Quote From: wasthere2You say this is the kind of proof you are looking for:
1) Photo’s picturing the “abuse”
http://www.xfamily.org/index.php/Image:My_flirty_fish_pg_3.jpg (I direct your attention especially at the photo in the bottom left-hand corner)
2) Video showing the “abuse”
I point you to the numerous videos of children who did the nude dances for Berg.
3) Audio playing sounds of the “abuse”
I refer you to the audio recording of The Last State which was transcribed and published
4) Literature/E-mail having to do with the “abuse” (a) As in a document written by the accused to someone else, telling of the “abusive” act. (b) Or a diary written by the accused stating the act of “abuse”
Got that too. There are a number of FSMs and Q&A letters on that one.
5) Witnesses who physically witnessed the “abuse”
Got plenty of those. Count me as one of them.
6) Physical marks on victim showing “abuse” and proof that the marks are indeed directly connected with the “abusive” behavior
You really think those kinds of bruises last 20 years?
In number 5 you indicate that oral testimony counts as evidence. Why do you think this does not apply to the victim of abuse? Did you know that in a court of law oral evidence IS evidence? Many of the ex-SGAs are lawyers you could run circles around you when it comes to the law. Trust me, you don't want to get into that with them.
You say The Family has always been found "not guilty". It seems abvious that you have not read the Judgement of Lord Justice Ward in its entirety. http://www.xfamily.org/index.php/Complete_Judgment_of_Lord_Justice_Ward
In it He give the most comprehensive outline of The Family's History to date. His judgement: "I accept the generality of the evidence presented to me that there was widespread activity of that kind (sex with minors) to an extent significantly greater than would take place between children and between teenagers outside The Family. "
The are also at least 2 courtcases that I know of (one in France, the other in the US) in which Family members were found guilty. But Maria and Peter don't publish that kind of news to their Members.
I'm not sure if you think I'm stupid, but all the stuff you reccomemnded we do when it comes to forgiveness and getting rid of our bitterness: I've done that. Now I'm in the final stage in which I seek justice for myself and those of my peers who were abused.
You may not realize this but you are doing some serious projecting onto the ex-members. Are you familiar with that concept?
You seem very disconnected with the feelings of the victims of abuse. You seem to think that they have not considered all of the things you mention. But don't worry about it. I used to be as naive as you. I used to wonder why on earth anyone would say abuse occured in the Family. I used to reason with myself that the experiences I had were not abusive. In fact, were I still in The Family, I can see myself writing a post similar to your own. I have hope that you'll see it differently some day. I never thought I would. I swore I would stay in the Family for the rest of my life. And yet, here I am.
Loecon, here's where what you write just doesn't add up. You say that you are truly sorry for the pain that the vicitms of abuse feel, and yet you place all of your references to abuse in quotes, as if you don't really consider them abused. You act as if you don't believe a word of what the abuse victims say. Your post is blatantly two-faced. So which is it? Do you believe they were abused or do you not?
(Original Air Date: 10/03/05) Imagine growing up in a cult where you are forced to have sex with strangers -- when you’re as young as 5. Dr. Phil talks to people who escaped the group known as the Children of God, and need help moving on. Meet a daughter who says she can’t forgive her father for the years of painful abuse she suffered at the hands of this cult. How can she reconnect with her dad and start trusting again? Plus, China and her husband, John, are building a new life after leaving the group, where they were forced to have sex with strangers when they were both underage. They’ve had a difficult time adjusting to the outside world, and China wonders if she should prosecute her parents for abuse. What does Dr. Phil think? Talk about the show here.
