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Topic : 10/07 The Latest Debates

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Created on : Friday, September 30, 2005, 03:40:18 pm

Author : DrPhilBoard1

Dr. Phil and his guests strike up heated conversations as they debate the latest hot topics. Should women give up their right to breastfeed their babies in public so other people don't feel uncomfortable? Will passing out condoms in schools prevent unwanted pregnancies or just send the message to kids that it's OK to have sex? And, is it acceptable for others to discipline your kids if they see them acting out in public, or should they just mind their own business? Dr. Phil weighs in on these controversial subjects. Share your thoughts, join the discussion.

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pregodego2

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October 8, 2005, 12:40 pm PDT

10/07 The Latest Debates

honestly, i get commended constantly by those around me on how well i can feed and cover up and do other things at the same time. i am modest, but i am NOT modest about the fact of BFing. i don't hide the fact that im feeding, i just respect those around me and cover myself. christian can eat just as much and just as comfortably when covered then when not. maybe all children aren't like this, but for us it works and i have never gotten "looks" although im not really paying any attention anyways. i wear it proud that i am giving my child the best. BFing is something that intimidates alot of woman (this is a sad fact) and so i am very proud to have the strength and supply to do this for my son. it is the best and IMO, if you have the ability and supply, there is NO other choice. nursing in public is a must. WE eat in public, children drink bottles in public...eating is natural, so why is the ONE THING that is MOST natural in our present day society where there are people filling up on fattening greasey unhealthily cooked processed foods (that aren't natural in any way), looked down upon by some? you don't see or hear BFing moms going around complaining they don't want formula feeding moms to feed in public anymore cause it isn't what they believe in...so why is it the other way around. basically because people aren't looking at the simple fact that this is a child's food, instead they are looking at it in a sexual way....pathetic.

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jax3303

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October 8, 2005, 12:42 pm PDT

Breastfeeding in public

The way I see it, if you or I can eat in public, then so can my child. If bottle feeding is allowed in public, then so should breastfeeding. I'd rather see a breastfeeding mother over a formula feeding mother any day. At least with a breastfeeding mother, you know that baby is getting the best food possible, and not some artificial junk. (yes, MY PERSONAL OPINION is that formula is junk). People see more breast from a random woman wearing a low cut top in the mall than you do seeing me breastfeed my daughter. If you dont like a woman breastfeeding in public, don't look. Nobody is forcing you to stare at my child eating.

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sunshine80

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October 8, 2005, 12:45 pm PDT

You made an intelligent decision!

Quote From: migal2127

As a formal teen of the generation, i am surprised that so many people have said NO to schools giving out condoms and them giving the wrong message. I think it's a good idea. i un-like most teens watch Dr. Phil almost daily. i have a health class in school right now, and yeah sure they did hand out condoms ONE time but that doesn't mean that everyone takes one. i didn't because i believe that pre-marital sex is wrong. sex should happen after marriage. the school is not telling you to have sex, their telling you that if you are going to have sex that you need to know what the consequences can be and that you need protection not only so the female won't get pregnant but also so that you won't get an STD. so i have to say that their NOT giving the wrong message and that they should give them out, because not every parent informs their kids on STD's and protection. they always tell us that the only 100% effective way not to get pregnant, or get an STD is to not have sex, and i have to say i'm disappointed that people think that all teens will take the condoms and have sex because that's NOT me. pre-marital sex is wrong, but educating kids on the subject is right.

Good for you! I am not that old YET LOL, and I am a mom, too. I really very much respect your decision to wait until you are married to have sex. It certainly seems that you looked at all of the information, thought things through and decided that abstinence was best. I think that this is the best possible scenario, because the topic was totally demystified and it was presented in a factual light. In my experience, if you make decisions based on someone else's views (it's dirty/bad/wrong or "we'll kick you out of the house if you are having sex/being a slut!") it is hard for a person to really own that decision. When you look at something from an intellectual standpoint , assess the facts and decide that this is what I am doing for ME, then it's a personal and powerful tool. I know that when my children come of the age when they need to be educated about sex, I want them to be given all of the information, so that they have a better chance at making the right decision. Whether or not to have sex is an adult decision, so it needs to be dealt with in an adult-like manner. I am really proud of you for showing such stellar maturity and also for having the sense to talk about it. Thank you and keep up the good work!

