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Topic : 06/06 "I'm Gay, OK?"

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Created on : Friday, October 14, 2005, 03:56:41 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1

(Original Air Date: 10/19/05) Sexual orientation used to be something kept hidden from family and co-workers, but now more and more people are "coming out" and finding acceptance. Anjela says her mother and sister don't support her sexual orientation, and feel she can't be Christian and gay at the same time. Can they reconcile this touchy issue? Then, two men debate whether a person can go from gay to straight, and parents of a 4-year-old boy fear their son's desire to play with dolls and wear heels means he'll grow up to be gay. Are they overreacting to his wishes to be a princess instead of a prince? Talk about gender and gay issues here.


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October 19, 2005, 3:15 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

An age old question: Is this something that I do or something that I am? I feel that I have some special insight. I recall being dressed as a girl when I was either kindergarten or before. I am now a 53 year old male and have always had an attraction towards cross-dressing. I have struggled with this question over the years. In one sense, I have always felt the need to express the "woman inside". At the end of the day, however, I usually conclude that this is something I "do". I believe, though, that the feelings towards this are very similar to homosexuality. There is the need to do this and the everpresent question of whether it is behavior or identity. I believe strongly that it is "not of God", and that I have been guitly, over the years, of compartmentalizing my life, that is, this for God and this for my ego.  

I tend to think it is the same for gays. 

 
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October 19, 2005, 3:16 pm PDT

Oh my goodness, that is my family!!!!

That was my family up there, with an exception that I am the oldest and my bisexual/lesbian sister is the younger one.  I totally relate to the younger sister.  My sister changes with the wind, however.  One day she acts like she cares about us, wants to be involved with our family, then the next day she doesn't care and disappears.  One day she is a responsible person going to school, paying her bills, trying to be a productive member of society, the next who knows?  She was by my side when I had our first child, she bonded with him, loved him, adored him, came over all of the time to see him, she was in love with my son.  Next thing I know, she dumps the guy she was with for a girl and acts like she could are less about him (my son), going around touting about how much she despises children.  She wants to write a book on how bad kids are, she says.  I never tell my son how badly she hates him now, because she changes like the wind, she will come back around and love him again.  She has done this exact same thing before with other people and things.  Our youngest child doesn't even know her.  Our oldest knows her name but that is about it, he is 3.  He knows her mainly from the pictures he sees of her holding him, feeding him, and playing with him.  She has been in and out of gay relationships since we were younger.  I was there for her, listened to her, male or female, I never told her that I think what you are doing is wrong or bad.  NEVER!  She knows I am a Christian, was raised in the same home I was and knows how I feel about the whole gay thing, so I felt no need to rub it into her face.  My focus is loving her, not judging her.  I was there for her when she was dumped and broken hearted, for everything.  She had moved to another city a few months prior to this last gay relationship, so we didn't see much of each other, but still talked alot on the phone.  She asked about the kids all of the time, talked to them on the phone.  Even after she got involved with this girl, we still talked alot.  She moved back out here with her and we still talked alot and I thought we're still kinna close, except that she worked alot so I didn't see her much.  The only thing I asked of her was to refrain from too much PDA (public display of affection) in front of my 3 year old.  In front of my husband and I, I didn't care, but my kids, no, because this is something that I am not prepared to talk about with them yet.  I am not going to shelter them from it but want to discuss this with them at an appropriate age, not 3!  That went fine.  We did stuff together without my children and she did show affection and I said nothing to her about it, nothing new for me.    She got involved  with a girl that in my opinion is very sweet, but young and immature.  My sis is almost 30, and she is barely in her 20's.  She already has walked in on her cheating.  They broke up, I wrote her and told her that I am here for her, I love her, nothing about I told you so, that's what you get, NOTHING like that.  Well, they get back together and next thing I know I don't hear from her anymore, then I am accused of being hateful to her girlfriend on the phone, (which I wasn't) for being gay.  WHAT!  I have NO history of that with her, NONE!  I would think that she would say something like, I know that you might be upset with her for hurting me, but please be kind, NO, it was don't be disrespectful to her for being gay.  OH WHATEVER!  She made up things that I have supposedly done to her, like constantly breaking plans with her, which she has done to me more than I to her.  She is a bit of a flake when it comes to plans, so it never was a surprise to me when she did, for her to throw that at me was rediculous!  She has nothing to do with us anymore.  It really seems like the straight sister is right!  If I don't agree with her lifestyle then she can't be involved with us.  Which is extrememely hypocritical because unlike the gay sister on the show my sister in no way claims to serve God in any way shape or form, she is not a Christian and doesn't claim to be.  She does other things in her life that are contrary to my beliefs but had not sparked the kind of attitude that this has on her part.  It was NO shocker to me when she started doing the gay thing.  I was shocked because I treat her no different.  I am used to her "contoversial", if you will, lifestyle choices.  That is her.    To be honest, I think that her girlfriend is putting these notions in her head because in past gay relationships our relationship hasn't ever changed.  It seems like she is trying to find something to get mad at me over.  I feel as if she is trying to push me away because I am straight, have a loving marriage, kids, and a happy family.  I agree with Dr. Phil in that being "gay" isn't who you are, it is who you are attracted to.  I chose to base my relationship with her on my love for her as my sister, our history on having to stick together because of abuse as children.  A bond only sisters have, not on who she chooses to sleep with at the moment.  It seems like she is using that as a way to push me away from her.  She admitted to me when I had our first child that I got everything I wanted out of life from living how I should and she has suffered because of her choices.    She has so many issues that homosexuality is only one of a million.  So, why would that one thing out of so many be the one that she feels that I would treat her differently over?  That is mild compared to some of the things she has done and I have treated her in love, regardless.  I learned that by telling her what she should do would only cause her to push me away from how she was with our mother.  I feel like she won't be happy until I become gay, dump my family and be like her.   Whatever.  I just want to have a relationship with my sister, my kids have a relationship with their aunt, I want for her to be a part of our family but she is finding any possible way to push us away from her.  She used to say, "You are one of the few people (aka Christians) that actually practice what you preach".  She used to tell me that most Christians are hypocrites but you actually practice what you preach.  Now she has taken to accusing me of rediculous baseless things.  I respond to her in a loving way with the truth.  When she can't get mad at me over that she tries to find something else to get mad me over.  I am continuing to respond to her in love giving her the truth behind her accusation, but it is really getting on my nerves because I feel like I am waisting time that could be spent taking care of my kids explaing this or that.  I just feel like throwing my hands up and saying, if you don't want me in your life then just go away and quit this mess!  I have NO time or emotional energy for this.  She knows my husband is never home and I am practically raising 2 toddlers by myself.  To me it is selfish on her part to do this to me when I have never done anything but love her!  I won't, because one day she will come to her senses and realize that she is acting rediculous and want to be a part of our life (gay or straight).  Anyway, I relate  wanted to jump up and scream AMEN!!!!  You go!  Thanks again!
 
