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Topic : 12/19 The Honeymoon's Over!

Number of Replies: 245
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Created on : Friday, September 23, 2005, 04:41:13 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

(Original Airdate: 09/26/05) One in 12 couples call it quits within 24 months of tying the knot. Dr. Phil's guests haven't even been married a year, and they already want to pull off their wedding bands and end their marriage! Did they know each other well enough before they said "I do"? Shamika says she wants to be treated like a southern belle, but her husband, Marlon, says she needs to get off her pedestal. Is Shamika asking too much? Plus, Miranda and Donny say the honeymoon was over before their suitcases were unpacked. So why is Miranda desperate to get pregnant, and should they have gotten married in the first place? Tune in for what you need to consider before making a lifetime commitment. Share your thoughts here.

 

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upset
September 27, 2005, 11:39 am PDT

Run Donny Run!

 
Miranda is a narcissist.

Narcissisism is a personality disorder that is extremely difficult to have a fufilling relationship with.

Narcissists cannot love you. They see other people as objects. Literally.

They do, say, and act any way they can to get whatever it is they want from you. When they stop getting it, they throw you away.

My heart is breaking for you.

All you want is your wife to love you, care for you, and share with you.

Miranda is incapable of seeing you as a person. Only as an object to serve her needs.

If Miranda had a washing machine that washed her clothes, she would keep it. It is doing what she wants.Washing her clothes. If  the washing machine stopped working she would throw it out and get a new one.
You are a washing machine to her. When you ask for love, attention, affection, you are no longer doing what she wants. And she will disgard you. She won't even give it a second thought. Do you think she thinks about how the washing machine feels when it's broken?Thrown away? Nope. She just simply gets a new one.

You said on the show that Miranda told you about all the men who treated her SOOOO badly and never loved her. THAT was a HUGE red flag to me.

You also said she lies and lies and lies. Ever think maybe some of those men who treated her so badly, really did love her, and SHE was the one who discarded THEM? Maybe the men treating her badly WAS JUST ANOTHER LIE?

Loving a narcissist is a horrible lonely life. You do not matter. You needs are unimportant. Everything focuses only on them. And they never ever tell the truth. They spin lies so fast, and most of the time lies that don't make any sense at all..but that come at you so fast and furious, you start to question you own sanity. You love them, you want what they say to you to be true....it's a very hard situation to be in.

She was completely cold and evil to you on the show, and the only time she became upset was when she had to admit she said she was upset about sex before marriage, but she had slept with 40 men.....(????) She was upset for herself.  Notice sleeping with 40 men and being upset about sex before marriage do not go together? it is illogical. But logic is not a concern of the narcissist.

She cried for herself.
Another HUGE RED FLAG was when she said she never told you about her past was because that is not who she is now...... Narcissists re-invent themselves regularly. They paint their own picture of who they think you need to see to be able to give them what they want. They have no grounding in reality. They make thier own fantasy world in which to live.

The woman you fell in love with never existed. She was only an illusion created to get from you what she wanted.

These are all very difficult things for you to read, I'm sure.

I'm sure your thinking this is not my Miranda, but I urge you to read more about narcissism, and see if others experiences are simular to yours.

Try this group: narcissistic personality disorder on msn groups. or google narcissistic personality disorder.

Please take care of yourself, and I wish you the best,

From someone who has been there,

Christine







 
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September 27, 2005, 12:37 pm PDT

You make total sense!

Quote From: wubba1108

Ironically, I missed this episode live because my husband and I were traveling back from a friend's wedding.  But, my trusty Tivo managed to record it and I watched it yesterday while folding laundry w/ my DH. 

  

I was absolutely dumbfounded.  Are these people just stupid or off in la-la-land??? 

  

What part of "LIFE LONG COMMITMENT" do they not get?  'Cause that's what marriage is, folks.  A life long commitment.  And when you talk about something that long term, how can you possibly EXPECT that there won't be any potholes along the way???  Who EVER said that marriage is fairy tale???  **looking around** Anyone?  I didn't think so. 

  

My DH & I have been together for 6 years, married for almost 2.  As much as I loved him, I was never so blind as to NOT have absorb what the term "LIFE LONG COMMITMENT" was actually going to mean in my life.  I wasn't so obliviously that I didn't recognize that MARRIAGE is suppose to be UNTIL DEATH DO YOU PART. 