~Sunshine~

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eyancey

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October 8, 2005, 12:48 pm PDT

10/07 The Latest Debates

I am a new mom breastfeeding my 11 week old son. While I think it is my right to fulfill my child's needs, I realize that some people may be uncomfortable with me breastfeeding in public, so I either do it discreetly with a blanket or remove myself from the situation. Both women in this debate were so strongly intrenched in their position that I don't think they would ever compromise. What the woman needs to realize, that was so against breastfeeding in public, is that her disgust with it is her issue, and to suggest that someone should feed their child in the restroom is ridiculous. New moms already feel isolated enough. Whether it is attractive or not, feeding your child from the breast or the bottle is necessary. To banish breastfeeding mothers to another room or from public, will lead more women to choose not to breastfeed or do so for only a short period of time. Breastmilk is the best for new babies, and provides not only nutrition for the baby, but encourages bonds between mother and baby.

In response to the condoms in school debate, I don't know what the issue is. I'm 31 years old, and when I was in high school a condom machine was put into a bathroom at my school. It was controversial at the time, but that was fifteen years ago. I think we need to lighten up on this subject. Condoms are not necessarily going to encourage sexual activity at an early age. I had access to them, but I still waited till I was 25 to have sex for the first time. Having said that, I think knowing that I could have access to them, made me feel like sex was not a taboo thing, that I could talk to counsellors, friends and my parents about it. When you make something forbidden, it only makes people, especially teenagers, want it more. Having access to condoms, along with education, only makes our children stronger and more capable of dealing with growing up in a highly sexually charged world.

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sprlact8r

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October 8, 2005, 12:55 pm PDT

Well said

Quote From: jensensmom

     Clearly there is an epidemic in our society that is causing us to view public breast-feeding as wrong, disgusting and inappropriate. It is undoubtedly due to the commercialization of infant formula feeding, an industry which spends countless dollars every year to bombard us with commercial and print ads advocating the use of their formula. This is not surprising nor should it necessarily be suppressed. This is a corporation in the business of making money. However, if we want society’s views on breast-feeding to change so must the culture in which it is suppressed.
   There are two ways in which we can alter our culture’s views on breast-feeding. The first is education. Every ad that exists for formula should be matched by an ad that supports breast-feeding. Media plays a huge part in shaping the views of our society and if we want to change our culture then the media’s view on infant feeding needs to no longer be one sided. There simply do not exist any mainstream ads for breast-feeding. Meanwhile, formula companies are making claims that formula is “as close to breast milk as you can get” which are misleading at best. You simply cannot achieve the benefits of human milk by substituting it with cow’s milk that has been enhanced with vitamins and the like. People need to understand that our children are human babies, not calves which have four stomachs. Breast milk was the designed as the perfect nutrient for infants. Further more, the stigmatization in our society of those who breast-feed for an extended period of time is appalling. The APA recommends breast-feeding for a minimum of one year, the World Health Organization (WHO) says two. Yet, despite this fact, when a child is approaching his/her first birthday and still breast-feeding regularly, the mother is stigmatized for her decision. If she chooses to breast-feeding beyond the first year and comply with the WHO’s recommendations she is ostracized even further. Clearly more education is needed surrounding the benefits of breast-feeding and the implications of not.
   The other key piece of changing society’s views is exposure. We live in a culture that fears the unknown. It is not surprising that when we see a woman breast-feeding our gaze is naturally drawn to it. It is unfamiliar, unknown territory to many Americans. It defies everything the media teaches us about the breast, namely that they serve the sole purpose of being objects of sexuality. If public breast-feeding became common place again than breast-feeding rates would rise tremendously. The APA guidelines for breast-feeding clearly state that one of the current major road blocks to reaching ideal breast-feeding rates is the lack of public approval.
   It is astonishing that formula feeding is so condoned by our society despite the fact that the APA explicitly states that breast-feeding is the preferred method of feeding our infants. If a mother decided not to comply with other APA guidelines she would be counseled by her child’s pediatrician to change her views. Instead, our doctors and hospitals are handing out formula to those who do not wish to breast-feed.
   As a mother I have not only a right but a duty to feed my child when he is hungry and I simply refuse to do that in a restroom. Maybe if restrooms provided a couch or a chair where I could privately breast-feed my child the circumstances would be different but I simply refuse to sit on the toilet or the ground of a dirty restroom to feed my child. What message does that send to my child about the importance of his nutrition? Would you even allow your child to eat his sandwich in the bathroom? Would even consider eating in the bathroom? Somehow our culture has become more comfortable with seeing a 15 month old baby eating french fries and a soda than they are with seeing a 9 month old breast-feeding. I just don’t understand.
   Most mothers are rather discrete in their breast-feeding habits. I have yet to meet a mother who takes off her shirt to expose more than is necessary to feed her child. We often tell mothers to “cover up” with a blanket or a throw. But have you ever tried to eat under a blanket? It is hot, uncomfortable and difficult to breathe. Not to mention the fact that it is terribly rude to the child. We need to remember that infants are little human beings with rights and feelings. To force a child to hide under a blanket or in the bathroom sends the message that there is something inherently wrong with what they are doing. The only way that our society will change is through education and exposure, one mother at a time.