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October 19, 2005, 3:16 pm PDT

The wages of sin is death

Quote From: suzy_q

Well thanx! 

I figure you only have one life to live....so live it up! 

Thanx for replying! 

 No matter what sin we live in; "unless"  we repent and get right with God - the outcome is punishment and separation from God for eternity when we die. 

Many years ago - people were eating and drinking and having a fun time.  The flood came and drowned all but the family and the animals God told them to put on the ark.  The ones saved were not perfect by any means; however, they wanted to serve their God. 

Many were about their day on 9/11, and death caught them by surprise.

Today is the day of salvation - we do not know what tomorrow will hold.

See:  King James Version of the Bible - John 3:3 and Romans 10:9-13 (salvation message) or check out http://www.chick.com
 
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October 19, 2005, 3:19 pm PDT

As a Mormon...

Quote From: openmind1

 

Of course you can be gay and Christian! Perhaps not a fundamentalist bible Christian like a conservative evangelical, Pentecostal, JW, SDA. Southern Baptists or Mormon but  they are NOT the ONLY Christian organisations in America. Why are some people on this board assuming they speak for Jesus and for ALL Christians? You don't! There are MANY Christian organisations that welcome gay people and treat them with respect and allow them to worship and participate free from harassment and persecution. They don’t hide behind, “Love the sinner hate the sin” nonsense either. Some Christian groups that welcome gay people are: Church of the Brethren, Church Women United, Dignity/USA , Episcopal Church , Evangelical Lutheran Church in America , The Interfaith Alliance , National Council of the Churches of Christ USA  National Council of Jewish Women , North Georgia United Methodist Conference, Presbyterian Church (USA) ,  Unitarian Universalist Association , United Church of Christ , United Methodist Church , Young Women’s Christian Association and the Quakers.  These religious organisations accept what modern science and over 50 years of research says on homosexuality. They do not preach that gay people are perverted or any more sinful than anyone else. They do not support ex-gay programmes! They recently joined with the American Psychological Association and more than 477,000 health and mental health professionals, to make a statement denouncing it as psychological fraudery and abuse. Do some Christians here know where the idea for conversion camps for gay people first originated? NAZI GERMANY. Go research it. Is that what followers of Christ want to get involved in? Fraudulent threatments that damage people?  

 

  

 

 

I know there are some fundamentalist Christians on this board who take Leviticus and Paul’s letters to the Romans and Corithians 2000 years ago as LAW, demanding slavish obedience to them. They act like Jesus never came and set us free of laws and traditions and as if Paul IS Christ himself when he is nothing more than a human servant and a sinner no greater than you or me. See Romans 7: 17-25. His letters are no more than his feelings, experiences and advice to a specific people at a specific time in history. If we are to follow his personal letters to early churches as LAWS then we deny Christ. In addition, Paul said, in Romans 14:5 “Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.” In other words, USE YOUR BRAIN and THINK FOR YOURSELF.  

