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Topic : 06/06 "I'm Gay, OK?"

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Created on : Friday, October 14, 2005, 03:56:41 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

(Original Air Date: 10/19/05) Sexual orientation used to be something kept hidden from family and co-workers, but now more and more people are "coming out" and finding acceptance. Anjela says her mother and sister don't support her sexual orientation, and feel she can't be Christian and gay at the same time. Can they reconcile this touchy issue? Then, two men debate whether a person can go from gay to straight, and parents of a 4-year-old boy fear their son's desire to play with dolls and wear heels means he'll grow up to be gay. Are they overreacting to his wishes to be a princess instead of a prince? Talk about gender and gay issues here.


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October 21, 2005, 12:58 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: momisme2

In the Gospel According To Thomas there is another verson of the Creation story too.    That is one of the texts that got thrown out of the Bible.  If youre interested in it im pretty sure you can read it online.  Pull up the Gnostic Scriptures and you will find a whole mess of books that were written in the same time as the Bible.  (a side note...some are calculated to have been written even closer to the original time of Jesus then the remaining Gospels in the modern day Bible were)  The Gospel According To Thomas will be among those many books. 

  

My personal opinion on why this particular book got tossed is because of the way women are portrayed in it.  In this Gospel, Jesus holds Mary above his male disciples.    Even so much as the men disciples(or apostleswhichever you prefer) were downright pissy and more then a tad jelaous over his sharing information with her that he wouldnt with them.  There are a few verses in there where the disciples go to Jesus angry and basically wanting to know whats up with that.  tehehe   ;) 

  

Just thought I would fill you in in case youre interested in reading other accounts of the story of Creation.  A word of warning though,  I wouldnt reccomend reading this Gospel unless you have an open mind.  If you have never heard of it before it could offend you as it has many versions of  Bible stories with quite a different twist.  However, it does have alot of the same stuff as well.     

 The gospel of Thomas wasn't 'thrown out'.  It was only discovered fairly recently and it never got included for good reason,

Personally, I believe it is a fake.  I have faith in God that the Bible we know is the one that was preserved and is perfect the way it is. 
 
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October 21, 2005, 12:59 pm PDT

Response to your question.

Quote From: rlanthier

What is it about homosexuality , or just consensual sex in general that makes it so terribly evil? Who exactly is being hurt? What and where is the harm?

  

Hello!!!!  

  

  I was reading the message board and came across your question and it is a great one!!!  I hope you don't mind a long and in-depth answer but it is necessary to pay a lot of time and attention to your question in order to give it the answer it deserves.   

  

  To understand what is considered wrong about homosexuality and consensual sex in general, we must examine first who is saying it is wrong and why.  First of all, God, the God of the Bible called Yahweh or YHWH in Hebrew, says that it is wrong.  Because He has said this, people that believe in Him and His Word and follow Him are called Christians and also believe that it is wrong.  The term Christian means Christ-like.  It describes an individual who has given his/her life fully to Christ and declared His lordship over them.  As a result of this declaration, this person's highest life's mission is to become like Christ in his/her inward spiritual condition as well as outward behavior.  Christ lived His life with intergrity, love, genuiness, humility, and kindness.  He stood for both love and justice.  Now with regard to Christians, we must realize that not everyone who says they are a Christian really are.  Not everyone that says they are Christians live their life like Christ did.   And they are the one's that make people who live homosexual lifestyles hate God and what He stands for.  They feel that Christians want to discriminate against them and treat them badly.   

Now, if you've read the Bible, you have found that Christ neither ridiculed nor rejected anyone based on their gender, race, creed, age, or socio-economic status.  As a matter of fact, He came to break the societal and cultural rules set forth by the religious leaders, the Pharasees and Sadusees, who were not really religious and were discriminating against people.  The only time we see Jesus angry (and this anger was righteous) was when He sees the Pharasees and Saducees treat people in this way by twisting God's word to fit their racisms and prejudices!!!  Having said this, if a person claims to be under the Lordship of Christ, he will not do the very thing that Christ himself hated--twisting the word of God to discriminate against people.  Bottom line:  people who have twisted the bible to deny people rights or even kill people cannot, by definition, call themselves Christian!     

 

Why homosexuality is wrong: 

  As far as speaking out against homosexuality... We must first understand who God is before we can understand His rationale for His stance on homosexuality and other things that He says is sinful. 

