for child care or any of the extras in life, barely enough to feed our small family.  Well, since we were declined for day care benefits, we were forced to sleep on staggered sleep schedules to make sure someone was always awake because we couldn't find a lock to keep our oldest daughter in the house.  Well, even as much as we tried, our oldest daughter snuck out, unattended, and improperly clothed, and the authorities became involved.  I can't tell you the number of times it occured, but it was more than once.  The state took custody of our children (both, even though there was no abuse to my youngest daughter (who was about 9 months old at the time/12 years old now).  We jumped through EVERY hoop there was.  We went to parenting classes, nutrition classes, individual and family therapy, you name it.  But it wasn't enough.  We had a two story home.  Initially, the girls room was on the ground floor, because we didn't want to worry about either of them falling down the stairs.  So, after the state became involved, we moved their room to the second upstairs bedroom.  Then, they stated that the girls could fall down the stairs (even though we installed a screw in the wall gate).  There was a window air conditioner in the girls bedroom (it was an old home, approx 100 years old, with only window air conditioning).  We were ordered to remove the air conditioner, as it could "fall on the girls if they pulled on the cord".  But then they stated to the courts that we lived in a home that didn't have appropriate air conditioning to cool the girls.  In the end, we were forced to move to a home we couldn't afford, but was a ranch style home to get them home.  Then they changed it and stated because I was so difficult (stating we didn't want to move because we couldn't afford a different place) I was ordered anger management because I was "resistant to change".  A year passed, and the state began termination proceedings against my former husband and I, because the "case was languishing in the system", even though we jumped through all hoops there were and then some.  Long story short, I finally, out of desperation, took my case to the Lawrence Journal World reporter who handled monitoring the broken system in Kansas.  We provided him with all court documents and treatment plans, he wrote an article documenting our case, and less than 16 days later, our girls were returned to our home.  Bear in mind, that in this case, there was ZERO abuse to our girls.  They were height/weight appropriate for their ages, our house clean, and we both held full time jobs.  Neither of us drank or did drugs, and I smoked, but never at home, only at work.  If you search the Lawrence Journal World's website (ljworld.com) and search for my name at the time, Jennifer Butcher, you can still find the story he broke on our case.

Now, I will also be honest and state, I lost my middle girl again just over a month later.  Why?  Because apparently, my ex spanked my daughter.  He admitted it to the Lenexa Kansas police.  He spanked her on her diaper line.  This is the reason I divorced him.  The babysitter found a small bruise just above her diaper line.  HOWEVER, if you looked at the court documents, you would be led to believe that she was beaten within an inch of her life.  I feel very bad, in some respects, because I left my husband over this.  It wasn't until I saw the photographs of my daughter that I realized she wasn't actually "beaten".  On the photo, a very small bruise is seen just above her diaper area.  What it looks like is he tried to swat her hard enough to get her to notice it and she moved.  Bear in mind, that at this time, I was working 60-70 hours a week to support us, and he took care of the kids more because at the time I had a better paying job.  The day care center reported the bruise, and I think that my daughter was more taken because of the previous contact with the state than the bruise.  BUT, the judge who presided over the case stated that unfortunately, in the state of Kansas, child abuse is subjective, and there is no set guideline that specifies exactly what constitutes child abuse.  A tiny finger print was sufficient to take custody of her.  How did I resolve the issue?  I divorced my ex.  I moved to a small town with a great support system.  I had letters of recommendation from my other two kids (my oldest daughter, and my last child, a son who at the time was 1, now is 10) day care provider, my oldest daughter's school, physicians, nurses, etc.  They all stated the kids were always happy, healthy, were meeting all age appropriate milestones, never came to school dressed inapproprately, etc.  We attended visitation with my daughter twice a week, one hour (each way) from where we lived to participate in visitation with my daughter.  The state still attempted to terminate my parental rights to my daughter.  It took me great effort, and a lot of legal research for me to regain custody.  I ended up representing myself in court, as I couldn't afford an attorney and because I lived in a different county I wasn't eligible for legal aid.  I was able to have the private contractor found in contempt four times for failing to comply with the case plan that THEY wrote up.