 

How can you be a Christian and when you worship the bible as the final authority and not Christ. It is not the bible that is GOD's WORD. Jesus is God's WORD. The bible is a collection of Jewish law, geneologies, history, poetry, gospels and letters put together by the Roman Catholic Church and cannonized as scripture around 369AD. It is a tool to be used with discernment and in the RIGHT context. All the bible does is serve as  a spiritual guide that points the way to Christ. JESUS IS THE WORD OF GOD. To worship ANY OTHER THING as the word of God is idolatry. Only Jesus is "The word of God made human (flesh)" (not words) in John 1:14. The ONLY figure ANY Christian needs to follow is Christ. And what did Christ say when people asked him “Who are the ones who will be with you in heaven?” or ‘Who will get eternal life?”  See Luke 10:25-37.  What is the ONE commandment Christ ever demanded we follow? See: Matthew 7:12. Christ said this commandment fulfills the ENTIRE LAW and PROPHETS.  

 

These bible worshipers think by idolizing the bible as God word instead of following CHRIST as GOD's WORD, they can predict God’s mind on EVERYTHING and use the bible to judge others. They can EARN salvation and see themselves as righteous. They do not realize the danger they put themselves in. Why? If you judge by the Old law, so will you be judged by God that is what Jesus Christ said in Matt 7:1-2. The truth is NOBODY can follow the entire bible perfectly. Yet, these sects ask their followers to follow bible laws literally or according to THEIR interpretation in order to prove they are Christians.  Folks this is called fundamentalism or extremism. They are making a mockery of the FREE GIFT of God’s unconditional love. Remember! Jesus came to liberate people from hopeless bondage to legalistic judgmental abusive religion. Jesus IGNORED religious laws that did not show human consideration for the greater good and he asked his followers to do the same. That is why the Pharisees hated him. See: Mark 2:23-28 and Mark 3: 1-7.  

 

Should we Christina place ANY OTHER burdens or rules on others other than the commandments Jesus gave? NO. Jesus warned some would do so in Matthew 23:4 and they are nothing but blind guides who put religion over humanity. Bottom line, if we are to be imitators of Christ, we are to experience freedom. Jesus said, “My yoke is light.” in Mathew 11:28-30. So being a Christian should never a burden. It should be a JOY! It should be freedom for the heart and soul, refreshing the spirit. If you are gay and in a sect that is causing you to experience self-hatred, suicidal thoughts, rejection, isolation, etc. then you are not in a religious sect that is following Christ but their OWN fundamentalist agenda. They are Pharasees! Remember Jesus said, “The way they treat the lest of my brothers is the way they treat me.” My gay brothers and sisters in Christ, you are loved by fellow Christians like myself and there is a place for you in God’s heaven where Jesus said there are MANY mansions. ONLY GOD KNOWS YOUR HEART! Do not listen to those who would appoint themselves masters over YOUR faith; just remember your only master is Christ. 

 

 

God Bless!.

  

 

  

  

 

  

  

 As a Mormon, I guess I could say thank you for at least acknowledging that we ARE Christians since there are many who believe we are not.  On another note, I (and other Christians as well) don't deny that you can't be gay and be a Christian.  I absolutely believe you can be a Christian and be gay.  Being gay has nothing to do with whether or not you believe in Christ.  The life you choose to live is yours and no one else's.  I'm not going to judge anyone.  I have a hard enough time with my own sins.  And you're right....only God knows your heart, so stop worrying about what other "Christians" are posting....and try not to categorize all Christians.  Thanks and God bless.
 
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October 19, 2005, 3:19 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: riviera

I think being gay is genetic but not a good thing. I don't think it is normal or should ever be considered normal but a biological defect like mental illness. As so many people say they wouldn't choose it .  

A lot of people have experimented with bi-sexuality in their youth thinking gay sex is ok.  

I think if you are gay "that's nice" but I really don't care what you do in private.  I would like to know why so many married men go to parks to pay for sex with underage boys/ 

Because a person is gay is not to say they are pedophiles, lets not get the two confused. 

Many married men who go on the low down and meet with other men to have sex are a product of society saying they can and should change so they decide early on to supress whats within and obviously you can't supress who you are and not pay a price some where down the road. 

 
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October 19, 2005, 3:20 pm PDT

Confused

I hear about what is supposedly in the bible about homosexuality, but it's all interpretation anyway.  I also have heard that the only person who can past judgment  is God. So I don't understand people who read the bible and say they are Christians then pass judgment on others, hypocrisy at it's best.  Watching 'religious' people with their signs and anger at protests confuse me.  