  

 

  

God is a God of Love!  In fact God is Love (1 John 4th Chap Verse 8).  As much as God is love, God is EQUALLY Just.  That is to say, He is also a God of Justice (Psalms 9th Chapter Verse 16). 

  

 

  

                

  

 

  

If God were only Loving and not Just then He could not be God because He would be unfair.  Because He is loving and loves all His creation equally, He has to be fair in His justice. 

  

 

  

 

  

 

  

Let's Look at His Love:   Because God/Christ/Holy Spirit LOVES His creation so much, he lovingly set forth rules into the universe and in His Holy Word to govern the universe by.  He did this because He knew that there would be things that people would do that would be harmful to themselves and others.  God did not want people to harm themselves and/or others because He is the perfect Father.  Just like any good father and mother sets rules that govern the household in order to protect their babies, toddlers, children, pre-teens, and teenagers from themselves.   As we know from watching good parents structure their households and the legal structure that governs America, rules are good.  We need them for order.   And God is a God of Order.

  

 

  

 

  

 

  

Let's Look at His Justice:  A God of Love that sets forth rules for the benefit of His creation must enforce these rules or the rules don't stand and if they don't stand then they don't protect the people they are intended to protect.  So God has to make sure that the rules are followed and anyone who does not follow the rules have hurt themselves and/or someone else and must be dealt with.  Now all of mankind can identify with God's desire for justice because we follow a legal system that sets up laws and punishes those who do not follow.  For instance, if a person sees a woman on the street and assualts, rapes, and kills her everyone (hopefully) that heard the story would be outraged and cry out for justice.  They would want to see to it that that person be charged and punished for his crime against her.  The family of the woman would particularly feel this way.  Well, God agrees.  He punishes atrocities done to the innocent too.  Now if God were only loving, He would see what happened to the woman and then say, well what the man did was wrong, but because I love him, I'm going to let him go scot free without any consequences to his actions.  Would that be a good God? Of course not because that woman, her family, and the rest of the world needs to know that that kind of behavior will not be tolerated.  Because He loves them He gives justice to the victim and also because He loves the offender, He does not let him get away with his wrong doing because that would not be good for him either.  He would learn nothing and continue to do what he had done and hurt more and more people.

  

 

  

 

  

 

  

 So now we see that God does not advocate people calling themselves Christians and at the same time discriminating against people.  We also see that God is both and equally a Loving God and a Just God.  So we see that He has given us rules that are for our own good.  These rules include the 10 commandments (Deuteronomy 5th Chapter 6th-21 Verses), and other commandments.  Included in the rules is the rule against sexual immorality as defined by looking upon someone with lust, masturbation, pornography, fornication (sex before marriage), adultery (sex with someone other than husband or wife),  homosexuality and even beastiality (having sex with animals).  While this definition may not be exhaustive, these behaviors are considered sin becuase they are committed against one's own body and God created the body as a temple for Himself ( 1 Corinthians Chap. 6 Verses 18-20).    

     The first reason that homosexuality is wrong is because it destroys our relationship with God.  If we are living in sin (homosexuality or any other sin)  we cannot have fellowship and intimacy with God.  So the first person that is being hurt as a result of our sin is ourselves.  No relationship with God means no happiness, no peace, no sense or a false sense of safety and security, continual worry and stress, and eventually death.    The only way for us to avoid these bad things is a relationship with God and He knows that and does NOT want us to have terrible lives so He does not want us living in sin.   