Now, before you think I am some kind of crack pot writing in, let me tell you this.  The last contact I have had with Kansas SRS was in 2000.  I have all three of my kids.  I divorced my former husband, remarried, and my current husband adopted the children in 2004.  I fought long and hard with our public schools district to get my oldest daughter into special education services (and even did a stint of homeschooling with all three children when the school system failed my daughter).  My oldest has been in counseling since 2000 and she has been diagnosed with ADHD (combined type) and dysthymic disorder (I am probably butchering the spelling, but hopefully you can get what I am saying).  She is treated and is beginning to finally get a grip on her issues.  She is also very low IQ and only functions at about a 5-6 year old level (she is 14).  We also have two other children, our middle daughter (who at 12 is normally either honor roll or honorable mention in addition to a multiple sport athlete) and our son (who is 10, involved in every sport on the face of the planet, a Cub Scout, and also a straight A student and the kid who is the first to hug his parents in public).  I am the soccer association president.  I was young and made mistakes.  Mistakes that had the state of Kansas had their way, I would be paying for until the day I died, because had that second time my rights to my daughter been terminated, I would have lost custody to my other children as well and they would have been terminated.

So, I believe the father when he says that he was pressured to drop the fight.  I was pressured as well.  Before you hammer these two other people again, please review the state of Kansas' laws.  I honestly feel from what I have read over the past month or so that this boy was a child that was failed from the top on down.  Very many red flags were raised.  But the state of Kansas has so many flaws in their foster care laws that it is easy to slip through.  When I fought my case, attorneys for us, and outside ones who reviewed the case stated that because we were low income with limited resources we had less of a chance to regain custody than a couple who were abusing drugs or alcohol, because there were no obvious flaws to "correct".  If there were flaws to correct, the adoptive parents would get their kids back.  I spoke to many foster parents while I was in parenting classes (they were the peer therapists to guide me in learn how to properly parent) who said they hadn't even met their social worker and it was a year after having kids placed with them.  Some had social workers change so much that by the time they learned the social worker's name, the case would be reassigned.  This case goes far beyond the family.  It goes to a broken system.

BUT, let's not go into my anger at the aunt in this case.  How the hell she could go to bed at night in good conscience knowing her nephew was locked in the bathroom I will never know.  I know Nancy Grace said they couldn't be charged because there is no law stating you have to be a good sameritan...I wonder if the prosecutors thought hard enough if something could be charged.  Obstruction, or perhaps even accessory before the fact since they were aware of the crime.  I am sure a creative prosecutor could persue charges against the negligence of this family.

This is similar to a case that just broke in rural Cass County Missouri.  This just broke today.  A man "allegedly" raped his oldest daughter (who is now 19) for six years, and during that time fathered four children with her in two states.  Two of the children were stillborn, and one died of pneumonia.  The fouth child is three years old.  The mother stood by for six years, watching her daughter pregnant four times, and apparently never decided to do anything about it.  They interviewed the mother of the suspect on the news tonight and she said they lived in trailers on her property and he wouldn't let her see the kids or near their trailers.  She hates him and admits he never should have had children, but doesn't accept blame for the fact that she did nothing about it when she was prohibited access.  Here is another great story for you to do a "in the headlines" show.  This one is again particular gruesome and horrifying.

But seriously, please find someone on your staff to look more into the laws of Kansas before you do your next show on this developing story.  I think you would be surprised to find how wierd the laws of Kansas are.  And how disturbing the failures are in the social services system.  This system is as much to blame as the family members for this child's disappearance/potential death.  And again, please visit the Lawrence, Kansas Capital Journal website to review articles written on the subcontracting of child protective services.  Articles by a reporter named Mike Shields will be particularly enlightening.  He covered that beat for a long time, and he was one of the first to call the state on the carpet.
 
January 24, 2009, 6:22 pm CST

Miracle on the Hudson

I was so upset to see the man that Dr. Phil had on his show that was a passenger in the plane that "landed" in the Hudson River.  He and his wife were crying and stating things like him being afraid of flying now, blah, blah, blah.  I think he should have been crying from gratitude that he had a hero at the helm.  "Sully" is a remarkable person, a hero.  When that plane was going down, I'm sure that Captain "Sully" was only thinking about how he could get that plane down and save 155 people at the same time, with no major injuries. That man should have come on the show to express how humbled and appreciative he is to be sitting on the Dr. Phil show and not in a hospital dying, missing a limb or handicapped for life or already dead.  This episode didn't sit well with me due to his lack of appreciation and graciousness for being alive.  He seemed to be pitying himself when all the while he should thank God and the Captain that he made it out alive and safe!  Shame on both the man and his wife.  Sully should be presented with a "purple heart" due to his heroic efforts and selflessness!