This is intelligently written - thank you!

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gladiw8d

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October 8, 2005, 12:56 pm PDT

broken heart

I came home Friday from a local high school where I gave a message about the character it takes to love someone so much you would not put them at risk --- at risk for stds, at risk for unexpected pregnancy, at risk for emotional or relational consequences. I watched 15,16, and 17 year olds --- boys and girls --- line up to tell me my message changed them, they saw sex in a new way and they wanted to save those wonderful experiences for marriage. 70-80% in each class, day after day....

Then I came home and saw Dr. Phil say, "Abstinence program don't work."

I was broken-hearted that the same person who says, "We teach others how to treat us" doesn't think young people can teach others that they are worth waiting for. The one who says, "Stop giving away your power!" says our kids can't control themselves.

I saw Dr. Phil blithely say, "Comprehensive prgrams have proven the most effective..." If all we care about is that society doesn't have to pay for the "unwanted babies" or the cost of stds, maybe then a condom & a pill would be enough. But sexually active teens are more likely to be depressed, do poorly in school, fail to finish college and to consider suicide.

It's not enough! Because their hearts are WAY more important than their privates.

No 12, 14, or 17 year old is ready for the emotional bonding that comes with sexual intimacy --- most adults aren't even prepared for it! Giving them access to birth control or handing out condoms even with "comprehensive education" will not MAKE them ready!

And what about the conclusive proof that saving sex for marriage is linked to lower divorce rates, greater sexual satisfication and the completetion of higher edcuation.

Abstinence works --- every single time. Maybe not every abstinence PROGRAM works --- but abstinence does. If young people heard messages about their value and how THEY decide how they want to be treated, if we empower them at every level of society to develop the character it takes to make this 100% healthy decision, then we wouldn't have to worry about the ineffectiveness of condoms ---- which according to the 2001 Reoprt from the National Institiues of Health, varies tremendously for different stds, and which Dr. Phill dismissed as "an obscure study."

The problem isn't that the kids "are going to do it anyway" --- the problem is adults, unfortunately now including Dr. Phil, won't give them the chance and the tools to choose a higher standard than previous generations.

I wasn't given those tools and my consequences are permanent --- I'm sterile from multiple infections and openly share with the kids the relational and emotional consequences of aborting the only baby I would have... the difference is someone taught me, I could START OVER. I have lived what I teach. My example proves to students it can be done, and that is is worth the fight.

My heart is broken, Dr. Phil.

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bugz132

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October 8, 2005, 12:58 pm PDT

Have you ever tried pumping breastmilk???

Quote From: worfsmum

First of all you are not in public. You are in your own hospital room. You are also in a room with others like yourself. And my belief is people have a right to do as they see fit in the privacy of their own home, hospital room, etc... I just do not want to see it. Before going out for a trip why can't you pump your breast milk and put it in a bottle. No one gets offended by a baby bottle. I do not care how natural it is, i don't want to see it. Just as masturbation is a healthy normal act, but i wouldn't want to see that either. All we ask is you show some respect when being out in public. Covering up is respectful, but using a bottle with your own milk in it is even better. What is it going to hurt. The baby gets the exact same thing, just in a different manner. A woman's breast will always be viewed by some as a sexual part of the body. Just because you have a baby hanging from it, doesn't change the views. And if you don't want to go somewhere because you do not want to drag other kids with you if they happen to be with you. Then schedule your outings around the baby's' feeding time. I know i certainly would as a matter of respect for others.

I pumped breast milk for an entire year. I did it once a day before bed. In 20 min. I could usually pump 3-4 ounces. This milk was stored for the rare occasions when I would go out without my baby. Pumping is rather painful and tedious. When I went out with my baby I would feed her with my breast. I refused to use the precious small amounts of pumped milk that I was able to get. I don't think a stranger ever saw any part of my breast or niple and no one ever complained. I think viewing a breast as a sexual object is your problem, not mine! As for scheduled feeding times. Not all babies eat on a schedule, especially in the early days!

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kleewalter

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October 8, 2005, 1:00 pm PDT

Not pumped up about pumping....

Quote From: jenmousie

No one gets offended by a baby bottle.