    He also considers sexual immorality sin because it has horrific consequences for the doer and people around him/her.  Lust is disrespectful towards the object of the lust and can be the motivational factors in acts of rape and child molestation.  We know that rape and child molestation hurts and destroys other people and God does not want this.  Masturbation is sinful because it is virtually impossible to masturbate without the element of lust.  Lust hurts you because it breaks your relationship with God, but it can also be harmful in marriage because if a person is being sexually satisfied by someone other than the spouse including himself, it creates feelings of inadequacy and insecurity for the spouse and also leaves the spouse sexually unsatisfied.  As a result, the spouse is likely to cheat (adultery) which is also considered sinful.  Now masturbation that was thought to only affect the person who is masturbated has over time caused the person's spouse to sin by having an affair.  Also, if you think back to your first experience with masturbation I'm sure there were feelings of guilt and/or discomfort after  it was done.  God doesn't want us living in guilt so He doesn't want us living in sin.  Pornography also utilizes lust and masturbation and can have devistating effects on the spouse of the person engaged in pornography.  The person is left feeling betrayed, hurt, angry, and insecure--all of which are damaging to the marriage relationship.  Trust is disolved and the marriage is left in shambles.  Fornication is sinful again because of lust and the misuese of sex.  Sex is beautiful and was given by God as a gift between husband and wife to bond them together and solidify the commitment and emotions within the marriage relationship.  Outside the context of the marriage relationship, sex still has bonding effects, however, it usually only bonds one person to the other and pushes the other person away.  It can be used to manipulate people or to destroy a peson's self worth.  There are terrible consequences for people engaging in the powerful act of sex before marriage and God does not want us to have to deal with them so he tells us not to do it.  Similarly sex with someone other than one's spouse has dire consequences that destroy relationships and God does not want this because he is the universe's Biggest Advocate of Relationships!!!!    

 

  As for homosexuality (men engaging in any sexual activity with men and lesbianism, women having any sexual activity with women)  it is sinful because God created man for woman to be married because God loves marriage and the intimacy it brings.  To be with someone of the same sex is to decide to not have the type of relationship that God has said was good.  As a result of homosexuality in both the early Greek and Roman culture woman were made to be second class citizens and were discriminated against.  It was not God's desire that women be treated this way.  We can still see how homosexuality and lesbianism causes rifts between the sexes.  Feministic lesbians bash men and are disrespectful and mean towards them in the same way that homosexual men of the past were mean and hurtful to women.  So homosexuality causes devision between the sexes, uses lust, masturbation, and pornography, and has broken up marriages after one spouse has found out another has had homosexual or lesbian sex.  When these marriages break up, children are hurt and brokenhearted in the process.  Furthermore, it makes the marriage relationship between a man and woman impossible.  And if a person is in a heterosexual marriage but chooses to engage in homosexual sex, that is still sex outside of marriage (adultery, and we know how hurtful adultery is) and is still sin!  Can you see now why God declares sexual immorality or sex outside of marriage sinful?  Do you see how it hurts people?   Do you see how it hurts God? 

  

This type of behavior hurts God's feelings because His greatest desire is to have an intimate relationship with all of us.  But our sin has broken our relationship with Him. He knows that a relationship with Him through Jesus Christ is the only way for us to break free of these sexual sins as well as any other sin.  Jesus Christ gave His life up so we don't have to continue living frustrated and sad lives as a result of our sin.   If we believe in Him and accept Him as our Lord and Savior and confess our sins He is faithful and just to forgive us and restore us to our right positions in His kingdom.  We will no longer only be His creation but we will be His Children.   

 

  There is a huge debate going on that says that homosexuality has its origin in either nature (biology or genetics) or nurture (learned behavior).  I attest that it is neither!!!  While there are behavioral implications associated with homosexuality ie. having sexual interactions with someone of the same sex, the origins of homosexuality is SPIRITUAL.  It is a spiritual condition that millions of people deal with everyday.  So many people who struggle with homosexuality have been hurt and frustrated in trying to come to terms with what they feel is a part of themselves.  They often go through periods of denial and try to live a life absent of homosexual behavior to no avail.  It is not surprising that people try so hard to stop having homosexual feelings and finally give up and decide to accept the feelings.  The Bible tells us that we have no power over sin and if  homosexuality is a sin then it stands to reason that we have no power over homosexuality.  So it makes no sense to try to stop living a homosexual lifestyle on our own.

  

 

  

 

  

There is still hope!!!  God knew that we could not defeat homosexuality by ourselves and He does not expect us to!  So in the most loving act ever done, He made Himself into flesh, was born of a virgin, and lived a perfect life among us to show us how.  He was Jesus Christ and Christ was God in the flesh.  If that was not enough, he was beaten, brusied, ridiculed, embarrassed, harassed, and ultimately killed so that we no longer have to be slaves to sin (homosexuality).  Guess what?  God knows exactly how each person struggling with homosexuality feels.  He too has been made fun of, been outcasted, talked about, not accepted, and even brutalized.  Even still, He willingly gave His life so that none of us would have to experience the tragedy of a life marred by sin (homosexuality) because it is so painful.   A person struggling in this way and wants to be free must give his life to Christ.  I can tell you exactly how this works but that was not your question and I have written extensively already.  But if you are interested in know how this works and how a person can be free from homosexuality and the pain associated with it, please e mail me or respond to this response.  My e mail address is intense1913@yahoo.com. 