 
January 24, 2009, 6:32 pm CST

Kudos to "thesystemsuxs" from Kansas

Quote From: thesystemsuxs

 I have been a foster parent for over 10 years now. When I started they were for the kids and getting families back together. Somewhere along the way it became a business.I have seen and experienced first hand how the workers bully the parents. They make the parents jump through flaming hoops, attend parenting classes,anger management classes, counseling, therapy, family therapy, and set up the visits with their children at the workers convenience And let's not forget court, caseplans, worker/child visits, and worker/ parent visits. So what if the bio-parent has a job. If they miss enough work they will lose their job. And Dr. Phil you are wrong they do pull kids out of the home for bruises and sometimes even less then that. I know of a situation of the house being dirty. And tell that woman that was on your show I had  a bio-dad that had to get a bigger place because his children weren't allowed to share a room because they were 7 & 8 and a boy and girl. So he finally got them back after 2 1/2 years in the system, but only for 30 days if it doesn't work they will put them back in the system. A big majority of these bio-parents are very low functioning or scared out of their wits and want their children back so they do whatever the worker assigned to them tells them to do even if it means setting them up for failure. I know you have a lot of money and pull. I wish you would investigate the SRS, TFI (The Farm Inc. ) ,DCCCA,and other child placing agencies in Kansas. I know you would find things that you would question like I do. I am just a resource parent as they call us now and they do get upset with me a lot so they blow me off. After SRS passed the responsibility of Foster care to the agencies is when all sense of family was lost. And believe me they all stick together.I have complained and turned in workers to the complaint line only to have it trickle back down to the person I complained against and nothing was accomplished. I feel as long as they can keep a child in the system it is job security for them, and nobody questions it. I also know of a boy that is over three years old and has been in the system since 4 months old. The bio-parents still have rights and visits but his half brother was placed back home over 22 months ago, and his full sister is still in a  Foster home in  Kansas City. And yes bio-mom is pregnant again and due next month and since she lives in the county she does they will probably take it from her at birth in the hospital. Does this sound fair no but it's how things are done here in Kansas.  Our system here needs major tweaking. I remain a Resource Parent so I can advocate for the children in my home and also their parents and help them get their children back. I also have promised the over 60 children that I have had in my home that I will help change the system and change it for the better. We need a major over-haul  in the Foster Care system in KANSAS.  PLEASE INVESTIGATE THIS FURTHER>>>>>>>>>>>>

You are a good "egg" due to the fact that even though you yourself are a foster parent, you are for the biological mother (and/or father) eventually getting the children back together with their biological parents.There are some foster parents who wish only bad things for the biological parents because they are not only getting governmental monies for these children, but because some of them cannot have children of their own and only want to rip the children away from the real parents permanently.  Only people like you should be allowed to care for foster children because you realize it's only a temporary situation in order to give the real parents a chance to rehabilitate their lives.  KUDOS TO YOU! You are a truly a hero to a child in the "system." Congratulations!

 
January 24, 2009, 6:42 pm CST

Abuse of power--

Quote From: tricec

My daughter had my grand-daughter taken from her on the day she was born.  I have every since been trying to get custody of my grand-daughter and has had every attempt blocked by the CPS worker.  My grand-daughter was placed with a 4th cousin who happens to look more like my grand-daughter then I do.  And has said that the CPS worker is doing everything she could to make sure that my grand-daughter stay with my cousin then to be with me.  She and the 4th cousin has gone so far as lied about me just to make sure that I don't get custody of my grand-daughter.  It does happen that when the workers make up their mind about the situation that they do all that they can to make sure it stays the way that it is, even if it is not in the best interest for the children.

There are some people that, if given an ounce of decision-making power, will take it to extremes and abuse that power.  Who they think they are is beyond me but the bottom line is that each state has to take responsibility for who they hire and if there is any type of a power struggle, they should be instantly removed from their positions.  People talk and people file complaints.  When this happens, the state should not turn a blind eye and should take action.  LET'S FACE IT, CHILD PROTECTIVE SERVICES AND THEIR EMPLOYEES DO AS THEY PLEASE, WHETHER THERE IS GROUND TO DO SO OR NOT... THAT'S THE WAY IT IS IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.  TOO BAD!!!!
 
January 24, 2009, 7:14 pm CST

01/23 Behind the Headlines

being a resident of kansas and listening and learniong about this poor boy's life it just makes me sad and mad that it took ten years before he was noticed gone. what ever happened to him is just wrong, not only did his adoptive parents let him down but the state of kansas did also. look it up, kansas is one of the worst states for child neglect cases getting either put on the back burner or not enough case workers to handle the cases. but you know there were enough red flags before he dissapeared for something to be done to protect him. whether he had issues with running away or not you DO NOT DO ANYTHING WHEN YOU SEE A CHILD CHAINED TO A BATHTUB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THAT IS SO WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.I really hope that maybe he is alive and just to afraid to come in, but if not i hope who ever is responsible gets what they have coming to them.
 
