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Topic : 10/07 The Latest Debates

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Created on : Friday, September 30, 2005, 03:40:18 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

Dr. Phil and his guests strike up heated conversations as they debate the latest hot topics. Should women give up their right to breastfeed their babies in public so other people don't feel uncomfortable? Will passing out condoms in schools prevent unwanted pregnancies or just send the message to kids that it's OK to have sex? And, is it acceptable for others to discipline your kids if they see them acting out in public, or should they just mind their own business? Dr. Phil weighs in on these controversial subjects. Share your thoughts, join the discussion.

 

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October 9, 2005, 9:21 am PDT

10/07 The Latest Debates

Quote From: abstract

How do you know nothing was coming out?  

  

You realize that less than 1% of women worldwide can't breastfeed, right? 

  

If the softspot on his head was sunken in and he had stopped producing wet diapers, then he was malnourished. Otherwise, you were paranoid. 

  

Did you consult with a lactation specialist? How about LLL? Did you try oatmeal, tea and fenugreek? How about Relegan (sp?) Assuming that you really did have a diminished supply, did you use a supplimental nursing system so that whatever milk you produced went directly to your child while they were being supplimented with formula?  

  

Or did you assume you were not making enough, fed formula in a bottle because you didn't know what else to do and then assumed that your children didn't want your breast after that? 

  

You can still breastfeed even if you have to give formula. If you want to breastfeed you shouldn't give bottles because it causes nipple confusion. If you have low supply issues, you need to nurse MORE and not bottle feed. If your kid is malnourished you know because their temples, eyes and soft-spots sink in and they are lethargic and don't urinate... you can boost your supply with an SNS. 

  

There is probably no reason at all why you couldn't have breastfed. It's hard sometimes... but if you had really wanted to, you could have. 

I knew because my breast were engorged and yet nothing came out!!!! Do you not ware breast pads to prevent any leakage? I didn't have to because I did not have any leakage. NOTHING came out! So no I couldn't have even though I really wanted too. The point was is that you shouldn't assume to know everyone's reasons for choosing to bottle or breast feed. Again you assumed to know my reasons and were way off base. If you are able and choose to breast feed then by all means you should. It will benefit you and your child. But if you can't or choose not to breast feed then you and your child can still benefit. I held and bonded with my children during bottle feedings just as if I would have if I were breast feeding. I held them and sang to them just the same. That was a personal choice. Because I do realize that some parents make the choice to bottle feed for the wrong reasons.  

So please tell how you can say in one sentence that less then 1% of women can't breast feed end then say in another sentence that "There is probably no reason at all why you couldn't have breastfed. It's hard sometimes... but if you had really wanted to, you could have." Did it ever occur that just maybe I was part of where research has concluded that 1% figure from? 

 
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upset
October 9, 2005, 9:23 am PDT

are you kidding me?

Quote From: alibuff

Yes, I do know that the worldwide average age of weaning is like 4 yrs old :)  I'm sure the opposers on this message board don't know that though :)  So, thanks for posting that! 

 

AND to use the comparison of a buttcrack showing, urinating or defacating in public, or having sex in public with breastfeeding is beyond absurd.  Like someone else posted, its just a breast, people.  Get over it.  Men go without shirts.  And someone else posted that in Canada, its lawful for women to do the same.  Also, as with most others on here, I have NEVER seen a woman who's NIP baring her breast(s).  NEVER.  And all of my siblings and my sil does it.  Its not about showcasing our wares, its about the child's nutrition and comfort. 

 

I feel exactly the same way, if we normalize NIP, then barely anyone will still be offended by the next generation of breastfeeders.  Its a shame we have to try to hard to come full-circle to what's right and natural. 

is that a picture of a child breastfeeding? i hope not because that's something you should'nt be placing on your computer.feeding in public, i'm okay with but not that!
 

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October 9, 2005, 9:28 am PDT

breastfeeding in public

I was utterly appalled at the utterances of the woman against breastfeeding in public. Recognizing that she is not the only one of the opinion that women should not be allowed to breastfeed in public, it was her so-called reason for being offended: she finds it “unattractive”!!!!! What?! A_MA_ZING! I disagree with all people who are against, but her reason was beyond ridiculous. Ok, next time a fat, sweaty man, crack and back hair showing, slurping his corn chowder as chunks of it stick in his beard, is sitting in the restaurant with me, I’ll bitterly request he be sent to the stall to finish his meal, because I find it “unattractive.”  Oh, wait – he has a right to eat in public! But my babies don’t? Now, before the comments come up about giving them a bottle, guess what? Based on everything I’ve read, breastfeeding is the best choice for the development of my children, and unfortunately those moments will simply not come when it is convenient for every else in the room…especially mom!  Oh, and despite a mom’s best intentions to be discreet with blankets, babies can’t be told not to pull it off because the two-toned hair women is glaring, rather than paying attention to her own meal and her companions. Babies actually have an excuse for their lack of rational thought: they are too young to know the prejudices in our world.  