 

  I hope I have illustrated what it is about homosexuality and consensual sex that is "terribly evil", who exactly is being hurt, and where the harm is. 

 

  

 

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October 21, 2005, 12:59 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: mr_lion

My theory is - All humans are born potentially bi-sexual and yes, sexuality starts at birth.  The new born is sexual.  It is just not manifested in children the same way as during puberty, when the physical characteristics start to set in.   

  

Do NOT confuse sexuality with behavior.  I said children are sexual and do have sexual feelings.  I did not say that they necessarily act out in terms of what we would call "sexual acts."  Children may act out a sexual feeling in ways that we would not necessarily consider sexual.   

  

For instance, I know now that I felt sexual attraction in connection with males before I was 4 Yrs old. 

  

This is a true story:  I remember once when my 11 yr old male Cousin came to my house for a visit.  I owned a toddler's ride-about stuffed horse.  My prized possession!  My cousin took my horse away  from me and sat down on it very hard, bending the legs.  He was clearly too heavy for it and it was starting to break.  I remember being incredibly frustrated and crying at him to get off my horse  before he ruined it completely.  He remained on it bouncing and laughing.  While all this was happening, I can recall experiencing a sexual feeling, a kind of pleasure/frustration all at once, perhaps from seeing him straddling my horse.  There was absolutely no physical contact between us.  I believe an adult then came in and ordered him off the horse.  In any case, the legs were almost crushed..  Now to my 3 1/2 Yr old mind, all horses were male animals then.  I recall that after the visitors had left and I was alone in my room with the stuffed horse, I pulled my pants down and proceeded to piddle all over it, soaking and ruining the soft fabric.  I was probably punished, after all I was already potty trained, my parents having no idea why I did such a thing.  My thoroughly ruined horse was thrown out.   I definitely know now that my childish urination act was clearly, an act of masturbation.   It came about as a result of the powerlessness and frustration I felt about my prized toy, and the fact that it was ruined by another male.  The fact that the horse (in my mind) was male, probably had some significance too. 

  

I present that true scenario just as one example of how a toddler might act out his/her sexuality   And believe me, that act was definitely sexual.  I still remember it. 

  

As a Psychologist, I have been studying human sexuality for over 40 years.  I would suggest you read some of the works of Sigmund Freud regarding sexuality. 

  

BTW, nobody can choose to "fall in love."  Falling in love is quite involuntary and is a sexual manifestation.  One might fall in love with someone of the same sex.  Although falling in love is not love, it certainly is a prerequisite for starting a sexual relationship, that hopefully will lead to true love.  Otherwise, one might as well just have a platonic relationship with someone that is loved.  I'd suggest reading M. Scott Peck MD - "The Road Less Traveled"  for further explanations regarding what is love and what it is not love. 

so you agree that your homosexuality was due to an incedent that you experienced, which caused you to become curious, which caused you to experiment, which caused you to like it and become addicted? 

  

bottom line: you agree that you were not born this way? 

 
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October 21, 2005, 1:01 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: rapunzel

umm...why?? why is hetero natural? cuz it's natural to you? everyone was born hetero cuz you were born hetero? do you think maybe other people have a different experience than you? by your theory, anyone with a different hair colour than you is unnatural, wrong, and chose to be that way. 

  

also, if hetero is natural, why do some people who experiment with the same sex like it, as you say, while others don't? sounds like two different orientations to me. 

  

lastly, america is homophobic (in general - not every individual of course). there are gay-bashings, government-sanctioned discrimmination, fewer rights etc etc. why would someone 'choose' to be gay if they were naturally inclined to be straight? do straight people just wake up one day and say to themselves "gee, I'd really like to make life more difficult and dangerous for myself. I think I'll go be gay"...?? 

  

not a very sound theory... 

 Great reply!  I feel the same way.  I just couldn't get it into words.
 
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October 21, 2005, 1:07 pm PDT

interesting opinion...