January 24, 2009, 7:25 pm CST

What's With Nancy Grace (and Ann Coulter)???

Dr. Phil...I am not someone who tends to write on TV show message boards. But in the last week you have allowed not only Ann Coulter run her mouth on your show (quite unchecked and I'm sure you looked a tad smug at some of her comments), you introduce Nancy Grace as one of the top legal commentators. EVERYONE knows Nancy Grace is a joke! You are turning your show into the equivalent of a tabloid. These people are not experts on anything. Such a dreadful and horrific story about that poor child was tainted with Nancy Grace's quavering voice (do NOT try and convince me that was sincere) and her over the top affectations made the importance of the story drift - and become more about what NANCY GRACE felt about it. Typical Nancy Grace. Just as with Ann Coulter, the show became about Ann Coulter and her extremist views. Any more of these kind of 'experts' and I'm going to think the real ones won't go on your show. And if they won't...why should I watch?
 
January 24, 2009, 8:12 pm CST

The states fault

My children were in states custody out here in Kansas also. Thankfully I got my kids back. But trust me when I say that they find some funky reasons to take kids away. My kids got taken because my Mom had to take my daughter to the ER cause she fell off her bike and broke her arm and they took them because I didn't have them in a licensed daycare. So out here you cant have family watch your kids. I know people who have had their rights terminated also for outlandish reasons. But to get back to my point. When I got my kids back my oldest, who had ADHD, came home with a broken leg. Not only was it broken it was a spiral break in her femur. And supposedly Toni and Kent Edmonds, foster parents, were charged and convicted. I was told that they would do jail time. But they never have. I have searched the Kansas Offeneders website and they were never incarserated for abusing my daughter. And they still got to keep custody of their own child. My sister's boys were molested in there foster home too. So my question is what is Kansas going to do to keep our children safe? These kids are getting taken for whatever reasons and then put into foster homes that are just as bad or worse then the origional "situation."
I also know someone who was adopted  and she was taken from her mother because her mom was mentally retarted and had a lot of kids and couldn't take care of them, And her adopted father is abusive and on drugs. How was he even able to become a foster parent let alone an adopted one?
I just hope that they find Adam alive and that Kansas will finally fix their part in this horrible situation.
Also you would think that after the death of Brian Edgar they would of tried to turn there system around and screen these adults better.
Well I just pray that the bad policity will get the ball rolling on what is really going on behind the doors of KVC (Kaw Valley Center) and SRS (Social Rehabilitation Services).
KVC is contacted by the state and SRS to provide foster and adoptive services.
 
January 24, 2009, 8:32 pm CST

Thank You!!!