  

While I’m at it, why is it that smokers are allowed to freely walk downtown shopping districts an outdoor malls, poisoning me and my tiny babies with proven DEADLY second hand smoke, yet some close-minded, repressed, unaware of the rest of the planet individuals are out there thinking I deserve a citation if I FEED MY CHILDREN??? If you want something to be offended by, let’s pick up the topic of people who drive around in their cars, windows up, smoking, with children riding in the back seat. In my opinion, they should be cited for child endangerment. It’s sad to find people adamantly, bitterly complaining about moms NOURISHING their children when there are so many true evils in the world. 

  

To Dr. Phil: I really wished you had taken the time to point out the multitude of studies proving the benefits of breastfeeding. You had this type of info ready for the woman against distributing condoms in school, yet not a word with respect to breastfeeding. It surprised me. Here’s the other thing: as someone who has children, let alone all of your education and experience with family issues, you KNOW that even as discreet as woman may try to be, she doesn’t always have a choice. The breastfeeding mom said that her child pulled the blanket off – in other words, she had tried, and with her child it didn’t work. I’m still pregnant with my twins, and I am willing to bet that in my attempts to get two feeding, inevitably some skin will show – not my intention, but I’m certainly not going to sweat it. My job, my first priority, is to nourish my children – not to worry about what some stranger in the room is thinking. Finally, as entitled to her opinion as she is, I was really surprised that you didn’t call the anti- woman on the fact that the ONLY reason she had for being against it is that she finds it unattractive. I’ve seen you call people on a lot less than that. Have you ever met a woman who is hoping against hope that someone will check her sexy self out as she feeds her child? From what I hear, moms are lucky to get a shower or even find any clothes w/o a stain – attractiveness is just not part of the equation. I find it amazing that breastfeeding women transcend all the pain, bleeding nipples, leaking breasts, lack of sleep, and unending dependence to find the experience unparalleled and beautiful. I can’t wait – honestly. Breastfeeding women deserve respect, not glares and citations.
 

 

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frustrated
October 9, 2005, 9:30 am PDT

Another idea...

Quote From: mama2e

I have an idea for those who don't like to see women nursing in public.  Whenever and wherever you see a nursing woman feeding her child in public, go complain not to the mom but to the manager, supervisor, the most important person you can find.  Tell them how wrong you feel it is, but make sure you tell them that nursing moms should have a separate "mother's" room with rocking chairs, a nice changing table, maybe some soft music playing and a vending machine with soda, coffee, snacks, etc.  A nice massage chair wouldn't be bad either.  Maybe a little play area for the older tots.  If every place I went had something like that, I'd NEVER nurse out in pubice, lol! 

  

Sorry, don't mean to make light of this topic.  But wouldn't you rather nurse in a room like that than out on some bench somewhere getting glared at?  I know I would! 

Here's another idea: how about you complain to no one??? 

Tell someone in charge "how wrong you think it is?"  I still don't understand why nursing in public is anyone else's business.  Does seeing a mother holding her child bother you?  Should we have a separate room for mothers who want to play with their children?  Breastfeeding is just another example of a mother taking care of her baby, and to send a nursing mother to a separate room, away from the public eye, implies that there is something shameful and wrong about breastfeeding.   

I have a friend who formula fed her first son because she had never been exposed to BFing.  Now that she has seen others doing it and is more comfortable with the idea, she is planning to BF her second child.  For that reason, I don't mind nursing "out on some bench somewhere getting glared at!"  I hope that my public nursing makes BFing a more familiar sight to women who might choose to formula feed just because they haven't been exposed to the alternative. 

And let me say for the record, to anyone who doesn't approve of NIP - instead of glaring at me while I'm nursing, please come on over and say something!  I'd love the opportunity to educate you on the advantages of BFing.  Since the mother-child bond clearly isn't enough of a reason to earn your approval of BFing, maybe lower healthcare costs will.  One study found that 50% of infants breastfeeding could save an HMO up to $140,000 annually.  Talk about a benefit for society!! 

  

Hopefully, if more mothers go about their normal lives and feed their babies when and where they are hungry, BFing will become a more normal sight in everyone's lives.  And maybe, just maybe... someone will approach a BFing mother to say "thanks!" 