  

And because of that, I can't imagine having entered into that kind of agreement without making darn sure that I knew exactly what I was getting into.  And my DH felt the same.  Regardless of how much we loved each other, we were cautious.  Neither one of us wanted to be one of those people that jumps into something we didn't understand, only to fail.  Just thinking of what the wedding alone was going to cost, the cost for our guests to attend, the cost of gifts, showers, etc.  Neither one of us was willing to put our families through that unless we knew darn well that we were a successful match. 

  

We talked about EVERYTHING.  Our expectations, what we envisioned our roles being in our marriage, where we wanted to live, whether or not we were both willing to relocate for career advancement, how we would handle inlaws, how many children we wanted, WHEN we would both be comfortable bringing children into this world, our financial status, how we wanted to handle our finances, the division of labor in the home, the personal dreams we each still wanted to fulfill, EVERYTHING.  And when all those talks were concluded and we found that we were on the same page then and ONLY then did we decide that we were right for each other and right for marriage. 

  

'Cause at the end of the day, love isn't enough.  Not in marriage.  No way, no how.  It takes more than that.  It takes hanging on when the going gets tough, KNOWING how to work as a TEAM, putting your spouse (sometimes) before yourself, respect, and commitment. 

  

I love my DH more than anything in the entire world.  We have our ups and downs but 95% of the time, we have a great relationship and a peaceful household.  Yet, as much as I love him.  As much as I would do anything for him, there is no way in heck I would've walked down that aisle not really knowing who he was as a person and what our life would be like. 

  

No wonder the divorce rate is so high in this country.  Those had to be the 4 most clueless people I've ever witnessed on tv.  I wish them all the best and hope things work out for them.  But for God's sake, slow the heck down and think things through before you go jumping into life changing decisions! 

Thank you for saying what is so logical.  That you HAVE to discuss everything you possibly can think of BEFORE you marry!   You are so right - at the end of the day, LOVE is just not enought.  No way.   

  

Marriage is more about love.  You HAVE to be on the "same page" and everything HAS to be discussed.  You have to know if you can live with the differences.  Yes, TEAMwork, TEAMwork, TEAMwork.   

  

You two were brave enought to discuss things that so many others are just too afraid to bring up BEFORE the marriage.  I made that mistake many years ago when I got married.  I wanted him - he was SO attractive and everyone thought I was SO lucky to "have" this very outgoing, funny, life-of-the-party attractive, athlectic man.  People were jealous of me.  I got off on that.  I felt great.    

  

 I was just too afraid to bring up the dirty business of ASKING about his ideas about how we would share money (if he even wanted to) or if he ever wanted to own a house, and where we would live, relocation?, what household chores he should do, and which I should, and even if he wanted children, and how many, did he expect me to quit my job if we had a baby?  We discussed nothing!!!   How insane.   

  

I was shocked just before the wedding when he told me he would not go to the bank to open any joint checking account with me, he did not want to move away to our own apartment, rather he wanted to live in the townhouse I was renting with two other roomates ( because it was cheap with the other roomates, and spacioius and new and had a driveway & a garage and small yard).  We got into a huge argument when I "forced" him to pay for half of a new queen-size mattress I said we had to have if we were going to sleep together.  He also announced that he would continue going out to clubs and strip joints every Friday night with all his single guy friends.  It turns out my ex husband was an alcoholic.  I found out after we were married.  He got a second DWI after we were married.   HA!  He had to pay all the fines & his attorney fees with his own checking account money.  

  

Anyway, we discussed NOTHING.  What a big mistake.  We divorced, of course.  After a year.  I learned a VERY VALUABLE LESSON.  

  

Now, the man I live with is technicaly really only my roomate.  It's MY house and I have nothing at all to lose, as I own everything.   I can tell him to leave anytime I want.   For now, I want him to stay and pay me the rent.  So it's OK.    I know in my heart that I could never marry this man.  I will now listen to the warning signs I feel inside!    

  

Marriage is great when it WORKS - and you seem to have gotten it right!!!   Congratulations!    