Quote From: thesystemsuxs

 I have been a foster parent for over 10 years now. When I started they were for the kids and getting families back together. Somewhere along the way it became a business.I have seen and experienced first hand how the workers bully the parents. They make the parents jump through flaming hoops, attend parenting classes,anger management classes, counseling, therapy, family therapy, and set up the visits with their children at the workers convenience And let's not forget court, caseplans, worker/child visits, and worker/ parent visits. So what if the bio-parent has a job. If they miss enough work they will lose their job. And Dr. Phil you are wrong they do pull kids out of the home for bruises and sometimes even less then that. I know of a situation of the house being dirty. And tell that woman that was on your show I had  a bio-dad that had to get a bigger place because his children weren't allowed to share a room because they were 7 & 8 and a boy and girl. So he finally got them back after 2 1/2 years in the system, but only for 30 days if it doesn't work they will put them back in the system. A big majority of these bio-parents are very low functioning or scared out of their wits and want their children back so they do whatever the worker assigned to them tells them to do even if it means setting them up for failure. I know you have a lot of money and pull. I wish you would investigate the SRS, TFI (The Farm Inc. ) ,DCCCA,and other child placing agencies in Kansas. I know you would find things that you would question like I do. I am just a resource parent as they call us now and they do get upset with me a lot so they blow me off. After SRS passed the responsibility of Foster care to the agencies is when all sense of family was lost. And believe me they all stick together.I have complained and turned in workers to the complaint line only to have it trickle back down to the person I complained against and nothing was accomplished. I feel as long as they can keep a child in the system it is job security for them, and nobody questions it. I also know of a boy that is over three years old and has been in the system since 4 months old. The bio-parents still have rights and visits but his half brother was placed back home over 22 months ago, and his full sister is still in a  Foster home in  Kansas City. And yes bio-mom is pregnant again and due next month and since she lives in the county she does they will probably take it from her at birth in the hospital. Does this sound fair no but it's how things are done here in Kansas.  Our system here needs major tweaking. I remain a Resource Parent so I can advocate for the children in my home and also their parents and help them get their children back. I also have promised the over 60 children that I have had in my home that I will help change the system and change it for the better. We need a major over-haul  in the Foster Care system in KANSAS.  PLEASE INVESTIGATE THIS FURTHER>>>>>>>>>>>>
This is one of my points in my personal post. Thankfully you seem like a dedicated foster parent. But being on the other side of you I wonder what all screening did you have to go through to get to be a foster parent? And what else do you think they should do with choosing foster/adoptive parents? And from what I understand Kansas does the three strike thing. You get three terminations and then they automatically take the next child. I am not sure about that and hope to never find out. And you had mentioned the flaming hoops...lol
I had
Couples therapy on Mon.
individual therapy on Tues.
anger management on Wed.
visits on Thus.
parenting classes on Fri.
And I worked.... I had to have a job it was a court order. Even know my husband was working full time and was able to pay the bill alone I still had to work. I was young and I never had a night out because I was always busy.
And they give other court orders too that are just ridiculous... my hubby had to some offenders class that wanted him to admit to abuse or you don't pass. Well my kid wasn't abused. And isn't that a violation of the 5th amendment if that would of been the case? Because this class wasn't confidential. Thankfully our lawyer squashed that court order before it even got started.
And another thing a lot of these families that are dealing with this don't have the money for a real lawyer. They are stuck with the public defenders that don't really care that much. So then these people get stuck with these outlandish orders that are impossible to complete, which warrants termination. I should know. I barely got my kids back. If it wasn't for my Mom passing away they probably wouldn't of given them back.
Please read my post above before you reply to this one. Thank you.
 
January 24, 2009, 8:41 pm CST

In Kansas

Quote From: stitch94

People are very quick to jump on someone for NOT doing anything.  Morally, yes ADAM should have been helped immediately, social service called.  BUT how many people see domestic violence happen daily?  I am sure most people - husband yelling at wife in a public place, a child getting spanked - do call the police when you see this happen?  Both examples are exactly the same thing - domestic violence in which child abuse falls under, yet most people will not interfere in either of these situations.  Is it right? Absolutely not.

 

So, before you jump on others for their lack of action, do me a favor, next time you see a child get smacked or spanked in public - CALL THE POLICE right than an there, report the abuse.  Because, hitting anyone is illegal and spanking IS hitting.  Once you take that oath to do that and report ALL abuse you see, than you can critise the lack of action of others.

An opened hand spank on the butt is not abuse! And it is like that in most states. My brother works for Wyandot Center for Mental Health with the children and that is one of the first things that they learned in training. Most of the kids have serious mental problems which result in them lying and overexagarating. He was told that if a kid tells him that they are being beat, to ask for details. And that if the child says that it is open hand on the butt that its okay. They are allowed to do that. And to be honest I have to agree. Until you have a child with a disorder that causes them to act out constantly even with meds and nothing else works as disapline you need to resort to physcial disapline. As long as it is controled and not out of anger I don't see what the problem is.
So yes if you see a child getting abused call the police. Just make sure it is abuse. Because spanking is not abuse!!!!
 
January 24, 2009, 8:46 pm CST

try this

Quote From: shaylf4

I have 3 children and my ex husband and I got divorced when my youngest was 9 months old he remarried and told the judge that he had a job making over $40,000.00 a year and showed pictures of a house that he said they would live in if he got custody and got to move to AZ. well his now ex wife is willing to tell the truth that it was all a lie! I got my kids taken from me because I was in college! My 11 yr old tells me that her daddy has a grlfrnd 19 who he pays more attention to and that she has to take care of her brother and sister. I call child services they don't check up on anything! I called the police they don't do anything. I have been to court 3 times and the judge takes his side because he goes into a neighborhood and takes photos of a house that he says he lives in but really does not. What else really is there for me to do??? So when you easly say the police or child services will do something I don't know what I am doing wrong then!

Because in reality it is not all that simple!

go onto google and put in his address and look at the map. they have this new thing where you can see a street view as long as its in a larger city.
Print the pics and take them to the judge. Also you could hire a PI to take pics of the house. Or if you could see pics that he is giving the judge you could use that address and google search the owners on a reverse look up and then call them and ask them if they know your ex.  If you can get a resess during the procedings to do this you could get him on pergery. Also you can have his ex testify for you.
 
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