  

Being homosexual is not breaking any of the 10 Commandments so shouldn't people be more upset and angered by the theives, adulters and murderers and others breaking the commandments?  Parents actually turn their backs and disown their gay children but will be there and support another child who was just convicted of murder or theft!!!!    Explain this to me please. 

 
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October 19, 2005, 3:22 pm PDT

Do you think a drunk wants to be a drunk?

Quote From: godin44

If you have not excepted the Holy Bible as absolute truth and have not accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, you will not understand why this lifestyle is wrong. It's not society that says it is wrong, it is the one that created us. It is however wrong for people to treat them badly.
 A drunk or drug addict doesn't want to be controlled by the drink or drug.  They do not enjoy the pain of being a drunk or a drug addict.  But - maybe they can't stop drinking or doing drugs - cause of the demon of addiction and need deliverance.  The homosexual just wants to be loved and identify with their gender - they are not bad people - they are people that need to be loved. Jesus LOVES us all - just the way we are.  HE (God) will change us from within - if we turn to him.  Dr. Phil's  show may have been the opportunity for some to see there is hope for change and find it.




 
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October 19, 2005, 3:22 pm PDT

Thank you very much!

Quote From: momz6pack

Happy Anniversary to you and your partner. 

  

I think what you have said was very well spoken.  I applaude you for living your life the way your heart leads you, instead of the way society and upbringging leads you.  Kudos to you!  Here is to another 11 joyful years to the two of you! 

Thank you.  I take great pride in our wonderful relationship.  So many people don't care enough to understand that love comes in all shapes and sizes.  Love is a blessid thing that I am eternally grateful to have in my life.
 
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October 19, 2005, 3:22 pm PDT

10/19 "I'm Gay, OK?"

Quote From: godin44

  • All translations of the Holy Bible state that homosexuality is a sin. The KJV, NIV and NAS translations are word for word translations. This means they were translated from the original Hebrew and Greek texts. You are looking for an "out" for your sin., which is human nature. No one is sinless, except Jesus. But we are told to confess our sins and give them to God. When your sin becomes a lifestyle, your are not living in the way God has asked us to: Galations chapter 5 says...
  •     16So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. 17For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want. 18But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.

        19The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.  

        22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. 25Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other. 

Please get counceling from a trusted christian councelor. 

THANK YOU! THANK YOU!  You have said what I wished I could say, but could never fit it into words without looking like a gay-basher.  I don't hate gays, but I do NOT believe that being gay is natural.  People who are abusive sometimes feel they can't control themselves.  Is it their fault?  It may not, but it's not NATURAL.  Most abusers become abusive because they were abused at some point.  No one is BORN gay, it's something that is developed because of something that happend.  Like the man who said gays can change said, it could have to do with bad relationships with your mother or father.  You may not chose to be gay, but it isn't something natural.  If it's against God's law, he wouldn't MAKE someone gay, just like he doesn't MAKE people kill someone else.  I think all gays are straight deep down, but it takes counseling and really wanting to become straight to uncover it.  Like alchoholics or smokers.  They made the choice to start, so they feel they can't stop.  SOMETHING started it.  I'm not saying it's your fault that your gay, but you can change if you want to.  If you are an alchoholic and you TRULY want to quit and are willing to do anything to do so, you'll succeed.  Same with becoming straight.  If you have the desire to stop being gay, you can do it.  Some of you may think it IS natural to be gay, but I do not.  God would not do something that cruel, He would NOT say that you shouldn't be gay and then make someone gay.  He made everyone NATURALLY straight, and something could happen that makes them change, but it doesn't mean that their straight self isn't still there.  I have depression/anxiety and I know I didn't naturally have it.  Several things happend to me that triggered it, but that doesn't mean I'm going to sit around and use it as an excuse.  I'm taking medication and I've had counceling, I'm doing everything I can to change.  I'm not going to let it affect me and complain that it's the reason some people don't like me or that I have troubles.  I know I don't know what it's like to be homosexual, but I do have struggles and you CAN control them.  You don't have to let it control your life if you don't want it to.
 
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October 19, 2005, 3:23 pm PDT

Are you kidding?

Quote From: godin44

If you have not excepted the Holy Bible as absolute truth and have not accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, you will not understand why this lifestyle is wrong. It's not society that says it is wrong, it is the one that created us. It is however wrong for people to treat them badly.
Come on.  God also says that we are all equal and we should all love one another.  Here's another take on this... As much as your society may not understand gays and lesbians, gays and lesbians don't understand people of the Church.  It isn't a choice that you make.  You can't go to a counselor in an attempt to get it fixed  Personally, I am straight and married to a wonderful man who has two daughters.  One of my step-daughters is lesbian and her heart isn't any different than mine.  The only difference that makes her who she is are people like you.
 
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