  

 
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quiet
September 27, 2005, 12:41 pm PDT

My relationship

I saw this show and it remined  me of my relationship with my man (we are not married).   We have been together for a year and a half and we are in the midst of working on our relationship.    My boyfriend and I are JUST like this couple.    I want to feel appreciated as well as does my boyfriend but sometimes he does things that drive me absolutely bonkers.    I love him dearly, am very attracted to him sexually, but he drives me crazy sometimes.   I am not trying to be selfish but my boyfriend does not hardly do anything for me.    I just want to feel that he loves me and appreciates me.   The more and more he does nothing, the more and more I am pulling away and I don't want to do that.   I know he probably feels the same way about not being appreciated but in the beginning of our relationship and up until months ago, I was buying him things, treating him when we go out, just plain showing him how I appreciate him.  What do I get - NOTHING.    I don't think guys realize that they have to pamper their woman (or wife).   If they do, you will be amazed at what you see in return.   Women are natural born nuturers.   I believe for the most part  that people put up expectations and sometimes we are so selfish that that gets in between relationships because we want to protect ourselves and don't want that other person to hurt us (wife, husband or otherwise).    What hit me most was, Dr. Phil said, "you need to be friends first" and that is so true.   Sometimes people rush into relationships too fast and don't become good friends first.   Best of luck to this couple.  
 
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September 27, 2005, 12:47 pm PDT

Easier not to even BE married

Don't get me wrong, folks, marriage is WONDERFUL when done correctly - when it's done RIGHT.  

  

When you discuss everything in the world BEFORE you go "into business together" which is what marriage really is.  A partnership, just like a business.  The difference being, of course, love.  But love is not enough!   If all you have is love, then dating each other while leading seperate lives will work.  But marriage will not.   

  

I think pre-marital counseling should be FORCED, MANDATORY for everyone applying to get married.  That way, someone asks the hard questions that the man & woman are afraid to ask each other and did not even think to ask.  Only the Catholics require those classes if you choose to get married in their church.  A real shame there is no such counseling available either free or very low cost for EVERYONE, regardless of where they want to get married.    There would be fewer marriages in our country, and also fewer divorces.   

  

Maybe I'm bitter from my past.  I can't imagine any man coming into my life that I would TRUST completly to hand over my life to - to trust that any life-altering decisions (marriage! )  I make because of him would not, could not, destroy the rest of my life and my young sons' life.   

  

  

 

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September 27, 2005, 12:54 pm PDT

09/26 The Honeymoon's Over!

Quote From: sierraz36

 
Miranda is a narcissist.

Narcissisism is a personality disorder that is extremely difficult to have a fufilling relationship with.

Narcissists cannot love you. They see other people as objects. Literally.

They do, say, and act any way they can to get whatever it is they want from you. When they stop getting it, they throw you away.

My heart is breaking for you.

All you want is your wife to love you, care for you, and share with you.

Miranda is incapable of seeing you as a person. Only as an object to serve her needs.

If Miranda had a washing machine that washed her clothes, she would keep it. It is doing what she wants.Washing her clothes. If  the washing machine stopped working she would throw it out and get a new one.
You are a washing machine to her. When you ask for love, attention, affection, you are no longer doing what she wants. And she will disgard you. She won't even give it a second thought. Do you think she thinks about how the washing machine feels when it's broken?Thrown away? Nope. She just simply gets a new one.

You said on the show that Miranda told you about all the men who treated her SOOOO badly and never loved her. THAT was a HUGE red flag to me.

You also said she lies and lies and lies. Ever think maybe some of those men who treated her so badly, really did love her, and SHE was the one who discarded THEM? Maybe the men treating her badly WAS JUST ANOTHER LIE?

Loving a narcissist is a horrible lonely life. You do not matter. You needs are unimportant. Everything focuses only on them. And they never ever tell the truth. They spin lies so fast, and most of the time lies that don't make any sense at all..but that come at you so fast and furious, you start to question you own sanity. You love them, you want what they say to you to be true....it's a very hard situation to be in.

She was completely cold and evil to you on the show, and the only time she became upset was when she had to admit she said she was upset about sex before marriage, but she had slept with 40 men.....(????) She was upset for herself.  Notice sleeping with 40 men and being upset about sex before marriage do not go together? it is illogical. But logic is not a concern of the narcissist.

She cried for herself.
Another HUGE RED FLAG was when she said she never told you about her past was because that is not who she is now...... Narcissists re-invent themselves regularly. They paint their own picture of who they think you need to see to be able to give them what they want. They have no grounding in reality. They make thier own fantasy world in which to live.

The woman you fell in love with never existed. She was only an illusion created to get from you what she wanted.

These are all very difficult things for you to read, I'm sure.

I'm sure your thinking this is not my Miranda, but I urge you to read more about narcissism, and see if others experiences are simular to yours.

Try this group: narcissistic personality disorder on msn groups. or google narcissistic personality disorder.

Please take care of yourself, and I wish you the best,

From someone who has been there,

Christine







I think she would be bordering on being a sociopath since she wants to bring a baby into to mix!!!!  she is a selfish little girl who has no business being married.  She married because he was the only fool to ask.  The 40 others were "smart" enough to see her for what she really is.
 