Quote From: maria_44

I have my own opinions about this. I believe that all people are born straight. That is our NATURAL sexuality. Even at a young age, we feel this. Boy feels "attracted" to girl and girl feels "attracted" to boy. Our natural "girl" doesn't want another girl--it "wants" a boy.....some kind of balance. Same goes with boys--their natural "boy" doesn't want another boy--it "wants" a girl. It's when some people grow up that they get overly curious about male/male...female/female. They possibly experiment and become fascinated with that curiousity and become addicted. When they go through counseling and all, or course they won't go back...they've already experienced it and they're addicted.....they like it. Most no longer have the will power to stop completely.  

  

Saying that they are born gay is dumb. It's only an excuse for their choice. I have yet to hear a homosexual stand up and say "I made the choice to be a homosexual". Why don't they? Because no one wants to take responsibility for their choices. No one wants to say they were not born that way, they chose to be that way--especially with how the United States (especially) is with gay people now-a-days. 

  

Anyway, if you beg to differ, please do. 

Your descriptions of "natural" attraction at a young age are very accurate...for heterosexuals.  I, however, am a young gay male.  You don't know how attraction works for homosexuals.  You are not gay; you have no credibility. 

  

Is it possible that you've never heard a homosexual "stand up and and say 'I made the choice to be a homosexual'" because...there are no homosexuals who are gay as a result of choice?  Yeah, it's possible to "experiment" and go through the motions of "being gay" but that's not the same as knowing that you are gay with every fiber of your being...in your heart and soul.  What about the homosexual people who do not believe in God and coundn't care less of what people thought...if this was indeed a choice, why wouldn't they just come out and say it?  They have nothing to hide.  

  

Have you ever taken the initiative to look into the research done on sexual orientation?  Being a student, I have read over many of them.   You should consider reading my last post which included some of the text supporting the biological basis for homosexuality.  If it is in fact biologically based, how can you judge someone based on someting that is beyond his/her control?   

  

I really don't mean any of this offensely.  I appreciate you expressiong your opinion, and I welcome any questions or comments. 

 
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October 21, 2005, 1:09 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: maria_44

Whoa! 

  

People who suffer from mental retardation are not going to hell! Homosexuals, like it or not, have the choice on whether to lay on that bed and have sexual relations with another of their same gender. No one forces them. 

  

Mentally retarded people CANNOT, even if they wanted to, "repent of their sins or pray". They don't have the brain power for it! Are you implying that homosexuals have the same brain power? or don't have the brain power enough to make their own decisions? That's what you were implying when you compared them together. 

  

By the way, how do you know that mentally retarded people don't love God? Have you asked one? They probably love God more than you or me. What sins do they have to repent of also? 

  

please respond! 

kay...this wasn't posted to me, but I couldn't resist. the logic seems so flawed. 'gay people choose to be gay, but mentally retarded (your awful word, not mine) people don't choose the wya they were born'..? what is that assumption based on? and what about people with developmental disabilities who are gay?? and as far as your point about sinning goes, according to the bible's definition of sin, people with developmemtal delays can sin as well as anyone. my client masturbates (that can be pretty sinful, depending on how fundamentalist ya wanna get), she's definitely a big fan of gluttony, she doesn't honour her parents a whole bunch...you get the idea. she doesn't repent those sins though. in fact, she doesn't even have enough language to know what christianity is, let alone memorize all the rules and regulations around it.
 
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October 21, 2005, 1:10 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: oet_gaol

You say that the bible has led many early cristians to literacy, again many is not the correct word most people where simple farmers and couldn't afford any type of schooling only the nobles and priests could afford to be thought writing reading and Latin. This great number you speak of does not exist. It was the opposite priests and noble men had no interrest in educating the people, because god feering domb people where easier to control then well educated people.  

  

Why do you think that the church feered science in the middle ages? It wasn't because it was thought to be the work of satan no it was because they feered that people would get educated know that the bible isn't as true as they'd like to believe. They where afraid that the people gained control lost faithed in the church that they would lose power. 

  

And you know they where right because as soon as the people got educated they lost their faith why is it that many scientists do not believe in the story of creation? why is it that in Europe this liberation has led to a dramatic decrease in numbers that visit the church? 

  

It is because people know that people know they do not have to read a bible and do not have to go to church to feel a connection to god or whatever they believe in. 

  

And the sweden thing? it can be cold there if he would've walked on water there I wouldn't have had a problem with it.  

 I think you're getting your history a bit mixed up here.  The time of Jesus wasn't in the middle ages, with priests and noblemen. 