 
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frustrated
October 9, 2005, 9:30 am PDT

10/07 The Latest Debates

Quote From: moiras

Dr Joy, 

  

It is too my dismay that you practice medicine, and have patients who listen to you.  I have 3 children, age ranges from 11 to 11 months, and not once has a doctor tell me I shouldn't breastfeed in public.  They have all encouraged to feed my child on demand.  I don't flaunt my breast for the whole world to see, but I also don't cover up like I should be ashamed of my act of feeding my child.  I am a nurse, and worked with doctors who encourage woman to breastfeed, not bottle feed for the health and well being of the child. I know in your training your were made aware of the benefits of breastfeeding over bottlefeeding.  I like the woman before me have large breasts, and plan on having breast reduction when I am through breastfeeding my children.  I am not FLAUNTING my breast for sexual pleasure for anyone, I am FEEDING my child.  My 11 yr old daughter thinks it is perfectly natural for me to breastfeed my 11 month old daughter, and is not the least be ashamed that I do it in public.  On occassion while out, she will hand her too me and tell my to feed my daughter.  As a "doctor" do you find this wrong too?  Breastfeeding in public and anywhere else in Texas 

What I would like to know is why you need to show your breast?  The baby is still eating if s/he is covered up.  That's why many people feel that women who just expose their breast while breastfeeding are flaunting themselves.  What I find very funny is that women wouldn't want their children to see bare breasts on television but it's okay to look at them if a child is hanging off of it?  A boob is a boob.  The only difference between the two is that the ones on television look better! *lol* 

  

Amanda 

 
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October 9, 2005, 9:35 am PDT

10/07 The Latest Debates

Quote From: antedote

I too am extremely offended when I see a baby being bottle fed or with a pacifier stuck in its mouth.  I think it is ugly and disgusting. 

It inteferes with how I am trying to raise my children.. to be healthy, to value babies and people, to discern what is true (breasts and mothers arms) and what is fake (bottles, pacifiers, baby swings, car seats as  infant holders). 

If you decide to have a baby....stay home, breastfeed, hold your baby, give of your self to your baby and someday he/she will do the same loving things for you when you are old and can't feed yourself, turn over in bed or even to talk to the person who you are completely in LOVE with and dependent upon. 

  

Hmmm.  What's more disgusting.  A bottle or pacifier or a droopy, saggy, stretchmark covered breast?  There's no competition there.  It's the droopy, saggy, stretchmark covered breast that's disgusting! 

 
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October 9, 2005, 9:36 am PDT

stick a fork in it

Quote From: shellyee

If your child is clever enough to eat your breastmilk with silverware like an adult, by all means......
what if I put my breast on the plate? The baby would be eating off a plate, right? Do you see how silly your"logic" is?
 
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October 9, 2005, 9:42 am PDT

your dogma is fear based....

As a breastfeeding mother I am saddened that this topic is so controversial. The American Academy of Pediatrics suggests breastfeeding for a minimum of one year, 99% of women around the world feed their infants with breastmilk, this is how our bodies were designed. I believe those women who find breastfeeding mothers and babies "unattractive and inappropriate in public" either 1. have no children of their own hence they should not even comment 2. failed at their own attempt to breastfeed 3. breastfeed but are so repressed and confused about their body as a life giving and sustaining vessel and a sexual vessel that they buy into a sexist provencial mentality. These are the same women who can't tolerate the thought of a topess beach or exposed breast in artwork or print ads. I feel sorry for these women who are so unsophisticated and shamed by the strength of the female body. 

Secondly, I am a social worker who has worked in Adolescent Health Clincis and schools x12 years. Those of you who believe abstinence works are incredibly naive. Teenagers are having sex and many of them are not using birth control. I imagine if you sat in on a session with me and the doctors who have to tell teenagers they tested positive for STD's and HIV (this is a weekly occurence for us), you might think handing out condoms is not a big deal. Handing out HIV meds and hospice referrals is more concerning. Remember, in most states, doctors don't have to tell parents that their teenagers are infected with an STD-confidentiality laws protect the teen. I urge you to get with the times and understand our teens need tools to make safe sex choices.. 

 
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October 9, 2005, 9:45 am PDT

10/07 The Latest Debates

I did post earlier but in all fairness I wanted to add that I would be willing to hear the other reasons (there must be more than "it's not flattering, it'sjust not flattering...") so I would love to join Shelly for lunch, I will let her pick the bathroom!!! I will be there!
 
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October 9, 2005, 9:46 am PDT

10/07 The Latest Debates

Quote From: cecep31

I was so bothered by the comments made by Synnora, the breastfeeding mother, I felt obligated to comment. I have 5 children and breastfed every one of them. I have never been asked to leave an establishment nor have I ever been confronted by an individual who thought my behavior was inappropriate. I believe breastfeeding is a very natural thing and it is one of the best things I could do for my children, but I also understand that everyone in this world does not share my beliefs. The bottom line is... as a breastfeeding mother you have the RIGHT to feed your child whenever and wherever you please, but you have an OBLIGATION to use discretion.

Who gets to decide what "discreet" is? It is a subjective term. I don't have an obligation to anyone except the 5 kids I BF. 

  

Also, it is not a belief that breastfeeding is healthy, safe and natural. It is a fact. 

  

Let's not get the BFing mommies fighting with eachother too. 

 
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