NOT TRUE!!! I get very offended every single time I see a child eating from a bottle. And it isn't the same. I wasn't able to develop a good nursing relationship with my first child, so I pumped and fed her with a bottle. Because she was eating from a bottle she had excess gas, spit-up and ear infections. Nursing at the breast eliminates most of the causes of those problems.

Then schedule your outings around the baby's' feeding time

Because breastmilk is better digested by a child's immature digestive tract it doesn't just sit there like formula. Formula feed babies are easier to "schedule" because they are being given a food that does not digest well and sits in their stomachs for longer because of it. Breast feed babies do eat more frequently and it is impossible to ALWAYS schedule feedings around other activites. Add in to the mix the occassional growth spurt where children demand more feedings for a day or two and you can't know when your child will need to eat next.

The best solution would be for folks to educate themselves about the benefits of feeding at the breast (the breast milk is great, getting it straight from the source is better). That and get over this immature idea that breasts are strictly for sexual pleasure. No wonder half the world thinks we are insane here in the US. Our celebraties can prance around half naked and that doesn't bother us but a woman breastfeeding causes all this debate!

With my last child, I developed mastitis (commonly known as breast milk fever) and was hospitilized. The doctor advised me to pump my breast milk off so that the production would continue, and feed the baby formula until I was off medication and could continue breastfeeding. I bought 3 different kinds of pumps, but was unable to use any of them with much success. I wound up with sore & bleeding nipples, and my milk dried up as a result of no "supply & demand". I had more luck expressing milk in a hot bath than any other way!!

You are right. There are many side effects caused by bottle feeding that do not occur with breast feeding, and pumping does not work for everyone, even though they may try.

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antedote

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October 8, 2005, 1:01 pm PDT

BREASTFEEDING protects aaainst BREAST CANCER!

October is breast cancer awareness month!!! Millions of dollars will be raised to find a cure. TV personalities will talk about the need for education and PREVENTION. What you haven't heard yet, most likely, is that BREASTFEEDING protects against BREAST CANCER!!! The Lancet published the most comprehensive study 3 years ago....For every YEAR that a woman breastfeeds, her risk of BREAST CANCER is REDUCED by 4.7%. The American Academy of Pediatrics and the World Health Organization currently recommend breastfeeding 2 years and beyond. By the time my last baby is weaned, I will have about 9 years of breastfeeding "under my belt." I'll take that protection.

The stigma of breastfeeding in public causes many women to either quit nursing, leave their baby behind, give a bottle of formula or express milk. ALL THESE OPTIONS can disrupt the normal course of breastfeeding!! A missed feeding can trigger the return of menses and the estrogen cycles that come with it. BREAST CANCER feeds on ESTROGEN!!

If you want to fight breast cancer, encourage every mother you know to BREASTFEED for years and support the public breastfeeding mother. She is making the choice for a healthier world and saving your tax dollars as well!!

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megazach

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October 8, 2005, 1:02 pm PDT

10/07 The Latest Debates

Personally, I am offended by seeing bottles in public. Have noticed how much like nipple caricatures those things are like? They look like the comics of women's breasts you'd see in Playboy or something. Disgusting! And the fact that the baby's health is being put at risk *really* puts off my eating.

Okay, that was rather tongue-in-cheek. I have bottle-fed one baby (my first, I wanted to breastfeed and gave up too easily, which I will always regret) and am still breastfeeding my second (although not in public for a long time, as there are even limits to my comfort level), so I have experience doing both. I never had to put a blanket over my daughter's head, my shirt worked just fine. I am a *very* modest person! The first time we went out to eat after she was born, she started fussing, so I took her out to the car. I forgot to take keys with me, so we sat out in an extremely hot vehicle (90+ degrees), because I was too embarrassed to nurse in public. I swore that was the last time I would *ever* do that. I started actually practicing in front of a mirror at home so that I could figure it how to do it without exposing myself. It can be done. And yet, even that wasn't enough! Even covering up with a blanket isn't enough for some people. Just *knowing* there is a baby under there eating offends some people. Trust me, there is nothing sexual going on when a baby is nursing, if that's your worry. If you've ever had a baby suck on your finger, that's about what it feels like.

If we lived in any other time or any other country, this wouldn't be a big deal. Even in extremely conservative Muslum countries, where women have to be covered head to toe, women are allowed to nurse their babies in public! It is understood in those places that breastfeeding is best for their babies and therefore for the nation as a whole, so they make accomodations! Sad that our country, which is supposed to be so reasonable and forward-thinking, can't think more like that about this issue.

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