We're getting way off topic here and I'd rather debate creation in another forum.  There is one under News and Current Events entitled "Should we teach Creationism in our schools".   I'll try to make it over there soon but I'm busy on this thread at the moment but it's also a very interesting discussion. 

I do not defend the Catholic church.  I know a lot of good Catholics and I love them but the church's history is a different story. 
 
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October 21, 2005, 1:13 pm PDT

Practicing? Homosexual? or Heterosexual?

There is no such thing as a practicing homosexual, just like there is no such thing as a practicing heterosexual, or even a practicing bisexual. 

  

Heterosexuals who are homophobic often refer to gays as "practicing homosexuals." That implies that one has to work at his sexual orientation to be a homosexual. But, those same heterosexuals will try to claim that they themselves are not "practicing heterosexuals;" they claim they were just born that way.  

  

Well, one does not have to practice the sexual orientation with which one was born. One CANNOT make his body experience a physiological sexual attraction toward another person, opposite gender or same gender; and that's because one's body experiences those physiological sexual attractions occasionally directed toward another close person close by without one even having to think about the person close by or even be thinking about sex.  

  

I have known about and personally known men who were exclusively heterosexual that were insulted when a homosexual man told them that they were not sexually attracted to them. Somehow, they had the idea that all homosexual men were sexually interested in all men. Some of those heterosexual men could not look at another woman without thinking about sex with her, especially if the woman was better than average looking. 

  

But, the gay man would tell them, in words to this effect, "Oh, I think that you are good looking; but, I have no interest in sexual activity with you at all. I don't have any sexual feelings for you."  

 
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October 21, 2005, 1:18 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: katlover

Wy must you mention homosexuality in comparrison with vicious criminals who do so much harm? That is a very illogical stance. It shows fear too. I resent that you used Jeffrey Dalmer in comparrison to gay people feeling different when they are children. This is deeply offensive to me and other gay people.
 I'm sorry you took it that way.  I didn't mean it that way at all.

I said I was using the most extreme example of how the devil works on our minds (Mine too!!) 

It was an extreme example but the devil plants thoughts in our heads.  If we dwell on them long enough, the lies become truth.

Same would go for a KKK member.  It starts with a lie that festers over and over until that person believes something totally untrue is truth.

I was just stating that homosexuals start off with thoughts, allow the thoughts to continue until the person is convinced that the thoughts are the truth.   By the time they are adults, they fully believe that they have no choice in being gay.  The compulsions are so strong after so long that they believe they were born with these compulsions.   I talked on another board with a man who had turned from homosexuality and he told me that a lot of what they do, is help them to control the thoughts, or stop the thoughts and turn them. 

Again, I'm sorry I offended you.




 

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October 21, 2005, 1:27 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: rapunzel

umm...why?? why is hetero natural? cuz it's natural to you? everyone was born hetero cuz you were born hetero? do you think maybe other people have a different experience than you? by your theory, anyone with a different hair colour than you is unnatural, wrong, and chose to be that way. 

  

also, if hetero is natural, why do some people who experiment with the same sex like it, as you say, while others don't? sounds like two different orientations to me. 

  

lastly, america is homophobic (in general - not every individual of course). there are gay-bashings, government-sanctioned discrimmination, fewer rights etc etc. why would someone 'choose' to be gay if they were naturally inclined to be straight? do straight people just wake up one day and say to themselves "gee, I'd really like to make life more difficult and dangerous for myself. I think I'll go be gay"...?? 

  

not a very sound theory... 

I've already answered these questions to you in my comment. 

  

No, I do not believe that other people have a different experience "than me". Boys don't NATURALLY want other little boys--their body wants balance or girls. Vice-versa.  

  

When exactly did I mention hair color??????? Please! People are born black, white, hispanic, asian, etc--not homosexual. 

  

If you say that people are born homo, than you also say that people are born serial killers, child molestors, thiefs, rapists, terrorists, etc. Is that what you're saying? 

  

As far as America on homosexuality, I know all that. That's exactly why I said that homosexuals don't come out and say that they made their choice--because they don't want to be subject to that persecution. They'd rather try to convince people that they were born that way to try to get some kind or pity and acceptance. 

  

If people were born homo, then half of our population would be gay. Right? 

  

Also, it's true, some people like experimenting with the same sex--others don't. Umm....usually people who like it are the ones who become gay....and people who don't....well, they don't. 

  

 
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