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frustrated
September 27, 2005, 5:08 pm PDT

Affirmation

I would like to thank Miranda for re-affirming my belief in the women of today!  Her husband should cut his losses now, line her up on the 20 yard line and punt her through the goal post of divorce court.  Then he can make money, rent love and be happy, for the rest of his life!  Er,, see my other posts in other message threads!   Take care....Voidheart. 

 
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September 27, 2005, 5:56 pm PDT

Til death do us part? Nahh!

 What can you really expect from a culture or generation of single/divorced parents who replace the old fashioned "til death do us part" with  nonsense like "For as long as we continue to love each other" and "For as long as our love shall last" and my personal favorite, "Until our time together is over."  (RETCH!!! GAG!!!!)

Children today will probably never know an intact, two-parent functioning home.  What a selfish, self-centered, spoiled society we've chosen to become. Those silly people on the show were so immature it was pathetic!
 
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September 27, 2005, 6:16 pm PDT

Till Death do us Part

Quote From: falucchi

 What can you really expect from a culture or generation of single/divorced parents who replace the old fashioned "til death do us part" with  nonsense like "For as long as we continue to love each other" and "For as long as our love shall last" and my personal favorite, "Until our time together is over."  (RETCH!!! GAG!!!!)

Children today will probably never know an intact, two-parent functioning home.  What a selfish, self-centered, spoiled society we've chosen to become. Those silly people on the show were so immature it was pathetic!
The problem with your thinking is:  If they came to you instead of Dr. Phil for advice:  You would say:  You are both selfish and you need to work it out :  "Till death do us part."  And you would make Donny feel alot of guilt for Miranda's faults.  And Miranda would continue to mistreat Donny and get away with it.  And you would be happy because Donny and Miranda remain together because you don't believe in divorce.  But you don't live at their house so you don't have to put up with any of the #$%^&*&.  And things would SEEM right from the outside looking in, but on the inside there would be alot of heartache.  But you don't care cuz it doesn't touch you or anyone related to you.  or you won't care until it touches you or someone related to you.  Now following Dr. Phil's suggestion maybe it will make Miranda realize that she can't treat a guy like this and if she wants to keep a guy she needs to change.  Sometimes people need to lose something in order to change on the inside.   But in theory:  Till Death do us part is a good goal.
 
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September 27, 2005, 6:33 pm PDT

Gift Ideas for Ladies

I think this would be a good show idea..... Robin always does a great job when she helps out with these types of shows.....   WHY do guys think that tires? timing belt for a car?  motor oil?  and CAR ACCESSORIES are GREAT GIFTS?  Probably because that is what they want themselves....
**SIGH**  We WOMEN HATE THOSE GIFTS.  I MEAN HATE THEM!  Now don't get me wrong, I like when my car is cleaned and maintained and I appreciate it.  BUT PLEASE DON'T CONSIDER THAT A BIRTHDAY OR MOTHER'S DAY OR CHRISTMAS GIFT!  HELLO?   Good Gift Ideas for Ladies include any of the ones Robin suggested on prior shows or simple, cheap ideas would be would what Marlon wanted FOR HIMSELF:  balloon, card, also flowers, picture frames, scented candles, ANYTHING CUTE. (not practical)  THINK IN TERMS OF CUTE and SWEET!  ok?
 
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September 27, 2005, 7:04 pm PDT

8 month marriage

 trying to find some insight at what people think about this situation.  i am a thirty two years old professional with my own company and real-estate investor. my ex-wife spent one year planning this 60k wedding which i was not even involved in.  after we were married things hit bottom.  she would push my buttons as far as i could be pushed.  arguments would last for about 30 minutes about plants, rocks cleaning etc... she would go on forever.  i would start out by saying please stop! please stop!  it would never stop she pushed me into screaming matches over nothing.  after 4 months of her telling me that i am abusive physically or verbally.  how many times can I get in my car and drive around for a hour or two to cool off and come home to the same argument it would never die.  she would wake me up from a dead sleep to tell me i am mentally ill or some other nonsense i was doing nothing wrong when i was sleeping.  my ex also complained that all i cared about is money which is totally untrue and that she never wanted these elaborate houses or cars etc... after five months was pressuring me to put her on title of my properties in case i die  three weeks later she left me and i was served divorce papers saying she wants half??  go figure she never wanted money??  also we have been apart for three months and she has not called me once
 
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